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y0willy0
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nissan is entering this:

http://www.topgear.com/uk/car-news/nissan-deltawing-launch-le-mans-2012-03-13

interesting to say the least,



[Edited on March 13, 2012 at 1:56 PM. Reason : -]

3/13/2012 1:56:01 PM

jaZon
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The hell

3/13/2012 2:09:49 PM

H8R
wear sumthin tight
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some junk

3/13/2012 2:16:36 PM

sumfoo1
Foo1ish
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^ yeah some junk.

3/13/2012 2:18:15 PM

H8R
wear sumthin tight
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you ain't avoiding any accidents with that junk

gonna cause a couple when you try and pass, though

3/13/2012 2:22:53 PM

y0willy0
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could be a tuned nissan juke engine onboard.

3/13/2012 3:21:34 PM

tchenku
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3/13/2012 4:09:45 PM

Hiro
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No bat-mobile joke yet? really?

3/13/2012 4:18:09 PM

H8R
wear sumthin tight
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no reason, in the article they called it the batmobile

3/13/2012 4:20:04 PM

0EPII1
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looks hot.

and in theory sounds great too: 1100 lbs, 300 hp? that's amazing. that's like having a Lotus Exige with 600 hp.

that shit would dominate, in theory.

i love this:

Quote :
"The maths is disarmingly simple: though it has half the power of a full-fat Le Mans Prototype, the DeltaWing carries just half the weight. It also produces half as much drag - the design does away with conventional wings in favour of ground-effect underbody aerodynamics - and will consume half as much fuel and get through half as many tyres. Useful attributes in an endurance race. "

3/13/2012 5:12:30 PM

Hiro
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^^ Didn't read the article. FML

3/13/2012 5:52:22 PM

jaZon
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It also has 10cm wide front tires and 70% of its weight is in the ass end.

3/13/2012 6:46:52 PM

0EPII1
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^ i was just about to quote that paragraph. very unusual and interesting.

so those back tires, are they like around 300 mm width?

3/13/2012 7:01:22 PM

arghx
Deucefest '04
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I'm curious about the suspension geometry. There must be something giving it stability. The people who know aren't talking.

The engine is surely a modified MR16DDT engine from the Juke.

3/13/2012 7:19:00 PM

smoothcrim
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Quote :
"I'm curious about the suspension geometry. There must be something giving it stability. The people who know aren't talking."


I'm also curious about the braking, as I imagine the bulk can't possibly be up front

3/13/2012 7:27:17 PM

jaZon
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i've decided it won't handle worth a shit at moderate speeds

[Edited on March 13, 2012 at 7:35 PM. Reason : ]

3/13/2012 7:35:34 PM

merbig
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There is a video of the car doing a test. It was slow as shit, but it's hard to draw conclusions on its actual performance.

But I sure am glad IndyCar passed on these track riding dildos.

3/13/2012 7:49:08 PM

MattJM321
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It kinda makes sense - it seems like a tripod is more stable than a chair?

3/13/2012 8:00:22 PM

jaZon
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that makes no sense

3/13/2012 8:02:26 PM

MattJM321
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You have two outside contact patches and one inside when cornering instead of two outside and two inside.

3/13/2012 8:11:10 PM

jaZon
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You're right - the reliant robin was the most stable car ever designed

3/13/2012 9:09:04 PM

MattJM321
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I saw that episode of Top Gear too. Anyway, all of the rear weight is on the rear axle.

3/13/2012 11:09:30 PM

jaZon
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remember when three wheelers were banned? that was fun

[Edited on March 13, 2012 at 11:14 PM. Reason : im' being a prick at this point - but three wheels != stable]

3/13/2012 11:12:12 PM

dustm
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it still has 4 wheels

and come on, the CG is waaaayyyyyy lower than the Robin's

[Edited on March 13, 2012 at 11:29 PM. Reason : all of the rear weight is on the rear axle]

3/13/2012 11:28:46 PM

jaZon
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hey, did you know the weight is all on the rear axle?

3/13/2012 11:37:19 PM

Dr Pepper
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Quote :
"It kinda makes sense - it seems like a tripod is more stable than a chair?

"


didnt we learn anything with Hiro 's argument about that goofy saw-buck design

IT'S ALL ABOUT THE NODES, MAN.


the nodes.

3/14/2012 4:44:41 PM

sumfoo1
Foo1ish
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if the chair had all of it's legs angled away from the center, it would be more sturdy too.

seriously this is not a great idea.. but it will show at lemans

3/14/2012 5:18:14 PM

jaZon
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^ THANK YOU

3/14/2012 5:28:05 PM

dustm
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every car has all of the rear weight on the rear axle

the outside front tire loads up most when you are entering a corner; I can see this thing having a bit of a disadvantage

i wonder how it behaves... understeer/oversteer? horrible understeer sometimes, horrible oversteer others?

3/14/2012 6:16:13 PM

vinylbandit
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It'll be the fastest thing on the Mulsanne.

When the dirty air off a passing Audi blows it into the wall.

3/19/2012 3:16:40 PM

Wolfmarsh
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Why two sets of headlights?

3/19/2012 3:37:00 PM

smc
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Because a single headlight would make it look like a dick.

3/19/2012 4:29:17 PM

Wolfmarsh
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Yes, but I asked why there were 4.

3/19/2012 4:33:27 PM

smc
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300% less like a dick.

3/19/2012 4:43:28 PM

vinylbandit
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^^ The spread would be too narrow if there weren't any on the side. A prototype also needs highs to blink at GT cars.

3/20/2012 5:47:31 PM

H8R
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3/22/2012 2:41:29 PM

Flyin Ryan
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Quote :
"
"The maths is disarmingly simple: though it has half the power of a full-fat Le Mans Prototype, the DeltaWing carries just half the weight. It also produces half as much drag - the design does away with conventional wings in favour of ground-effect underbody aerodynamics - and will consume half as much fuel and get through half as many tyres. Useful attributes in an endurance race. "
"


Yeah. It breaks all the rules that the ACO sets down that competitors are supposed to obey for their cars to be legal. But because this car is entered by Dr. Don Panoz, who is allowing the American Le Mans Series he owns to slowly die to pay for this thing, the ACO are giving his car an exemption where he'll be unclassified but allowed to take part (in other words, it'll go around the track, but they won't officially score it). For example, I can produce a car that is underweight, has ground effects as well, it's incredibly simple to do so, but my car would not be allowed to race by the ACO because it doesn't meet their rules. This is one big meaningless public relations exercise that's taking advantage of a press corps stupid enough to not understand it but they'll fall for the "it's green" guise.

The whole thing is nothing more than trying to find use for a "mistake", as this car was originally meant to be Chip Ganassi's manuever to become sole car supplier for the Indycar Series so he could control the grid to his whim, and the reaction from everyone was so negative Indycar went away from it, the car's design has changed a little in the time since and Dr. Don Panoz became financial backer. Lost in all this is that Dr. Don Panoz has lost a fortune in the past half-dozen years and all his businesses have shriveled, so this could be just some last ditch ploy to get some press by creating a single make "Delta Wing" series.

http://murphythebear.com/blog/index.php/2011/06/16/191-mottos-back-to-the-future-plying-phallus-disposing-of-an-empire-cheese/#more-1098

Quote :
"Phallus

Reception of the Dayton/Panoz/Gurney (with the ACO as facilitator) “Delta Wing” has been as bad as the Bear has ever seen for any racing-related endeavor (puttering around as a demonstration is an “endeavor,” not a race). Much of the opinion of racing fans is unprintable in the Bear’s blog. Of course the principals (and their advisor) in this adventure have paid little attention to fans before, so why should they now?

The derision in this case is well deserved. Not only does it look bad, it’s not by any definition a sports car, even if one stretches the definition of prototype to a breaking point. It’s an IndyCar (or a copy of one), and a rejected one at that. The excuse for this nonsense is to demonstrate “new (green) technology. And what technology is that? Here’s Murphy’s summary: 1. Lighter cars use less fuel. 2. Lighter cars require less horsepower to move. 3. Ground effects tunnels are an effective aerodynamic device. Aren’t you glad we’ll have a chance to see those things demonstrated at Le Mans next year? That will be a fair trade for a well-funded ALMS, won’t it?"


[Edited on April 23, 2012 at 11:54 PM. Reason : .]

4/23/2012 11:46:36 PM

TKE-Teg
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either way, we need more variety in racing. It's become quite boring and more of the well known series are nothing but spec racing these days.

I yearn for the days where all manner of vehicles raced at Le Mans and Indy. Anyone recall the turbine car (not in person as we're too young) and Penske's trick pushrod engine from '94? Or how about multiple engine configurations being allowed in Formula One?

These days...booooooring.

4/24/2012 9:36:48 AM

dubcaps
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hey nissan, batman wants his car back!



4/24/2012 9:57:25 AM

Flyin Ryan
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Quote :
"I yearn for the days where all manner of vehicles raced at Le Mans and Indy. Anyone recall the turbine car (not in person as we're too young) and Penske's trick pushrod engine from '94? Or how about multiple engine configurations being allowed in Formula One?

"


The Penske '94 engine was nothing more than taking advantage of a rulebook. And with the benefit of hindsight we now know that Penske finding that loophole in '94 hid some deficiencies with his chassis that meant neither of his 2 cars would qualify for the '95 race.

It's too expensive and if you take a chance on the wrong thing it puts you out of business. I with a guy designed a sportscar that'd cost $225k to race in LMP2 which is cheaper than most of what is out there. No one outside a couple guys in New Zealand were willing to take a chance. People can take a chance on something that cost $20k, which in the scheme of racing is cheap. If you want an example of that, look at USAC, in a 22-car feature it can have 6 chassis and 5 engines no problem, and routinely does. When you get up to where you're talking a lot of money to the point you have a limited number of people that can enter? Why would you risk buying something that's guaranteed to lose?

The Lotus Indycar engine is a perfect example. It underperforms in comparison to the Chevy and Honda and the teams are allegedly trying to find a way out of the year contracts because they don't want to be at the back of the grid for the year because that'll mean when 2013 comes around they may not be able to find drivers or sponsors because they'll have a reputation as a back of the pack team. And then the team shuts its doors and all the employees are laid off. This isn't the NBA where the Charlotte Bobcats can be absolutely dreadful sh*t and they're guaranteed to exist next year, get the best player coming in, get millions of dollars in revenue from the league, and millions of dollars in ticket sales money. Racing is a very brutal meritocracy when it comes to teams making it from one year to the next.

[Edited on April 25, 2012 at 1:06 AM. Reason : /]

4/25/2012 1:01:46 AM

merbig
Suspended
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^ 2 teams are already out of their contract with Lotus, one of which won't be at Brazil.

4/25/2012 1:48:47 AM

TKE-Teg
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Quote :
"
The Penske '94 engine was nothing more than taking advantage of a rulebook"


That's what you're supposed to do, yes?

4/25/2012 8:26:50 AM

benXJ
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if you ain't cheatin, you ain't tryin

4/25/2012 10:40:43 AM

sumfoo1
Foo1ish
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It's not cheating if it's not against the rules.

Doing things that may be found against the intent of the rules is just finding a loop hole in the rules and is not exactly cheating.

4/25/2012 11:08:50 AM

nightkid86
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Can't wait for Morgan to be back in LeMans. Won the class in 1962 with TOK258. Even if the one racing this year is more pescarolo than moggie, it'll be fun to see it on the track.

4/25/2012 8:14:43 PM

Flyin Ryan
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^ Morgan's raced there a couple times recently. 2002:



This car is from '04.



Compared to the rest of the GT field I remember they were incredibly slow.

Quote :
"That's what you're supposed to do, yes?"


Yes and as an engineer I can appreciate the ingenuity and thought, but as a racefan it made for an awful race. The only good thing that happened in 500 miles was Fittipaldi with almost a lap lead over 2nd place Al Unser Jr. had a brain fart and crashed late, leading to the crowd erupting in cheers after Fittipaldi refused to drink milk after winning the year before.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnNDdJm80BA

The only reason that was allowed to happen by the way had nothing to deal with series rules, it was because Indianapolis was not a CART-sanctioned event, it was a USAC-sanctioned event, and USAC had an outdated rulebook. The loophole was closed for the following year, although Penske and Mercedes Benz would later both say they knew it was only a one-shot deal when building the engine in secret. (For anyone wanting more history telling the story of everything in 23 parts: http://forix.autosport.com/8w/penske-mercedes-pc23.html, this site's pretty good, it even tells the story of the ill-fated Alfa Romeo Indycar engine.)

[Edited on April 26, 2012 at 1:37 PM. Reason : /]

4/26/2012 1:12:16 PM

cheerwhiner
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don't forget ALMS is going to VIR in September, replacing Grand Am -also running full course- as in the extra bit the Patriot Course added to the Full Course creates- so I guess its the Grand Course

http://virnow.com/events/american-le-mans-series-presented-by-tequila-patron/

of course ALMS won't have the Delta Wing or the Audi LMP1 cars, among others.

I'm still gonna go.

[Edited on April 29, 2012 at 7:33 AM. Reason : link]

4/29/2012 7:32:22 AM

Flyin Ryan
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went to the first-ever Grand-Am race there (pre-Daytona Prototypes), not been back since, but it's a beautiful circuit

4/30/2012 1:58:33 PM

vinylbandit
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I think the rhythm of the Full Course is a lot better than the Grand Course (especially braking into Rollercoaster), but it's entirely possible that's just the traditionalist in me talking. Either way, I'll probably be at that ALMS race.

5/1/2012 6:44:06 PM

jaZon
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I wish I knew what stream I saw last year with nothing but british announcers - that shit was entertaining

right now i have one with american commentators and it's boring as shit

6/16/2012 12:08:29 PM

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