I don't even know what to think of this call...

kensMoE8 (10:46:26 PM): PokerStars Game #8576016169: Tournament #43327293, $15.00+$1.50 Hold'em No Limit - Level III (25/50) - 2007/02/22 - 22:42:36 (ET)
Table '43327293 71' 9-max Seat #4 is the button
Seat 1: ooPsGuy (1660 in chips)
Seat 2: rmcosby (6965 in chips)
Seat 3: HeavyHand35 (4290 in chips)
Seat 4: kensmoe8 (815 in chips)
Seat 5: Paul Ordeeb (3010 in chips)
Seat 6: ablurt (3095 in chips)
Seat 7: Commander25 (2205 in chips)
Seat 8: mikey93 (2140 in chips)
Seat 9: itsrat (1010 in chips)
Paul Ordeeb: posts small blind 25
ablurt: posts big blind 50
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to kensmoe8 [Kh Ah]
Commander25: folds
mikey93: folds
itsrat: folds
ooPsGuy: calls 50
rmcosby: calls 50
HeavyHand35: folds
kensmoe8: raises 765 to 815 and is all-in
Paul Ordeeb: folds
ablurt: folds
ooPsGuy: calls 765
rmcosby: folds
*** FLOP *** [Ts 9s Jd]
*** TURN *** [Ts 9s Jd] [7s]
*** RIVER *** [Ts 9s Jd 7s] [5d]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
ooPsGuy: shows [4d 8d] (a straight, Seven to Jack)
kensmoe8: shows [Kh Ah] (high card Ace)
ooPsGuy collected 1755 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 1755 | Rake 0
Board [Ts 9s Jd 7s 5d]
Seat 1: ooPsGuy showed [4d 8d] and won (1755) with a straight, Seven to Jack
Seat 2: rmcosby folded before Flop
Seat 3: HeavyHand35 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: kensmoe8 (button) showed [Kh Ah] and lost with high card Ace
Seat 5: Paul Ordeeb (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: ablurt (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 7: Commander25 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: mikey93 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: itsrat folded before Flop (didn't bet)

2/22/2007 11:06:06 PM

at first i thought that was a rebuy tourney

2/22/2007 11:12:03 PM

Quote :

"$15.00+$1.50 Hold'em No Limit "

thats why

2/22/2007 11:20:41 PM

my buddy is on ESPN right now if anyones interested


about to pick up AA against negreanu

2/23/2007 2:07:59 AM

yeah it's a $15 dollar tourney, plus you were low stack so people are more likely to call you with crappy cards.

i mean you played the hand correctly pushing, but at those stakes people don't tend to play pot odds.

[Edited on February 23, 2007 at 1:07 PM. Reason : asdf]

2/23/2007 1:04:35 PM

You never lay down suited 3 gappers. NEVER!!!

2/23/2007 1:34:56 PM

its tired using a buyin level to justify a players play.

im guilty of it too, but it doesnt apply here.

thats pretty plain and simple.

2/23/2007 2:10:17 PM

I want to play poker this weekend. Ben come to Raleigh & play poker w/ David & I. Right David? haha

2/23/2007 2:22:42 PM

Quote :

"its tired using a buyin level to justify a players play."

words to live by

2/23/2007 2:27:33 PM

Sometimes when I get on tilt, I'd exit all my games and go into a $5 sit 'n go and start going all in with anything just to crack someone's good hand. Fun stuff.

2/23/2007 2:29:54 PM

hish has watched me put >$200 into a $3 rebuy

2/23/2007 2:44:42 PM

Quote :

" want to play poker this weekend. Ben come to Raleigh & play poker w/ David & I. Right David? haha"

I really should!!

I think im gonna go to the borgata in a couple of hours

2/23/2007 2:45:35 PM

Ben's too cool for us now Brandi. He doesn't have time for you unless you're azn.

2/23/2007 2:58:34 PM

I don't have to be azn... I have nice boobs.

2/23/2007 3:01:48 PM

Hah. I think some of the waitresses at the borgata could give you a run for your money.

2/23/2007 3:05:52 PM

LAWL. I do have a thing for the aznz.


And im sorry brandi, im not a chest man =[, but you still hold a special place


On second thought, i may go home and take a nap first.

friday traffic on 95 or the DMB is pretty wretched in late afternoon.

2/23/2007 3:06:14 PM

Yeah but they're waitresses

Oh you poker boys are all the same. You all just like asses-- but then you sit at a table where you have full access to the chest but you want to be difficult and see something else.

[Edited on February 23, 2007 at 3:08 PM. Reason : pooie]

2/23/2007 3:06:32 PM

and btw,

Quote :

"stuck flex yeah it's a $15 dollar tourney, plus you were low stack so people are more likely to call you with crappy cards. i mean you played the hand correctly pushing, but at those stakes people don't tend to play pot odds. "

Im sorry stucky,

but that doesnt make any sense at all =[

2/23/2007 3:08:46 PM

Those waitresses probably make more money each year than both Ben and myself.

2/23/2007 3:09:29 PM

Haha that's pretty sweet then AND they have nice boobs. Okay props, props.

[Edited on February 23, 2007 at 3:11 PM. Reason : I've never been a waitress... Don't know what's UP ]

2/23/2007 3:11:19 PM

Have you ever seen the tips they get in the casions?

2/23/2007 3:12:32 PM

No- I've never been to a casino.

2/23/2007 3:13:04 PM

^x5 I know it doesn't make sense, because he is calling with crap. But having observed a good number of hands at low limit tourneys and sit and gos this seems to be the trend. I don't do it, it's just an observation, doesn't have to form a logical sequence of events.

[Edited on February 23, 2007 at 3:14 PM. Reason : asdf]

2/23/2007 3:14:09 PM

Quote :

"Yeah but they're waitresses Oh you poker boys are all the same. You all just like asses-- but then you sit at a table where you have full access to the chest but you want to be difficult and see something else. "

ahahahahhaahhaha

brandi, you are so right.

but at the same time, ive never in my life been at a poker table and been trying to hit up on some girl, or check her out.

ok, well... twice.

but both of the times i had no chance, they were playing my lowly 20/40 games while their insanely high rollin' boyfriends played (one is a 150/300 stud reg. and the other when he comes in from nyc rocks the highest NL games, never seen him play below 25/50, or tries to get a 200/400 or higher O/E game going)

funny storry with that actually

i was flirting hard with this one girl, the one from nyc... she convinced me and her bf to play 1/2 nl with her, after she was getting beat up in the 15/30/30/45 7cs game we were playing in

me and her bf went AI blind on alternating hands for 25 hands

i ended up doubling up, and before it was over everyone but the three of us had left the table, two going to bitch at the floor who just laughed.



and on the matter of the cocktail waitresses... yes, they do make bank.. esp. at borgata... but the timeframe they have to do so is limited..

they realize they onlyhave a few years in which to do that..

the ones in the poker room are poker room exclusively, and dont venture to the pit.. its one of the most saught after jobs in AC.... they dont tipshare like in the pit, they dont have to tip out the bar, and some other perks.. (a big one being no smoking in the pr...)

but they pull 400-700 a night, with the occasional huge night.

hell, a dealer makes 150-450 a night easy.

2/23/2007 3:16:31 PM

Well that's pretty sweet then.

Well win big tonight Ben.

2/23/2007 3:19:50 PM

Quote :

"^x5 I know it doesn't make sense, because he is calling with crap. But having observed a good number of hands at low limit tourneys and sit and gos this seems to be the trend. I don't do it, it's just an observation, doesn't have to form a logical sequence of events."

actually, i wasnt disagreeing with you on that point. the point that someone made a bad play...

i was disagreeing with you on your next point.

Quote :

"yeah it's a $15 dollar tourney, plus you were low stack so people are more likely to call you with crappy cards. i mean you played the hand correctly pushing, but at those stakes people don't tend to play pot odds. "

your assessment that the correct play was made. that, i cannot agree with.

at 25/50, with over 800 in chips, hes not getting short enough to be in push mode.

with an unopened pot, moe is more on a steal here than hoping to get called.

he's trying to preserve his life, and pull a "barry" play to pick up the pot uncontested.

the only problem here is that usually the only thing that calls you has you destroyed.

99% of the time this range is AA, KK, QQ, AK.

and your equity against this range is horrid.

now, balancing that out with the chance that someone wakes up with this range is something that im not too sure about right off my head.

but t 800, i think the proper play here was to make a moderate raise, and play accordingly...

i mean, your m is still >10, and you're not in p000sh monkey mode yet,

or at least, not as i see it.

he's not low enough such that someone on the bb will have the equity to call correctly, or even realize that he should call, w/o this range.

i dont liek the push here.

you cant really assume that people who play $15 tournaments arent playing pot odds either.

hell, moe is a great player, and he's playing $15s.

theres plentyof money to be made at this low buyin range, your edge for a better player will be higher... but your sigma is huge due to the field sizes.

but thats acceptable, with proper roll management, which, for mtts should be at least 200 buyins.

thats a 3k roll for $15's

2/23/2007 3:25:15 PM

Quote :

"but t 800, i think the proper play here was to make a moderate raise, and play accordingly... "

I didn't think that this would have been a play I could have made....

Say I raise to what, 250?. That puts me @ 565. What am I doing when I don't flop an A or K... I pretty much have to shove any flop for 565 into the ~600 assuming I got 1 call preflop. I don't think that theres any way I fold it after the flop regardless of what comes, so I think I like my push in this spot, hoping to pick it up uncontested. If I happen to run into AA KK then i shrug it off. Also, I think its safe to assume that I only have to worry about getting a call from one of the blinds b/c I think it's doubtful one of the limpers has a hand strong enough for a call... but hey I guess 84s obv= nuts.

2/23/2007 4:04:14 PM

Moe.

you know i value your opinion and think you are one of the strongest tournament players who post here.

I see what you are saying, and I will make that play too.

However, i also dont think that the raise/push is too bad either.

it's just like a dramatic c-bet really..

2/23/2007 4:10:45 PM

to the borg!

2/23/2007 5:31:14 PM

Ben has been playing well over 13 hours and just called me with this hand.

He raises with KK to $35 and gets 5 callers.

Flop is Kx 3d 5d

He leads for $250 and gets raised to $500

He calls

Turn is a 6s

Guy bets out $500, Ben Calls

River 7

Guy bets $750, Ben Calls

Guy turns over Kd4d for the rivered straight

2/24/2007 12:58:00 PM

thats one way to lose $1,785 in a hand.

2/24/2007 1:00:12 PM

I would have pushed on the turn.

Ben had over 3k in front of him. And during the showdown, the guy didnt even realize he hit his straight.

2/24/2007 1:16:13 PM

hish, if the guy thought ben had AA he may have called


ben minimized the amount he would have lost this hand

2/24/2007 2:13:27 PM

i realize that, but still its tough to call ad additional 2k+ with his hand of Kd4d

2/24/2007 2:15:31 PM

2/24/2007 3:22:17 PM

more details and stories to come.

however, i'd like to point out that i racked up and immedately left after that hand.

the first step of tilt control.


but jesus christ, if that hand would have held, sitting at a 2/5 nl tabel ($500 max buy) with nearly 6k would have been absurd

2/24/2007 3:35:23 PM

Seems like on the flop you reraise, only thing you are behind to is 4d/6d or 2d/4d and neither would make much sense.

2/24/2007 5:32:56 PM

^agreed

2/24/2007 5:37:05 PM

he isnt behind to 2d4d or 4d6d

[Edited on February 24, 2007 at 7:10 PM. Reason : .]

2/24/2007 7:10:07 PM

I just saw some girl w/ $50 go all in against a shortstack w/ AK. Shortstack showed pocket kings, and the kings took it.

The very next hand, EYE get pocket kings. The girl raises preflop, I go all-in for $25, thinking maybe she's on tilt and will call. She does, and she has AK AGAIN. A king comes down and I pocket $25.

2/24/2007 11:08:15 PM

well... i just woke up after falling asleep on the couch after my last post.... 14 hours ago

and since there's nothing to do at 630 am on a sunday, ill post some more interesting things that happened yesterday/friday night.

I had only taken about a grip in cash with me, started by 745pm.

by 1130 pm, i was busto, primarily from two hands.

got some dinner, and after 12 (when my atm window opened again) i got another $500.


had worked that $500 into ~$3800 in one sitting at the batshit 2/5 table.

so when i walked with ~$1980, i had only really made like $500... but an interesting way to do so.

My two busto hands: both took place at a table lineup that was really shitty, but i couldnt get a table change due to a long list to get off the table. in hindsight, i should have just walked for a bit then came back to get on the waitlist for the 2/5 tables again. instead, im stubborn and thought i could still beat a table with like 8 rocks and regulars, and 2 people who were nut peddlers.

So anyways

AQo utg. I raise to $25.. immediately to my left calls... button calls.

flop comes AQ4

i lead for $75, both smooth call.

the turn is a 6, i lead for $175, to my left RR all in, for $230 total.

the button goes AI for $320 total.

now im stuck in a bad spot, tihnking theres no way im ahead, but im getting like 1050 to call 145.

so i do.

AQ vs QQ vs 44.

oops. at least ive got outs, but bomb off.

That one i kind of feel like is a setup hand for me to lose a good bit of money.



Next bust-o hand, im sitting with $860, villian has me covered.

he raises out mlp to $35, button calls, sb calls, I RR to $135 with Ac As

he pushes for >my stack, others fold.

i call, to see two hearts ont he flop, a heart on the turn and river.

AA vs AA, i got flushed in a $1600+ pot. bonk bonk bonk.




So, during my miraculous return (which seems to be my standard, ask noidroid or anyone who has played in ac with me over the last few years), there was this one hand that stuck out as being pretty hilarious to me still

playing 5 handed:

one azn dude is so drunk he cant stack his chips, its like 4 am.

iim sittin on like $850, and over the next 3 hours am going to go ona rush where im flopping sets of 2s, 3s, and 4s like its my job.

and it begins here

however, azn dude is being ultra slow and its pissing off the table, but hes giving lots and lots of action.. his large bets are winning pots, but its gonna come sometime.

doing things like he'll be flirting with the dealer, someone will raise preflop, and he'll ask the dealer if the hand was good that she dealt him.. she'll say yes of course, i only deal good hands, and he'll push all in against one of these two weak tight kids at the table

it was brilliant really, and pretty funny with his 9Ko that he did this with once destroyed a kids 77 that he called the push with.


well, he gets into a tangle with me here

i raise out 44 utg to $25.

button calls, sb calls, bb calls (azn)

flop is 4, 7, K

azn leads for $60

i raise to $180

others quickly drop.

azn looks at me hard, then calls

he turns his hand over, what reason i have no idea

Js 7s

i guess he thought i was all in or something, but i lean back and reveal that ive actually got him covered.

dealer stops him, exposes his hand to the whole table, and he decides to play his hand face up for the rest of the hand.

which, he is forced to, i think.


well my money card comes on the turn, another 7

he looks at me smiles... and quickly checks to see what ill do

i look pissed off and glare at the dealer,

i push all in, throw her $2 and say "why'd you do that"

stand up and put my hands in my pockets

he makes some weird attempt at saying something that in a mumbling trance of horribly accented english i have no idea what he was saying, then in like 6 scoops manages to get his chips over the bet line (remember they arent stacked)

when i open my hand up, his smile dissapears.


he proceeds to rebuy like 5 times

then leaves.

i think we got like maybe 15 hands an hour in during his time there, but he sure pumped the table up for the absurdities that would follow.

2/25/2007 6:52:04 AM

That's kind of scary calling it your money card. That's actually one of his outs. That's one of a few cards you really don't want to see.

2/25/2007 3:29:26 PM

how is that scary at all? thats the best card in the deck i could have seen

money card int he sense that its the only card where i get him to bust on.


does it give him a chance to win?

sure,

but i'll take being an 85% favorite for a $900+ pot on the turn sure.

[Edited on February 25, 2007 at 3:35 PM. Reason : e]

[Edited on February 25, 2007 at 3:38 PM. Reason : e]

2/25/2007 3:34:34 PM

I dunno. I know there is no such thing as "luck" and that all things even themselves out in the end. However, that being said, 2 of the 3 biggest hands I've ever been in have had me as greater than an 80% favorite after the turn and seeing the guy suck out on me on the river. Yes, I know that in the long run, it "should" work itself out, but the fact is I don't play enough for the variance to find its way back to the bell curve like it eventually will, so I don't like for the guy to have any outs after the turn. That's just me though.

2/25/2007 10:37:26 PM

Don't tell me you've turned into one of those guys that goes all in 50X bb preflop with their AA in order to avoid getting sucked out.

2/25/2007 10:40:43 PM

dont worry fm

ive come to the conclusion that the long run doesnt exist in live play.

for anyone.




i seriously doubt anyone here has or will ever play 50,000 hands live.

on this board, id be willing to bet i was the one with the most live play...

and im no where close.

[Edited on February 25, 2007 at 10:57 PM. Reason : (thats like 1700 hours or so playtime)]

2/25/2007 10:55:50 PM

oh and its a pdf, not a bell curve

2/25/2007 10:59:20 PM

I'd say in the long run I've won 80% of the hands where I was an 80% favorite. It just sucks if the pot amounts of the 20% you lost were multiple times larger than the pot sizes of the 80% you won.

Heh, I think Jim's poker memories and Jim's engineering class memories have somehow gotten intertwined.

[Edited on February 25, 2007 at 11:02 PM. Reason : bell curve]

2/25/2007 11:00:17 PM

see my set of kings hand above =]

Quote :

"being said, 2 of the 3 biggest hands I've ever been in have had me as greater than an 80% favorite after the turn and seeing the guy suck out on me on the river."

also, im curious here as to where the money went in


it seems to me that th ebiggest pots are on a "suckout" but the big money goes in after the suckout occurred... so it's not fair to say i was an 80% fav. to win, esp. if the money went in when i was drawing dead on the end...

thats my experience.

i know i flop huge then pay off somethingt hat suckedout on the river all the time

[Edited on February 25, 2007 at 11:03 PM. Reason : e]

2/25/2007 11:01:34 PM

exactly

2/25/2007 11:02:38 PM