Or get a good coach with real recruiting skills.



[Edited on February 8, 2009 at 4:17 PM. Reason : Lucky 13]

2/8/2009 4:17:10 PM

I honestly have no idea why Horner is EVER in.

Put in Williams. Sure, he's raw, but he has potential at least. Horner has already reached his (extremely low) limits.

2/8/2009 4:18:11 PM

Ok, VT raped us, queue the asian kid cutting our heads off with a knife.

2/8/2009 4:18:23 PM

Or...we can get some good recruits...play an NBA offense...you know, don't teach how to shoot and dribble because they know how to do that apparently...and they will all go to the league as sophs and we still won't win.

2/8/2009 4:18:35 PM

that is hilarious

2/8/2009 4:18:43 PM

see that's the thing, we can't get a good coach

scratch that Lee Fowler can't get a good coach

his EPIC CHOKE in the coaching search is what ended us in this position

Sidney was doing Lee a favor because Fowler struck out on every big coach he courted and was desperate and behind as we bled recruits backing out of their LOIs because of the uncertainty

2/8/2009 4:19:13 PM

id rather flounder with a fresh coach than completely stagnate with sharply contrasting coach

2/8/2009 4:19:41 PM

^^ +1

2/8/2009 4:20:29 PM

I mean, floundering in football with a new coach landed in a bowl in year two and some damn good optimism in year three.

2/8/2009 4:20:59 PM

For a second there, I thought I was watching the '04 tourney game against Vandy. It went along with the same script.

2/8/2009 4:21:17 PM

minus white guys on the other team

2/8/2009 4:21:45 PM

How did WF get so good? They were shit the past few years. We were blowing them out. And now they are ranked? WTF WF?

2/8/2009 4:22:51 PM

theres only so much room on the bottom

2/8/2009 4:23:15 PM

coaches?

2/8/2009 4:23:18 PM

I'm fucking tired of being NOT-Duke and NOT-UNC.

We have won the fucking national title before, and no-name teams are doing better than us each year.

Totally unacceptable.

At least our football team has some potential, but this shit is a fucking curse.

It's almost like NCSU basketball can only excel if one of our head coaches get cancer.

That's not right.

2/8/2009 4:23:29 PM

Are you implying Lowe should get cancer?

2/8/2009 4:24:15 PM

^^^a dead coach's recruits. we all know prosser wasnt a good coach.

[Edited on February 8, 2009 at 4:24 PM. Reason : .]

2/8/2009 4:24:30 PM

I don't know if we've played 40 minutes of good hard basketball this whole season.

2/8/2009 4:25:22 PM

fuck this team

2/8/2009 4:25:55 PM

you have no idea how much this game has inspired me to do my shitton of hw and study for three tests this week

this shit might literally be hazardous to my health

2/8/2009 4:28:25 PM

i'm gonna say it. If lowe did his normal shitty substitutions early in the second half, we would have won the game. We still would have chocked, but at least we wouldn't be dead on defense. also, i'm not sure why trevor didn't play, but he must have played like ass in practice, but this game in the second half, i feel as he would have contributed.

2/8/2009 4:31:45 PM

fire lowe

2/8/2009 4:35:55 PM

2/8/2009 4:38:47 PM

One positive --

Javi choked by missing his free throws, sure. But I really liked what I saw from him today. He had some rust (understandably) and he had a few turnovers, but I thought he controlled the flow of the game really well -- until we went into duck-and-cover mode at least

2/8/2009 4:43:00 PM

it's too late in the season for moral victories. don't bother.

2/8/2009 4:47:32 PM

He and Costner both had 5 turnovers. That isn't real good.

2/8/2009 4:49:06 PM

Quote :

"fuck this team"

2/8/2009 5:12:39 PM

http://www.statefansnation.com/index.php/archives/2009/02/08/acc-officials-embarrass-league-spark-vpi-comeback/

lol StateFans says WORST REFS EVER and FIRE LOWE

that was a pretty painful game, the wolfpack might make an alcoholic out of me yet

2/8/2009 5:17:55 PM

is someone really blaming the REFS on this one??

seriously, i saw more blown calls that went in our favor than that horseshit flagrant call on Fells. that's arguably one of the worst calls I've ever seen, but two blatant missed calls/fouls went our way 2 minutes before that.

we blew it.

we gotta learn how to finish games. we're arguably the worst finishing team in the country.

a small adendum. . . i absolutely agree that the refs were absolutely HORRIBLE. some of the worst I've seen. but they certainly weren't biased, I can tell you that. we got away with a lot.

[Edited on February 8, 2009 at 5:31 PM. Reason : fsdafsdafsdf]

2/8/2009 5:29:06 PM

Quote :

"He and Costner both had 5 turnovers. That isn't real good."

Javi was far from great, but he actually made things happen and created offense for others. That's the first time we've had a PG consistently do that all year.

I'm also thinking at least two of those TO's were good passes our big guys simply dropped ... I know McCauley did this at least twice.

2/8/2009 5:40:23 PM

fuck

[Edited on February 8, 2009 at 6:12 PM. Reason : .]

2/8/2009 6:12:10 PM

where was smith in the 2nd half?

[Edited on February 8, 2009 at 6:33 PM. Reason : how does horner end up with 29 min and smith with 22??]

2/8/2009 6:32:39 PM

Haven't read anything on here about the change in pace in the 2nd half. Seemed like we slowed it down and it got us out of rhythm. You don't take your foot off the gas when you're up 19. Good teams pour it on.

Sid deserves the blame for that. Should have never come down to FTs.

2/8/2009 7:27:32 PM

What still gets to me is the intentional that Fells got. He should not have been given an intentional. Simple foul - fine, but not an intentional. That was the game changing moment. They knocked down both FT, then hit a 3, then with the no call when Horner was bringing it back up, they got a TO and then another 3. 8 point swing...18 pt lead to a 10 pt lead in less than 30 seconds.

If not for that call...well...with NC State, I don't know anymore, but I would like to say that we would have kept the lead strong and got the W.

2/8/2009 7:57:54 PM

^ we were still up by 10 points, but yeah with NC State no lead is ever safe.

2/8/2009 8:11:04 PM

I have realized I hate cheering for this team. We have had the lead in so many first halfs and I expect to lose. WTF.

2/8/2009 10:12:24 PM

I'll say this....Regardless of anything, we should have won that game. One free throw from Horner and the game is ours. One less boneheaded turnover down the stretch and Horner's free throws are irrelevant....


But if you don't think the officials had anything to do with the outcome of that game, you're fucking retarded, you didn't watch, and you are fucking retarded. We ran them out of their own gym in the first half and the officials went 5 minutes without calling shit on VT and meanwhile allowed them to cut a 17 point lead to 4 mostly from the free throw line. So don't give me this "we got every call for 30 minutes" bullshit. The only possible calls that went our way included some at the beginning of the game off the ball that did nothing but skew the foul count, and the technical foul on their coach. Other than that, this game was lopsided. Allen should have fouled out 3 different times with the amount he waas hanging on costner andMcCauley's back. Don't get me started on the 8 point sequence at the 12:30 mark with Fells' "intentional".



I just re-watched the last 13 minutes and I'm more furious now than I was at the time. I didn't get to see the last 8 minutes so I had to listen on the radio. Of the turnovers we committed down the stretch, they fouled us on at least half of them, there are 3 that were so obvious I just yelled at the fucking DVR. There were 2 charges called on us that were clearly blocking fouls. McCauley scored a bunch from the free throw line, and he could have doubled those points if they called the fouls that they should have. On the second to last basket for VT, that foul on McCauley was garbage. Apparently you can't play Defense with your feet flat for 3-4 seconds with your arms straight in the air. That foul didn't matter, but fast forward to our last attempt where McCauley got literally raped by Allen (had his cock under his armpit) and we don't get the call. I don't expect that call normally, but we had to get 3 fouls committed against us to have 1 called down the stretch, and they gave those calls to tech all afternoon.



Now that whole rant didn't include shit about the momentum killing intentional call that turned a blowout into a manageable deficit for Tech on their home floor. Don't come in here talking like we got calls all afternoon. If we had, we would have been up ty 30 when Fells got the intentional.


(note: Rant is mostly directed at those who think a) Don't think we lost because of officiating and b) are trying to put this loss on Sidney Lowe. I admit we still should have won, but in a fair basketball game, it shouldn't have come down to Horner's free throws. We played THAT good for 27 minutes...and the last 13 were decided on when the officials stopped blowing the whistle when we had the ball. )

[Edited on February 8, 2009 at 10:19 PM. Reason : ]

2/8/2009 10:16:49 PM

i'll agree with most of that

but we did get away with javi traveling once in the second half at least!

2/8/2009 11:19:46 PM

How did they call that foul from fells intentional? They even looked at the replay. He went for the ball, and fouled him with the body.

And that Bullshit gives them momentum and gets the crowd back into it.

A combination of players sucking at the worst possible time (HORNER) and the officials giving the game to VT.

2/8/2009 11:44:11 PM

Are we seriously blaming the Refs for blowing a 19-point lead? Come on.

Stop blaming the fucking refs and blame the ones really responsible, our players and coaching staff.

Yes the Intentional foul was a bad call but in the first half we were getting every call.

2/9/2009 12:21:33 AM

are you seriously suggesting that the refs had nothing to do with it?


I'm all with you on the fact that we still had to choke balls, but the point is that the refs took a blowout and made it a game, and on the road in the ACC a 10 point lead doesn't mean shit, regardless of who you are or how bad you "choke".


If I had a dollar for every 10 point lead that was overcome this in this league I'd be loaded. I realize we suck. I realize we should have done some things different, I realize we should have made 1/2 freethrows with 30 seconds left in the game. That doesn't take away from the fact that momentum means a lot in this league, and VT was given the momentum, they didn't earn it. Did they have to take advantage? yes. Did we have to play poorly down the stretch? yes. We still played well enough to win that game, and if the last 13 minutes is fairly officiated, we win going away...regardless of the fact that we didn't play that well. They had to commit 3 fouls to every 1 that was called, and we couldn't touch them without a whistle blowing.

2/9/2009 9:33:11 AM

I was traveling over the weekend. I turned it on right when Fells got his shot blocked about 45 seconds into OT. I made two assumptions:

That we blew some enormous lead to end up in OT and that we'd lose.

So I turned the game off. Sad to see that both assumptions were correct when reading up on the game this morning.

2/9/2009 10:30:01 AM

wolfAApack, I appreciate the fact that you are pissed. I am as well. hell, we all go to nc state are fucking sick of this.

BUT....


The Refs were like reason #5 why we lost this game.

I'm a Sales Exec at a Software company, and one of the many things we talk about is a sphere of influence. (things you can control vs. what you can't)

If NC State focused on the things they can control (free throws, ball handling, boxing out) then things like the Refs become a non issue.

We suck.


It's time to stop blaming the refs and realize that displaced anger isn't the answer.

2/9/2009 10:39:21 AM

Quote :

"I mean, floundering in football with a new coach landed in a bowl in year two and some damn good optimism in year three."

yes, but don't compare the coaching ability of TOB and Sid. That is laughable.

I hate our offense, our defensive intensity, and our substitution/game management. Other than that I am happy. Anyone who tries to defend Lowe as a good college coach at this point is not watching our games. He simply is not. Average, maybe, but anything other than that is a joke.

Our line-up IMO should be Mays, Thomas, Fells, Smith, and McCauley. Sub Ferguson for shooting at times and occasionally Javi or Degand to give Mays a blow. Tell Fells and McCauley to play 38 minutes a night. Let Costner play 10 minutes for Smith and give Smith 30. I am so tired of seeing Costner not run and never play hard. Mays is young but has some talent and has shown he will play D and has no fear of the big shot. Smith and Thomas play hard as well.

That line-up would give us defense, hustle, and we would still have some guys out there that can put the ball in the basket.

2/9/2009 10:43:03 AM

complaining about refs is like complaining about the weather

just doesn't do any good

so STFU

2/9/2009 10:45:57 AM

Panthro...


In all honesty, I can look at the game an say we still should have won. I really wish I didn't have to blame the refs. My anger doesn't come from losing for the most part. I get pissed after games, but then I get over it. My frustration with this team isn't so much at our team, its at our fans. I can see what happens on the floor, and whether its justified or not, we have a vocal part of our fanbase who thinks everything wrong with this program starts with Sidney Lowe, and I think thats a dangerous assumption to make and a dangerous thing to start firing off at the mouth/keyboard about.

So since people like to point out that Sidney lost this game for us, I couter with "we got fucked by the refs so it shouldn't have mattered what sidney did". I understand that we still should have won. I look at it 50-50...from both sides...but its frustrating to know that no matter how we lose people are going to blame the coach. You cant sit there and say the refs didn't have an outcome on the game, and I can't sit here and say that they are the only reason we lost.

The problem comes from people that look at it from only one side, and I'm voicing my opinion from the other side, even though I see where they are coming from. So in other words, you're right. Its time to stop blaming the refs, but you cant say the refs had nothing to do with it, and in the same breath say Sidney is the sole reason we lost this game (not saying you did). Thats where the frustration comes from. If I didn't have to listen to this garbage from our own fans, read it on the boards, and read it in the papers, it wouldn't be so frustrating to lose...but I think when we lose I'm more upset at the outcry that follows than I am at the loss. I hate to come across like I'm only taking one side, but someone has to give the counter-argument, and most of the time I'm countering such a ridiculous post that there's no point in letting the poster know that I can see where he's coming from.

2/9/2009 11:21:12 AM

everyone likes everything so black and white when it clearly isn't. people want to blame it all on the ref. or people want to blame it all the coach. or people want to blame it all on the players. when clearly it was a combination of all three.

if sidney was a better coach, we would have won. if our players were better players and didn't choke like they are so used to doing with missed free throws and turnovers, then we would have won. if the refs didn't give give vt 8 points on a terrible momentum-swinging, game-changing intentional foul (among many other atrocious calls- many of which went our way as well), we probably would have won. had any of these factors (coaching, players, refs) turned in our favor, we probably would have won.

had all three of them worked in our favor, it would have remained a blowout.

2/9/2009 12:07:39 PM

IMO though, the one who has the least control over the actual game is the one people spend the most time bitching about, and thats the coach.


Sure, he should put guys in position to win, he should motivate, he should work the refs...but when it comes down to it, he can do all 3 of those things and if our players don't execute what he tells them and if the refs still fuck us over, we still lose.


Too bad nobody else sees it that way.

2/9/2009 12:39:52 PM

There are certain better players we could have had by now with a better recruiting coach, and Lowe made some bad decisions about when to have who on the floor.

Like you can't blame an entire country because of its horrible leader, until you realize the entire country elected him.

[Edited on February 9, 2009 at 2:37 PM. Reason : -]

2/9/2009 2:35:49 PM

so you're trying to say that sidney isn't a good recruiter?

2/9/2009 2:38:36 PM