Is anyone interested in a serious discussion of ideas? I've never had the privilage of take a religious course in college... My guess is no. This thread would be trolled relentlessly for padding rather than for the sharing of ideas.

2/6/2006 12:16:46 AM

I'd say Soap Box, but this topic has been beaten to death.

There is no way you can have a civil discussion about this in any section on this site.

2/6/2006 12:19:55 AM

K, nm. LOCK!!!

2/6/2006 12:21:23 AM

Quote :

"There is no way you can have a civil discussion about this in any section on this any site."

2/6/2006 12:26:16 AM

Well nothing makes a failure but a try.

2/6/2006 12:28:31 AM

My views are that all religions are cults. They seek to control their members and anyone who does not lockstep within their fanatical beliefs is persecuted. That is why religion hates science, because it attempts to explain what is supposed to be unexplainable, and the unexplainability of it is why you are supposed to bow down before their bland god/goddess/pixie fairy and wish/pray for SUFFERING and ILL WILL towards those who donot share your faith. Religion divides and encourages discrimiHATE against "not our kind of people" and anyone who doesn't agree with their particular brand of HATE is hammered ruthlessly to the merciless CrossOfShame for their uniqueness.

"Your skin does not look like mine, so therefore I will enslave you and here is a verse in my BOOK OF HATE that says I am justified in doing so"

"Your cult is different from my cult, so off to the gas ovens with you."

"You pray to the bland god differently than I do, so I will torture and behead you because differences will not be tolerated."

"YOU DONOT WORSHIP MY GOD SO I WILL BURN YOU AT THE STAKE, BECAUSE I HATE YOU AND MY GOD HATES YOU FOR YOUR UNIQUENESS AND DIFFERENCES. YOU DID NOT LOCK STEP AND THEREFORE MUST BE DESTROYED"

And that's all religion in a nutshell. DEATHWORSHIP!! HATE and DEATH for people who fail to lockstep in with their radical views. Religion is the cause of some of the greatest atrocities in the history of humanity, but people quickly forget all of that and continue to goose step in lock step behind their bland god/goddess/pixie fairies, wishing hate upon those who refuse to lock step and seeking to make their lives as miserable as possible. Religion equal DEATHWORSHIP!!

2/6/2006 12:58:47 AM

theology and beliefs are different than religion.

choosing to believe in the jewish faith found in the old testament
or
choosing to believe the words of the Christian bible do not make you a part of a cult nor are there any other members involved with this belief to force you to do anything

2/6/2006 1:01:37 AM

Quote :

"choosing to believe the words of the Christian bible do not make you a part of a cult nor are there any other members involved with this belief to force you to do anything"

They do force me and others to lock step within their nonsensical religious beliefs when they lobby and pass laws that FORCE their brand of morality on everyone. Such as the recent homosexual marriage bans. RELIGION seeking to deny HAPPINESS to two OF AGE GROWN ADULTS wishing to enter into a legal contract with each other. RELIGION seeking to allow REAL LIVING BEINGS to suffer because their BOOK OF HATE says that destroying a blob of cells is wrong. RELIGION seeking to censor the people's FreedomOfSpeech because a silly drawing of one of their Prophets (ie: bringer of hate). Religion continues to preach hatred and intolerance against "not our kind of people" and hammer them to the CrossOfShame for not lock stepping in with ways their bland god/goddess/etc. RELIGION EQUALS DEATHWORSHIP!!!

2/6/2006 1:16:38 AM

all religions are not cults.

there is a very specific set of criteria to label a cult.

but some professed religions are cults in disguise.

2/6/2006 2:01:44 AM

^^ You sure know an awful lot about life and why people do what they do. How did you get so wise in your 18 yrs of existence?

2/6/2006 2:07:07 AM

holy shit

2/6/2006 2:22:56 AM

Quote :

"^^ You sure know an awful lot about life and why people do what they do. How did you get so wise in your 18 yrs of existence?"

Hehehe, I'm saving this quote.

2/6/2006 8:07:57 AM

^gg, lol

2/6/2006 8:56:47 AM

Quote :

"^^ You sure know an awful lot about life and why people do what they do. How did you get so wise in your 18 yrs of existence?"

Funny thing is, I just knew it had to be a young'un before I even clicked on "user info"...

2/6/2006 9:04:38 AM

Quote :

"They do force me and others to lock step within their nonsensical religious beliefs when they lobby and pass laws that FORCE their brand of morality on everyone. Such as the recent homosexual marriage bans. RELIGION seeking to deny HAPPINESS to two OF AGE GROWN ADULTS wishing to enter into a legal contract with each other. RELIGION seeking to allow REAL LIVING BEINGS to suffer because their BOOK OF HATE says that destroying a blob of cells is wrong. RELIGION seeking to censor the people's FreedomOfSpeech because a silly drawing of one of their Prophets (ie: bringer of hate). Religion continues to preach hatred and intolerance against "not our kind of people" and hammer them to the CrossOfShame for not lock stepping in with ways their bland god/goddess/etc. RELIGION EQUALS DEATHWORSHIP!!!"

nope. thats still not Theology doing that. Thats organized RELIGION. as you put it. RELIGION and Theology are actually 2 separate things. A RELIGION is generally based on a theology of course but they are not the same.

says youre into metal. you should check out my band. but youll probably hate us because all our members are Christian

2/6/2006 9:55:03 AM

Theology on Tap
On the third Tuesday of each month we gather at a local pub to talk about God and culture over a pint. This is a great time to get to know people from Vintage21, as well as a comfortable atmosphere for those who do not enjoy church but like talking about spiritual matters. Join us February 21st, 8:30, at local favorite Mitch's Tavern, 2426 Hillsborough Street. Go straight up the stairs past the first dining room, and take a left into the back room.

http://www.vintage21.com

2/6/2006 10:09:38 AM

My view is that organized religion is largely an outdated method of social organization and truth seeking. The high nature of religious truths makes them static which doesn't fit well in a world where we are always learning new things. I’m fond of more fluid and progressive churches.

Most of what I know of religious history comes from history & philosophy classes rather religious classes. I find religious history interesting insofar as it is intertwined with philosophy (being a philosophy major). I tried taking a religion class at ncsu once, but the professor required lots of outside of class work in groups… he called them “group parties” I think. I had a busy semester and couldn’t coordinate around 7 other people’s schedules for multiple regular meetings a week so I had to drop the class. Maybe in grad school I’ll get a second chance.

I was raised Baptist, but never learned a lot of religious history or doctrines there, so I worry if I wouldn’t fall behind quickly in a Christianity class where they expect their average ncsu student to know more coming in. I’d also have trouble writing coherent & accurate statements of people’s beliefs for essays or test answers that I found to be inconsistent.

In some sense higher education has filled the gap thats often in religion's sphere of influence. University life (with plans for grad school & teaching at a university level) has provided social organization, and education in general/philosophy specifically have given me tools to tackle deep questions that alot of people turn to religion for.

2/6/2006 10:24:20 AM

theology on tap is pretty good - it's different every time i'm told (i've only been once due to it being on a tuesday an di travel every week) - a few people actually created a small spinoff to meet more regularly

2/6/2006 12:11:29 PM

Quote :

" You sure know an awful lot about life and why people do what they do. How did you get so wise in your 18 yrs of existence?" "

HAHA gg.

Anyway I'll discuss with you. What theological matter do you want to discuss?

2/6/2006 3:52:58 PM

how do you know which dreams are divinely inspired? (i heard one religion scholar who turned to christianity after jesus saved her from mermaids in a dream)

2/6/2006 5:27:01 PM

Quote :

" You sure know an awful lot about life and why people do what they do. How did you get so wise in your 18 yrs of existence?"

It doesn't take age to look at the past and see that religion has caused some of the greatest atrocities in human history. You, for some reason, feel that as I grow older that the Christian cult (along with all other religious cults) will somehow become more valid in my eyes. A cult is a cult, time does not change that. And the Christian cult has caused more death and misery than other belief on this planet. From slavery to the Holocaust to the Salem Witch Trials, the list goes on and on endlessly. And people, in spite of all this death and destruction, CONTINUE to lock step in with this cult of HATE. I am an atheist (obviously). Some parts of my family will not even speak to me because I donot bow down before their bland god. They HATE me not because of anything I have done, because solely because of my beliefs. One family member has gone so far as to say I am not allowed to go near his child for fear of contaminating it with my "non beliefs". My father is constantly arguing with me, fighting with me about the friends I choose. He tells me that I was not raised to associate myself with "those people who donot bow down before the bland Christian god who despises uniqueness" (ie: not our kind of people). Just today I was accosted by some Christian loon attempting to peddle his propaganda to me. I DONOT WANT TO JOIN YOUR CULT!! IF I WANTED TO JOIN YOUR CULT, I WOULD VISIT ONE OF THE VARIOUS SUBCHAPTERS. Seriously, Christians are the only ones who do this. Pushing their propaganda on everyone else. Muslims don't do it, nor do the Jews or Satanists or any other religion. I should start handing out fliers for the Church of Satan just to spite people. I'll hand them to all the Christian do gooders, who try and peddle their propaganda to me. And you can't forget random dorm visits, gotta peddle the propaganda there to. But regardless of who hands out what, it still doesn't change the fact that all religion equals DEATHWORSHIP!!! Divide and conquer, not unite and prosper; that is what religion seeks to do.

2/6/2006 11:06:00 PM

Quote :

"Seriously, Christians are the only ones who do this."

ROFL

once AGAIN..this thread is about THEOLOGY and BELIEFS. *not* RELIGION.
you just stormed in bashing organized religion and so-called cults when this thread had nothing to do with that. The original poster even said this was to be a serious discussion of theological ideas.

Not "lets bash on one religion"

start your own thread if you want to keep ranting in large incoherent paragraphs please.

2/7/2006 12:03:06 AM

"once AGAIN..this thread is about THEOLOGY and BELIEFS. *not* RELIGION"

i agree that a rant wont change anyones views, but trying to seperate "religion" from a thread on "theology"/religious views (such as in a "religious course in college")... is too difficult. for honest reponses i don't think their should be artificial cut offs to the discussion.

2/7/2006 12:12:57 AM

true enough. The OP said they wanted to discuss ideas and the thread topic was theology and to me that came off as more of personal beliefs that can exist outside of an organized church.

but i will agree there is a fine line. i just did not think the incoherent rants were needed

2/7/2006 12:45:08 AM

^^^^ You have a very valid point. It is absolutely correct to stereotype over 70% of the American population as hatemongers who wish to destroy everyone that does not think like them. It is clear that you don't have a clue of what you're talking about.

I was raised in church, my father was a preacher, his father was a preacher, and so on. I was never taught to hate anyone. I was taught to respect and love everyone as a person regardless of their beliefs.

Obviously you do not believe there is a God so why are you even posting in a Theology thread, could it possibly be that you are trying to push your beliefs on me. Wait...that can't be it because christians are the only people that do things like that.

I have an idea, why don't you go learn something about christianity so that way you can at least come up with a decent argument instead of spouting out generic stuff about how all christians hate everyone.

2/7/2006 1:00:56 AM

most non religious ppl were raised religious of some type or another, so i think there can be valid expressions of spiritiual beliefs from someone who is no longer spiritual.

the expression of messed up family and social expectations i think makes a good ancedote, even though its not wrapped in a great package of a rant.

2/7/2006 1:08:40 AM

Quote :

"Some parts of my family will not even speak to me"

Lucky them.

Quote :

"I have an idea, why don't you go learn something about christianity so that way you can at least come up with a decent argument instead of spouting out generic stuff about how all christians hate everyone."

Second best quote of this thread!! Good job!

Quote :

"how do you know which dreams are divinely inspired?"

I don't know. It's something you need to pray about, maybe consult a priest or, in serious cases where you believe divine revelation is involved, the local bishop. Obviously if something in a dream contradicts Scripture or other clear divine revelation, then it is not divinely inspired. However, if it does not contradict, and it indeed draws you closer to a relationship with God, then you may regard it as inspired if it pleases you to do so.

2/7/2006 1:23:43 AM

^^I agree. I do not think you have to be a christian in order to add something to a discussion about God. I also understand the family and social issues that go along with choosing to be different. However, someone who wants to join a serious debate on religion would not use such charged language when engaging the people he/she intends to influence.

[Edited on February 7, 2006 at 1:30 AM. Reason : ^^]

2/7/2006 1:29:11 AM

Quote :

"However, someone who wants to join a serious debate on religion would not use such charged language when engaging the people he/she intends to influence. "

Haha... you must be new to the internet...

2/7/2006 1:48:10 AM

The problems we have had throughout history have been the faults of man, not faults of a religion.

Protostar typifies the renowned FroshKiller post.

2/7/2006 12:42:08 PM

Quote :

"Obviously if something in a dream contradicts Scripture or other clear divine revelation, then it is not divinely inspired. However, if it does not contradict, and it indeed draws you closer to a relationship with God, then you may regard it as inspired if it pleases you to do so. "

What if it does contradict, but in a way that makes you think the current version of scripture or church practices are in error. When testaments can trump each other, and throughout history people have seen fit to have spin off after spin off denominations, when is the contradictory feeling mean it was just a random dream, and when is it time to start your own spin off to reform or purify the church?

2/7/2006 12:49:39 PM

^

2/7/2006 4:13:01 PM

Quote :

"The problems we have had throughout history have been the faults of man, not faults of a religion."

Religion is a concoction of man. Man came first, then came the concoction that is religion, invented to explain the unexplainable to the dumb masses and to discriminate and repress "not our kind of people".

2/7/2006 4:27:41 PM

Quote :

"The problems we have had throughout history have been the faults of man, not faults of a religion. "

The problems we have had throughout history have been the faults of man, not faults of a government.


But organized governments are run by man, and I think governments should be held accountable.

2/7/2006 4:29:19 PM

Quote :

"Some parts of my family will not even speak to me because I donot bow down before their bland god. One family member has gone so far as to say I am not allowed to go near his child for fear of contaminating it with my "non beliefs". "

I sympathize. I bet most of my extended family would be the same way if they knew the extent of my disbelief. Congratulations on seeing past society's "lock steps". (I like to call them "automatic values".)

Quote :

"Lucky them."

Would Jesus approve of those sentiments, Chuck?

2/7/2006 7:15:37 PM

Quote :

"Religion is a concoction of man. Man came first, then came the concoction that is religion, invented to explain the unexplainable to the dumb masses and to discriminate and repress "not our kind of people"."

Nothing about the teachings of most major religions inherently discriminates or oppresses other people. The only time it comes close is when man distorts its principles to fit their own desires. The problem is not the ideals but how man misuses them. Most problems people have with religious groups are cultural ideals, not religious principles.

Quote :

"The problems we have had throughout history have been the faults of man, not faults of a government. But organized governments are run by man, and I think governments should be held accountable."

You are comparing two distinctly different things, a set of predefined religious principles vs. an operating body of governemnt. Denominations argue over what is more important or what is allowable, but the literal teachings of Christ do not change just the convenient interpretations. More accurate would be to compare principles of government to a religion. Communism is not inherrently flawed. It is a beautiful concept, but the pitfalls of man screw it up. In the same way you can blame chruches, like the Catholic church for its handling of the child molesters, but it is not condemning of the teachings of Christ. You can distort the message to fit an agenda but the problem is with the person who chooses to do it, not with the doctrine itself.

2/7/2006 11:25:02 PM

^^ Yes.

Quote :

"What if it does contradict, but in a way that makes you think the current version of scripture or church practices are in error."

Then it is not divinely inspired. It is erroneous and is trying to lead you into error.

Quote :

" When testaments can trump each other, and throughout history people have seen fit to have spin off after spin off denominations, when is the contradictory feeling mean it was just a random dream, and when is it time to start your own spin off to reform or purify the church?"

"People" have seen fit to spin off denominations, but that is not the way it is ordained by God. God's Ways are as far above man's ways as the heavens are above the earth.

And no testament ever trumps the other. The Bible, in toto, "trumps" everything.

[Edited on February 7, 2006 at 11:31 PM. Reason : add]

2/7/2006 11:29:23 PM

"You are comparing two distinctly different things"

^^religion & governments on the large level, and denominations & specific types of govs like communism on a more intimate level seem both seem like reasonable comparisons.

I think you comparison might have been better for getting at certain points, but I don't see any reason why mine doesn't hold.

Well the torah trumps the new testament cause it doesn't count in some ppls view, but jesus coming and making things less wrathful & more forgivey means the new testment trumps the old in other ppl's view. I'm sure on some high level the whole bible is held to be the truth, the word, the goodness and all that, but my point that with all the religious literature (such as the bible) and all the revelation out there, it can be hard deciding how much to value different parts (as an extension of how to value and judge dreams) is still a reasonable point.

2/8/2006 12:32:09 AM

Quote :

"religion & governments on the large level, and denominations & specific types of govs like communism on a more intimate level seem both seem like reasonable comparisons."

I think we are using the same words to represent different things. I don't think you can compare a specific government, lets say the current US administration, to a religion. Its more apt to comparing to a specific body that follows a religion, like the catholic church or southern baptists. A religion is simply the sum of beliefs and principles much like Marx's hypothesized communist government. You seemed to be comparing a religion to a principle of government in action (how the people use it) and that seems flawed to me. If anything it supports the notion "the problem is with man, not the religion/ideology." Communism has failed essentially everywhere but its not the fault of the principles but of the execution by the people. In other words, I don't see how someone can look at the teachings of Christ and say "This ain't nothin' but trouble."

As for the dreams stuff... I have no clue what you are talking about, haven't paid attention to that conversation line.

2/8/2006 10:36:57 AM

Quote :

"It doesn't take age to look at the past and see that religion has caused some of the greatest atrocities in human history. "

Yeah, so has progression of science (nuclear weapons), urbanization (countless plagues), even sex (STDs, not to mention the whole Trojan war). Yeah you heard me; simply enjoyling life has contributed to the world's gretest atrocities. Oh and in the 20th century Japan was accused of some of the most horrendous war crimes, and they are practically the least religious country on the planet.

Quote :

"My views are that all religions are cults. They seek to control their members and anyone who does not lockstep within their fanatical beliefs is persecuted."

Well, I'm Quaker. We don't believe in telling people what to do, as we don't even have any dogma. It's up to every individual to seek their own personal interpretation, but there are advantages to discussing our views as a group. In fact, there is no pastor to suggest that his interpretation is any better than everybody else's. These pacifists haven't persecuted anybody. For the most part, what I've read not only in the holy texts I value but in those of other religions, the teachings stress humility, forgiveness, love... fire and brimstone is a scare tactic that worked its way up some religious orders just as it has many political orders.

If you are really concerned about gays not being welcome in the Christian community, check out my brother's site: http://www.gaychristian.com

2/8/2006 9:19:03 PM

Look, it's pretty obvious: religion is THE DECEPTION; an cococted excuse to set one's self apart from the rest in self-made PositiveKingdom's and label all others 'negative' and HATE them, ruthlessly doing figurative carpentry on the merciless CrossOfShame.

Governments form in order to LIBERATE The People from religious tyranny -- from the very first government every formed in the past two millennia. Religion infiltrates, infects it's ThoughtVirus of special-interest HATRED for differences, divides, spoils, mocks, ridicules, and discriminates against so-called beloved-neighbors, lobbying government to hate by law, concocting the largest national debts in the history of the world, therefore undermining The Peoples' 'more perfect union.'

ALL TERRORISTS ARE RELIGIOUS.

These terrorist organizations concoct any excuse to dismiss their tyranny under the guise of 'peace/love' and 'we're so oppressed' -- plastic-faced images of wolves in sheeps clothing. They've pooled funds, cult with cult, denomination with denomination, religion with religion, conspiring to buy law for social-engineering.

This has ruined education, science, medicine, research and human achievement, binding and holding back all of humanity, like a dead-weight.

Life takes ZERO BELIEF. Only FICTION requires belief. It takes zero belief to know that fire is hot or what it feels like to be cold -- that up is toward the sky -- and that down is somewhere below your ass.

2/8/2006 11:33:07 PM

Someday, Protostar, you might understand.

Here's an old speech someone made on here once that I think will put you in your place.

Quote :

"Hi. You're probably new to the Wolf Web. In fact, I'm willing to bet you're new to college in general. It's an exciting time, isn't it? I'm sure that you have been exposed to many ideas and perspectives you'd never realized existed, and you're just bursting with enthusiasm at the thought of sharing a few ideas of your own with your peers now that you find yourself in an academic environment that seems perfectly suited to such an exchange. Why don't we go a little further? Odds are you consider yourself very intelligent. In fact, you're probably so intelligent that you've figured out all the quirks and kinks of organized religion--or at least Christianity. Yeah, that's it, isn't it? You were probably raised in a Christian household and resent that upbringing for limiting your personal freedoms, so it's only natural that you'd seek to undermine Christ's teachings and save others from having such a faulty belief system for their own good. Pretty cool of you, isn't it? You've really got it together. FUCK YOU YOU STUPID FUCKING FAGGOT COLLEGE KID LET ME TELL YOU A SECRET NONE OF YOUR THOUGHTS ON RELIGION ARE RADICAL OR EVEN THOUGHT-PROVOKING IT'S NO SECRET YOU GOT THEM OFF A FUCKING WEBSITE WE'VE ALL READ THE PROSELYTIZER QUESTIONNAIRE TOO NOTHING YOU CAN SAY IS GOING TO LEND A FRESH OUTLOOK DO YOU EVEN UNDERSTAND THAT FOR SEVERAL FUCKING CENTURIES NOW SOME OF THE MOST EDUCATED PEOPLE IN THE ANNALS OF HUMAN HISTORY HAVE DEVOTED THEIR LIVES TO ANSWERING DEEPER THEOLOGICAL CONCERNS THAN YOUR PETTY BULLSHIT ABOUT THE DISCREPANCIES IN THE GENEALOGIES OF CHRIST IN THE GOSPELS? I MEAN HOLY FUCK DO YOU THINK YOU'RE THE ONLY COCKSUCKER WHO EVER NOTICED THAT OR SOMETHING?! WAKE THE FUCK UP YOU'RE STILL JUST A STUPID KID AND WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO IS SHAMEFUL INCONSIDERATE AND DISRESPECTFUL BECAUSE MAYBE YOU'RE TOO MUCH OF A PUSSY TO LIVE ACCORDING TO A STRICT MORAL CODE AND MAYBE YOU'RE TOO MUCH OF A PUSSY TO ACTUALLY TRY AND DEVELOP A STRONG, HONORABLE CHARACTER BUT THAT DOESN'T MAKE IT RIGHT FOR YOU TO ATTACK MILLIONS UPON MILLIONS OF PEOPLE NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU TRY TO PLAY THE VICTIM TALKING ABOUT HOW THEY "FORCE THEIR BELIEFS" ON YOU BY HANDING OUT A FUCKING PAMPHLET I MEAN HOLY FUCKING CHRIST WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO IS TEN TIMES WORSE GET OVER YOURSELF ALREADY THIS REBELLION AGAINST MOMMY AND DADDY ISN'T IMPRESSING ANYONE WE'VE SEEN IT BEFORE YOU ARE NOT THE FIRST YOU ARE NOT EVEN REMARKABLE STOP ARGUING WITH GARY HE IS MAKING A FOOL OF YOU I SWEAR UPON THE BODY AND BLOOD OF THE PIERCED FUCKING JEW KING THAT IF YOU PULL THIS SALISBURYBOY, SYLVERSHADOW KIND OF SHIT ON ME YOU WORTHLESS WICCAN PANTYSTAIN I WILL SPLIT THE TENDER TISSUES OF YOUR WEEPING ASSHOLE WITH A HARDCOVER EDITION OF THE NEW INTERNATIONAL VERSION OF THE HOLY FUCKING BIBLE YOU THINK YOU'RE SO FUCKING SMART I'D LIKE TO SEE YOU DO THE SAME SHIT WITH ANY RELIGION BESIDES CHRISTIANITY OR JUDAISM WITH SOME BOOK BESIDES THE BIBLE OR THE TORAH YOU AIDS-FELCHING CUM FLAKE SO PUT THAT IN YOUR FUCKING PIPE YOU JUST BOUGHT FROM BUDDHA'S BELLY THE FIRST WEEKEND YOU WERE UP HERE AND SMOKE IT YOU FUCKING FAGGOT COLLEGE KID and that's my word."

Hate on me for posting the FroshKiller speech, but it needed to be quoted. Protostar, here's a little advice.

Faith and religion are as old as the hills. They are a fundamental part of human civilization. So if you fuck with the foundations, you fuck with everything. Why do you think humans have done the things they've done? Why do you think humans will do things that they would never do? Unadultered human nature would never allow us to do what we do. So for God's sake, shut the fuck up and at least give us with faith a little respect, ok?

2/8/2006 11:48:50 PM

Respect? Why should I give those with "faith in a bland god/goddess/pixie fairy" respect when they do not respect others ways of living their life? Religious HATEMONGERS constantly lobbying WeThePeople's government to pass laws restricting activites which might offend their "morals". Can I go out and buy the services of a prostitute? NO, because religious HATEMONGERS have said it is "immoral" and those who engage in it are wrong (ie: not our kind of people). Can I go out and buy weed, legally? NO, because the religious HATEMONGERS have declared it "immoral" and worthy of being banned. And if the CrotchWorshiping, goose stepping religious HATEMONGERS have their way,
EVERYTHING deemed immoral (read: pleasurable) will be banned and law breakers (ie: sinners) will be persecuted. Here you have the idiot Muslims, damn near trying to start a war over A FUCKING CARTOON!! And "loving, tolerant" Christians are no different. Lobbying for the passage of "HATE" laws, whose purpose is to repress and constrict "not our kind of people" and hammer them to the CrossOfShame for not lock stepping in with their bland religion. I have ZERO respect for the "tolerant" religious folk as they seek to force their brand of morality on everyone else. SO you can take that Froshkiller post and stick it up your ass, because I will continue to call out the religous folk of all "faiths" (read: cults of hate) for their Crotchworshiping, DeathWorshipping, HATEMONGERING, FEARMONGERING, goose stepping ways because thats exactly what they are: CrotchWorshipping, Deathworshipping, HATEMONGERING, FEARMONGERING, goose stepping idiots seeking to spread their misery to as many people as possible via laws or outright terrorism. RELIGION EQUALS DEATHWORSHIP!!!!

2/9/2006 12:13:03 AM

Quote :

"...and launches into a typical anecdote about his daughter, Ellie, who had a teacher (Mr. Pordy) who had no interest in nuance. When he asked his class why there's always been conflict in the Middle East, Ellie said it was "'a centuries-old religious conflict involving land and suspicion and culture and...'" Her teacher cut her off: "'Wrong,' Mr. Pordy said. 'It's because it's incredibly hot. And there's no water.'"

If christianity is right then religious people act out of high spiritual motivations which seems like a good thing. If not, if Christianity is just as wrong as every old religion called mythology and every other contemporary religion called misguided, then as in the quote above, they would be acting out of the same kinds of motivations everyone else does, just indirectly.

An agnostic can desire for social interaction/gatherings, can be desire to help others and be chariotious, can desire to be moral. And on the flip side an agnostic or athiest can be dumb, or prejudicial. I suppose, since most people start religious, that people who have changed their religion or become athiest have atleast put some thought into it (for the most part). But anyone who shows that they've put thought into their religious beliefs and isn't prejudicial or dumb is okay in my book.

2/9/2006 12:17:43 AM

such misinformed scorn. a bit hypocritical but commical at the same time.

i hope he is trolling

2/9/2006 12:30:27 AM

that vinatage21 deal is more a cult than anything....

Quote :

" In our efforts to build this church, Vintage21 is hosting a time of spiritual development and training for owners and regular attendees. We need shared time to strategize, repent, pray, plan, and focus the vision of the church. Beginning on January 24th at 7:00 pm, we will start having monthly gatherings to do just that. These meetings, held on the fourth Tuesday of each month, are going to be one of our main focuses for the coming year. Our goal is to make the gatherings so excellent, so informative, so Christ-centered that people will have to register to guarantee their spot. These gatherings will empower us as owners to build a church that transforms our world. Please make this a priority in your life. "

trying to start their own 'church'

what about JUST a discussion group and nothing more nothing less?

on a different note:

Quote :

"I do not think you have to be a christian in order to add something to a discussion about God."

true. but then again alot of what some people 'say' doesn't add much positive to the discussion...




i dont have a problem with different religions or beliefs or anything, i have a basic problem with fundamentalists, namely, violent fundamenatlists, those few people (most recently the islamic variety) in a religion that just can't seem to cope with the idea that other people may have valid but different beliefs than them, as a result of this inability to cope with this simple dis-association, they decide that everyone who doesn't think like them must be wrong and must be killed or in some other way desposed of, either here on earth or somewhere else.

it's those kind of shit-fuckers that really piss people off. case in point the recent islamic fundamentalist knee-jerks that have been happening in the last few years...

people as a rule like to do nothing but push the buttons of others for entertainment if nothing else

[Edited on February 9, 2006 at 3:15 AM. Reason : e]

2/9/2006 3:00:52 AM

bttt, so close to 2...

2/9/2006 9:40:15 PM

You know Protostar, reading those posts, I could swear you sound like some whiny little white liberal bitch.

2/10/2006 4:00:35 PM

Quote :

"Communism is not inherrently flawed. It is a beautiful concept, but the pitfalls of man screw it up."

Two inherent flaws come to mind immediately:
1. People don't get to choose their own values. They're told they must value the group, for whatever reason consistent with some screwed-up philosophy.
2. Some get what they don't deserve, while others lose what they do deserve.

Sorry if having a self-beneficial ethical point of view is a pitfall. (Note: this doesn't mean I hurt or take unfair advantage of others.)

Quote :

"If anything it supports the notion "the problem is with man, not the religion/ideology." Communism has failed essentially everywhere but its not the fault of the principles but of the execution by the people. In other words, I don't see how someone can look at the teachings of Christ and say "This ain't nothin' but trouble.""

You have the same flaw in viewing both. The fault IS with the principles. The values they teach conflict with humanity's fundamental judgments of goodness.

Quote :

"Oh and in the 20th century Japan was accused of some of the most horrendous war crimes, and they are practically the least religious country on the planet."

I blame culture, which is the same problem as religion.

Quote :

"You were probably raised in a Christian household and resent that upbringing for limiting your personal freedoms, ACTUALLY TRY AND DEVELOP A STRONG, HONORABLE CHARACTER THIS REBELLION AGAINST MOMMY AND DADDY ISN'T IMPRESSING ANYONE"

Frosh's quote is really overrated. Truth is, there are many of us that have legitimate complaints against the methods and ideologies under which we were raised. It has nothing to do with petty rebellion or being a "pussy". It has everything to do with being coerced to automatically believe and behave a certain way, and being punished for refusal. You can continue to DEVELOP A STRONG, HONORABLE CHARACTER by conforming to your surroundings, and I'll just REBELL AGAINST MOMMY AND DADDY with my desire for reason and truth.

[Edited on February 13, 2006 at 2:48 AM. Reason : ]

2/13/2006 2:45:31 AM

So close to... wait for it...

2/13/2006 8:18:19 AM