i'll stick with my pump

4/1/2012 11:00:47 PM

Quote :

"pistol grip is fine for a home defense shot-gun. You're not a member of HRT trying to do precision shots, you're trying to put as much lead as possible as quickly as possible b/n you and thug-tard. You can do this just as fine with a pistol grip shotgun as you can with a folding stock shotgun. (You should be practicing on shooting the shotgun with the pistol grip though). "

Shoot a regular stocked shotgun in an IDPA style course then shoot the same course with a pistol gripped shotgun and report back with your times.

4/2/2012 2:03:39 AM

I prefer my combo stock.

4/2/2012 8:24:00 AM

i wonder in the event of a home intrusion / self defense situation if it would make any difference if you shot said intruder with a handload?

would you go more under the microscope at that point? is it generally frowned upon?

4/2/2012 8:36:16 AM

That's a topic of much debate on many gun forums. It's been beat to death.

4/2/2012 9:28:36 AM

Quote :

"Shoot a regular stocked shotgun in an IDPA style course then shoot the same course with a pistol gripped shotgun and report back with your times."

Did I say go shoot competitively? No, I said that for home defense, getting that lead downrange quickly a pistol grip is fine, especially if you practice with it.

4/2/2012 9:47:50 AM

i'd rather have one round downrange and on target than a whole magazine simply downrange

4/2/2012 10:27:54 AM

especially with defense...

one dead person on the floor vs 4 holes in your walls and 1 dead person on the floor.

i currently don't own a shot gun.. i really want an M2 though.

I'd really like to do 3 gun competition stuff to get better with shot-gunnery.

and now that i think about it... with a pump shot gun (like NRR said), racking in a round would probably work as a pretty good deterrence keeping you from having to clean said person off the floor.

[Edited on April 2, 2012 at 10:31 AM. Reason : .]

4/2/2012 10:29:48 AM

or maybe it'll just give away your location and let the intruder know that he's definitely gonna have to shoot you

i keep one in the chamber. all i gotta do is flip the safety. y'all do whatever you want.

4/2/2012 10:35:02 AM

double barrel with hammers ftw.

4/2/2012 10:37:22 AM

in a home defense situation, you better have a round in the chamber before the person is close enough to discern the sound of racking one in the chamber. I personally would rather be slinging out rounds with an M2 or SX3 instead of worrying about operating a pump in close quarters. I can shoot a pump accurately as fast as most people can shoot an automatic in a bird-hunting situation, but I wouldn't trust that to be the same in a close quarters scenario.

4/2/2012 10:49:02 AM

http://www.armslist.com/?utm_source=c000019&utm_medium=plink&utm_campaign=p005783

Please click that link, I want the new XDs!

4/2/2012 11:06:53 AM

I really want an XDs in 9mm, not sure why they are only releasing one in 45. I guess it is the same thing as my Kahr but I don't need a reason for wanting another gun.

4/2/2012 11:31:18 AM

why would shooting an intruder with a handload bring more scrutiny upon you? if it's because that's potentially the hallmark of a gun enthusiast that is perhaps too trigger-happy, wouldn't that enthusiasm be flushed out in the investigation anyway?

4/2/2012 12:15:28 PM

As I understand it, the scenario is that a prosecutor would use the fact that you hand load ammunition to paint you as blood thirsty since you went out of your way to make your ammunition deadlier than commercial ammunition. By painting you as bloodthirsty, they will then argue that you shooting the intruder wasn't necessary and was a result of your urge to murder and not a threat to your safety.

4/2/2012 12:22:52 PM

That's pretty damn stupid but I can see exactly how that could go down like that in the respective court/media circuses

4/2/2012 12:33:17 PM

I still want to know how they would know it was hand loaded. It's not like they're going to send it out for ballistic analysis with people that would know or care.

4/2/2012 3:45:04 PM

^This.

I guess they could tell if it were a hand-cast bullet, but really, I don't see anyone caring. It's the same argument/garbage for caliber - no one cares if you use .22 or .45, even though one is often more lethal than the other.

4/2/2012 3:53:26 PM

Quote :

"Did I say go shoot competitively? No, I said that for home defense, getting that lead downrange quickly a pistol grip is fine, especially if you practice with it."

Competitive shooting and real world shooting have two things in common; only hits count and whoever gets the hits the fastest wins.
You claim a pistol grip is just as fast. What I suggest to you is try it out and find out for yourself if it really is just as fast before you promote the use of pistol grips.

Personally I'd rather get my shots on target by shouldering a shotgun than just spraying lead and hoping I hit something before I run out of ammo. It's a lot easier to miss with a shoulder fired shotgun than people think; much more so firing from the hip. Remember, shot spreads around an inch a yard through a cylinder bore. The widest it'd spread in my house would be less than 10 inches.
I'd be much better off with a pistol than a pistol gripped shotgun because I know I'm more accurate with a pistol. If you take the stock off a long gun then you've removed its primary advantage over a handgun. That 12 ga power isn't going to make up for the huge loss of accuracy.

Quote :

"I still want to know how they would know it was hand loaded. It's not like they're going to send it out for ballistic analysis with people that would know or care."

You could possibly tell it was a handload by the powder residue, bullet/brass combination, whether or not the brass is new or once fired, etc.
I agree with yall. I don't think it'd come into play unless you weren't completely justified in using lethal force.
On the flip side, it's so easy to get good quality self defense ammo in most calibers, so why not take the what ifs out of the equation and use factory ammo?

4/2/2012 4:51:06 PM

Quote :

"I still want to know how they would know it was hand loaded."

If you shoot somebody, they will ask.

4/2/2012 5:48:47 PM

Some also argue that using hand-loaded ammunition will open you to wrongful death lawsuits. i.e. Your hand loads killed my precious child where commercial ammo wouldn't. You're a blood thirsty killer who murdered my child who just wanted a TV of their own and some non-consensual nookie with your children. The jury should make you give me a million dollars because your were twisting your mustache and laughing evilly in your garage as you were crafting your child-killing death cartridges all while plotting ways to lure my precious angle into your murder cave of a living room.

It seems farcical, but some lawyers will do anything for their 30% cut all while sleeping like babies on large piles of money and shattered lives.

[Edited on April 3, 2012 at 1:43 AM. Reason : can't type]

4/3/2012 1:42:25 AM

many handloads are downloaded though; much weaker than factory ammo.

would this still make you look bad? not that i would grab my 45-70 first in this event, but i have 500gr loads under 1000fps and 350gr loads above 2400.

does one make me appear more bloodthirsty than the other?

i believe another reason theyre frowned upon has to do with the lack of a forensic profile (for the cartridge). no information on your handload in any database, so ballistics info is going to be lacking.

[Edited on April 3, 2012 at 8:10 AM. Reason : -]

4/3/2012 8:09:34 AM

Anyone have or use a Leupold VX-R Patrol 1.25-4x20mm?

4/3/2012 10:44:30 AM

Apparently a Raleigh gun store was robbed last night?

http://boards.4chan.org/k/res/11262271 (yeah yeah I know)

anyone know anything about this?

I'm inclined to believe it's bullshit. It would at least show up on wral.

[Edited on April 3, 2012 at 5:51 PM. Reason : .]

4/3/2012 5:41:06 PM

gtfo of here with that 4chan bullshit

only thing worth a fuck in that thread is this



hahaha

4/3/2012 5:54:05 PM

^haha yeah I like how he helped the dog up over the counter afterwards

4/3/2012 5:55:09 PM

Fixed sight drift formula? I've seen this on a few pages this evening and was wondering if it had any merit? I've always been under the impression it was just a trial and error thing. Now I'm wondering if, given the situation described below, I might have actually been drifting the sight exactly this far-


Given a SIGHTRADIUS of 6.4 inches (my SA Mil-Spec 1911, for example),
A 1.5 inch “bullet hits target this far from center” distance,
And a TARGETDISTANCE of 300 inches (25 feet),
MOVEMENT = ( 6.4 * 1.5 ) / 300
MOVEMENT = 0.032 inches (approx. 1/32?)

4/3/2012 8:46:29 PM

Quote :

"does one make me appear more bloodthirsty than the other? "

I was told to carry the same duty ammo that local LE carry to eliminate the overkill argument. In Wake county that would be Speer Gold Dots. And they are great defense rounds.

4/3/2012 8:56:53 PM

haha

kinda like how Black Talons got all that bad press about being "cop killer bullets" and then Winchester renamed them Ranger SXT, put a sheriff's badge and "Law Enforcement Ammunition" on the box, and marketed them as duty ammo. all the idiots shut the fuck up, but all the gun folks know it's the Same eXact Thing.

4/3/2012 9:33:36 PM

ok so the wife wants to conceal carry a .22 which worries me... i kinda feel like that's like shooting a bear with a 9mm. you're just gonna piss it off.

4/5/2012 9:37:56 AM

Hits with a 22 are better than misses with a 9 or 40 or whatever.

4/5/2012 9:55:08 AM

does anyone know where I could get my hands on a Kel-Tec RFB, or are they just backordered everywhere?

4/5/2012 9:57:20 AM

Quote :

"ok so the wife wants to conceal carry a .22 which worries me... i kinda feel like that's like shooting a bear with a 9mm. you're just gonna piss it off."

the main thing i'd worry about carrying a 22 is the inherent unreliability of rimfire

4/5/2012 9:59:35 AM

^^^ true...

I think i'm going to get a target .22 pistol and a 9 or 40 for me and let her shoot both and see what she likes.

4/5/2012 10:13:53 AM

Quote :

"the main thing i'd worry about carrying a 22 is the inherent unreliability of rimfire"

That is true but I think if you used quality ammo like CCI then the chances of a dud are super low.
I've only had 2-3 duds in the thousands of rounds of rimfire I've shot and all of those have been with bulk ammo.
Anyone here ever had a dud with non bulk?

Having said that, a low power 38 Special load is easy to shoot and I think we'd all agree it would be better than 22 LR.
Maybe sumfoo1 can talk her into a 38 special.

4/5/2012 10:18:44 AM

Speaking of rimfire, does anyone have a Ruger mkII or mkIII they want to sell me?

4/5/2012 10:20:16 AM

Why not a revolver in .38?

Perfect gun for a girl, she should be able to handle it and if it misfires you just pull the trigger again. The big thing about .22 that makes me a bit weary is how often I get FTFs or dead rounds and if she doesn't know how to clear those she would be in for some trouble.

4/5/2012 10:20:41 AM

Not loading with bulk for self-defense.

4/5/2012 11:14:21 AM

She just needs an XDS or similar and call it a day. Can't go wrong with 45ACP when your life is on the line

4/5/2012 11:19:57 AM

yeah i think i can get her into a .38.


I told her a family friend Annette (52) Carries a .357 mag revolver.

and she thought that was cool.

4/5/2012 11:37:29 AM

Quote :

"She just needs an XDS or similar and call it a day. Can't go wrong with 45ACP when your life is on the line"

You certainly can go wrong if the person shooting cannot handle the round. My wife can't rack the slide on my Glock 19 and was less than accurate when I made her shoot one round of my .357 (wanted her to see what the recoil was like). For this reason I have a youth model 20 gauge with #3 buck for her to use. She doesn't carry so that isn't an issue, if she did I would definitely get her a revolver though.

4/5/2012 11:57:27 AM

Picked up my new to me toy this weekend.
Glock 38 OD in .45 GAP
I can change the swap ejectors and slides with my G23 if I want an OD G23 and a standard G38.

I sold (my wife's) Keltec PF9 (which she hated) and some other used car parts to buy this...

Glock Olive Drab pictured with a FDE colored 1911.

4/5/2012 7:45:16 PM

Why 45 GAP?

4/5/2012 8:13:38 PM

Good price for a OD Glock, and ease of converting to .40.
Would have prefered a 19, but people want way to much for them, and people don't realize how easy the conversion is from GAP, as the Lower is identical except for the ejector.

4/5/2012 8:50:26 PM

Well, I finally sacked up and joined the NRA today.

4/5/2012 11:00:35 PM

Suggestions for a cheapo scope for a .22 purely for plinking? Just want to make my Marlin 60 a little more fun to shoot but don't want to waste money on anything fancy.

4/7/2012 9:24:56 PM

I've found cheap scopes to be annoying enough that I'd rather not use them and would rather have a set of nice peep sights. It annoys me when I pick up a gun and I'm not sure if it's still going to be sighted in or when I can't clearly make out the target. What's your budget?

Have you ever considered peep sights? Tech Sights and Williams make good ones.

4/7/2012 11:17:28 PM

Haven't really considered peep sights, to be honest I didn't really know what they were until just now. As for a budget, I don't really have one, under $100 for sure. Spending anymore than that and I'll just stick with the iron sights.

4/8/2012 1:05:00 AM

I'm stoked, my P232 should be here this week. I had ordered one form a dealer in Raleigh so I didn't have to pay the excise tax but and they told 4-6 weeks but after 3 months I gave up on them and ordered one from Bud's for almost the same price (figuring in gas to get to Raleigh and sales tax). I ended up with the Stainless w/ NS because it looks sexy and will be a little less felt recoil but it weighs about 5 oz more than the alloy frame - still will weigh less than the G27 I had been carrying.

4/8/2012 9:29:37 AM

^^ http://www.tech-sights.com/

Highly recommended, great for plinking on my 10/22 and WAY better than the factory open sights. Easy to install too, at least on the 10/22. In your price range too.

4/8/2012 6:17:33 PM