I've got my GTI listed on Autotrader for $17,450. This guy calls from a Houston, TX phone number, says he's from Houston, and after a number of emails answering questions/negotiating he sends this:

Quote :

"OK, well I've got the money transferred...so the funding side is ready to go. We're off by $900, 16,550 to 17,450. If you can settle on $16,750, I would appreciate it...it helps cover the airfare. Bank=Bank of America Arrival time in Raliegh=11AM on April 15th (still need to book) I'll have two bank/certified checks. The first one will be for $10,000 from Pentagon Federal. The second will be for $6,750 from Bank of America. Both of these checks should be in hand on Thursday. I'll scan them, then email the scan the same day for proof/confirmation. The PenFed check is the financed portion."

Anytime I've sold vehicles in the past we've met at the buyers bank for them to issue me the check and draw up the papers and I'd prefer to keep it that way.

I guess this guy is saying he'll send scans of the checks by Thursday so I can verify with the banks prior to sale, but it still seems scammy to me. Obviously I'm going to check with my bank etc, but I figured I's see what you all thought first since you all seem to have a lot of experience buying/selling on the internets. I will say the dude has a .me email, and his purported name matches a linkin.com profile with a shitload of connections...if any of that matters.


Here's my listing if anyone is curious: http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=p&car_id=296091808&dealer_id=66124733 (open to any comments etc on the pricing or the ad too )

4/12/2011 9:26:21 PM

PenFed deposited the money into my account and I wrote a check to my other Credit Union when I refinanced the Lexus. Perhaps he got both an Auto loan and a personal loan (hence the two seperate institutions...) See if he shows. If not, then no harm right?

[Edited on April 12, 2011 at 9:29 PM. Reason : .]

4/12/2011 9:29:02 PM

I guess I'm worried about him showing up with a fake PenFed check, and a real BOA check. PenFed has no locations around so I guess I'd have to call to verify the check???

4/12/2011 9:31:44 PM

Penfed info:

QUESTIONS?
CALL US AT 800-247-5626

ABA Routing Number: 2560-7844-6


Branch Locations:
https://www.penfed.org/aboutUs/branchLocations.asp

Where are you located?

[Edited on April 12, 2011 at 9:34 PM. Reason : .]

4/12/2011 9:33:24 PM

^ Raleigh, closest location is Fayetteville

He just emailed:

Quote :

" Your local BoA bank can verify the funds with PenFed directly... "

4/12/2011 9:43:10 PM

If it were me, I'd say it's worth the drive to make sure the check is legit... Same with BOA.

4/12/2011 9:45:05 PM

Worth the drive to Fayetteville? Hardly, a phone call would accomplish the same thing...

4/12/2011 11:17:48 PM

but there are cool bros in fayetteville!

4/13/2011 12:22:16 AM

this is why I only sell my cars locally. It's not like Raleigh is a small market where it's impossible to sell a car locally.

4/13/2011 12:41:27 AM

My bank has called to verify cashiers checks for me in the past. No idea how perfect the system is, but they always seemed confident that the checks were real after they called. Check with your bank to see if they can verify it with 100% certainty.

4/13/2011 9:12:39 AM

why not a wire transfer?

i just sold my car to a guy who flew out from Minnesota

he did the bank transfer and waited around for 2 days for it to clear.

he didn't have posesssion of my car until my bank had the funds and I'd signed the title



my bank told me it could take 5 to 10 days for a certified check to be verified in my case

4/13/2011 9:15:31 AM

^What he said.

My car and title aren't going anywhere until funds clear. If you want it now, give me cash.

4/13/2011 12:55:28 PM

Well VW has the title.

The PenFed check is coming from an auto loan, so it'll be made out to VW Finance I assume. The other will probably be made out to me (again, I assume).

So can't I just accept the checks at a a local BOA (so I can cash/verify the BOA check), call to verify the PenFed check, and let him drive off with the car? I'm assuming he's going to have to trust me/VW to send the title after the PenFed check is totally cleared right?

I'm about to just scrap the deal but I'm trying to explore all avenues first...

Quote :

"he did the bank transfer and waited around for 2 days for it to clear."

I would never wire some dude $17k with no contract or anything, so I can't really ask anyone to do it either. Did you do some contract or something prior to the guy sending you the money?

4/13/2011 1:53:19 PM

Do you need to sell it now? Why not tell him that you still aren't comfortable with the arrangement?

4/13/2011 2:26:10 PM

he did not wire it to me, he wired it to my bank

They put a hold on it once it cleared and contacted me with what to do with it

I gave them my loan information and they deposited the remainder into my chosen account.

He flew out to drive the car and verify everything I posted was on the up and up, met the branch manager of my bank before he called back home and had his wife make the transfer, then stayed local in town until the proceeds cleared

he literally took all the risk, but he wasn't getting my car any other way.

we had a verbal agreement and a handshake, so there was some trust involved.


it was either that, or travel across country with a stack of cash

[Edited on April 13, 2011 at 3:23 PM. Reason : s]

4/13/2011 3:21:52 PM

Quote :

"Did you do some contract or something prior to the guy sending you the money? "

You could do a notarized Bill of Sale before funds clear?

4/13/2011 3:24:53 PM

none of that shit matters from what I have experienced, other than the signed title


get the funds verified and in hand first

4/14/2011 9:56:14 AM

I'd do the transaction at Bank of America (where they can verify their check) and have them call to verify the other check.

I'm all for protecting yourself, but it can only go so far. You're going to have one check drawn from this guy's checking account, his ID will be verified by the bank/notary process, and you'll have a second check that the bank will call to verify. The check itself constitutes a contract for him to pay you and you should have a notarized bill of sale as well. You really can't ask for much more security than that. And, to top it all off, if the car breaks down a week from now he'll be hundreds of miles away unlike the local yokels who might try to make your life suck for it.

It's just as likely that he could commit identity fraud and wire the money (which would be reversed as soon as it was discovered) as it is that he could forge a check and somehow slip it past your bank's scrutiny.

[Edited on April 14, 2011 at 3:04 PM. Reason : s]

4/14/2011 3:03:55 PM

So I have this girl out of Philly who's flying down Sunday with a friend to buy the GTI Monday (she forwarded me her airline confirmation email so I think it's on)

She's going to be paying with checks from TD Bank, so I'm going to give her the payoff amount and she's going to write one to VW America for that amount and one to me for the rest. I have requested Cashiers checks...one to make me feel better and b) because VW will release the title in 3 days instead of 10 for personal check. Cashiers checks are pretty standard for transactions of this amount right?

My plan is to meet at my bank (SECU) and sign a bill of sale (guess I'll google for one) and have it notarized, then give her the keys and let her drive off. Then when I receive the title from VW mail it to her.

So a few questions for those more experienced than me with buying/selling cars private party:

1) Does the plan sound good? Any room for me to get screwed?
2) She's asking if I mind making the bill of sale amount for less than the purchase price (supposedly for her to pay less tax, it's 6% in PA). That sounds pretty sketch right?
3) She's planning on taking the bill of sale (and probably me) to the DMV to get temporary tags to drive it home. I'm thinking that should be easy enough.

5/3/2011 9:39:15 AM

1. Sounds good to me, but have SECU call to verify the checks are legit.
2. Sounds sketch. In NC they use a blue book value for the taxes on private party transactions, so this would be useless for her. PA may have different laws, but I'd tell her that the bill of sale needs to match the amount of the checks you're receiving and that you won't help her skirt her state's laws. You have nothing to gain for it.
3. Could be difficult without having the NC title in hand. Call the DMV to see if they'll accept the bill of sale for temporary tags. If she seems trustworthy you might want to let her drive home on your tags. The notarized bill of sale should help you out of any red light tickets, unpaid tolls, etc. You can always withhold the title until she sends the plates back if you want to return them.

[Edited on May 3, 2011 at 9:51 AM. Reason : s]

5/3/2011 9:49:28 AM

she's flying down from PA to buy a car and drive it home without a title? if she is legit she is more trusting than i am.

5/3/2011 9:56:45 AM

I've bough motorcycles before where I picked them up and had the seller mail me the title later, after they notarized it, if it was too late to go to the bank same day (i picked them up with a truck so no plates were required). As long as you pick it up from the person's house and the person seems legit, I think checking out the tittle in person, them making a copy with a Bill of sale with both the seller's and buyers ID photocopied and signed sounds like enough protection to me. If you need further assurance, you make it clear that if you intend to come back with gas can and matches if you do not get your title in the mail within a week

5/3/2011 10:11:12 AM

It's illegal to write a bill of sale for less than the actual purchase price. Rare to get caught doing it, but I wouldnt want to get caught up with that.

She should be fine driving home with a bill of sale. The important thing is that she has proof of insurance on the vehicle. You should cancel your insurance on the car as soon as you sign the bill of sale. Otherwise if she wrecks it on the way home, you're on the hook.

5/3/2011 3:50:06 PM

Cool thanks for the advice people...think I'm ready to do this

5/6/2011 9:37:55 AM

BTW, you don't want to cancel insurance until the plate is either transferred or turned in at the DMV.

5/6/2011 10:35:12 AM

car = sold

only slight hangup was we met up at the DMV, and she said the lady at the counter told her that a title was required for a 10 day tag for her to transport the car home. the counter lady wouldn't accept a notarized bill of sale...so I let her use my plate for the trip home.

how liable am i if she causes a monster wreck on the way home? i've got proof of transfer of ownership with the notarized bill of sale, so I'm thinking I'm not that exposed here. What do you all think? I didn't cancel my insurance yet just in case (thought I thought about cancelling to limit exposure...)

5/9/2011 4:07:10 PM

should have told her to bring her own plate.

5/9/2011 11:57:22 PM