So, I've been injured quite a few times now playing football and have had a ton of new aches and pains pop up...mostly knee and shoulder issues.

I know my way around the gym and do the typical lifts, work different muscles each day, shift up my lifts every trip, all that normal stuff. However, I think I'm doing too many 'big muscle' lifts that don't aim to protect the joints very well.

What are some exercises to help strengthen typical problem areas? I'm mostly looking to protect my knees, shoulders, and back.

So far, for these types of exercises I have:

Knees:
-'Leg extensions', where you're in the chair and lift a weight by extending your leg.
-Bicycle? I've started doing this for like 30 minutes

Shoulders:
-Arm raises: front and side
-Barbell raises, where you have a close/wide grip on a bar and raise it to your chin.

Back:
-Back extensions, where you're in that chair thing and you lean back

4/18/2009 10:37:31 PM

Quote :

"I know my way around the gym and do the typical lifts, work different muscles each day, "

oh god

4/18/2009 10:43:31 PM

Yeah, I do, what of it.

4/18/2009 10:45:53 PM

Sounds like youre on the right track. Make sure you use free weights instead of machines because they work your stabilizers and are good for joints. Machines lock you into a single motion which limits what gets worked and also some machines require some awkward bending if not set up for you.

When my knees ache I typically just stop lifting heavy, works for me but doesnt make them any stronger.

Add some shoulder press to your life.

No advice really on back, depends what hurts? Im assuming lower back? If so, do some light weight knee-locked deadlifts. Just grab 1/2 of what you normally deadlift and lock your knees. Good for the lower back. But, careful on those knees I guess

4/18/2009 10:45:56 PM

Well my back doesn't really hurt yet, just hoping to do some different lifts to strengthen some stabilizers. My Dad had a slipped disk a couple of years ago and he lifted a lot, but apparently doing only stuff like Lat Pulldowns and Rows didn't help out his lower back.

4/18/2009 10:48:06 PM

I find that arcgreek is pretty much just a troll and rarely if ever adds anything useful to a thread.

4/19/2009 4:30:13 PM

^^ of course they didn't. that's why they're called LAT pulldowns!

^ I'm gonna have to go ahead, and uhhh, disagree with you about that.

Quote :

"I'm doing too many 'big muscle' lifts "

Nah, "big-muscle" lifts are money. They should be the staples of your workouts. Hell, in my opinion, isolation movements are only minimally necessary, unless you're bodybuilding/otherwise training for aesthetics.

4/19/2009 4:36:48 PM

"big muscle lifts" exercise the "little muscles" in the area as well.

4/19/2009 4:42:08 PM

be careful with Leg Extensions

unless you're only doing the last 30 degrees of the motion you could actually be doing more harm than good (they put a tremendous amount of stress/extra torque directly on the knee).

Knees are best worked by doing compound movements (squats, deadlifts) but also things that will work to help the stabilizing muscles around the joint (most unilateral stuff - lunges, step-ups, single-leg squats, single leg deadlifts, even just practicing balance on some kind of unstable surface, etc)

For shoulders, I'd look up the Cuban Press as it seems to help in most cases

for lower back, deadlifts (assuming proper form), reverse hyper extensions, and back extensions

It's also important from a preventative standpoint to make sure you're stretching (look into foam rolling as well) to insure nothing is overly tight which could cause undue stress as well.

In most cases you can see benefits from just stretching calves, hip flexors, hamstrings, and lats (possibly even the piriformis)

4/19/2009 5:04:02 PM

Quote :

"Nah, "big-muscle" lifts are money. They should be the staples of your workouts. Hell, in my opinion, isolation movements are only minimally necessary, unless you're bodybuilding/otherwise training for aesthetics."

This.

I don't understand why you are on a bodypart split, when your interests/goals/experience is not one where this split is appropriate. TheDuke can attest to this... bodypart splits are hard on the body, and if done w/out some serious planning can lead to immbalances that can lead to pains/injuries. Some of you pains are most likely imbalances.

You might consider going to full body workouts or an upper lower split. There are plenty of very good premade stuff all over the web, and I can give you some starting points, if you want. make sure you are getting both squats and deads, and a push and pull in both horizontal and vertical planes (and that you are hitting these equally (push:pull)). The best way to protect your posterior chain/knees/shoulders is to be doing the big lifts (deads/squats/vert pressing/pulling) w/ correct form. Things like curls/tricep extensions/calf raises/flyes are really not that essential. I would however Rx some external rotation exercises for you shoulders (just a blind assumption on a almost positive existance of an imbalance).


(and lat work does nothing for your lower back....DUUURRR)

How is your current posture? Are you stretching sufficiently? Do you know about myoficial self-release (foam/tennis ball rolling)? Are you giving yourself enough nutrients? How is your diet? Are you sleeping enough? How are your stress levels?

[Edited on April 19, 2009 at 6:32 PM. Reason : google for eric cressy "shoulder savers" --good article]

4/19/2009 6:12:49 PM

"Everybody wants to be a bodybuilder, but nobody wants to lift no heavy ass weights"

4/19/2009 6:16:50 PM

Quote :

"FeebleMinded"

4/19/2009 6:17:57 PM

Quote :

"TheDuke can attest to this... bodypart splits are hard on the body"

Yeah...I guess I can't verify that it was only because of bodypart splits, but I can tell you that the way I worked out for years (which was strictly bodypart splits, with very heavy weights and pretty significant volume) caused problems that I fear will be permanent.

I had some phenomenal strength, but I wish I could go back and take a different approach. It wasn't worth it in the long run, and I think I could've gotten the same or better results with an approach that wouldn't be damaging.

...and even if I only benchpressed 300 lbs instead of 350, I can almost guarantee that I would've been in better overall shape with a different type of training.

[Edited on April 19, 2009 at 11:21 PM. Reason : asdf]

4/19/2009 11:19:01 PM

These fitness threads always turn into a pissing-contest. Just because a specific regimen works for one individual does not mean that it is equally applicable to somebody else.

4/19/2009 11:29:58 PM

I don't understand the problem with doing bodypart splits, unless you're saying that people who don't put the same emphasis on one day that they do the others might cause muscle imbalances. I could understand the problem with bodypart splits with the majority of people you see in the gym who are always hyped about chest day but just laxadaisically going through the motions when they show up to work their back a couple times a month.

Quote :

"...and even if I only benchpressed 300 lbs instead of 350, I can almost guarantee that I would've been in better overall shape with a different type of training. "

I felt like I was in better shape when I did HIIT training for my lifting and sprinting combined with an hour of cardio a day than I did when I was doing volume training and could bench 350 for 10 reps. When I could do the latter, I was just strong as shit but lacked cardiovascular fitness because I was only doing low intensity cardio a couple times a week. I keep thinking I should try something like crossfit to get the best of both worlds, but I doubt I'd stick to making a change like that at my age.

[Edited on April 19, 2009 at 11:46 PM. Reason : more]

4/19/2009 11:42:32 PM

Quote :

"(and lat work does nothing for your lower back....DUUURRR)"

Yeah, my bad for missing the when I posted it.

Quote :

"I don't understand why you are on a bodypart split, when your interests/goals/experience is not one where this split is appropriate."

I've done the full body workouts before, and at this point feel that my different muscle groups are well attuned to each other to so that I can focus on gaining mass. My goal is to gain mass, and I have plenty of experience. Just not this area (which I feel most people learn from being on sports teams), hence my post.

That said, when I'm able to get back into the gym I will be starting the first couple of weeks or so on compound lifts so that I can get everything back in working order.

Quote :

"Some of you pains are most likely imbalances."

More so only from recent sports injuries and not being used to running/making cuts, I would say. I try and match every push day with a pull day and do equal lifts. Honestly, the only pain now is in my knees and my injured shoulder, which was injured from a bad collision. I didn't used to run often at all, which could have contributed to this soreness.

Quote :

"How is your current posture? Are you stretching sufficiently? Do you know about myoficial self-release (foam/tennis ball rolling)? Are you giving yourself enough nutrients? How is your diet? Are you sleeping enough? How are your stress levels?"

Yeah, can't say I knew about that one . My posture/lift form is good, one of the big things I've been stressed to keep on top of when I was learning. Diet and nutrients are good, with protein shakes, multivitamins, balanced meals. blah blah blah...

Thanks for the feedback, but I don't exactly see why you're attacking this experience issue.

4/20/2009 12:50:22 AM

Quote :

"I don't understand the problem with doing bodypart splits, unless you're saying that people who don't put the same emphasis on one day that they do the others might cause muscle imbalances. I could understand the problem with bodypart splits with the majority of people you see in the gym who are always hyped about chest day but just laxadaisically going through the motions when they show up to work their back a couple times a month. "

well, that's another problem, although not in my case...i beat the bejeezus out of my back, too. i think the problem was just overdoing it. My rotator cuffs are shot, and at the time, my elbows and wrists gave me trouble, too. I even developed TMJ to the point that I went on a liquid diet for a few days one time, because I clenched my jaw so hard when I was lifting.

I'm not strictly blaming bodypart splits, but I don't think any of that would've happened if I'd done training more on the order of Crossfit all along.

Quote :

"I felt like I was in better shape when I did HIIT training for my lifting and sprinting combined with an hour of cardio a day than I did when I was doing volume training and could bench 350 for 10 reps. When I could do the latter, I was just strong as shit but lacked cardiovascular fitness because I was only doing low intensity cardio a couple times a week. I keep thinking I should try something like crossfit to get the best of both worlds, but I doubt I'd stick to making a change like that at my age. "

Yep, except that I did switch to Crossfit. I was doing bodypart splits PLUS Crossfit for a while, but when I got to Iraq, I didn't have the time or energy to continue doing that, so I just focused on the Crossfit. I was getting good results, and it seemed to not bother my shoulders nearly as much, but then I did something to my right bicep on one of those workouts featuring 150 pull-ups, so I've had to lay off of the Crossfit for the last few months (since the workouts have so many pull-ups and cleans). Once I'm satisfied that the bicep is OK, I'll start doing Crossfit again, although I might scale some of the pull-up workouts until I'm really sure that I'm healed.

4/20/2009 6:36:22 AM