There's a tree that is possibly partially on my property (possibly meaning that I'm not a surveyor, but I have GIS and a tape measure). If it is on my property, it is only partially so. It's a really tall tree, and the top branch on it has grown over the house next door to mine.

The owners of the house next door (they're realtors, they used to rent it but it's been pretty much abandoned for the past several years) are planning to sell it and say that, in order to renew the homeowner's insurance, they have to cut the branch down. They want me to pay for it. I told them to get me an estimate on paper and I'd take a look at it. That was about a week ago and I haven't heard back, but I want to be prepared to respond and to know my rights and how best to proceed.

1. Is there a better way of determining the property line without bringing out a surveyor?
2. If it is partially on my property, do I have a legal obligation to pay for the branch removal?
3. If so, what portion of the costs should I be responsible for?

Has anybody had experience with something like this before? Any ideas?

8/10/2012 11:24:01 AM

haha, what a bunch of dicks. you should get the city/HOA to harass them when the yard gets a bit unkempt.

8/10/2012 11:29:26 AM

to me it looks like its their problem.

8/10/2012 11:29:58 AM

If everything you've said is true, it sounds like your realtor neighbors are just trying to take advantage of you. I'm sure there is a legitimate explanation of your obligation/rights in this matter but I wouldn't know without doing some research of my own. I may be mistaken, but I always thought that a tree on a property line had to be designated one way or another and couldn't really be considered "shared". So, it's either your tree or theirs, meaning you pay all or none of the cost for having the branch removed. Just a guess really

8/10/2012 11:30:36 AM

What condition is the branch actually in? Why does it need to be trimmed? That matters for the purposes of me answering the question.

8/10/2012 11:39:48 AM

found this...http://realestate.findlaw.com/neighbors/conflicts-involving-trees-and-neighbors.html

Quote :

" Most of a large tree hangs over my yard, but the trunk is in the neighbor's yard. Who owns the tree? The neighbor owns the tree. So long as the tree trunk is wholly in the neighbor's yard, it belongs to the neighbor. When the tree trunk is divided by the property lines of two or more people, it is referred to as a "boundary tree". In the case of a "boundary tree", all of the property owners own the tree and share responsibility for it. Tree removal without the consent of all the property owners is unlawful. "

and this

Quote :

" If my neighbor's tree branches hang over my yard, can I trim them? Yes. By law, you have the right to trim branches and limbs that extend past the property line. However, the law only allows tree trimming and tree cutting up to the property line. You may not go onto the neighbor's property or destroy the tree. If you do harm the tree, you could be found liable for up to three times the value of the tree. Most trees have a replacement value of between $500 and $2500. Some, that are considered ornamental or landmark trees, can have an astonishing value of between $20,000 and $60,000. So use extreme caution when tree trimming! "

so if it is partially on your property, i would think that while they aren't removing the tree and only just the branch b/c the branch is on their property it's totally their responsibility. if they were removing the tree then you would probably want a surveyor to make sure it is partially yours before contributing to any removal costs.

8/10/2012 11:39:50 AM

to me it looks like its their problem to me

8/10/2012 11:42:33 AM

i don't know how consise that diagram is, but the tree looks halfway on your property at worst, and completely on theirs at best.

i'm suspicious they are trying to take advantage of you, too. it's clear the property line is dubious, but they are immediately claiming it's your problem?

see what happens after the estimate. fortunately, removing a branch isn't hugely expensive, but if it gets more complicated or contentious the only final solution will be a surveyor.

8/10/2012 11:44:29 AM

Disclaimer: This is not legal advice, it is a recitation of law.

The first thing to determine is whether or not three is on your land. If it is partially on your land (but really, just a fraction), then they would have a hard time proving that you own the tree. If the base is fully on your land, then you are responsible for the tree and its branches. If the base is split, it is what's referred to as a "boundary tree", and you all own it. However, branch removal goes to the property owner it affects.

This is if you own the tree:

There is no provision that states you have to maintain the branches of the tree so that they are aesthetic or don't annoy your neighbors. You are responsible under negligence if you know the branch is dead/going to fall/blocking line of site for the road, etc.

Your neighbors are permitted to trim the branches, so long as they do not destroy the tree or mutilate the tree.

In Rowe v. McGee, 168 S.E.2d 77 (Ct. App. N.C. 1969) the court directed that a landowner be held responsible for a private nuisance if he knew of a tree's condition and it damaged property.

[Edited on August 10, 2012 at 11:45 AM. Reason : ]

8/10/2012 11:45:14 AM

Yea, don't pay for it. It's their problem, they can trim it.

8/10/2012 11:45:18 AM

^^But, if it is on his property, he would be liable for cutting that branch if their HO insurance is
unwilling to renew, I would assume

Plus, if it is on his property, I'd want to cut it down or trim significantly, as any storm that knocks it into the neighbor's house instantly becomes his problem.

[Edited on August 10, 2012 at 11:49 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2012 11:47:58 AM

He's only liable for the branch if the branch was in damaged condition and he, as owner of the tree, knew, or should of known, that the branch would cause damage to someone else's property. A storm coming through and knocking over a perfectly healthy tree is not negligence, it's an act of God, legally speaking.

8/10/2012 11:50:53 AM

^ This is correct.

Do not pay for anything. If they want the branch trimmed, that is their problem to pay for, regardless of who the tree belongs to.

Now, they may counter by claiming they are putting you on notice the limb is ill and might fall, at which point it would matter who owns the tree...so if they pull that crap and you still can't determine who owns the tree, having a tree technician come out and put in writing that the tree/limb is healthy might be the cheapest option.

What I would do is tell them you have measured it and the tree is not on your property. That would put it on them to maybe bring out a surveyor to prove one way or another.

8/10/2012 12:04:28 PM

I had to go through this with my property and the adjacent, HOA-owned property... they have a tree and the branches grew so they were actually touching my house... i ended up having to trim the tree myself as the HOA wouldn't do anything.

8/10/2012 12:11:05 PM

You may be able to locate the pins that mark your property corners. I was able to find all of mine with a metal detector (when I was planning a fence installation).

8/10/2012 2:13:33 PM

I think you may have screwed yourself by asking for the estimate since NC is a verbal contract state.

8/10/2012 2:54:42 PM

Yeah, no clue why'd you do that.
I'd scoff if something similar happened.

8/10/2012 2:57:43 PM

^^ IANAL, but his description so far doesn't amount to a verbal contract to remove the tree or its branches. He said he would "take a look at the estimate." Yeah, I went there.


as for this scenario, I'd need to see more to really know, but if there's any dispute about where the tree lies, then I'd tell them it's their tree and it's their problem. After all, it is pretty much their problem right now, because their HO insurance doesn't want to insure the house any more. They are hoping you are a sucker and will just pay to trim their own tree. Tell them you don't think it's on your land. The ball is then in their court: trim their own tree, or prove that it's yours.

[Edited on August 10, 2012 at 3:08 PM. Reason : ]

8/10/2012 3:04:58 PM

Quote :

"I think you may have screwed yourself by asking for the estimate since NC is a verbal contract state."

No, he hasn't. He's fine.

^I agree with that approach.

[Edited on August 10, 2012 at 3:09 PM. Reason : No contract without consideration. No consideration here.]

8/10/2012 3:09:05 PM

Quote :

"What condition is the branch actually in? Why does it need to be trimmed? That matters for the purposes of me answering the question. "

It needs to be trimmed because the insurance company says so. We went through this last fall with our insurance company and it was total bullshit. But we paid the money to have some stupid branches cut so we wouldn't have our insurance canceled on us. We tried contesting it at first but it was obvious that was going to get us nowhere. It kind of worked out though because now we have plenty of firewood for this winter

8/10/2012 4:55:50 PM

Quote :

"as for this scenario, I'd need to see more to really know, but if there's any dispute about where the tree lies, then I'd tell them it's their tree and it's their problem. After all, it is pretty much their problem right now, because their HO insurance doesn't want to insure the house any more. They are hoping you are a sucker and will just pay to trim their own tree. Tell them you don't think it's on your land. The ball is then in their court: trim their own tree, or prove that it's yours."

I agree. We had a sort of related problem with our rear neighbors are stormwater runoff/drainage. Basically it came down to it was their problem for buying a house at the bottom of a hill, but they wanted someone to blame for their problems. They probably gave up on the old owners and jumped on us when we became the new owners Some people are just assholes and hope that they can force other people to fix their own problems.

8/10/2012 8:05:23 PM

Just stop responding to them, they are responsible for the branch.

8/10/2012 9:51:42 PM

it probably wouldn't be the worst idea in the world to take a photo of the branch in question. that way they can't argue that you were negligent for not cutting down a dead/dying branch.

8/10/2012 10:54:31 PM

Quote :

"Just stop responding to them, they are responsible for the branch."

2nd this one, or just tell them to get a survey done to determine whos property the tree rests on, they probably wouldn't be willing to shell out the money for a survey and they would shut up

8/10/2012 10:58:55 PM

Quote :

"Just stop responding to them, they are responsible for the branch."

8/10/2012 11:30:24 PM

Quote :

"they are responsible for the branch"

8/11/2012 12:21:46 AM

that tree and those houses look shitty, what city do you live in, Minecraft?

8/11/2012 2:29:38 AM

The real question is, does the life begin as a seed or sapling?

I'm Krallum and I approved this message.

8/11/2012 2:34:56 AM

don't do anything

8/11/2012 8:58:34 AM

You sure that's a tree? Looks like a light pole to me.

8/11/2012 9:11:13 AM

So on Friday night, I'm having a fucking dinner party and these fools come over and tell me they found somebody to cut the branch for $150 and weren't going to continue working with the previous contractor they were using (they'd had a tree removal service working all over their property for a week or two). I told them the tree was, at best, on the property line, so I wasn't committing to anything. I told them if they wanted to get a professional surveyor out, I'd be interested to see where the property line is and work from there. They told me they had to have the work done by 8/12 (spoiler alert: that's today!) and they didn't have time to get a surveyor.

The next day, I hear chainsawing from like 8 AM until somebody (the earlier guy, who they told me they'd stopped working with) rings my doorbell, shows me that he cut the branch and trimmed some other trees, then hands me an invoice for $850. I told him he should give that to the property owners next door since I'd never agreed to do fucking ANYTHING with him. He said OK and that's the last I've heard of it as of now.

tl;dr wtf lolz

8/12/2012 10:25:24 PM

burn their house down

[Edited on August 12, 2012 at 10:27 PM. Reason : they sound like real pricks]

[Edited on August 12, 2012 at 10:28 PM. Reason : as most realtors are]

8/12/2012 10:27:28 PM

they do sounds like pricks.

8/12/2012 10:45:35 PM

Just ignore them. You never agreed to any of this.

8/12/2012 11:17:23 PM

Email
JRay5562@gmail.com

for all your tree needs

8/12/2012 11:27:34 PM

Not gonna lie, that's hilarious. Keep us updated on this.

8/12/2012 11:28:06 PM

Douchebags.. FIGHT THIS TO THE DEATH. You are not footing that ridiculous bill.

8/13/2012 12:44:50 AM

If it's on their side they have to deal with it.

Yeah if they called the guy out they are on the hook for it.

8/13/2012 2:21:54 AM

find a bunch of illegals and tell 'em ya got some free firewood, they just hafta get it themselves, then tree problem solved

8/13/2012 3:04:11 AM

trees have no rights. their ownership gets split right on the property line. they are responsible for their part of the tree, not you. even if the trunk of the tree were on your property. now if YOUR portion of the tree fell on their house or something, you would be liable. if THEIR branch is a problem, it's THEIR problem, not yours.

TLDR: fuck them, carry on.

[Edited on August 13, 2012 at 4:30 AM. Reason : that boundary tree thing is not how it works in some places]

8/13/2012 4:25:51 AM

The whole comment about the insurance company requiring the tree be trimmed sounds like a load, my entire neighborhood would be un-insurable if they regularly did that.

I also took out a new policy about six months ago with a behemoth tree about 3 feet from my house and branches going all over the roof. If this tree fell it would destroy my entire house.

8/13/2012 1:54:40 PM

They were claiming the branches were touching or "almost touching" the roof. They were not. Apparently they ascertained this from Google street view, I shit you not, and if we wanted them to send out a real live person we would have to pay. So we said screw it, had some branches removed, and sent in some crappy cell phone pics showing the removal. tl;dr don't use Liberty Mutual if you live on a wooded property.

8/13/2012 10:12:00 PM

I have Farm Bureau.

They definitely gave me a policy with tress all around the house.

8/13/2012 10:15:19 PM

i'm gonna call some landscapers out to mow my lawn...then tell them to give the invoice to the next door neighbors...some of their grass blades sometimes get in my property's airspace when the wind gusts

8/13/2012 10:18:27 PM

surely these fucks know it's their responsibility, but are hoping spookyjon is a tard

i bet it works for them over half the time

8/13/2012 10:20:18 PM

Quote :

"The owners of the house next door (they're realtors,"

Names.

8/13/2012 10:38:10 PM

Quote :

"surely these fucks know it's their responsibility, but are hoping spookyjon is a tard i bet it works for them over half the time"

8/13/2012 10:46:01 PM

updates?

8/17/2012 12:21:44 AM

I just got a quote for $2000 & $1700 to remove some trees.

8/17/2012 12:33:43 AM

i have a similar situation at my house with a pine tree that could fall on either house. i told my neighbor it doesn't matter legally where the property line is since the tree is not dead and that i would pay half for the tree to be completely removed. it's still there

[Edited on August 17, 2012 at 6:46 AM. Reason : a]

8/17/2012 6:45:48 AM