http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/feb/15/defector-admits-wmd-lies-iraq-war


holy


shit

2/15/2011 8:36:32 PM

old news. Ron Paul told us in 2003 that this guy was full of shit

2/15/2011 9:20:03 PM

Quote :

"In a series of meetings with the Guardian in Germany where he has been granted asylum, he said he had told a German official, who he identified as Dr Paul, about mobile bioweapons trucks throughout 2000. He said the BND had identified him as a Baghdad-trained chemical engineer and approached him shortly after 13 March of that year, looking for inside information about Saddam's Iraq. "I had a problem with the Saddam regime," he said. "I wanted to get rid of him and now I had this chance." He portrays the BND as gullible and so eager to tease details from him that they gave him a Perry's Chemical Engineering Handbook to help communicate. He still has the book in his small, rented flat in Karlsruhe, south-west Germany. "They were asking me about pumps for filtration, how to make detergent after the reaction," he said. "Any engineer who studied in this field can explain or answer any question they asked.""

haha

hilarious

[Edited on February 15, 2011 at 9:23 PM. Reason : ]

2/15/2011 9:22:32 PM

I'll be really interested to read the books written about OIF in another 20 years, once the dust settles and most of the facts come out.

2/15/2011 9:27:03 PM

Thought this was going to be a thread about Saddam Hussein, the guy who ethnically cleansed half a million of his fellow countrymen while enslaving the rest in his personal amusement park fatuously named the Republic of Iraq.

2/16/2011 9:21:45 AM

Because that was totally the justification used by the administration. The people were told, up front, that this was a purely humanitarian intervention.

Who are you kidding? Any of these half-baked justifications you come up with after the fact are irrelevant. We were mislead into an unconstitutional war, so stop trying to save face for a government that is actively fucking you over.

2/16/2011 12:13:01 PM

Now, wait right there. While the war was unjustified and stupid, you can't claim it was unconstitutional. Congress voted for it. If you feel there was insufficient challenge posed to the war monger Bush, take it up with the doves in Congress and the Media. It was their responsibility to challenge the crap Bush was spreading, they failed. They failed for one reason: the populous was up for whatever Bush threw at them, making it political suicide to challenge the Bush line, so they didn't challenge. Remember that next time your Democracy goes to war.

2/16/2011 12:39:21 PM

The Constitution says Congress declares war. Congress was derelict in its duties, as it has been in so many ways, but this idea that the President declares is wholly unconstitutional, and not what the founders intended.

2/16/2011 1:04:24 PM

Who's defending the Bush administration? I was opposed from the start to how the Bush administration sold the war.

I was just pointing out the fact that the person most responsible for the Iraq war was the dictator who committed several acts of genocide, ran an Orwellian police state, invaded several countries, used weapons of mass destruction and thwarted all attempts to verify that he had finally given them up, and whose removal from power was a moral and civilizational necessity that virtually every civilized country had acknowledged by 2003.

And by the way, if you want to blame someone for the "slaughter" of Iraqi civilians, you can start by pointing a finger at the remnants of his pathetic, racist Baath party.

[Edited on February 16, 2011 at 1:52 PM. Reason : ]

2/16/2011 1:50:12 PM

Quote :

"I was just pointing out the fact that the person most responsible for the Iraq war was the dictator who committed several acts of genocide, ran an Orwellian police state, invaded several countries, used weapons of mass destruction and thwarted all attempts to verify that he had finally given them up, and whose removal from power was a moral and civilizational necessity that virtually every civilized country had acknowledged by 2003."

Nope

You're acting like Iraq forced our hand morally or something which is a fairly hilarious causal assessment of the situation

[Edited on February 16, 2011 at 2:04 PM. Reason : .]

2/16/2011 2:01:10 PM

This is old... he was outed as a liar years ago.

So the US took his lies (which were known to be lies by then), and slaughtered and facilitated the slaughter of hundreds of thousands of civilians.

I think it is only fair that he should be turned over the Iraqi public, and they can do what they like with him in the streets of Baghdad.

And he is not the only one. There were at least 2 others who lied about weapons and/or Al Qaeda being in Iraq so that the US would attack Iraq. The guy who lied about Al Qaeda was a senior militant himself, captured in Afghanistan. He had an ulterior motive; he wanted all the world's militants to flock to Iraq so that they could kill Americans, and so he lied about Al Qaeda already being there.

All such people should be turned over to the Iraqi public, along with people such as Powell, Cheney, Bush, Rice, and others, including the 'intelligence' officers from Germany and US.

2/16/2011 4:00:33 PM

2/16/2011 4:54:04 PM

Quote :

"You're acting like Iraq forced our hand morally or something which is a fairly hilarious causal assessment of the situation"

A genocidal regime that wages a daily campaign of terrorism against its own people, I would say, does force the civilized world into a position of moral responsibility.

[Edited on February 16, 2011 at 11:36 PM. Reason : ]

2/16/2011 11:35:37 PM

Quote :

" A genocidal regime that wages a daily campaign of terrorism against its own people, I would say, does force the civilized world into a position of moral responsibility. "

Cool this has nothing to do with why we went to war in Iraq

2/17/2011 12:37:19 AM

I can't believe there are people out there like this^^ asshole who still defend the Iraq war. I mean Jesus Christ what the fuck is wrong with you?

2/17/2011 8:55:23 AM

I actually think it does have a lot to do with why we went into Iraq. It was certainly cited by administration officials and Congress during the lead up to the invasion. But yeah, it wasn't the primary reason offered by the Bush administration, which, as I've said, was wrong.

^ I'm an asshole for advocating for the removal of genocidal dictators? Fine, I'm an asshole, then.

[Edited on February 17, 2011 at 9:01 AM. Reason : ]

2/17/2011 8:57:28 AM

So once China becomes the world's biggest superpower, is it going to be their responsibility to do this shit from now on?

2/17/2011 10:24:26 AM

Quote :

"I actually think it does have a lot to do with why we went into Iraq. It was certainly cited by administration officials and Congress during the lead up to the invasion. But yeah, it wasn't the primary reason offered by the Bush administration, which, as I've said, was wrong."

It has seriously nothing to do with it at all you are literally buying the bullshit

2/17/2011 12:53:09 PM

Quote :

"A genocidal regime that wages a daily campaign of terrorism against its own people, I would say, does force the civilized world into a position of moral responsibility."

Look dude, stop talking like you know shit. Two reasons, and only 2 reasons why the US went to war:

Israel
Energy, aka, oil

If you want to talk about genocides, there are REAL genocides (while Saddam killed a lot, his killings were never classified as "genocide", yes I know, a technicality, but this is important here) such as Sudan, Congo, Sierra Leone. And remember Rwanda?

None of those countries ever threatened Israel or were ever in a position to attack Israel in any shape, way, or form. And none of them have any oil or any other assets the US would like to secure. Damn the millions killed, raped, and amputated... who gives a shit about them?

2/17/2011 4:08:15 PM

^ you’re wrong. I’m pretty sure it’s okay for the world’s largest military power, and 5th largest military power to start wars based on weak evidence, or outright lies and fabrication. Seems perfectly reasonable...

2/17/2011 7:40:06 PM

I wonder how much it will cost us to rebuild Egypt.

2/17/2011 10:12:50 PM

Quote :

"Two reasons, and only 2 reasons why the US went to war: Israel Energy, aka, oil"

Normally you make a lot more sense than this. Give me some evidence, eh? Israel's dislike of Saddam and the presence of oil in Iraq had been around for decades. Why'd we strike when we did? 9/11? You gonna tell me that was a conspiracy next?

Quote :

"If you want to talk about genocides, there are REAL genocides (while Saddam killed a lot, his killings were never classified as "genocide", yes I know, a technicality, but this is important here) such as Sudan, Congo, Sierra Leone. And remember Rwanda?"

Were the events in any of those countries ever classified as genocides? Certainly Sierra Leone's wasn't. Everyone has hemmed and hawed about Sudan and Congo. Maybe we decided after the fact about Rwanda, but nobody was calling it a genocide while it was happening.

You're making bullshit arguments here. If something being technically called a genocide is "important," your examples are shit.

2/17/2011 10:49:37 PM

People called those things genocide

2/17/2011 11:36:31 PM

Quote :

"I can't believe there are people out there like this [lazarus] asshole who still defend the Iraq war. I mean Jesus Christ what the fuck is wrong with you?"

Agree 100%.

Fuck lazarus and you other warmongering fucktards with your "moral responsibility" to kill innocents.
I don't know how you fuckers sleep at night.

[Edited on February 28, 2011 at 11:11 AM. Reason : ]

2/28/2011 11:10:28 AM

slam

3/1/2011 11:02:30 AM

Quote :

"I don't know how you fuckers sleep at night."

Flimsy rationalization and enforced ignorance

I'm constantly shocked that people can get onto the internet and spend time arguing without letting any information IN

3/1/2011 11:26:54 AM

That from the guy who once told me he didn't really need to know all that much about Afghanistan in order to make the most categorical denunciation of our presence there. Slogans cribbed from Michael Moore "documentaries" may fool some people, but they're not enough to convince me that you have the slightest fucking clue what you're talking about. Present an argument, or don't. Vapid ad hominem doesn't advance anything, including your stature.

3/1/2011 12:00:01 PM

Missing Iraq cash 'as high as $18bn'

Quote :

"Osama al-Nujaifi, the Iraqi parliament speaker, has told Al Jazeera that the amount of Iraqi money unaccounted for by the US is $18.7bn - three times more than the reported $6.6bn. Just before departing for a visit to the US, al-Nujaifi said that he has received a report this week based on information from US and Iraqi auditors that the amount of money withdrawn from a fund from Iraqi oil proceeds, but unaccounted for, is much more than the $6.6bn reported missing last week. "There is a lot of money missing during the first American administration of Iraqi money in the first year of occupation. "Iraq's development fund has lost around $18bn of Iraqi money in these operations - their location is unknown. Also missing are the documents of expenditure. "I think it will be discussed soon. There should be an answer to where has Iraqi money gone." The Bush administration flew in a total of $20bn in cash into the country in 2004. This was money that had come from Iraqi oil sales, surplus funds from the UN oil-for-food programme and seized Iraqi assets. Officials in Iraq were supposed to give out the money to Iraqi ministries and US contractors, intended for the reconstruction of the country. 'No trace' The Los Angeles Times reported last week that Iraqi officials argue that the US government was supposed to safeguard the stash under a 2004 legal agreement it signed with Iraq, hence making Washington responsible for the cash that has disappeared. Ghassan Atiyyah, of the Iraq Foundation for Development and Democracy, discusses Iraq's missing billions Pentagon officials have contended for the last six years that they could account for the money if given enough time to track down the records. The US has audited the money three times, but has still not been able to say exactly where it went. Al Jazeera's Iraq correspondent, Jane Arraf, reporting from Baghdad, said: "It's an absolutely astonishing figure - this goes back to 2003 and 2004. "There is going to be a fairly wide net cast - some of them [involved in mishandling of this money] are thought to be US officials, but many here believe that it is the Iraqis who have filled their pockets. "Safeguarding the money was up to the Americans ... after the invasion, provisional authority here was run by the American military. "Piles and piles of shrink-wrapped US dollars came here, but the cash coming in is not the important part - it is what happened to it after [it got here]. "There are no documents to indicate who got it, where it was spent and what was ever built from it.""

This clearly shows how little the DoD cares about "reconstruction" of Iraq. Regardless of whether Iraq or US officials misappropriated the funds, it was the DoD's job to make sure the money was distributed properly.

6/19/2011 12:49:03 PM

Even before 9/11, I thought it was likely Bush was going to get into Iraq. As soon as he came in, he amped up anti-Iraq rhetoric even though nothing new had happened. That raised red flags for me.

Once 9/11 happen, I thought it was certain they invade Iraq and trump up and excuse possible to justify it. The UN resolutions and WMD rhetoric were comical in this light. They were all machinations that allowed Bush to fulfill a wish he had long before 9/11.

6/19/2011 2:33:35 PM