wtf?

Quote :

"• Ethiopian planes bomb the Islamist-held airport in Mogadishu, Somalia • Attacks come after Ethiopia formally declares war • Analysts say Ethiopia seems to have halted initial Islamist assault • Ethopia and U.S. say Islamists backed by al Qaeda"

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/africa/12/25/somalia.jets.reut/index.html

12/25/2006 2:47:04 PM

its just more islamists vs. westerners, hardly a wtf

12/25/2006 3:02:26 PM

Isn't Ethiopia one of those countries that gets food donations? How the hell do they have enough money for planes but not for food?

12/25/2006 3:26:15 PM

Ethiopia, like all bat-shit-insane countries, has plenty of rich elites. It is everyone else that starves to death.

12/25/2006 3:43:31 PM

ethiopia is backed by western nations

12/25/2006 3:45:49 PM

^^hail capitalism.

12/25/2006 4:07:52 PM

about the starving people, that's pretty much it - its the dark side of capitalism

12/25/2006 4:39:17 PM

CLINTON DID IT

12/25/2006 5:23:47 PM

someone needs to be annexing someone else

make it old school

make it interesting

12/25/2006 6:45:57 PM

I wonder if they drop bags of rice instead of bombs

12/25/2006 7:29:49 PM

Ethipoia is the only christian african country

fyi

12/25/2006 7:37:23 PM

Maj. Gen. Sally Struthers is in charge of planning the initial wave of ground attacks

12/25/2006 7:55:06 PM

Ethiopia had to build a military a while back because of their war with Eritrea, which is currently siding with the Islamists.

So basically Ethiopia and half of Somalia vs. Eritrea and the other half of Somalia

If we could just get those pussy-ass pacifists in Djibouti to pick a side we could make a proper war of it.

12/25/2006 9:52:37 PM

Djibouti.

Always makes me chuckle.

12/25/2006 11:00:55 PM

MOMMA SAY SON SAY YA GOTTA DJIBOU
MOMMA SAY YA GOTTA DJIBOU

12/25/2006 11:12:09 PM

THIS IS NOT A LAUGHING MATTER, BRIDGET

















oh, i just got it. hehehe

12/25/2006 11:14:13 PM

Wait, so whenever some are prospering at the expense of others we call it capitalism?

Bull Shit. They are rich because they are war lords, not the other-way-around.

Don't believe me? Go, start a business, and see how long until the men with guns come along to confiscate your capital. Then you will know that in Africa capital only rules when it is in the hands of men with guns.

Compare that to western capitalism where all capital competes equally (well, as far as congress allows).

[Edited on December 25, 2006 at 11:22 PM. Reason : .,.]

12/25/2006 11:18:57 PM

Quote :

"Ethipoia is the only christian african country"

A number of African countries have majority Christian populations, and according to the CIA world factbook, Ethiopia isn't one of them.

Quote :

" Muslim 45%-50%, Ethiopian Orthodox 35%-40%, animist 12%, other 3%-8%"

That said, the Christians do have a substantial amount of influence there, and Ethiopia's Islam, from what I understand, is not the hardline scary kind.

[Edited on December 25, 2006 at 11:36 PM. Reason : ]

12/25/2006 11:34:37 PM

Quote :

"Then you will know that in Africa capital only rules when it is in the hands of men with guns. "

Did someone watch "Blood Diamond" for Christmas?

12/26/2006 1:40:50 AM

whats interesting is that there was an article in the paper about somalia from just a few days ago talking about how US policy in the region was pissing people off and getting more recruits for the islamisists (sp?) in Somalia because the whole country thinks we support Ethiopian incurssions. Then 2 days later this happens. It should be a fun war to watch from the sidelines.

12/26/2006 1:55:06 AM

^^^ hmmmmmm

historically christian countries.

as in before Europe was christian.

[Edited on December 26, 2006 at 2:02 AM. Reason : ^^^]

12/26/2006 2:02:22 AM

Meh, Egypt had a large Christian population around the same time as Ethiopia, and while the Copts aren't quite as powerful in Egypt as in Ethiopia, they still represent a sizeable majority. Besides, by that standard, the only countries in the world that are "historically Christian" might be those two and Armenia.

12/26/2006 3:14:29 AM

^^ oh, so in other words, your point was worthless and has no relevance to the present.

cool.

12/26/2006 8:32:35 AM

Quote :

"Wait, so whenever some are prospering at the expense of others we call it capitalism? Bull Shit. They are rich because they are war lords, not the other-way-around. "

Oh whatever Mr. Blind From the Capitalist Light. You know damn well that the scale of evil vs good rich tilts heavily in the favor of the evil and that "at the expense of others" is basically a tenant of capitalism.

12/26/2006 9:02:14 AM

you mean tenet?

Or were you trying to draw a complex metaphor where Capitalism is renting out some office space to Evil?

That would be clever!

12/26/2006 9:29:05 AM

Quote :

"Oh whatever Mr. Blind From the Capitalist Light. You know damn well that the scale of evil vs good rich tilts heavily in the favor of the evil and that "at the expense of others" is basically a tenant of capitalism."

Wow, that is utterly ridiculous. The whole concept and practice of capitalism is that their selfishness ends up benefiting the masses, and it works very well.

What exactly are the "evil rich" and how are you so sure they outweigh the "good rich"? It sounds to me like you either have a very sensitive definition of evil or a ridiculously incorrect view of people.

Oh and gg BD, lol

12/26/2006 9:39:22 AM

Eh, I knew I had tenet spelled wrong, but was lazy with letting firefox correct it for me.

Quote :

"The whole concept and practice of capitalism is that their selfishness ends up benefiting the masses, and it works very well."

Works very well??!!! HAHAHHAAHHA

Tell that to the families of cotton mill workers that don't have insurance because they can't pay the 4000 month required to insure their families now that the business has moved to mexico and left them without a job.

And don't go extolling to me about how they can now put those "bodies" (don't you love the heart of capitalism!!) to work for the common good doing something else.

I'm not saying capitalism isn't the better (or even best) system out there, I'm just saying those of you that don't realize that, on the whole, the humans that are driving the system are inherently evil and could care less for fellow man in its pursuit of the almighty dollar, are blind.

12/26/2006 10:33:46 AM

So what's your solution? Can factories never upgrade, because that may make workers more productive and reduce the number of required workers? Can factories never retool to make different (and better selling) products if it might result in the loss of jobs or lower wages?

You're confusing change with evil. Our economy has evolved from agrarian to industrial and is now moving towards technology/services. The change is certainly painful for some of those involved (steel mill, cotton mills, small farmers, etc.), but you'd have a hard time convincing anyone that society as a whole is worse off now than in the past.

12/26/2006 11:47:07 AM

Quote :

"Tell that to the families of cotton mill workers that don't have insurance because they can't pay the 4000 month required to insure their families now that the business has moved to mexico and left them without a job. "

What about the families of workers in mexico that wish they had enough money to be worried that they can't afford insurance. Surely they are as deserving of a job as anyone else no?

12/26/2006 12:12:25 PM

no no, we have to think of the poor people and their plight.

as long as they are Americans.

12/26/2006 12:14:43 PM

^^ That's an interesting comment coming from one of the most republican/libertarian posters on the board.

I'm not debating when capitalism works, it works well. I'm simply stating that on the average, people in general are greedy evil folks, and this isn't realized in a better way than by capitalism.

12/26/2006 12:27:48 PM

Exactly. I'd rather be poor. Poor people are always happy and dancing and full of culture.

12/26/2006 12:48:36 PM

I think capitalism rewards lower classes far better then any other instituted form of economy other then true communism.

12/26/2006 12:49:33 PM

Quote :

"What about the families of workers in mexico that wish they had enough money to be worried that they can't afford insurance. Surely they are as deserving of a job as anyone else no?"

Depends on the job. Do they deserve jobs where they have to live in cardboard shacks and earn 10 cents a day? I doubt it. Or do they deserve jobs with a decent wage?

I can tell you which one unregulated capitalism has gotten them.

12/26/2006 1:23:10 PM

Quote :

"I'm not debating when capitalism works, it works well. I'm simply stating that on the average, people in general are greedy evil folks, and this isn't realized in a better way than by capitalism."

I think your definition of evil is absurd. Evil is wanting something better for yourself.

Quote :

"That's an interesting comment coming from one of the most republican/libertarian posters on the board."

What kind of retarded-ass comment is that? It is going to be the libertarians that think we should capitalism take the jobs to where they are most valuable, being Mexico or America or wherever. I do think it is interesting that a lot of liberals are so worried about what is going on in the world and bitch about foreign aid being needed, when they simultaneously try to prevent the job migration that creates wealth in those poor countries.

Quote :

""Tell that to the families of cotton mill workers that don't have insurance because they can't pay the 4000 month required to insure their families now that the business has moved to mexico and left them without a job."

I'm from a mill-family. My dad has worked for many textile companies (and I have worked for one myself). Don't come to me talking about the plight of those people, because you have no idea what you are talking about. Sure, a lot of them are poor, but most of them make pretty decent money and stay poor because they like to have new chevy's and racing tickets instead of saving for their senior years.

12/26/2006 1:52:37 PM

Quote :

"on the whole, the humans that are driving the system are inherently evil and could care less for fellow man"

"It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker, that we expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own interest."

In other words, Thank God that the capitalists do not care about us, if they did then it would interfere with their efforts to maximize the return on their capital; which would reduce the overall return to society; which would, over time, make all of mankind substantially poorer, even the poorest among us.

[Edited on December 26, 2006 at 2:15 PM. Reason : .,.]

12/26/2006 2:11:24 PM

Quote :

"Oh whatever Mr. Blind From the Capitalist Light. You know damn well that the scale of evil vs good rich tilts heavily in the favor of the evil and that "at the expense of others" is basically a tenant of capitalism."

I just threw up a little in my mouth.

12/26/2006 2:20:53 PM

Quote :

"I'm from a mill-family. My dad has worked for many textile companies (and I have worked for one myself). Don't come to me talking about the plight of those people, because you have no idea what you are talking about. Sure, a lot of them are poor, but most of them make pretty decent money and stay poor because they like to have new chevy's and racing tickets instead of saving for their senior years."

I'm sitting in Kannapolis at the moment, about 2 miles from where Cannon Mills/Pillowtex used to stand. I can personally give you the addresses of 2 families that had their SAVINGS, their motherfucking savings wiped out paying for insurance over the past couple of years.

It isn't just the mills closing that fucked them, it's the insurance companies...you know, some of the ultimate capitalist...that fucked them too.

Quote :

"In other words, Thank God that the capitalists do not care about us, if they did then it would interfere with their efforts to maximize the return on their capital; which would reduce the overall return to society; which would, over time, make all of mankind substantially poorer, even the poorest among us."

Or stated another way, they will rape and pillage the land to make a buck. Then, when they have exhausted that outlet, they'll figure out another way to make a buck.

You folks haven't done too much to convince me that we as people aren't inherently evil and looking out for our own interests first and foremost.

[Edited on December 26, 2006 at 3:20 PM. Reason : a]

12/26/2006 3:20:27 PM

Quote :

"I'm sitting in Kannapolis at the moment, about 2 miles from where Cannon Mills/Pillowtex used to stand. I can personally give you the addresses of 2 families that had their SAVINGS, their motherfucking savings wiped out paying for insurance over the past couple of years."

2 families? Holy Hell it must be a global trend!

Also, you didn't tell me anything about how much those savings were. Were they consistently saving 10% or more of their income and were still wiped out.

Quote :

"You folks haven't done too much to convince me that we as people aren't inherently evil and looking out for our own interests first and foremost."

You haven't done too much to convince me that being "evil" by looking out for your own interests first and foremost is a problem. Its an instinct given to all animals and it has worked damn well to bring up global standards of living over the past 300 years.

[Edited on December 26, 2006 at 3:40 PM. Reason : .]

12/26/2006 3:38:02 PM

The majority of this thread is Capitalism vs. Other systems.

I thought it was about Ethiopia vs. Somalia.

You know what's really funny in a sick way; the two most popularized (notorious) countries when it comes to pics of starving people, are Ethiopia and Somalia!!! And now they are fighting a war with weapons that could have been food, amenities, education, etc.

Africans are damned, for a few more centuries to come.

12/26/2006 4:13:19 PM

Quote :

"You folks haven't done too much to convince me that we as people aren't inherently evil and looking out for our own interests first and foremost."

You apparently did not understand my simple statement: what you are saying is true, we only care about our own interests first and foremost. Capitalism is the system we use to convert greed and selfishness into the service of others.

"It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker, that we expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own interest." - Adam Smith

Now, whether or not we are inherently evil or not is irrelevant. If all humans are inherently evil then Capitalism will produce the most good. In all humans are angels then it doesn't matter what system you use.

12/26/2006 5:07:35 PM

Quote :

"looking out for our own interests first and foremost."

You're an idiot if you believe that anyone--regardless of race, crede, religion, socio-economic status, government, blood type, or any other classification--does not evaluate nearly everything in terms of their own self-interest.

12/26/2006 5:12:11 PM

Quote :

""It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker, that we expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own interest." - Adam Smith"

what did people ever do before capitalism.

besides, I make my own bread

12/26/2006 5:16:37 PM

Quote :

"2 families? Holy Hell it must be a global trend!"

Those are just 2 that I know personally. It's really not worth mentioning the countless "stories" I have heard in passing at lunch and in other places in the months/year that followed the closing of the plant.

Quote :

"Also, you didn't tell me anything about how much those savings were. Were they consistently saving 10% or more of their income and were still wiped out."

Now what kinda fucking mill worker who intends on working through until he is 65 or 70 can even think to save enough to withstand being on the hook for 4k a month in insurance costs, on top of all the other costs to live.

Quote :

"You haven't done too much to convince me that being "evil" by looking out for your own interests first and foremost is a problem. Its an instinct given to all animals and it has worked damn well to bring up global standards of living over the past 300 years."

Oh I wouldn't be so quick to proclaim the instinct to "look out for ourselves" as being the reason the standards of living have gone up in 300 years. I mean, Chinese folks in sweat shops will probably agree with you though, that capitalism is working wonders for them!!!

Quote :

"Now, whether or not we are inherently evil or not is irrelevant. If all humans are inherently evil then Capitalism will produce the most good. In all humans are angels then it doesn't matter what system you use."

Whether capitalism will produce the most good will be debated forever, but it is a bit telling to me that you proclaim if folks are angels it doesn't matter what system they use. It's like proving a point by arguing from the contradiction almost.

12/26/2006 5:51:22 PM

This thread teaches an important lesson about how nobody gives even the tiniest shred of a shit about Africa.

We can't even get a whole page in the goddamn Soap Box to be dedicated to them.

12/26/2006 5:57:21 PM

What the fuck do you want to talk about? It's a sad situation, the US won't do shit for them because there is no oil there. There isn't anything else to chit chat about.

12/26/2006 6:04:37 PM

um arent we already involved? im pretty sure that is a region we are actively involved, i think training soldiers and supporting governments counts as being involved

12/26/2006 6:56:20 PM

ok where are we not involved?

12/26/2006 7:52:30 PM

Who declares war on Christmas day? wtf

12/26/2006 7:58:56 PM

GOSH I KNO I MEAN LIKE THE WHOLE WORLD STOPS ON CHRISTMAS

12/26/2006 8:00:37 PM