http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/01/29/politics/fromtheroad/entry3767920.shtml

Quote :

"Florida Democrats delivered a win to Hillary Clinton tonight, though it was a hollow victory since no delegates were at stake. "I did not come here in person to ask for your votes, but I am here to thank you for your votes," Clinton said referring to a pledge she signed last year with all the other Democratic presidential candidates. The pledge stated they wouldn't campaign in Florida. After the Florida Democratic Party moved its primary from February 5th January 29th last summer, the Democratic National Committee stripped the state of all its delegates and prompted the candidates' pledge. "

I'm not a rabid Hilary hater, but I think this is lame as hell. Playing up the win to build momentum in a race that noone campaigned for.

1/30/2008 9:46:31 AM

Not quite true. Hilary did do some campaigning there at the very end. So I guess you could say she "won" a game of one on none.

1/30/2008 10:08:03 AM

thats even worse since she signed a pledge to not campaign there.

1/30/2008 10:10:44 AM

She didn't really actively campaign.

And she's thanking people for voting for her because its free press.

Its not silly or stupid or bad.

1/30/2008 10:12:07 AM

I liked the Obama campaign email that was sent:

Quote :

"Obama, Hillary tie for delegates in Florida tonight with 0 each."

1/30/2008 10:23:11 AM

I'm sure if the roles were reversed, Obama would also be taking advantage of the situation as well.

I still think it's lame to take advantage of the press generated from it. If the Democrats want to take a stand and say this race doesn't count because they moved their date up, then it shouldn't fucking count. Not in delegates, not in press, not in anything. It should be as if the election didn't happen. To claim the win and have a victory party for a race that doesn't count and noone competed in is a cheap way to build momentum for super tuesday.

1/30/2008 10:43:45 AM

Quote :

"thats even worse since she signed a pledge to not campaign there."

No, what's worse is that your party urged candidates to ignore an ENTIRE GODDAMN STATE FULL OF VOTERS.

1/30/2008 10:46:16 AM

whose party?

It's clear the primary cycle is seriously messed up when two low population and otherwise completely irrelevant states have a huge say on who gets elected, but the answer is NOT for every other state to move their primary dates up. If everyone started do that there would be campaigning years in advance of the actual presidential election. Florida and Michigan were warned what would happen if they moved their days up and they did it anyways.. fuck 'em.

1/30/2008 10:58:50 AM

With the importance Florida has shown in the general elections the past 2 times, it's hard to ignore the fact that she did win the state. It's one of the top 5 for electoral votes.

1/30/2008 11:00:51 AM

Fuck primaries. Just put the dozen top canidates on the ballet on election day. Let people really choose who they want instead of this doubly indirect democracy bullshit.

1/30/2008 11:03:23 AM

So we'll end up with a president that only 20 % voted for, awesome.

1/30/2008 11:21:55 AM

^ And it would be some nutjob that the crazy 15% support, we'd prolly end up with Jesse Jackson or Pat Robertson

1/30/2008 11:23:20 AM

is it really that different from a candidate who gets 20% that actually like them and then the other 35% vote for him/her because he is the lesser of two evils?

1/30/2008 11:24:31 AM

^ Yes.

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean-Marie_Le_Pen

1/30/2008 11:25:38 AM

We need a primary system before the general election, this one is lousy, but still better than nothing. I do however, like the balanced Primary system

http://politicalgrind.com/2008/01/08/a-better-way-to-choose-a-president/

1/30/2008 11:35:21 AM

Obama aired a national campaign commercial in florida in violation of party rules.
So either he did care about the race (until he lost) OR his campaign is managed very very poorly and he didn't know what was going on.

Neither scenerio looks good for Obama.

here's Hillary on the issue:

Quote :

"The Obama campaign today began airing paid television advertisements in a national cable buy that include advertising in the state of Florida. There is no question that these ads are a clear and blatant violation of the early-state pledge that Senator Obama and the other leading Democratic candidates signed last year. The early state pledge was crystal clear in its prohibition against any kind of campaign activity (outside of fundraising) in states that do not adhere to the DNC calendar. There is no ambiguity. Among the list of prohibited activities are “electronic advertising that reaches a significant percentage of the voters in the aforementioned state.” (According to Nielsen, there are 6,6 million TV households in Florida that receive CNN through either local cable systems or satellite dishes. This represents 92% of all Florida TV households.) The Obama campaign knows this, but has chosen to violate the pledge regardless. Just last week the Obama campaign snubbed the people of Florida in a memo that stated that Florida did not matter in the nominating process. After consecutive losses in New Hampshire, Michigan and Nevada, they appear to be changing course. Senator Obama’s flagrant disregard for the pledge that he signed is disturbing and calls the integrity of the pledge into question. "

[Edited on January 30, 2008 at 11:39 AM. Reason : OMG Flip-flopper!]

1/30/2008 11:36:05 AM

Quote :

"a national cable buy that include advertising in the state of Florida"

I guess when he debated and accepted interviews on CNN and MSNBC, he was campaigning in Florida as well. What particularly irritates me is that he chose not to block Florida IP addresses from accessing his website.

...

1/30/2008 11:52:28 AM

I think it's good she said something to them. If I was a voter and one party decided to ignore my state for something I had nothing to do with, I'd feel pretty damn left out and far less enthusiastic about throwing my support behind the party for the general election. Republicans can go around saying "Dems don't care about FL" because of this.

1/30/2008 11:55:56 AM

They will, and I'm pretty confident Florida and Michigan will be seated at the convention...but only after the nomination has been wrapped up.

1/30/2008 12:00:04 PM

^^ When has Florida every been important in the general election?

1/30/2008 12:35:28 PM

^^^ The repubs took away half of Florida's delegates. That's certainly better, in the eyes of the state, than having none, but the republicans didn't just ignore the decision.

1/30/2008 1:11:54 PM

ok, so i missed why the DNC made them sign a pledge not to campaign in florida or michigan.

I can't imagine why they would shoot themselves in the foot like this.

1/30/2008 1:48:26 PM

florida and michigan told them they were moving up their primary dates to mid january. both parties didn't want this to happen, but the dems threatened to take remove their delegate seats if they did. The states decided to be hard headed about it, and the dems did likewise, hence no primary race in florida or michigan for the dems.

thats the way i understand it, anyways

1/30/2008 3:08:12 PM

The DNC and RNC had rules saying when the primaries can take place.

Both Florida and Michigan's state legislatures voted to and succeeded in breaking those rules.

Therefore....

(I don't think it was a good idea to remove the support, but that's why they did it.)

1/30/2008 3:09:03 PM

fuck clinton; the last thing we need is a rotating monarchy running america. if hillary were elected would it be jeb bush in 2016.

1/30/2008 3:53:36 PM

Quote :

"They will, and I'm pretty confident Florida and Michigan will be seated at the convention...but only after the nomination has been wrapped up."

I agree. If it is wrapped up.

And I think if any is surprised by the Clinton tactic, then you are new to politics. Free media = teh winz.

I think she of course does not lose anything by doing this. The people that don't like her in the party, will villain-ize her more. However those that are trying to decide (that aren't fanatics like us), we're given another chance to see her on TV last night.

1/30/2008 3:58:25 PM

Quote :

"I can't imagine why they would shoot themselves in the foot like this."

Perhaps the Clinton's feel that they are above the party leadership and feel that any political cost from violating their decrees will be made up by both the popular boost and the populist message. She can after all, start harping about how the party disenfranchised an entire state or some nonsense like that, especially if the delegate count comes close; that sort of message will probably resonate well within the Democratic Party.

1/30/2008 4:38:22 PM

Not only is this a good way to garner some publicity. It seems like a classy move to thank people for voting you. but maybe that's just me

1/31/2008 3:55:29 AM

^ Nope. I think she should have ignored Florida (win or lose) just because it didn't give her any delegates. I mean, that's what Obama's doing. And that man shits diamonds.

[Edited on January 31, 2008 at 5:02 AM. Reason : ``]

1/31/2008 5:01:53 AM

^^^
nah, i meant why would the DNC shoot themselves in the foot that way.

If anything, I actually applaud Clinton for putting the voters before the party.

1/31/2008 3:35:59 PM

or before what she promised to do!

1/31/2008 3:39:27 PM

true.

it's still beyond silly that they made the candidates do that. The fact that the Democratic party is as effective as a Chuck Amato coached football team is why the GOP has gone to shit. There's no real competition to deal with.

1/31/2008 3:52:34 PM

^ you know that the GOP cut half of FL and MI's delegates to the convention right?

And thats after the GOP controlled FL legislature moved the date up on their own. I forget who MI is controlled by.

1/31/2008 5:03:09 PM