why can't you teach our team to rebound offensively and play a post/penetration style offense?

fundamental basketball teaches that you FOLLOW YOUR SHOT and box out for rebounds after the shot

you do not shoot the ball one time, pray it goes in and then set up on defense or for transition play. other than Atsur and Bennerman, i do not see anyone continuously penetrate the lane for either a shot or a rebound.

seriously, this is not a FIRE HERB thread. i just want to know why we do not do this as a team. i understand that we run a princeton style offense and they we depend on the 3 point shot alot. That, however, does not excuse the fact that the coach does not stress these two FUNDAMENTAL principles of basketball.

I do not want to hear the excuse "Herb teaches it but the players dont do it." That is a load of bullshit. It is the coach's job to instill this type of training in his players which he clearly does not. It is the coach's responsibility to focus his team to cover certain roles and follow certain drills. Herb obviously does not do this or we wouldnt have 4 guys in the backcourt as soon as the ball is shot.

if anyone has any input on this besides the common "HERB SUCKS FIRE HERB" comment, please post

i would love to hear some theories on this

2/23/2006 12:06:16 PM

this issue is seriously discussed in about 15 other threads, find one

2/23/2006 12:09:43 PM

Quote :

"you do not shoot the ball one time, pray it goes in and then set up on defense or for transition play."

I'm not trying to make excuses or shoot down your argument but Roy Williams' teams are all about fast, fast, fast transition offense.

A lot of our defensive plan probably involved trying to beat them to the other end following a shot to try and prevent this. Unfortunatly just beating the other team to the other end isn't really defense as was so painfully evidenced yesterday.

2/23/2006 12:12:20 PM

our players blew this one.

there is no other way to look at it. they didnt play defense.

2/23/2006 12:12:42 PM

What thoery do you want man

we're terrible at basketball.

2/23/2006 12:13:07 PM

i saw alot of issues discussed in other threads but i didnt see any SERIOUS thread about it

all of em seem to be hatred threads that i dont care to post in

i was looking for a serious theory as to WHY we don't do this

look if you want to complain about my thread, tell it to Carzin and have him delete it (if he feels it necessary)

dont come in here and bitch about it

[Edited on February 23, 2006 at 12:13 PM. Reason : ref to rwoody]

2/23/2006 12:13:24 PM

with herbs offense, they try to spread the floor, to open up the back door cuts. unfortunately the main thing that you give up when you do this is offensive rebounds. when everyone is spread out its hard to get to the basket after a quick outside shot. the offense is predicated on long offensive possessions, so quick shots kill us.
since herb has been here, we have consistently been one of the worst offensive rebounding teams in the conference

2/23/2006 12:22:27 PM

see now that is a good explanation


however, it still leaves the fact that NONE of our players FOLLOW THEIR SHOT

i understand that we need to spread the floor with this type of offense but why cant we follow our shots?

2/23/2006 12:23:39 PM

the "one question" in todays paper was better :x 5/10

2/23/2006 12:24:35 PM

just post it

2/23/2006 12:26:40 PM

when the floor is spread, defenders almost always have better postition for the rebound, its just hard to beat someone for the rebound (w/o fouling) when they have better established postion.

With that said, it doesn't mean they shouldn't try their asses off for the rebound anyway.

2/23/2006 12:27:12 PM

techinican page online is down. Mostly why in the holy fuck do we use ced to set high screens at the top of the key.

it's awesome to have an original offense. but when you have a talent like lil head you'd think it'd be slightly possible to alter it some and get him down low for more touches.

2/23/2006 12:28:11 PM

we play a transition defense. you have to make a choice between doing that and crashing the boards.

2/23/2006 12:29:05 PM

yep....

that's the trade off.

Imagine how angry everyone would be if we always crashed the boards hard ... but one or two times we crashed the boards and dindt get the rebound.... quick outlet pass and we give up a fast break 2 or 3v1 layup


in this system we dont get many rebounds but we get back and stop the fastbreak inorder to get in our half court defense to make a stop.

This works well on any night you're not shooting 2 for 3xxxx from 3 and not hitting any big shots at all. we had about the same ppp as unc but we gave them 11 more possessions in the first half. gotta hit shots if you're going to give up rebounds.

2/23/2006 12:33:02 PM

^^ A lot of it has to do with correct positioning (boxing out) which is something that is taught.

How many times did a tarhole get a rebound and a put back when 3-4 Wolfpackers around him? Rebounding is all about boxing out your man and desire. Carolina had great technique and played with a ton of desire while our guys were going through the motions.

[Edited on February 23, 2006 at 12:34 PM. Reason : ]

2/23/2006 12:34:33 PM

we've had one of the best FG% defenses in the nation all year, and we wouldn't be able to do that w/out our transition defesne.

2/23/2006 12:34:43 PM

FG percentages are deceptive when the other team gets 3-4 shots every possession from all of the offensive rebounds.

2/23/2006 12:35:27 PM

all i know is im sick of our "original" offense that any team with coaching skill can get around

2/23/2006 12:35:57 PM

not to mention our OFFENSE is constanlty moving and we dont always have people in the paint for the boards.

2/23/2006 12:36:37 PM

yep anyone can beat us. that 21-6 record is just a fluke

2/23/2006 12:36:56 PM

^ There's a good reason why only 4 teams from the ACC will make the Tourney this year.

2/23/2006 12:40:36 PM

Quote :

"all i know is im sick of our "original" offense that any team with coaching skill can get around"

our offense is dependent on a lot of things

i thought the princeton offense was designed to stay competitive against more athletic teams, but we always seem to fall flat on our face in that scenario

that being said i don't want this to turn into another "WTF Princeton Offense WTF " thread

2/23/2006 12:40:43 PM

^^how bout a top-10 ranked GW team that we destroyed by 21?

2/23/2006 12:41:32 PM

We were clearly a better team at the start of the season. GW was a good win. Still doesn't make up for losing to uncch TWICE when we have experience and talent on our side.

2/23/2006 12:42:53 PM

^^ Weakest argument ever


The next toughest team they've played is Maryland. After that, it's UNCC.

Gimme a break. They're not bad, but they're ridiculously overrated

2/23/2006 1:02:27 PM

i dont care if our players are not athletic, make em be!
condition those motherfuckers herb, you probably spend all practice shooting threes and working the motion offense. make em sprint for a full day

2/23/2006 1:04:20 PM

I would like us to just JUMP when we're trying to rebound. They dont call over the back when players are flying over you and actually playing good basketball.

2/23/2006 1:27:21 PM