OK i am trying to understand this law. last night on brent road a whole bunch of people got tickets. but there was no complaints phoned in, the officer was just driving up and down the street looking for any sign of noise or people on the front porch or anything. Is this a justified, and legal, reason to give a ticket? Furthermore. One party got a ticket and while he was writing a ticket at another he told the people that the reason they were getting a ticket is because the first party said it wasnt fair they were getting tickets (which i am told the first party did not do, and i have due reason to fully believe the first party as well as understand why the second party was pissed off) Is this legal for the officer to openly say something (which from what it seems is a lie) to another group of citizens about someone else?

2/26/2006 1:51:51 PM

This isn't about the law. Its about the law thumbing it's nose at college students. Just be thankful that you aren't a police officer and that one day you will be a successful engineer and they will still be a police officer.

[Edited on February 26, 2006 at 1:57 PM. Reason : Let's focus on the real crime please]

2/26/2006 1:57:14 PM

they do it on TV crime shows all the time.

but as far as real life i dunno.

2/26/2006 1:57:20 PM

NPO is written so subjectively and vaguely that they can pretty much enforce it however they want.

2/26/2006 1:57:34 PM

Police can do whatever the fuck they want, especially to college students.

Learn to love it. It's his word against yours. Always. Combine this with the cops that you know are making a janitor's salary and hate students because they're going somewhere/going to make much, much more. Combine this yet again with a needle-dick and a power-trip inversely proportional to its size, and you get the RPD.

2/26/2006 1:58:33 PM

What was the officers name?

2/26/2006 2:05:42 PM

dont know, let me find out.. why?

also does anyone know how/ where i can look up the exact law and find any precedents on both the law and the officers actions?

2/26/2006 2:12:38 PM

http://www.brentroad.com/message_search.aspx?type=topic&searchstring=NPO&username=&usertype=match&sortby=date&sortorder=descending&page=

2/26/2006 2:14:03 PM

http://students.ncsu.edu/senate/bills.php?lid=04&s=03

2/26/2006 2:19:39 PM

http://www.thewolfweb.com/story.aspx?story=425

http://www.thewolfweb.com/story.aspx?story=533

http://www.acluofnorthcarolina.org/page74.html

http://www.officer.com/news/IBS/wral/news-2019727.html

oh yeah and thank this douchebag for writing the ordinance
http://www.bensonkirkman.org/pubsafeimp.shtml

[Edited on February 26, 2006 at 2:26 PM. Reason : ]

2/26/2006 2:20:33 PM

hey sweet thanks. im doing as much research as possible. from what i am finding, a lot of people who fought it won, unless they have an outrageous police officer who decides to lie about it all. i know that everyone has been talking/ bitching ab this NPO for going on 6 years now, what i cant get is why its still in place. also im still working on finding out if an officer can disclose information from one citizen to another. that should be grounds for all tickets to be dropped.

2/26/2006 2:28:52 PM

i don't know that you will get far with that argument. if you plan on fighting it you may want to go ahead and retain an attorney because the cop wont even be at your first few court dates if it is in disposition court.

if you do ten hours of volunteer work and bring in a letter saying you did they will dismiss it. that is why most people dont fight them anymore. the public backlash has kind of died out over the whole thing since they got rid of officer bowem and stopped making people do a shit ton of community service to get it dismissed.

[Edited on February 26, 2006 at 2:39 PM. Reason : ]

2/26/2006 2:39:06 PM

well thanks again, and if anyone else has comments feel free to share. im gonna go spend some time researching and probably hit up student legal services this week.

2/26/2006 3:02:36 PM

basically, it's not justified, and i don't see how it could possibly be construed as Constitutional, but it is legal, and you're a college student with no influence or money, so nobody really gives a damn.

2/26/2006 3:35:17 PM

I've been lied to by an officer that was trying to coerce something out of me, this is definitely not something new.

Like I didn't know in my head that you can't be polygraphed at any old police station.

2/26/2006 3:40:22 PM

Quote :

"what i cant get is why its still in place. "

Because students like you do not vote.

2/26/2006 3:46:30 PM

from the last party i had from what i know they can just ride around and listen and write tickets to loud parties/don't need a complaint. that's what the cop told me at least--he just rides around looking for parties that are too loud. but he was really cool and since everyone at the party was over 21 he just told us to turn the music down and keep it inside (we were all on the front porch...small party...only about 12 of us or so)

2/26/2006 4:06:15 PM

really and truly, they shouldn't allow underage drinking to go on in a large, public fashion "IE BRENT ROAD". The problem they're aiming at is underage drinking. If you want to change this law, lobby to drop the drinking age.

2/26/2006 4:33:08 PM

or just dont have people under 21 at your party

2/26/2006 4:42:32 PM

where is student legal services.... i got one of those citations last night as well

2/26/2006 4:45:18 PM

This has nothing to do with underage drinking. It has to do with noise complaints, litter, and politics. If the cops were looking for underage drinkers they would use more covert means than walking up to the front door in uniform.

[Edited on February 26, 2006 at 4:52 PM. Reason : ]

2/26/2006 4:48:20 PM

you're wrong, it has everything to do with underage drinking

I've been to plenty of adult parties wild or wilder than the party in question, and they have absolutely no problems

when you want to have only of-age people drinking at your parties, then you will stop having problems with the police

case closed

2/26/2006 5:00:53 PM

Thats why when the RPD busts a party they write so many underage drinking tickets.

2/26/2006 5:07:46 PM

Quote :

"Furthermore. One party got a ticket and while he was writing a ticket at another he told the people that the reason they were getting a ticket is because the first party said it wasnt fair they were getting tickets (which i am told the first party did not do, and i have due reason to fully believe the first party as well as understand why the second party was pissed off) Is this legal for the officer to openly say something (which from what it seems is a lie) to another group of citizens about someone else? "

plz learn english

2/26/2006 5:13:33 PM

Quote :

"you're wrong, it has everything to do with underage drinking I've been to plenty of adult parties wild or wilder than the party in question, and they have absolutely no problems"

could also be because college students are comparatively powerless to do anything about it. you go around screwing with professionals with the means to fight back (and sometimes influence with the powers that be), it's a different fight.

2/26/2006 7:27:11 PM

Quote :

"Because students like you do not vote."

i did vote on that shit, thanks tho

Quote :

"where is student legal services.... i got one of those citations last night as well"

on campus, check http://www.ncsu.edu/stud_affairs/legal_services/

Quote :

"could also be because college students are comparatively powerless to do anything about it. you go around screwing with professionals with the means to fight back (and sometimes influence with the powers that be), it's a different fight. "

i would have to agree with you. im not saying all police are out to get college students, but some are a lot more disrespectful towards us. what they dont get is most of us work our asses off during the week and are just looking for a way to unwind on the weekends. neither of the parties i refered to had more than 20 people in the house, neither was pumping loud music, neither had anything crazy going on unless you consider beer pong outrageous.

2/26/2006 9:00:22 PM

Quote :

"where is student legal services.... i got one of those citations last night as well "

They likely won't represent you, I think it violates the boundaries of their service.

If you want to chat about it PM me.

2/26/2006 9:01:37 PM

^^right...if they started busting things up every time a couple dozen middle-aged people got together in Lochmere or something, the shit would hit the fan with the quickness.

2/26/2006 9:25:48 PM

Quote :

"i would have to agree with you. im not saying all police are out to get college students, but some are a lot more disrespectful towards us. what they dont get is most of us work our asses off during the week and are just looking for a way to unwind on the weekends. neither of the parties i refered to had more than 20 people in the house, neither was pumping loud music, neither had anything crazy going on unless you consider beer pong outrageous."

looks like they are back up to the same old shit again. its fucking bullshit.

2/26/2006 11:10:30 PM

I find it funny that people are getting robbed and murdered, yet the cops would rather go around writing NPO tickets. Seriously, do they not have anything better to do?

[Edited on February 27, 2006 at 10:51 AM. Reason : ]

2/27/2006 10:51:16 AM

We got a NPO ticket for having people outside the fraternity house playing basketball late at night. They could have at least gave us a warning. We are thinking about fighting it too.

2/27/2006 11:21:47 AM

Hey Beth.

2/27/2006 12:04:53 PM

reading this just makes me even madder at the shit ass police in this country. They serve no damn purpose. Fuckin sorry ass mother fuckers. Go solve these violent crimes and get the real skum out of here, not wasting time writing traffic tickets and entrapping college students. Get a fucking life

2/27/2006 12:12:04 PM

i received an NPO ticket on December 9th....i was intent on fighting it until the end because as said before, the ordinance is extremely bogus. i had letters from my neighbors and even an email from the mayor as proof that i was not a nuisance.

basically, i went through 3 rounds of court without even having my case heard. it was becoming such a waste of time that i eventually just accepted the 10 hours of community service for dismissal of the charge....

i would encourage everyone who gets an NPO ticket to email the mayor and city councilmen. i wrote a lengthy email to them describing the circumstances and how i believe the ordinance unfairly targets students. i ended up with 4 responses including one from the mayor saying he thought this was supposed to be a warn-first policy. here is their contact info:

Philip Isley
Council Member,
District E
pisley@boyceisley.com

Thomas Crowder
Council Member,
District D
Thomas.Crowder@ci.raleigh.nc.us

Jessie Taliaferro
Council Member,
District B
Jessie.Taliaferro@ci.raleigh.nc.us

Tommy Craven
Council Member,
District A
tfcraven@nc.rr.com

Joyce Kekas
Council Member,
At-Large
Joyce.Kekas@ci.raleigh.nc.us

Russ Stephenson
Council Member,
At-Large
Russ.Stephenson@ci.raleigh.nc.us


James West
Council Member,
District C
Mayor Pro Tempore
James.West@ci.raleigh.nc.us

Charles Meeker
Mayor
Charles.Meeker@ci.raleigh.nc.us

2/27/2006 3:43:31 PM

hahaha

college kids are so fucking stupid today.

cops are just jealous im gonna make more money than they do!!

hahaha you sound like a bunch of fucking punks.

[Edited on February 27, 2006 at 3:54 PM. Reason : ENTIRE COUNTRY!! FULL OF THEM< ALL USELESS!!! ]

2/27/2006 3:53:01 PM

Quote :

"We got a NPO ticket for having people outside the fraternity house playing basketball late at night. They could have at least gave us a warning. We are thinking about fighting it too."

wow

that's REALLY some bullshit. definitely fight it, if on principle if nothing else.

2/27/2006 5:10:14 PM

REFUSE to sign the ticket. The cop has to PROVE you were making noise. MAKE A SCENE and demand the officer call his supervisor. Speak plainly and clearly with the supervisor about the situation and how you didn't know you were making noise that violated the NPO OR you disagree it was.

READ the ticket. By signing you admit to doing the offense.

REFUSE to show your ID until a supervisor shows up and you talk to him. Raleigh RPD just hired like 20 new officers for the NCSU area. They are out to prove themselves and you're getting the shaft basically.

TELL the officer you do not agree and would like a supervisor to come and review the situation. Tell him you have the right to request that because you do.

2/27/2006 5:45:54 PM

^are you speaking from personal experience?

i argued with the cop for about 45 minutes very professionally and coherently. i even had every neighbor who was at my party speak to him. plus...i never signed anything.

i still got a ticket and i still had to go to court

2/27/2006 7:57:59 PM

That post is fucking bullshit the ticket is enforceable regardless of wether or not you sign. The signature square is only to acknowlege you have a court date. (It says so plainly on the ticket)

2/27/2006 11:24:30 PM

Signing the ticket does not admit guilt, it admits you got a copy of the ticket.

Quote :

"reading this just makes me even madder at the shit ass police in this country. They serve no damn purpose. Fuckin sorry ass mother fuckers. Go solve these violent crimes and get the real skum out of here, not wasting time writing traffic tickets and entrapping college students. Get a fucking life "

It's not the cops' fault most of the time - they have to enforce the law whether they like it or not. I agree it is a ridiculous law.

2/28/2006 9:53:56 AM

Quote :

"reading this just makes me even madder at the shit ass police in this country. They serve no damn purpose."

That quote is fucking stupid. Maybe RPD sucks ass in your opinion but police in cities like New York, Chicago, LA, Boston, etc are the lifeblood of the city. Blanket statements are ignorant..

[Edited on February 28, 2006 at 9:57 AM. Reason : f]

2/28/2006 9:56:55 AM

yeah, he clearly doesnt know what he is talking about. i tried that a long time ago and the cop just wrote "refused, copy delivered" or something like that in the box. actually now that i think about it, i dont think i have ever signed a ticket. it doesnt matter

2/28/2006 9:57:27 AM

^6 Yeah, so if you piss off the cop by calling in his supervisor, then they're even more likely to show up in court to bust your ass there and who do you think the judge is going to believe? The cop or some college kid? Just take the community service and be done with it, it's not like you can't do a whole day of habitat for humanity and knock it out all at once.

[Edited on February 28, 2006 at 9:57 AM. Reason : ]

2/28/2006 9:57:30 AM

Quote :

"REFUSE to sign the ticket. The cop has to PROVE you were making noise. MAKE A SCENE and demand the officer call his supervisor. Speak plainly and clearly with the supervisor about the situation and how you didn't know you were making noise that violated the NPO OR you disagree it was. READ the ticket. By signing you admit to doing the offense. REFUSE to show your ID until a supervisor shows up and you talk to him. Raleigh RPD just hired like 20 new officers for the NCSU area. They are out to prove themselves and you're getting the shaft basically. TELL the officer you do not agree and would like a supervisor to come and review the situation. Tell him you have the right to request that because you do."

i have a feeling that if someone (drunk college student) failed to cooperate with a police officer they would start to hear "sure, you can talk to my supervisor downtown. you have the right to remain silent..."

2/28/2006 9:57:56 AM

Quote :

"who do you think the judge is going to believe? The cop or some college kid? "

actually, you would be surprised. we are talking about college kids here. its not like its a cops word versus a crackheads word. i cant stress it enough. go to court and be heard, youre gonna have to pay court costs either way. if you want to lawyer up, try to find a lawyer that will represent you all for a discounted rate per person. if i just plead guilty for everything ive ever been accused of, i wouldnt have a drivers license for sure, and i would likely be in prison. just cause youre charged with it doesnt mean you are guilty of it!

2/28/2006 10:01:29 AM

Quote :

"Yeah, so if you piss off the cop by calling in his supervisor, then they're even more likely to show up in court to bust your ass"

State prosecutors generally don't want to deal with nuisance tickets, they have bigger things to worry with, so they are usually willing to plead it down, or even dismiss entirely for the first offense, etc. However, if you are obnoxious with the police officer, they often have an "understanding" that the officer will mark a little symbol like a star or something on the ticket, and the prosecutor knows that means that this person was belligerant with the officer, and the prosecutor will not deal with that person.

2/28/2006 10:01:57 AM

ive never seen the star thing, but the officer is almost always there when you go before the judge. and the judge will usually ask the officer if they agree with the reduced charges / PJC / whatever.... and for a summary of what happened... 95% of the time the cop just says "i pulled such and such over for speeding on blah blah date. the defendant was polite and cooperative"

2/28/2006 10:04:17 AM

Quote :

"This isn't about the law. Its about the law thumbing it's nose at college students. Just be thankful that you aren't a police officer and that one day you will be a successful engineer and they will still be a police officer. "

I went to ncsu, and i am becoming a cop, but i dont take offense to what you said. Yes i will make less, but i feel it is very importaint to try to be fair and level with everyone. I know how it is to be a college kid, and i wont forget that, and i'll try to teach a few officers what it was like too. I saw good cops and bad cops, I want to be a good cop. one that doesnt just let people go party, but one who says "alright, lets be smart, no drinking and driving, no stupidness, i'll be watching nearby, have fun be safe"

We need officers who dont let people go, but who also dont try to be Mr. Saftey 300%. We need officers who will know when to lay the law, but importaintly know when to guide, observe and protect the goodtimes.

I AM Wolf2Ranger, and THATS MY VIEW!
(i honestly want to be fair, no bs)
i know i cant spell

[Edited on February 28, 2006 at 10:09 AM. Reason : .]

2/28/2006 10:07:46 AM

Wolfpack2K said:

Quote :

"However, if you are obnoxious with the police officer, they often have an "understanding" that the officer will mark a little symbol like a star or something on the ticket, and the prosecutor knows that means that this person was belligerant with the officer, and the prosecutor will not deal with that person."

I call bullshit. Why would they bother having some kind of gay, supralegal little code system when there's a spot right there on the ticket for notes about the offender's behavior?

2/28/2006 10:08:11 AM

Quote :

"I call bullshit. Why would they bother having some kind of gay, supralegal little code system when there's a spot right there on the ticket for notes about the offender's behavior?"

I know a few cops who everytime they write a ticket, get a call, talkto someone... they take notes. and those notes can save your ass or burn your ass in court. They do mark if you were nice/not nice, and it may play a role (maybe small) in wiether you get a $200 or $100 fine for example

2/28/2006 10:11:34 AM