The timeouts are a legitimate concern. Looks like he took a page from Roy Williams and said fuck it guys don't listen and see what happens?

12/2/2010 11:59:26 AM

Quote :

"^^haha, man, i would so like to believe that. that not calling timeouts. that not doing anything resembling coaching was all actually a brilliant coaching ploy to make these freshmen believe in the value of team basketball. he saw it happening, and he let it happen. it was all intentional passiveness by sid. to teach these kids a lesson. and it will pay off. and against syracus we are going to see the best chemistry from a state team in years. that would be awesome. "

How many times have we heard players say "we're starting to listen to coach"? George Bryan said it this year more than half way through the season during a radio interview--we weren't listening before, but we are now-- and I forget who it was that said it TOB's first or second year. So it happens and I certainly believe it could be the case now.

12/2/2010 12:23:01 PM

The difference is TOB knows how to coach.

12/2/2010 1:07:01 PM

^ the Clemson and MD threads seem to say otherwise

12/2/2010 1:17:36 PM

^^True, but that's not the point. All coaches at some point deal with players not listening--it does happen. Some are dumb enough to think they know what they are doing when they go to the next level from high school to college.

[Edited on December 2, 2010 at 1:18 PM. Reason : .]

12/2/2010 1:17:56 PM

there was no way we were going to win this game anyways. i was thinking a 15 to 20 pt loss would happen, but we let it get out of hand early and we just crumbled. the freshmen & sophomores (remember, there are 7 of them and only Scott Wood has any credible experience) need to learn to play as a team on offense AND defense or we're never going to get anywhere. that falls on Sidney.

here's to hoping that these are definitely temporary growing pains.

12/2/2010 1:29:46 PM

weve been having growing pains for years

12/2/2010 1:35:31 PM

come back dr. seaver!

12/2/2010 1:38:06 PM

^^i speak of just the freshmen and sophomores....javi has been a growing pain since he got here...1 step forward 2 steps back.

12/2/2010 3:35:03 PM

javi was called for palming the ball twice in the first half. and called for at least one unforced travel (he stuttered before delivering a two-handed bounce pass). seniors shouldn't be making those types of errors. javi is boner.

12/2/2010 3:42:07 PM

i wonder if referees watched the youtube videos of Harrow and decided they were going to watch him hard (& our whole team) when he got here on palming the ball...those were ACC refs last night.

12/2/2010 3:50:33 PM

Isn't palming a "point of empahsis" this year?

Don't they say that every year?

12/2/2010 3:54:57 PM

^every year.

12/2/2010 3:56:48 PM

lol

12/2/2010 4:00:23 PM

Quote :

"those were ACC refs last night."

You would think we would have at least had a couple questionable calls go our way. Nope, none. Not that it really mattered. Wisconsin was the superior team last night regardless.

12/2/2010 4:05:25 PM

Quote :

"Quote : "^^haha, man, i would so like to believe that. that not calling timeouts. that not doing anything resembling coaching was all actually a brilliant coaching ploy to make these freshmen believe in the value of team basketball. he saw it happening, and he let it happen. it was all intentional passiveness by sid. to teach these kids a lesson. and it will pay off. and against syracus we are going to see the best chemistry from a state team in years. that would be awesome. " How many times have we heard players say "we're starting to listen to coach"? George Bryan said it this year more than half way through the season during a radio interview--we weren't listening before, but we are now-- and I forget who it was that said it TOB's first or second year. So it happens and I certainly believe it could be the case now."

my post came off sarcastic, but i really really want to believe it. i know coaches do things like that sometimes. i think that would just be giving sid more credit than is due. but we will see.

i've argued in support of sid for years, so i definitely want that to be true. but after a loss like last night's, it's getting harder to stay in his corner. all of the sid supporters i know have said that he gets this year to get us to the ncaas or not. i still stand by that. i'm not saying "fire him now." wait til the end of the season. ncaas or bust.
it's just that a loss like last night's really prepares me for the bust.

12/2/2010 4:20:57 PM

This is Sid's last stand. He knows it, everyone else knows it. Last night was plain horrible and will be mentioned if he is fired at the end of the season. NCAAs or bust Sidney...




[Edited on December 2, 2010 at 4:43 PM. Reason : as]

12/2/2010 4:27:05 PM

Quote :

"NCAA 2nd or 3rd round or bust Sidney.."

12/2/2010 4:32:39 PM

Quote :

"National Champions or bust Sidney.""

12/2/2010 4:36:35 PM

does anyone actually think he's a good coach?

12/2/2010 5:16:35 PM

Honestly I think he is about average however his recruiting seems to be good...

12/2/2010 5:41:17 PM

Quote :

"And I really take issue with all these fools that thought we were going to run train with no depth and three freshmen. "

Kentucky? Memphis? Is Calimari that fucking brilliant?

[Edited on December 2, 2010 at 9:51 PM. Reason : .]

12/2/2010 9:51:25 PM

I guess you're trying to bait me into saying Lowe is a better coach than Calipari?

He isn't. And he also isn't a better recruiter -- which is why no one thinks this class is as good as any Calipari has brought in in the last 10 years, and why no one should be expecting Calipari-type results.

12/3/2010 8:07:27 AM

12/3/2010 9:01:32 AM

^^ Not trying to bait you, but after what we saw against Wisconsion, that product on the floor can't even sniff the drawers of what Calipari would have put out there. Which was my point. I don't think NCSU is going to or could get an elite coach, but we should be able to get a coach that could take the guys we do have them playing a lot better than they are to this point.

12/3/2010 5:51:26 PM

You mean 6 games into the season?

12/3/2010 5:55:27 PM

WTF?

12/3/2010 6:07:19 PM

1. Kentucky was better 2 years ago than we were last year, ie the freshmen came to a better team
2. Wall is a better guard than either Harrow or Brown, probably both combined
3. Cousins is better than any big we have

and I can't help but think if we had Tracey Smith, both the Georgetown and Wisconsin games wouldve been a lot more competitive

12/3/2010 6:09:33 PM

I might have ranted prematurely a bit but good God we lost by 39. We decided to see what Lowe could do this year because he is going to have a lot of talent on this team maybe not UK talent but we have plenty of damn talent. Many of you better not go back on your word. If he sucks this year, he's out, no NCAA = fired. The excuses end this April. I hope I am wrong but we have NIT written all over us again. We're 0-2 against big BCS (if you will) conference teams. We lose to Cuse and Arizona, we have to go 10-6 to get in. Duke is 2 Ls most likely so that leaves us going 10-4 in the other 14 games.

12/3/2010 9:47:50 PM

Quote :

"if you will"

12/3/2010 10:30:50 PM

Quote :

"1. Kentucky was better 2 years ago than we were last year, ie the freshmen came to a better team"

Apples to apples, what players that were there 2 years ago were better than what we have now in Tracy Smith? Surely you don't mean Darius Miller and DeAngdre Liggins?

I will grant you Liggins is a superb defender, but Tracy is easily the best player of those three...

[Edited on December 4, 2010 at 12:42 AM. Reason : and yes, we did struggle w/ tracy in our first two games]

12/4/2010 12:42:05 AM

Patrick Patterson? And don't forget #1 & #3. Particularly #1.

Why are we comparing this year's team to Kentucky's team last year?

12/4/2010 5:34:51 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnIZ82y0jJ0



Got hot from 3, tracy owned zoubek. Too bad duke's team this year would also be beat Duke's team last year by 15

[Edited on December 4, 2010 at 6:00 AM. Reason : .]

12/4/2010 5:54:59 AM

^^i meant #2 & #3. particularly #2.

12/4/2010 6:24:57 AM

I brought up the fact that other coaches are taking in top rated froshies and making them basically superstars and the rest of the team better.

All we've seen out of our top 10 recruiting class is some pretty good talent and possibly long term potential. And...they aren't exactly making everyone around them better. Basically, what Fankind and Statefans were talking about post game, intangibles. We're lacking some real chemistry and leadership. Again <- the most important part.

We saw this with Hickson. Sidney doesn't appear to integrate the team very well. The only time we've looked like a cohesive unit over the past couple of years is when we've been doing the high low thing with Smith and just let him do his thing.

Look, I'm hoping I'll be surprised and we'll just start blowing people out in all aspects...but there simply hasn't been ANYTHING yet to make me believe it's happening soon, and that is unacceptable.

12/4/2010 8:46:27 AM

Quote :

"Why are we comparing this year's team to Kentucky's team last year?"

I was more comparing the level of play of this years team (remember, they also do not have their best recruit from this class yet, if at all) to ours. They had a bad game against UConn but also beat a very good Washington team and have ran roughshod over the non-conference teams they should, unlike us.

I'm not up in arms yet, like I said, because we did lose Tracy for a few games, but I'm already seeing what happened with Herb happening again. Injuries, bad luck, freak plays, etc, etc that keep people hanging on perpetually...

Hopefully we beat Syracuse and get Tracy back and this entire argument is moot.

12/4/2010 11:12:56 AM

The thing is, we've opened the season looking rough as fuck with three guys (Javi, Wood, Smith) that have gotten plenty of minutes before this year. If the trend was up, we'd have those guys as the gasoline and at least Brown and Leslie should have been the match. All the other role players (Painter, CJ, Howell) should be giving the starters breathers without much drop off in play. Tell me why it's unreasonable to expect that result at this point in Lowes career, with these players...especially considering you can look all over college basketball and find teams that do just with sometimes inferior talent?

This thread is 188 pages for fucks sake.

12/4/2010 11:22:04 AM

Quote :

"The thing is, we've opened the season looking rough as fuck with three guys (Javi, Wood, Smith) that have gotten plenty of minutes before this year. If the trend was up, we'd have those guys as the gasoline and at least Brown and Leslie should have been the match. All the other role players (Painter, CJ, Howell) should be giving the starters breathers without much drop off in play. Tell me why it's unreasonable to expect that result at this point in Lowes career, with these players...especially considering you can look all over college basketball and find teams that do just with sometimes inferior talent? "

There have been two games total when Smith actually played one was a preseason game in which we scored 111 points. By our first "real game" game he was already showing knee problems (He shot 2-8 from the floor for gods sake). East Carolina he was in for 6 minutes so we will agree that doesn't count. What you are talking about with your statement of having Smith, Javi, and Wood and looking "rough as fuck". The reality is we only had a healthy looking Smith for ONE game and in that game we put up 111 points (Smith, Brown, Harrow, and Leslie all scored 17). I know it was a pre-season game against a nobody. Just remember this is the first time since 02-03 we have broken 100 pts in ANY GAME!

In other words if you want to bitch make sure you have your FACTS STRAIGHT!

12/4/2010 12:04:22 PM

Quote :

"Just remember this is the first time since 02-03 we have broken 100 pts in ANY GAME!"

And? VMI averages 100 PPG. What is the obsession with high scoring? Our last two games we have 57 and 48 so what exactly are you trying to say?

[Edited on December 4, 2010 at 12:18 PM. Reason : oops]

[Edited on December 4, 2010 at 12:19 PM. Reason : That "nobody" Pfeiffer also runs and guns ]

12/4/2010 12:17:34 PM

Quote :

"Our last two games we have 57 and 48 so what exactly are you trying to say? "

Ok first PLEASE GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT IN OUR LAST TWO GAMES WE SCORED 77 and 48. I understand what you were trying to get at and here is my response. In those games without OUR LEADING SCORER AND REBOUNDER and the only consistent ACC caliber senior we have on our team. Honestly if you had put Smith in the Lineup for the Georgetown and Wisconsin games there is a good chance that we would have won the Georgetown game.

12/4/2010 12:42:27 PM

Obviously no way we know that, but I doubt Georgetown loses that game no matter what. They are really good and that kind of team isn't the kind that Tracy Smith is built for.

Wisconsin? Yeah, he would have been a huge boost... of course we also were turning the ball over before ever even looking inside half the time.

12/4/2010 12:54:45 PM

That is precisely the type of team he would thrive against. They would be forced to double team him which would open up things. One of their forwards absolutely went off on us (18pts averages less than 10) and I think Smith would have could have provided some help keeping him under wraps.

When your post players aren't a scoring option you don't look inside. This team was designed around Smith. He was our 1st scoring option and absolutely vital in securing rebounds. You are taking out the keystone of this team and you expect to not see it really fuck with an extremely young team?

12/4/2010 1:08:51 PM

i've always been a sid supporter...until the past couple of games.

now i've been extremely critical.

but i still don't see how anyone could be ready to fire sid now with our best player out around whom our offense was designed.

all we should and can do is wait until tracy comes back and see how the team performs. if we still suck, we all become much more critical and discuss potential hires. but we still wait to see if sid can somehow turn it around and get us to the tourney still.

and if he doesn't, then there should be no question he should be fired.

(even if tracy is never healthy this season, and we don't make the ncaas, there is still enough talent around which sid could manage to design an offense throughout the course of the season and get us to the ncaas. so he should be fired. i don't really expect him to have figured it out a few games into the season though)

to sum it all up.

no ncaas = no job

bottom line

12/4/2010 1:19:01 PM

Quote :

"Ok first PLEASE GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT IN OUR LAST TWO GAMES WE SCORED 77 and 48."

Yeah I wasn't counting our game against Fairleigh Dickinson High School which by the way we looked AWFUL against and barely won.

[Edited on December 4, 2010 at 1:49 PM. Reason : 0-2 against real competition unless Mason counts]

12/4/2010 1:48:20 PM

Well if you can only count certain games in your arguments I am going to only count games in which Tracy Smith was healthy. I guess we are 1-0? You can't ignore facts and make incorrect assertions and not get called out.

12/4/2010 1:59:11 PM

[Edited on December 4, 2010 at 2:21 PM. Reason : forget it, not arguing with your ass]

12/4/2010 2:19:53 PM

you both are crying

12/4/2010 2:21:09 PM

considering this team's youth, if it were up to me i'd give sid one final year after this one to turn things around. if it doesn't happen this year or next, then i'd get rid of him. i think getting rid of him this year would cause the freshmen to all jump ship and then the new coach would come into a situation just as tough as the one sid came into.

12/4/2010 4:06:18 PM

These freshmen have NBA aspirations, they are not going to transfer and sit out and waste a year. The only thing they could do is Josh Powell us but that would be dumb seeing as only maybe Brown would be ready.

^^I'm not crying or making excuses because a player is hurt....

12/4/2010 5:01:05 PM

^ No you are just making things up and running away with your tail between your legs when you get called out for it. I agree that none of these freshies (maybe brown) look one and done at this point.
^^ I think if Smith comes back soon and healthy excuses for Lowe are running out.

12/4/2010 5:22:50 PM