**poor title choice** but interesting nonetheless.

Quote :

"YOUR CHALLENGE: Stabilize the U.S. Debt at 60% of GDP by 2018. To begin the simulation, click the “Next” button above. There are 8 categories where your choices will affect the debt. Negative numbers next to a choice indicate how much the debt will be reduced, positive numbers add to the debt. Use the “Next” and “Back” buttons to navigate to each section; do not use your browser’s navigation arrows. Click the “Done” button when finished making all the choices you want. The bar graph on the right will chart how your choices affect the debt-to-GDP ratio relative to the 60% goal. Visit the FAQ page for more on how the game works. "

http://crfb.org/stabilizethedebt/

5/27/2010 9:50:19 PM

This "game" is fundamentally flawed in that tax increases are portrayed as revenue builders while tax cuts are portrayed as revenue detractors.

Talk to NJ about how well that's worked for them.

5/27/2010 10:05:15 PM

^ except by and large lower taxes = lower income

http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=0AgqOJHMO3_c6dGxEZzl5VHdrNFVYQlZqaGgwMUV3ZEE&hl=en&output=html



[Edited on May 27, 2010 at 11:11 PM. Reason : ]

5/27/2010 11:01:10 PM

^^yeah let's ask a state how well it worked for them, that will probably easily translate to the ENTIRE FUCKING COUNTRY.

5/27/2010 11:06:23 PM

Quote :

" except by and large lower taxes = lower income"

LOL at that meaningless graph. "Tax revenues as a % of GDP"? Really? What the fuck is that?

The whole idea of lowering the marginal tax rate is to increase the GDP, and thus total tax revenues.

moron being disingenuous, as usual.

5/27/2010 11:25:27 PM

How about playing the "Communist/Socialist" game. Press the "Next" button and millions of your citizens are slaughtered by your totalitarian regime.

5/28/2010 12:09:44 AM

^^ haha are you really that ignorant? you seriously think lower taxes doesn't lower revenues...?

5/28/2010 12:26:19 AM

surprisingly, there is a min-max solution to the tax question.

5/28/2010 12:38:53 AM

The concept was more of a thought process than a hard deficit proposal. Furthermore, even as a libertarian, I don't believe that tax increases are inherently going to lower revenue, they will after a certain point, but where that point exists is impossible to know and prior to it there will be increased revenue with increased taxes.


Of course none of this addresses the morality of taxation or the fallacy that taxes are even remotely geared towards revenue production (instead of social manipulation).

5/28/2010 7:59:53 AM

As far as taxes are concerned, I have heard off-hand claims that the "revenue" curve maxes out when a populations marginal tax rate approaches 20% of the GDP.

So having taxes <20% means you make less money as a % of the GDP while having >20% mean you make less money as people are dissuaded from working and seek tax shelters.

5/28/2010 8:24:03 AM

^as with the earlier posts, all you need to do is produce the evidence.

No need for thought experiments, guesses, speculation, theory, or propaganda. Let's see the evidence that shows a causal relationship between taxes and revenue. Or taxes and anything, for that matter. Then on top of that, let's see evidence that a lawmaker or administrator can do anything to get a desired change in revenue.

5/28/2010 9:26:12 AM

^ did you miss this?



When taxes were raised revenues increased, when they were lowered, revenues decreased. There are obvious other factors in there (the economic boom of the 90s), but that is the overall trend.

As solinari noted though, there is a point of diminishing returns on both ends.

[Edited on May 28, 2010 at 9:41 AM. Reason : ]

5/28/2010 9:40:05 AM

Dude. This simulator rocks! I can actually see interest rates falling in the long run as the government demand on loanable funds decreases. And my hand!!! Woah!!!

5/28/2010 9:43:45 AM

Quote :

"surprisingly, there is a min-max solution to the tax question."

Exactly.


On the "simulator", I made it down to 65% of GDP. I think I could've gone further, but some of the options for getting away from Social Security weren't available, so I made very few fiscal gains due to SS reform. I saved mostly due to spending cuts, and a little bit due to revenue generation.

5/28/2010 11:19:39 AM