I am planning to backpack all over europe and it seems like the 800 dollar pass is a bit cheap. Are there hidden costs or can you really hop on and hop off as you please? Are there annoying little ticket issues or reservation issues or can you just show up and jump on?

http://www.eurail.com/home

The site makes it seem so easy.

Any suggestions or ideas of places to go or how to do this trip or tips for this trip would be welcomed. Thanks.

4/10/2012 12:15:23 PM

you have to pay extra in a few countries...I had to pay an extra fee in france I believe, and if you want to upgrade, or get a sleeper car.

If you're going to be spending the majority of the time in a few countries, they have 2, 3 and 4 country specific unlimited passes for alot cheaper.

4/10/2012 12:44:13 PM

i did not sign up for one of these before studying abroad for the semester.

big. fucking. mistake.

4/10/2012 12:49:28 PM

just fly Ryanair and then use local rail

4/10/2012 12:51:45 PM

There are tons of hidden costs...but if you're going all over Europe, its still your best deal. Main extra cost is for seat reservations.

Being a European Traveling Noob in the beginning, I thought this pass would allow me to jump on a train whenever I wanted and go wherever I wanted. WRONG. You have to make seat reservations at pretty much every stop (far in advance in big cities like Paris/Barcelona/Amsterdam). Those cost a pretty penny in the big cities and are less in the smaller places.

Whats your itinerary?

4/10/2012 1:00:32 PM

$800 seems cheap for a train pass?

4/10/2012 1:10:46 PM

I'm going to Brussels, Amsterdam, and Berlin later in the summer for vacation. I should start figuring this shit out.

4/10/2012 1:15:09 PM

Ryan Air is your cheapest bet...seriously. Sure they sell lottery tickets while on board (and if no one buys one, the plane crashes) but they're cheap

4/10/2012 1:28:50 PM

Quote :

"(and if no one buys one, the plane crashes)"

4/10/2012 1:42:37 PM

Do your research before depending on the "Ryan Air" type places. They are very limited to when and where they fly. And if you have a heavy bag (which is likely if you're backpacking), then you get charged just as much as what a regular ticket would be in a big airline.

The cheap airlines aren't the best deal for people who are "backpacking". They can sometimes help if you're in a quick bind and need to get somewhere fast instead of a 18 hour train ride...but it's not something you want to (or can) use for most of your backpacking travel needs.

4/10/2012 2:04:38 PM

just keep your bag under 40 kilos and you'll be fine. I was in Europe for over a month and went all over the place with no issue. that's the biggest mistake people make is overpacking. There are laundromats everywhere and most have free wifi so it's actually nice to catch up on the internets as you wait on your clothes. for real, travel light. it is so worth the minor inconvenience of washing your clothes than to lug around a heavy ass bag and pay fees all over the place. hell, bring generic walmart clothes you can throw out at certain points in the trip if you want to reduce the amount you have to wash.

Ryanair
Smartwings
Easyjet
Wizzair
Vueling

all of these were great in my experience, but again, I stayed within weight and size guidelines with my pack. If you anticipate heavier bags, pay in ADVANCE because it's much cheaper than at the gate and it will save a ton of time. You can get flights as cheap as 5 euros for some of these. I don't think I ever paid more than $20 one way, but again, try to plan in advance. Often times we didn't and it was still dirt cheap.

I took the train from Amsterdam to Brussels to Paris and it was fast, comfortable and nice to see some scenery but it was expensive. I think it was called Thally's.

travel light and fly.

4/10/2012 2:53:30 PM

40 kilos isn't light -- it's 80+ pounds

4/10/2012 3:27:32 PM

Thanks, not all of us sell coke

4/10/2012 3:33:21 PM

^^^^You're out of your friggin mind, RyanAir and the like are perfect for backpackers. While one airline alone isn't sufficient to make it around the continent, there are tons of these airlines that all service different airports across all of Europe, Northern Africa (Morocco), and the Middle East (Turkey). RyanAir, Jet4you, Easyjet, Correndon, WizzAir, and Germanwings are just a few of the MANY dirt cheap airlines. I took 3 of these airlines, all very long distance (Turkey-Amsterdam, Brussels-Casablanca, Marrakech-London) and not once was it over $100, and that was when the euro was strong, and not once did I have a problem. Your airfare is unbelievably cheap so they nickel and dime you. If you have one large bag/backpack that is under 20 kg (and no guy needs a backpack bigger than this), you're going to have to pay a set price for your bag but it's not that much. Keep in mind if you take a train or a bus they often charge you to stow the bag as well. Also all these flights are charter flights, slightly different than flying here at home. Usually you cannot change your ticket for any reason, no refunds or exchanges, and the courier will recommend you have your travel insurance to cover the cost of a new ticket. Also there's no insurance on lost luggage or if a plane can't fly due to weather or Act of God, so make sure your travel insurance covers that as well.

Take it from someone that backpacked solo across Europe through 12 countries a couple of years ago. The air trips are the cheapest form of transportation, significantly cheaper then international rail and bus trips. If you plan on getting around in the UK, or to/from the UK to nearby mainland cities (e.g. Paris) use Megabus. The buses are very cheap, very nice, and all have wifi. In fact megabus just recently expanded to the east coast of the United States. It is WAY more economical than train tickets.

When you say you're going to backpack all over Europe, do you really mean all over Europe? Eurail is only for central and western Europe (with heavy extra charges for Switzerland). If you're going Eastern Europe (as in east of Germany/Austria/Italy) or Scandinavia then the Eurail isn't going to be honored at all. Three months travel starting in Moscow, ending in the UK, and with trips to Morocco and Turkey, I sure didn't spend $800 for transportation costs for the whole trip, to give you an idea. Also check nontraditional airlines to get from the USA to Europe, I only spent $600 from JFK to Moscow (Aeroflot) and $350 coming home Glasgow to Toronto (Thomas Cook).

Buy the Lonely Planet Europe on a shoestring and you can't go wrong, that was my "Bible" for traveling and was invaluable throughout my entire journey. Use hostelbookers or hostelworld to book your hostels, they charge a small fee each time but you only have to deposit 10% so you keep your flexibility. I had an iPod touch with me for the trip and it was great because more than half the time, people didn't secure their wireless connections so if I wanted to surf the web for free all I had to do was walk down a street in a city (not to mention you'd be amazed the remote places that have wifi nowadays). Don't bring or bring the fewest amount of cotton clothes as possible. Cotton is heavy, smells after a couple of wears, and doesn't dry quickly. Buy synthetic everything; socks, underwear, zipoff pants, shirts, and pullovers. If you have an idea of how long you'll be there and what countries and regions you plan to visit, I'll make some recommendations.

If it's at all possible, and you have a strong sense of adventure like me, go Eastern Europe. It's way fun, you meet a more diverse traveling cohort, it's cheaper, and there's a lot fewer tourists crowding you out. Moscow, Ukraine, Romania, Turkey, Slovakia, and Morocco were all beyond amazing, and I got around fine just knowing English and Spanish (the guidebook has lots of words/phrases in every language for all the countries). The UK, Belgium, and Holland were cool and easy to travel around, I didn't care for Hungary or Poland.

[Edited on April 10, 2012 at 3:38 PM. Reason : ]

4/10/2012 3:34:09 PM

it's the cutoff for these airlines iirc

I was wayyy under that.

^agree completely, especially about going to Eastern Europe. I had friends come out to visit me and they were scared to go to a place like BUDAPEST oh God! haha but for real it's so much cheaper and much more of a real experience.

[Edited on April 10, 2012 at 3:36 PM. Reason : .]

4/10/2012 3:34:22 PM

Quote :

"If you're going Eastern Europe (as in east of Germany/Austria/Italy) or Scandinavia then the Eurail isn't going to be honored at all."

What? My Eurail worked easily in all of those places. And I couldn't get a cheap flight out of Athens to any of the following major cities: Rome, Barcelona, Paris, Amsterdam.

I was traveling after the peak traveling season (September through early November) and every time I tried to find a cheap flight somewhere, it just wasn't happening.

[Edited on April 10, 2012 at 3:44 PM. Reason : .]

4/10/2012 3:38:42 PM

^I mean if you're going to shell out tons of cash for the Eurail global pass it will cover you, but it's not cost-effective as train prices in Eastern Europe aren't anything like they are in Western Europe. You'd be better off just buying tickets as you need them.

My trip was also not during peak season, but I didn't have any problems booking my flights only 10-14 days in advance. Not trying to argue, I'm just saying I had a different experience.

Also if you're going anywhere along the Mediterranean coast and it's summertime, the cruise ships might spoil some of the fun. I'm not saying I want a whole beach/town to myself every time, but the amount of people (and the types of people) on those cruiseliners take the fun out of traveling for me in my opinion.

[Edited on April 10, 2012 at 3:51 PM. Reason : ]

4/10/2012 3:39:06 PM

Quote :

"it's the cutoff for these airlines iirc"

The cutoff is closer to 40 pounds, not kg. For instanct, the heaviest allowable bag with a surcharge for Ryan Air is 20kg.

But your point about traveling light still stands and I couldn't agree more.

4/10/2012 3:55:10 PM

What are the hidden fees besides reservation fees and is it practical to think if you have time you can just wait until there is a single empty seat on a train that you wouldn't need to reserve one?

[Edited on April 10, 2012 at 4:06 PM. Reason : one thing to consider about trains is overnight trains save accomodations and hostels are expensive]

4/10/2012 4:05:31 PM

^^pounds, kilos; yards, meters

whats the difference?

but yeah I guess I just remembered the conversion. so yeah under 40 lbs

I've backpacked Europe a few times, and have had girls meet me for parts of the summer and they always brought soooo much shit and I ended up having to carry their extra shit. I'm talking giant rolling bags and all sorts of shit that you don't need.

think of it as urban camping for the most part.

[Edited on April 10, 2012 at 4:20 PM. Reason : .]

4/10/2012 4:18:27 PM

http://www.eurail.com/planning/train-seat-reservations/how-to-avoid

They make it seem like you can always find a way around paying.

4/10/2012 4:41:54 PM

You can't. I lived in Europe for 2 1/2 years...it's much easier to fly between countries. Sure rail is great inner-country (say Pisa to Rome) but from Pisa to Munich..FLY.

4/10/2012 4:52:16 PM

Damn. They make it sound like you have a wristband or swipecard and just hop on random trains all you want for a flat rate. Does anything exist for more money?

4/10/2012 5:13:03 PM

Quote :

"just keep your bag under 40 kilos and you'll be fine."

I just flew Ryan Air and the cutoff for a carry-on is 10kg. Flights are extremely cheap, as others have mentioned, but checking a bag costs like 70 euros!! They make you weigh your bag and put it in the sizing cage, if it doesn't fit you have to pay the 70 euro fee. As long as you don't check a bag or buy any lottery tickets, you will have a very cheap flight (cheaper and faster than a train - is there a reason you're so hooked on trains? I agree with bbehe that flying is better for longer trips)

I saw so many poor saps lugging around these enormous backpacks like they're sherpas on Everest. I'm a big proponent of packing light. You can very easily pack a low weight, airline carry-on sized backpack. Then you can carry it with you all the time if you're walking around town, and don't have to worry about the baggage handlers losing it. I used a frameless backpack - an internal frame could be too large for the overhead bin.

http://gossamergear.com/packs/mariposa-plus-ultralight-backpack.html

The best part is all the mesh pockets on the outside, that way you can put water bottles, camera, etc for easy access.

4/10/2012 5:21:13 PM

^ Thank you. 10kg sounds like more what I ran into. I think a lot of you traveled a long time ago. I was traveling during a shitty economy, and basically if you had anything bigger than a large purse, then it was above their "cutoff". And their flights have disappeared too.

Quote :

"What are the hidden fees besides reservation fees and is it practical to think if you have time you can just wait until there is a single empty seat on a train that you wouldn't need to reserve one? [Edited on April 10, 2012 at 4:06 PM. Reason : one thing to consider about trains is overnight trains save accomodations and hostels are expensive] "

If you wait until the last minute, you won't make the train. Don't fuck around with train seats. If you try to jump on the big trains without a reserved seat, they will fine you.

And overnight sleeper trains (upgrading so you can lay down) are just as expensive as a hostel. In my experience, hostels are pretty friggin cheap. I did one overnight train w/o getting a sleeper, and it wasn't that great of an experience (and I can sleep through anything). So I wouldn't try to save money by taking a bunch of overnight trains...it's not worth it.

4/10/2012 5:27:15 PM

So what the hell does the pass do? Sounds like you just pay money to want to ride the train.

4/10/2012 5:31:07 PM

^With the eurorail pass you can just get on the train in most countries. When they come cround asking for tickets, you just hand off the pass. Some of the time you'll have to book a seat. Doing so usually isn't hard and there will sometimes be a fee of a few dollars. It's not a big deal. Do a cost benefit analysis before you buy. If you can figure out how much you plan to ride, you might be better off just buying tickets the normal way. If you don't have a fixed schedule, the flexibility is hard to beat.

PS: overnight trains suck ass

4/10/2012 5:47:47 PM

Quote :

"Thanks, not all of us sell coke"

laughed

4/10/2012 5:52:35 PM

You are the first one that has made it sound positive. I want to go as many places as possible and some places I might only want to stay for several hours and have the chance to hop on a train and go somewhere else in a matter of hours.

Supplements seem to be in most places or is that a myth?

If you really can just hop on and flash the pass in most of the places then I want to do it. Even if I have to pay a little extra for paris, amsterdam, rome and barcalona.

I looked on ryanair and those flights seem extremely hard to find. Is there a kayak type engine for those cheap airlines?

4/10/2012 5:55:10 PM

^ I meant to be positive in my initial post...but I guess I came off negative when I did say there were extra costs.

I originally thought the Eurail pass was a great deal. Then I had to pay a pretty decent "seat reservation" on my first train from Paris to Amsterdam and it kind of put me in a negative mood about it. But I ended up traveling all over the fucking place and had a great time. And although I always had to chip in a couple extra bucks for a seat reservation, I still ended up saving money overall.

Save time and money and just get the pass. Flying the ryanair and jet air is best if you're already located somewhere in Europe (like studying abroad or if you got a job) and you're just doing weekend trips. It's not convenient if you're hopping around and have a bad that weighs a decent amount.

4/11/2012 1:14:07 AM

Wow, the Eurail pass must have changed a lot since I went in 2003.

We never paid a penny over the initial cost of the pass, the ONLY tickets we advanced purchased were sleeper trains, and we got those the morning before leaving.

I was in Europe for 14 days. We went to 10 countries. The pass was fucking amazing. We did virtually zero planning. Every morning we woke up and decided whether to stay another day where we were, or to go somewhere else. Got out a map, picked and interesting city, looked up the train schedule and got to the station an hour before the train left.

Plus the train stations always were in well located places near busses or local rail stops, so we got in and out of cities really easily.

4/11/2012 5:15:40 AM

^ I only had difficulty in the big cities. I tried to take an early morning train from Paris to Amsterdam without making a prior reservation and had to wait like 6 or 7 hours because all the early ones were full. That made me cautious for the rest of the trip and I always checked the availability and booked my seat the night before (when it was probably only necessary 2 or 3 times when I was in Munich and Barcelona).

I hate talking about this shit....makes me want to go back so bad.

4/11/2012 8:48:31 AM

Don't do Europe. Instead do a google search for people who have sailboats and need a crew. Most the time they just want you to help pay for food, and you learn to sail, and see awesome exotic places and you have a place to sleep at night.

4/11/2012 10:24:04 AM

Quote :

"Wow, the Eurail pass must have changed a lot since I went in 20032006. We never paid a penny over the initial cost of the pass, the ONLY tickets we advanced purchased were sleeper trains, and we got those the morning before leaving. "

same here...I just had to pay extra leaving paris, and i don't think that was even a "reservation" fee.

4/11/2012 11:11:09 AM

^^ Two completely different things. While your idea sounds fun, experiencing Europe is amazing as well. Not too many other ways you can experience so many different cultures and people in that type of time frame and cost. I always advice people to backpack Europe first, then do everything else next.

4/11/2012 11:19:21 AM

Quote :

"I want to go as many places as possible"

How long is your trip and what does this mean? You want to go to every country? You want to go to the major countries? You want to go to lots of cities in a few countries?

4/11/2012 12:14:47 PM

Quote :

"If you're going Eastern Europe (as in east of Germany/Austria/Italy) or Scandinavia then the Eurail isn't going to be honored at all"

Incorrect on all parts:

http://www.eurail.com/eurail-passes/global-pass

I had to pay separate for a trip into Poland (obviously they aren't covered by Eurail) but outside of sleeper cars and the occasional/minimal reservation fee, that was it.

Quote :

"with heavy extra charges for Switzerland"

I had no extra charges using my Eurail into Switzerland in 2004...perhaps that's changed but I doubt it. There are probably a couple special/express trains that require a fee, but the vast majority of lines are covered with no additional fee.
Yep, here it is: http://www.raildude.com/en/switzerland/eurail-reservation-and-supplement/ch

I agree with most everything else you said fwiw...I just think you have a bias against trains. Planes and trains both have their places for the multi-country backpacker...just depends on how much time and money you have available, and what kind of experience you're after.

Quote :

"My trip was also not during peak season, but I didn't have any problems booking my flights only 10-14 days in advance. Not trying to argue, I'm just saying I had a different experience."

See here's where trains win. Flexibility. When I did my 10 month/9 country trip in 04, I didn't want to have to book trips 10-14 days in advance. I wanted to be able to get done in a city one day and decide to go somewhere else the next. True enough at a couple larger cities I had to wait a day (Paris and Barcelona come to mind), but pretty much everywhere else I went I could leave the next day.

I took a few flights on Ryan Air (typically over water, or over long distances), and they were great and all, but trains win, in pretty much all ways...especially if you're travelling solo. You get flexibility, the ability to walk around and meet fellow travelers (I met a number of people on trains that I ended up travelling with later) more room to spread out/eat/drink/*relax*, and obviously they're way easier to sleep on. Also you can actually see and experience the scenery as opposed to flying over it. Plus the crap airports all the low cost carriers operate out of are often out in the sticks (requiring more time and $ to get to/from) while the train stations are usually located in city center.

I mean if you're really trying to do Europe on a shoestring, then sure, save a couple/few hundred bucks and fly everywhere. If you can afford it though, take the trains.

Quote :

"I was in Europe for 14 days. We went to 10 countries. The pass was fucking amazing. We did virtually zero planning. Every morning we woke up and decided whether to stay another day where we were, or to go somewhere else. Got out a map, picked and interesting city, looked up the train schedule and got to the station an hour before the train left. Plus the train stations always were in well located places near busses or local rail stops, so we got in and out of cities really easily."

+1

Quote :

"I want to go as many places as possible and some places I might only want to stay for several hours and have the chance to hop on a train and go somewhere else in a matter of hours. "

I will caution you against trying to do too much. A common mistake is to try and hit too many countries, and in the process, never truly experience the ones you visit. It's not about putting checks into boxes, it's about the experience. Outside of some outlier scenarios, I wouldn't want to visit a city/country for less than 3-4 days.

4/11/2012 1:05:25 PM

Good reading here: message_search.aspx?type=topic§ion=1&searchstring=europe

4/11/2012 1:36:15 PM

I don't want to read stuff from five years ago because I'm afraid that things have changed drastically with the economic crisis.

Are there any sites that put all the sites together for trains or cheap airlines? A european train/cheap air version of kayak? or even something like expedia? It seems like I have to peel through about 25 different sites.

[Edited on April 12, 2012 at 12:04 PM. Reason : err]

4/12/2012 12:03:49 PM

Quote :

"I don't want to read stuff from five years ago because I'm afraid that things have changed drastically with the economic crisis."

For general backpacking info, not for Eurail guidance.

4/12/2012 12:15:31 PM

As of now,I am thiking about combining a rail pass with a bus pass so if i run into a situation where they are charging fees, i can just take the bus. The bus pass is also much cheaper.

4/12/2012 4:40:04 PM

It may be easier to just buy individual bus tickets as it becomes necessary. I suspect that doing it that way will be cheaper than Eurail + Bus pass since you won't likely be needing the bus often if at all. This way also allows you to compare the seat reservation charge with price of bus ticket so that you can go with whatever is more cost effective at that time.

4/12/2012 4:46:49 PM

That makes sense. The only problem is that if I take the bus like 4 times, I have paid for the pass.

4/12/2012 4:48:59 PM

^^ how much are the seat reservation fees these days? in the few places i had to pay the, i remember them being pretty small in 04, like 10 euros or whatever...

4/13/2012 9:25:00 AM

i didn't read the entirety of this thread, but i'd suggest skipping eurail altogether

i suppose it CAN be a good deal under the right circumstances, but you likely aren't under those circumstances

4/13/2012 9:58:33 AM

Could you please describe said circumstances. I'm not under any circumstances and am currently trying to figure out my circumstances.

4/13/2012 1:31:43 PM