...FUEL CELL MODIFICATION KIT

1996 honda accord, 38 mpg to 109 mpg [/end quote

and of course the kit comes with the fuel magnets just in case

scams have been around Popular Science/Mechanics since before that cunt dr. Winnifred Cutler was a virgin, but this new one is the boldest one yet. they even took out an entire 1 pager ful color ad.

no i do not doubt 100mpg full size sedans are possible with the current technology or even 90's technology and some T125/70D16 at 80 psi, gutted interior, and two unplugged injectors, but these f00lz are promising the same results in your own daily shitbox after $1000 check and 2 hours of redneck wrenching time.

http://www.picctv.com/ps

plz discuss

3/6/2008 7:12:03 PM

i saw this before and if you notice it says it should be installed by an "approved" mechanic or something like that

plus they havent even released the whole kit, the website (when i saw it about a month ago) said that another phase should be completed in apr 2008 if i remember

3/6/2008 7:40:48 PM

Quote :

"#1 Grand Master Technician, Ontario, Canada"

3/6/2008 7:46:07 PM

they also calculate the mgp by using a "scientific test", i think this is the way they get around their money back guarantee (which i am sure does not include the labor).

Quote :

"In one test at our Research Facility, we got 9X the fuel efficiency from a gas guzzling 318 V-8 Chrysler engine. We ran a 318 V-8 Chrysler engine on a brand new state of the art dynamometer (the same testing equipment that Detroit uses) at 3,000 rpms under a 50% load for an hour. This test condition approximated an 8 cylinder van with a 318 engine, traveling up a 30 degree incline for one hour, at 65 miles per hour. Before the PICC modification, the engine used 18 pounds of fuel. At an average weight of 6.15 pounds per gallon for gasoline, that would equal 2.93 gallons of fuel. Converting that into miles per gallon, it got around 22 mpg. The researchers then switched the fuel injection process to the PICC Modification and ran the engine under the exact same conditions for another hour. Now, the engine used only 2 pounds of fuel instead of 18 — an increase in efficiency of 9x. In other words, the vehicle traveling at 65 mph up a 30 degree incline for an hour would have obtained almost 200 mpg! When they shut off the engine, the researchers reported that it coasted on the plasma for another two minutes "

and I thought EPA tests were unconvincing...

still, even with all the conversion errors and smoke and unrealistic circumstances, 2lbs of fuel vs 9lbs of fuel is a significant difference. and i KNOW the fuel magnets have nothing to do with it. what about the other components that sound like they were develop for the space shuttle and look like they came off a chinese pepboys scooter?

Quote :

"The HAFC Hydrogen Fuel Cell 6 x 6 x 4-1/2 draws 15 amps produces 50-70 liters of hydrogen/oxygen mixture per hour Our new double cell makes twice as much gas The Fuel Cell is the heart of the system. It separates water into hydrogen and oxygen, and adds the hydrogen to the fuel mixture, making the fuel mixture rich so the computer can “lean” the fuel. The unit is built of durable stainless steel. It can be used even in freezing weather. The HAFC Vaporizer The Vaporizer contains 6 powerful magnets to help ionize the fuel and break it down into tiny sized molecules for easier consumption, a cleaner burn, and a more thorough utilization of the fuel. The radiator hose provides heat to pre-heat the gasoline as well. The HAFC Optimizer Most cars have computers that govern the gas usage of the vehicle. The HAFC Optimizer is an actual computer that ties into the emissions control system on the car and teaches the manufacturer’s computer to operate the HAFC System to keep it from rejecting the savings. This unit is the patented difference between the HAFC and all other gas saving devices. The Covalizer The Covalizer is a blend of special chemicals added to the fuel that helps “crack” the fuel into smaller molecules and aid vaporization, so your engine burns the fuel more completely, yielding greater fuel economy. "

3/6/2008 7:53:56 PM

Heh, I like the shiny metal box. Looks "magical".

3/6/2008 9:41:41 PM

buy a fucking scooter!

3/6/2008 9:49:20 PM

I wish they would just explain what it is rather than spout all this deceptive pseudoscience gibberish.

The component that they call a fuel cell is not a fuel cell, its an electrolytic cell that creates hydrogen and oxygen. A fuel cell creates electricity from hydrogen and oxygen.

So the device injects hydrogen and O2 into the intake and with some programming of the engine computer, the car is supposed to see an improvement in mileage. Well, the electricity required for electrolysis has to come from somewhere, and you're not going to get more energy from the hydrogen/oxygen than what is consumed because electrolytic cells are well under 100% efficient. If the electricity comes from the car, I don't see how the mileage could be improved.

Plus, they claim the cell produces up to 70 liters/hr of H and O. A car will consume tens of thousand of liters of air in an hour, so 70 liters amounts to a small trickle.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_fuel_injection

I found this wiki article. Evidently, hydrogen injection is nothing new.

And apparently some Canadian company already has a similar apparatus for sale, but they only report 10% fuel savings.

As for the plasma-creating catalytic converter do-dad, I have no idea what the hell that is, but thats a fascinating bit of redneck science, much like the rest of it.

[Edited on March 7, 2008 at 3:15 AM. Reason : .]

3/7/2008 3:09:31 AM

Quote :

"Every car has a Catalytic Converter. The Catalytic Converter that is currently installed on your car is intended to help eliminate pollution and is located in your exhaust pipe. It works by breaking down the large gas molecules that were not burned in your engine and turns them into smaller particles that can be burned in your tailpipe before being released into the air, so less exhaust hits the environment. What if we could turn the gases you are throwing away via your exhaust into added mileage and power for your vehicle?"

lol...I guess for every one part gasoline that is burned four parts gasoline go out the tailpipe. THANK GOODNESS THEY FOUND A WAY TO SAVE ALL THAT UNSPENT FUEL.

3/7/2008 7:32:55 AM

Turbo?

3/7/2008 10:06:04 AM

Quote :

"When they shut off the engine, the researchers reported that it coasted on the plasma for another two minutes."

wut

3/7/2008 2:49:17 PM

What they meant to say was "we cut the fuel off and the engine, not having any resistance due to the fact it's not attached to anything, just kept spinning".

Maybe.

3/7/2008 3:23:39 PM

I think they're trying to say it kept running just because of whatever "fuel" their bullshit thingie is putting back into the engine.

Which would obviously make no fucking sense because of the whole ya know, ignition system being turned off thing.

3/7/2008 3:45:01 PM

Oh that's what they meant, yeah, I'm just providing an idea of what actually happened and somewhat sarcastically implying that these guys wanted to tell us the honest truth about what happened.

3/7/2008 3:53:17 PM

The video is hilarious.

the killer line come in at the end right about at 18 mins.
"you should no longer have to change your oil. pure elements burn so cleanly, the oil no longer gets dirty. NOT CHANGING YOUR OIL REGULARLY DRMATICALL INCREASES THE LIFE OF AN ENGINE"

this has to be some sort of a conpiracy by the shadtree greasemonkeys union to get some labor out of installation and then out of the engine replacement when that goes south.

either way this has LAWSUIT written all over it

[Edited on March 7, 2008 at 6:21 PM. Reason : http://dutman.vo.llnwd.net/o15/piccwin/piccwinhi.wmv]

3/7/2008 6:10:17 PM

okay...so this is bogus?

3/14/2008 3:00:21 PM

ya rly

plz 2 explain in laymans terms

3/14/2008 3:22:54 PM

It doesn't fucking work. I can't put it any more simply than that.

3/14/2008 3:34:15 PM

o

:failboat:

3/14/2008 3:34:37 PM

is there a REASON it doesn't work? my basic understanding of it is that it splits apart water molecules into oxygen and hydrogen, and then injects the hydrogen into the fuel system...you dilute the gasoline, but still allow it to combust, so your gasoline is conserved

now, i also understand that if we could do that, we could just build all of our fuel systems to split water molecules through electrolysis and we wouldn't NEED gasoline...i also (vaguely) understand that you have to put energy into the system in order to break apart the water molecules...is that why it doesn't work? because you put in as much (or, more likely MORE) energy than you're able to produce?

3/14/2008 3:38:21 PM

Quote :

"i also (vaguely) understand that you have to put energy into the system in order to break apart the water molecules...is that why it doesn't work? because you put in as much (or, more likely MORE) energy than you're able to produce?"

Yeah the reason it doesn't work is because it's not possible for any system to operate at higher than 100% efficiency. Since it's just adding some gay shit to your engine that doesn't do anything besides consume a little power, the opportunities for it increasing the efficiency of your existing engine are pretty much nil. It's snake oil potion and it's bullshit.

3/14/2008 4:03:14 PM

Ok so squeezed out more complete story from these guys and it is defenitely redneck engineering at it's finest. Here is their installation/user manual


http://www.installersupport.info

3/14/2008 4:42:26 PM

Quote :

"Essentially, you have 3 goals: lower the lean limits, lean out the air/fuel mixture, and adjust ignition timing. "

duh?

3/14/2008 9:35:22 PM

Quote :

"As it builds heat, it draws more amps. As it draws more amps, it outputs more Water Gas. "

Wouldn't that mean that it outputs steam?

3/15/2008 12:33:21 AM

Sufficed to say, if you believe this, you believe in 300% efficient engines, cause they are from the same guy, complete with snakeoil: Dennis Lee.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WVJRukhMIjs

http://www.phact.org/e/dennis.html

http://freeenergynews.com/Directory/Dennis_Lee/index.html
Even some of the free energy tooty fruity nuts think hes a shyster!

This shit really ought to be a capital crime.

6/2/2008 3:17:34 AM

Quote :

"WARRANTEE. This Savings Warrantee is provided by the seller, or UCSA dealer that the kit buyer purchased the kit from. It is not provided by the manufacturer. The manufacturer warrants defective parts and workmanship for one year. In order to activate the Savings Warrantee, the kit buyer must follow these procedures to determine the fuel economy increase. The kit buyer must test the vehicle for fuel economy according to the test procedures outlined in this installation manual. The same test must be done both before and after the HAFC modification and proper tuning has been performed. The test results of the vehicle before modification must be recorded on the Mileage Test Calculation Form on page 6 and the gas receipt to prove it must be saved until after the vehicle is modified. The modification MUST be installed in a temporary fashion until a Certified HAFC Trained Technician is able to examine the installation and install the O2ptomizer and tune it properly. When the Certified HAFC Technician has completed tuning and/or installing the HAFC Kit, he/she must sign the “Mechanic Sign-Off Sheet” on page 6 of this manual. The Kit Buyer must repeat the same mileage test after the modification to determine if the performance is in accordance with the Savings Warrantee. Once again, the results must be recorded on the Mileage Test Calculation Form on page 6 and the gas receipt to prove it must be saved. The “before” test results must then be compared to the properly modified and tuned vehicle “after” test results. If the mileage increased, under reasonably the same conditions as before modification, by at least an increase of 50% or better, then the kit seller has performed as advertised. If the increase is less than a 50% increase and the kit buyer is not satisfied, then the kit buyer may return the kit to the seller (Distributor) to receive a full refund within the allotted time. The kit buyer has two weeks from the HAFC Certified Tuner Technician’s sign-off date to test the mileage as outlined herein and request a refund from the seller (Distributor) if the savings performance was not at least 50% increase in fuel economy, and they are not satisfied. If the request is not made within two weeks of the Certified HAFC Technician installing and tuning of the O2ptomizer, the Savings Warrantee isthereafter void. When the request for refund is properly submitted the seller (Distributor) will have one week to determine if the calculations have been done correctly and everything was submitted as necessary. The seller (Distributor) will then issue a Return Merchandise Authorization to the kit buyer, with which they can pack up the kit and return it in resalable condition (as instructed in the Installation Manual) for their money back. For full refund, the kit buyer must follow the instructions in this installation manual outlined in the section titled, “The Procedure To Obtain A Full Refund” THE PROCEDURE FOR OBTAINING A FULL REFUND IF NOT SATISFIEDD If you have determined (within two weeks after a certified Installer/Tuner has tuned the optimizer) that the HAFC Kit System has not saved you 50% in gas mileage and you would like to return it for a refund, you must do the following in order to qualify: 1. Contact the seller (Distributor) with a request for a refund. Request must be made within two weeks of the date the Certified HAFC Installation/Tuning Technician signed off on the Form. (Warrantee is void if request is not made within the specified time.) Include the Signed Mechanic Sign Off Form found on page 2 in the Manual. Also include the Mileage Calculation Form found on page 6 with the requested information filled in. You must also send the original pump receipt you got on the day you road tested your car PRIOR to the modification that indicates the amount of fuel you used, the date of the test, and the original pump receipt you got when you retested it at the same gas station AFTER the modification. 2. The seller (Distributor) will determine if the request is in accordance with the Savings Warrantee, and will respond within one week, and issue a Return Merchandise Authorization Number (RMA) if warranted. DO NOT RETURN THE KIT WITHOUT THIS RMA No. It will not be accepted. 3. When you receive the RMA number, remove the kit immediately, and clean any oil, grease, or anything messy from each device and put all the components back into the packaging they came in (please put them back into the plastic bags to protect the packaging as well). Remove every apparatus including all the hoses and fittings that were in the box. Drain all the fluids from the devices and clean them with a dry rag. Make sure ALL fluids are out of the hoses and containers. Wrap the components back up with the wrapping that they came in (or get more bubble wrap at Staples.) Make sure all the parts are put back into the box, including the funnel, measuring flask, and all wiring, electronic and electrical components. Close the box by pushing the top down fully with the side flaps inside the box. Make sure there are no lumps under the box cover and then fold in the front flaps on both sides. Put the inner box inside the cardboard outer box. Use some sort of packing material to keep it in tight. 4. All components and parts must be present and in undamaged condition. 5. Return it all to the dealer you bought it from for a FULL refund. DO NOT RETURN IT TO THE MANUFACTURER. They are not responsible for refunding your money, and will charge S&H charges in advance to ship the unit back to you. 6. Seller (Distributor) will issue a refund within thirty days of receipt of kit in good condition. There will be charges for damaged or missing items deducted from the refund. If the buyer keeps the kit past the allotted Savings Warrantee test period, the buyer shall still have the right to upgrade it for the Pre-Ignition Catalytic Converter when that system is ready and a quote is submitted. Please understand that this kit will be reconstituted. It is very rare that one is ever returned, so you have better odds of being snake bitten than you do of getting a re-constituted kit. If you do, you will be given the option of buying it or waiting for one to be manufactured. Although the original purchaser may not have experienced at least a 50% increase in fuel economy, the great likelihood is that the next customer will. This kitwill still have a great value to the next customer. If you did experience an increase of 50% fuel economy or greater, then keep it, because that was all it was warranted to do. The kit must be sent back in as reasonably as purchased condition. We realize that you will have used some of the conditioner to test the vehicle and most of the caustic to charge the Fuel Cell. It is also important that you temporarily installed the system without welding, drilling, or making anything permanent. The seller will welcome the timely return as long as it is done in this manner. We wish you better mileage with less pollution for a happier you and everyone!"

half the fuckin manual is reasons not to get a refund

6/2/2008 11:05:50 AM

watergas, ahaha

6/2/2008 3:01:49 PM