oooh ok.

page 16 knows el nacho is a dumbass.

[Edited on September 5, 2007 at 11:19 PM. Reason : page 16]

9/5/2007 11:19:07 PM

9/6/2007 10:58:49 AM

http://www.macrumors.com/2007/09/06/steve-jobs-open-letter-to-iphone-owners/

$100 credit for early buyers

9/6/2007 3:30:29 PM

Wow, that open letter has spread amazingly quickly through the internet.

9/6/2007 3:51:14 PM

fuck yea, i was about to buy a macbook..guess i'll wait a week

9/6/2007 3:55:08 PM

The man knows how to make people like him, that's for sure.

9/6/2007 4:03:14 PM

it appears as though he actually listens to his customers..and does some reasonable things for them. complicated, i know..more businesses should pay attention to him

9/6/2007 4:18:27 PM

thats what i said should happen but then i was thinking that $100 x early iPhone customers is a lot of money. I was thinking in terms of giving us credit to buy iTunes stuff so its not a lose lose situation for Apple........but $100 store credit is even better! Hello new apple keyboard.

9/6/2007 4:27:22 PM

store credit? they gave me credit back on my credit card....but that was yesterday

9/6/2007 4:30:39 PM

so the other $100 went...in his pocket?

9/6/2007 4:33:43 PM

Yeah because giving people complete retroactive pricing is to be expected. It's still what... 10-20 million or so dollars?

[Edited on September 6, 2007 at 4:37 PM. Reason : ]

9/6/2007 4:35:35 PM

He wants a lot of good press about the company right before the holiday season.. this is a smart move

[Edited on September 6, 2007 at 4:44 PM. Reason : ^^^ when did you buy yours? ]

9/6/2007 4:44:11 PM

So this is Apple being generous and not an indication that they were clearly price-gouging their customers the last 2 months? Gotcha...

9/6/2007 5:10:17 PM

Of course he was price gouging, when ISN'T Apple doing that? It's just a bit of a first for a company to give money back instead of running off with it.

As I said, he sure knows how to make people like him. Twisted way to do it, but it works.

9/6/2007 5:19:38 PM

A company is GIVING REFUNDS to early adopters (Something that has NEVER been done, as far as I know) and you guys are bitching.

unbelievable....


you guys do realize that one of a companies' objectives is usuallly to make a profit, right???

[Edited on September 6, 2007 at 5:24 PM. Reason : d]

9/6/2007 5:23:39 PM

Hello and welcome to the wolfweb. Today we will be bitching about any and everything. Nothing will be good enough. Please enjoy your stay

9/6/2007 5:26:27 PM

^^ They're only giving the "refund" (in the form of a store credit, which is a win-win for Apple... either you don't spend all of it or you buy something for $100 or more which cost them less than that) because everyone raised a big stink about the 33% price slash after two months, and rightfully so. I hate how people spin this like Apple is such a nice company. The fact is, they weren't planning on giving anyone a refund and they did a real dick move by pricing the phone WELL above a much lower price that they're comfortable selling the phone at.

Face it, the $599 price point was a shameless money grab and Apple is trying to save face because they got seriously called out on it.

[Edited on September 6, 2007 at 7:18 PM. Reason : ...]

9/6/2007 7:15:22 PM

wtf money grab? are you insane? Apple (nor any other company) is not obligated to set a price other than what they think people will pay. and people obviously were willing to pay $599 for it. so the fuck what? this happens every day and nobody bitches about it

[Edited on September 6, 2007 at 7:23 PM. Reason : where is my $10k Lexus ]


[Edited on September 6, 2007 at 7:25 PM. Reason : you can make a pizza for $1.30 and domino's wants $13.99 for it!?!?!? LOCK SUSPEND TERMINATE]

9/6/2007 7:23:08 PM

^^ the optimal price is the one that makes them the most money, they're in business for that..not to make everybody happy because they can afford apple products. they had no trouble selling nearly a million already, the demand was there at that price..why would they be stupid enough to lower the price from the get-go? Most companies would have set the price at the absolute highest one the market would allow...but apple has given money back (ok so its not cash..still more than they had to do and more than anybody else virtually would do) to its initial customers, lowered the prices dramatically and increased features... not trying to sound like an apple fanboy but they're making people like them

edit:

just saw this:

Quote :

"Face it, the $599 price point was a shameless money grab and Apple is trying to save face because they got seriously called out on it."

were you a retard at birth or did your mom beat your ass too hard as a child? It was a revolutionary device..the fucking RAZOR was almost that price when it first came out. They DID NOT get called on it..if anything, they called everybody else on it after selling MORE units than they predicted.

[Edited on September 6, 2007 at 7:30 PM. Reason : asdf]

9/6/2007 7:28:48 PM

Quote :

"where is my $10k Lexus"

Your example might be relevant if Lexus sold a $30K car one day and dropped it to $10K two months later. If you had bought a Lexus at the $30K price point you would be pretty pissed off, wouldn't you? However, you would be more understanding of it if your car's value depreciated to that same $10K at a much more gradual pace.

Quote :

"were you a retard at birth or did your mom beat your ass too hard as a child? It was a revolutionary device..the fucking RAZOR was almost that price when it first came out. They DID NOT get called on it..if anything, they called everybody else on it after selling MORE units than they predicted."

You're a moron. People expected the price of the iPhone to drop over time... like a year or so. A 33% price reduction in two months is not as a result of economies of scale or improved production efficiency because that shit takes longer than two months to happen, especially to that extent! Apple could've sold that thing for the $399 price point they're offering it at now and still have made money, but they didn't. They did a quick money grab.

You're also forgetting that this is Apple, who is not known for dramatic price drops. They generally keep their price points the same and just upgrade the specs. A 33% price drop from them is extremely unusual, sorry.

Also, your RAZR example doesn't really fit. The RAZR didn't go from ~$400 to $100 (unsubsidized) within the span of two months. They've also sold about 50 million of those things, so obviously economies of scale kicked in.

[Edited on September 6, 2007 at 7:42 PM. Reason : ...]

9/6/2007 7:37:40 PM

And with the launch of the iPod touch the costs of all those nifty iPhone features get spread out over a couple million of those units.

While it's hard to argue the iPhone wasn't overpriced originally (many sites did stories explaining this in detail) they also didn't have to give early adopters store credit or even drop the price as much they did. Calling them money grubbing is absolutely stupid. No shit, they're a company- they charge what people will pay. Do you hate market economies? I mean there's plenty of reason to, but I think you just have a little extra unreasonable venom for apple in particular.

In the same vein, it's naive to think that the original price of the iPhone wasn't ridiculous. It was about twice production cost. Attacking apple for this (after they're actually giving those people something back) is asinine. It's because early adopters were willing to pay too much to have the coolest new phone.

9/6/2007 7:56:18 PM

Quote :

"To all iPhone customers: I have received hundreds of emails from iPhone customers who are upset about Apple dropping the price of iPhone by $200 two months after it went on sale. After reading every one of these emails, I have some observations and conclusions. First, I am sure that we are making the correct decision to lower the price of the 8GB iPhone from $599 to $399, and that now is the right time to do it. iPhone is a breakthrough product, and we have the chance to 'go for it' this holiday season. iPhone is so far ahead of the competition, and now it will be affordable by even more customers. It benefits both Apple and every iPhone user to get as many new customers as possible in the iPhone 'tent'. We strongly believe the $399 price will help us do just that this holiday season. Second, being in technology for 30+ years I can attest to the fact that the technology road is bumpy. There is always change and improvement, and there is always someone who bought a product before a particular cutoff date and misses the new price or the new operating system or the new whatever. This is life in the technology lane. If you always wait for the next price cut or to buy the new improved model, you'll never buy any technology product because there is always something better and less expensive on the horizon. The good news is that if you buy products from companies that support them well, like Apple tries to do, you will receive years of useful and satisfying service from them even as newer models are introduced. Third, even though we are making the right decision to lower the price of iPhone, and even though the technology road is bumpy, we need to do a better job taking care of our early iPhone customers as we aggressively go after new ones with a lower price. Our early customers trusted us, and we must live up to that trust with our actions in moments like these. Therefore, we have decided to offer every iPhone customer who purchased an iPhone from either Apple or AT&T, and who is not receiving a rebate or any other consideration, a $100 store credit towards the purchase of any product at an Apple Retail Store or the Apple Online Store. Details are still being worked out and will be posted on Apple's website next week. Stay tuned. We want to do the right thing for our valued iPhone customers. We apologize for disappointing some of you, and we are doing our best to live up to your high expectations of Apple. Steve Jobs Apple CEO"

I for one am shocked, but damn thats some good pr. That'll be all over the news and its going to make apple look like the juggarnaut that gives a damn about us little consumers. In all the years I bought tech stuff I've never seen that done, I've had my share of unanticipated upgrades but never a credit. Needless to say I'll hopefully get an iphone now, because my bro is due a $100.

9/6/2007 8:07:52 PM

quit whining.
thats what you get for sitting in line for 2 days to get an expensive as shit piece of technology in the first place. don't put up with that bullshit and you wont get screwed.

9/6/2007 8:23:07 PM

I don't recall ever waiting in line for a iPhone. Just walked into the apple store and 2 minutes later had a 8gb. This was in Crabtree.

9/6/2007 8:55:26 PM

Quote :

"You're also forgetting that this is Apple, who is not known for dramatic price drops. They generally keep their price points the same and just upgrade the specs. A 33% price drop from them is extremely unusual, sorry."

Apple price drops is normal.

1) I bought a brand new Powerbook G4 for $2999. Right after it shipped the price dropped by $300 and they refunded $300 back to my card without me even knowing about it.
2) The iPod video when it first came out was $499 if i remember correctly...now as i recall, its not $499.
3) every other apple product....

so to say that apple is not known for Dramatic price drops is ignorant.

9/6/2007 8:59:13 PM

^

This is unprecedented and you know it. The iPhone is a bleeding-edge/ultra high profile device. To see a $200 price cut in the first two months is insane. Even the best Apple rumor mills probably never could have guessed this one.

9/6/2007 9:18:40 PM

^ True, this massive a drop in this short amount of time is unusual even for Apple. It is also brilliant and very much needed if they want to capture cell market share over the holiday season. Heh, it also confirms my creedo never to buy a first generation Apple product- or nearly any first generation high-tech product if I can help it.

[Edited on September 6, 2007 at 9:29 PM. Reason : ]

9/6/2007 9:28:37 PM

Quote :

"2) The iPod video when it first came out was $499 if i remember correctly...now as i recall, its not $499."

no, it wasn't

9/6/2007 9:32:52 PM

here's all the iPod models and launch prices, btw
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ipod#Models

9/6/2007 10:14:38 PM

Quote :

"Face it, the $599 price point was a shameless money grab and Apple is trying to save face because they got seriously called out on it. "

hahaha, he said money grab. its supply and demand man, its not like they have a monopoly or something. nobody was being forced to pay the $599. i can't figure out if this is you being serious (aka stupidity), or crappy trolling. if its the latter, i suggest reading through this entire thread as theres a lesson on how to troll on almost every page. if its the former, read these articles in their entirety: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitalism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_and_demand

9/6/2007 10:35:40 PM

ahahha synapse ftw

9/6/2007 10:46:55 PM

Quote :

"no, it wasn't"

my mistake....it was $449....

9/6/2007 10:49:27 PM

that wasn't a video

Quote :

"fifth (video) fifth generation iPod 30, 60, 80 GB Slimmer design, larger screen, and video playback capabilities. Avaliable in black or white. USB (FireWire for charging only) 12 October 2005 $299, $399 (later $249, $349)"

[Edited on September 6, 2007 at 10:52 PM. Reason : a]

9/6/2007 10:51:33 PM

so they added a feature and dropped the price significantly....

9/6/2007 11:05:25 PM

i kind of had all these thoughts rolling around in m head, but Cringley summed it up nicely:
http://www.pbs.org/cringely/pulpit/2007/pulpit_20070906_002891.html

Quote :

"This week’s iPhone pricing story, in which Apple punished its most loyal users by dropping the price of an 8-gig iPhone from $599 to $399 less than three months after the product’s introduction, is classic Steve Jobs. It wasn’t an accident. It wasn’t a thoughtless mistake. It was a calculated and tightly scripted exercise in marketing and ego gratification. In the mind of Steve Jobs the entire incident had no downside, none at all, which is yet another reason why he is not like you or me. Let’s deconstruct the incident. Apple announced a variety of new and kinda-new iPods dominated by the iPod Touch (iPhone minus the phone) and an iPod Nano with video (great for watching miniseries). At the very end of the presentation, Jobs announced the iPhone price cut. Why did he wait until the very end? Because he knew the news would be disruptive and might have obscured his presentation of the new products. He KNEW there was going to be controversy. So much for the “Steve is simply out of touch with the world” theory. So why did he do it? Why did he cut the price? I have no inside information here, but it seems pretty obvious to me: Apple introduced the iPhone at $599 to milk the early adopters and somewhat limit demand then dropped the price to $399 (the REAL price) to stimulate demand now that the product is a critical success and relatively bug-free. At least 500,000 iPhones went out at the old price, which means Apple made $100 million in extra profit. Had nobody complained, Apple would have left it at that. But Jobs expected complaints and had an answer waiting — the $100 Apple store credit. This was no knee-jerk reaction, either. It was already there just waiting if needed. Apple keeps an undeserved $50 million and customers get $50 million back. Or do they? Some customers will never use their store credit. Those who do use it will nearly all buy something that costs more than $100. And, most importantly, those who bought their iPhones at an AT&T store will have to make what might be their first of many visits to an Apple Store. That is alone worth the $50 per customer this escapade will eventually cost Apple, taking into account unused credits and Apple Store wholesale costs. So Apple still comes out $75 million ahead, which is important to Steve Jobs. "

9/7/2007 12:54:13 AM

Quote :

"So Apple still comes out $75 million ahead, which is important to Steve Jobs."

which it damn well should be

i also hate this asshat's use of "undeserved"

[Edited on September 7, 2007 at 1:04 AM. Reason : ^too bad you feel this "sums" up your feelings]

9/7/2007 1:04:28 AM

if you read it in context, I believe he was using "undeserved" in the context of a certain scenario - being the case had customers not complained.

---

as far as "summing up my feelings", I don't think Cringley (or myself) is necessarily slamming Jobs or Apple for this move. But I do tend to agree that this has been in the works for some time, and Jobs knew what the reaction was going to be, and he had already planned on giving out a $100 credit. I bet the apology note on apple.com right now was crafted at the same time the $200 price drop idea was ever floated. Then he goes and "stuns the world" with a $200 price drop, acts surprised at the visceral reaction (which, again, he knew would happen), then goes and makes retribution by giving $100 store credit. If he had announced the $200 drop and the $100 credit at the same time, people would still be really pissed (some are, i suppose). But he announced the $200 drop, basically acting like he was doing the world a favor. Then the next day when, *oh my!*, his "favor" pissed so many people off, he just threw in a little incentive for some super PR.

genius, really. i don't fault him for it. I fully agree with the supply/demand model. Apple can price their products at whatever they want, and they don't owe anybody anything if people decide to buy at that price.

Furthermore, i also agree with the notion that the $100 credit will in the end more than pay for itself. I mean, what can you get for $100 at an Apple store, especially considering you already own an iPhone if you got the credit.... a Shuffle? a case? yeah, maybe..... but for a lot of people (ignoring the large number of people who will never make use of the credit), the $100 will go towards an iMac or MacBook or something.

[Edited on September 7, 2007 at 1:21 AM. Reason : .]

9/7/2007 1:15:15 AM

no he's saying that Apple's $100 "share" of the $200 "overcharge" is undeserved. this douchebag believes that the entire $200 profit that Apple made was undeserved

9/7/2007 1:19:13 AM

^$100 towards a $1000+ item is really pointless....I'll be using mine on accessories or software. that new apple keyboard looks hot! Hell, use it to buy an iTunes gift card for $100

[Edited on September 7, 2007 at 2:49 AM. Reason : fda]

9/7/2007 2:49:10 AM

where is escargs?????????? oh

9/7/2007 8:31:53 AM

Quote :

"hahaha, he said money grab. its supply and demand man, its not like they have a monopoly or something. nobody was being forced to pay the $599."

You're right, nobody was forced to pay it, but can we not at least agree that at $599 the iPhone was EXTREMELY overpriced? The fact that people paid that much has no bearing on that fact (for all they knew, that was a fair price, since obviously no one else makes the iPhone and is in the position to charge less). They were trusting Apple to not put a ridiculous amount of markup on their product. I mean honestly, a lot of people who paid $599 for the iPhone are the same ones who defend Apple against critics that say that their products are overpriced...

Apple makes plenty of profit on the iPhone at $399 (or else they wouldn't feel comfortable selling it at that price a mere two months after the introduction of the phone). Now everyone's made the point that, at the time, people felt like $599 was a reasonable price for the phone (because they didn't know any better), but I guarantee you hardly anyone would've bought it if they knew that the phone was going to drop in price by 33% after just two months. A year and several million iPhone sales would make that price drop more understandable. Two months and less than a million? Please.

9/7/2007 8:43:02 AM

has anyone neglected to mention that a normal 'cool' phone costs at least $599? Americans are so spoiled when it comes to buying cellphones that they forget how much they really go for....

9/7/2007 9:23:32 AM

because we care how much a cell phone costs in kuala lumpur

9/7/2007 9:28:14 AM

surprised you even know where that is. I was talking about the UK, Germany, and other European countries...or are they 3rd world countries to you?

9/7/2007 9:30:48 AM

why would i care what cell phones cost in europe? or anywhere else?

seriously, it's the same tired shit that people come up with when they say "WELL GAS COSTS $28273284 A GALLON IN LONDON!!!"

so?

9/7/2007 9:38:52 AM

it also explains why the iPhone is the first interesting phone to be released in the US. With that attitude its no wonder you get all the shitty hand me downs from Europe.

and that is the dumbest analogy you could have come up with. troll away.

[Edited on September 7, 2007 at 9:40 AM. Reason : fda]

9/7/2007 9:40:01 AM

Quote :

"A company is GIVING REFUNDS to early adopters (Something that has NEVER been done, as far as I know) and you guys are bitching. unbelievable.... "

exactly why I'm laughing hysterically at some of you 'tards and from this point on probably dismissing anything you say as "re-re" speak

xienze - i'd really stop trying to argue your point... you're just digging yourself deeper and deeper in that mine of stupidity

[Edited on September 7, 2007 at 9:45 AM. Reason : s]

9/7/2007 9:43:42 AM

^^ i couldn't possibly care any less about a "cool" phone

if i can make fucking telephone calls with it and the service doesn't drop all the time, the battery lasts more than an hour and it doesn't fall apart within a month, i don't give a shit

i want the damn thing to be cheap

so again, tell me why i should care what all the "cool" phones in europe cost

[Edited on September 7, 2007 at 9:53 AM. Reason : *]

9/7/2007 9:52:40 AM

then what are you doing here? the iPhone falls under 'cool' phone and is not cheap. Sounds to me like its way above your budget....

[Edited on September 7, 2007 at 10:17 AM. Reason : fda]

9/7/2007 10:17:14 AM

DUDES

WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU ALL ARGUING ABOUT

SO THE IPHONE DROPPED IN PRICE

BIG FUCKING SURPRISE

THERE IS NOT A CELL PHONE ON THE PLANET THAT DOESNT DROP IN PRICE AFTER A COUPLE OF MONTHS

LIKE WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU ALL ARGUING?

HURRRRRRRRRR IPHONE ADOPTERS GOT OWNED HURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

ANYBODY THAT BUYS ELECTRONICS KNOWS THIS HOW IT WORKS. DONT BE A DUMB FGT.

9/7/2007 10:25:16 AM