this Liverpool/Lyon match is just massive for Liverpool this week....

they lose at Lyon and Rafa could be toast.

11/1/2009 5:15:40 PM

The Eurosport warehouse sale is November 13-14 and 20-21 for anybody interested

for page 19

11/2/2009 7:40:25 AM

^^ They will lose at Lyon. I see no way they can beat them without Gerrard and Torres.

11/2/2009 8:55:32 AM

^^Damn. I'll be in Europe. Someone pick me up some cleats and shit on clearance.

11/3/2009 1:03:30 AM

Chelski's transfer ban suspended by CAS this morning



Rio Ferdinand looks to be out for a lot longer with some injury

11/6/2009 8:24:15 AM

i believe he hurt his calf muscle.

11/6/2009 8:51:54 AM

yeah, but they're saying it shouldve healed by now, so they're looking at his back again.

11/6/2009 8:54:28 AM

yeah. from what i've read there isn't really a time table for his return right now.

11/6/2009 9:03:40 AM

is it a bad thing that he is out?

it has been said that his injuries have caused his bad form. I say sit him for a long time so he is healthy for the final 16 of the champions league and run in for the league

V you're right

extented time out would be the best thing for united

[Edited on November 6, 2009 at 9:22 AM. Reason : ]

11/6/2009 9:09:54 AM

i don't think anyone is saying he should play hurt.

11/6/2009 9:17:37 AM

yeah, we ain't no Rafas up in here


we like our star players to heal before they play

11/6/2009 9:27:11 AM

lol, speaking of Rafa... somebody wrote this letter in to F365

Quote :

"a man who has won two La Liga titles, reached two European Cup finals (winning one), and land both the UEFA and FA Cup in an eight-year time-frame, while turning Liverpool from a team barely able to qualify for the Champions Leage to the team ranked 1st within 3 years. Turned a team who finished a staggering 30+ points behind the champions into a squad who were two goals away from being champions last year. A man who has helped to turn Steven Gerrard from a midfielder who scored on average 7 goals a season into the most dynamic attacking player in the country averaging 20+ goals a season for the last 3 seasons. They said he is "lucky" to have Torres, yet ignore that he signed him in the first place and has helped to turn him from a good player in Spain to a world class player in England in 2 seasons. He is not without fault, and yes he has made mistakes, but the man quite simply deserves better that the bile that is being spouted about him right now. In terms of trophies he is the third most successful manager in the Premier League (behind Ferguson and Wenger, and has been there less that half the time)."

I'm in the middle on Rafa - I think he's a pretty good manager but I think it's time for something different. It's just I can't see the point in firing him now and I don't think the owners have money for anybody better. If I could pick anybody to replace him though, it'd be The Special One... you know he's bored as fuck in Italy.

[Edited on November 6, 2009 at 9:34 AM. Reason : RAAAFAAAA]

11/6/2009 9:30:28 AM

i think rafa has done a lot for liverpool, but he needs to be fired. He's had some success, but really only in europe. He's failed to develop any players at liverpool at all. I don't attribute Gerrard (He was at liverpool way before Rafa) or Torres (He was already a top striker in the world). He hasn't developed one player at liverpool, if you can name a player that has gotten good under rafa , please do. He's spent millions on getting these promising starlets, but they haven't done anything at all. If you look at players coming through the ranks at premiership teams now like man utd (welbeck, fletcher, evans), arsenal ( almost everyone on their team) even small teams like southhampton have developed more good young players than liverpool. It's pretty sad considering he has so much money and such a legendary club. If they don't fix their team soon, i think they could be seriously screwed, they already have money problems and not getting in the top 4 would really hurt them.

11/6/2009 1:36:08 PM

Quote :

"i think rafa has done a lot for liverpool, but he needs to be fired. He's had some success, but really only in europe."

Because European success comes so easy for every other manager in the world that it's really worthless if you can't win your domestic league.

How many managers have had success in the Premier League? Hate on him all you want, but don't hate him because he's not Wenger or SAF, that's just silly, considering those are the two greatest managers in the history of the league.

Quote :

"He's failed to develop any players at liverpool at all. I don't attribute Gerrard (He was at liverpool way before Rafa) or Torres (He was already a top striker in the world). He hasn't developed one player at liverpool, if you can name a player that has gotten good under rafa , please do."

Benayoun is 10x the player now than he was when he came to Liverpool. Xabi Alonso is the perfect example of developing a player. Was he anywhere near Madrid before he came to Liverpool? Carra was a nobody for Liverpool until Rafa moved him to the middle. Gerrard was there but he wasn't the player he is now.. and if I'm not mistaken, was on the verge of leaving for Chelsea right after Rafa came. Torres was a good striker but he had nowhere near the reputation he does now as tops in the world. Rafa doesn't get any credit for bringing him in? That's just trolling.

Quote :

"He's spent millions on getting these promising starlets, but they haven't done anything at all. If you look at players coming through the ranks at premiership teams now like man utd (welbeck, fletcher, evans), arsenal ( almost everyone on their team) even small teams like southhampton have developed more good young players than liverpool."

C'mon, Welbeck and Evans? I'm not suggesting he's done as good a job as Ferguson but get some better examples then those two. He hasn't developed any real young talent - I agree, that's an accurate critique of him but again, he's not Wenger or Ferguson, so let's fire him!!

11/6/2009 2:11:44 PM

i'm just talking about young players now, welbeck and evans haven't dont a lot, but at least theyre doing something for the first team occasionally. Rafa hasn't had a guy break through to his first team from his youth squad or reserves in as long as i can remember. Most of the young guys that Rafa has bought in the last few years you could even say have regressed. Babel, Agger, Lucas, all of them haven't progressed in their development at all. Lucas was supposed to be one of the top young midfielders at the time, but he is a joke now. Rafa has alienated so many players and brought in so many shitty players, it doesn't make any sense at all. Rafa may have developed Xabi Alonso some, but he is also a big part of the reason he left, with his big push for gareth barry. I know Alonso wanted to go to real, but i bet he would've stayed too. Imagine where pool would be today if they had sold Gerrard to Chelsea back in 2005

11/6/2009 2:25:20 PM

gerrard and carragher were class and playing every game before rafa ever got there. carragher has been starting for liverpool since the 90s. he already developed as a player before rafa got there. correct me if im wrong, aimorris, but rafa came in and won in europe with players that were already there right? all these players he has brought in now havent won him anything i think....i could be wrong about this, but im fairly certain that is correct.


wow. since they won in 2005, i decided to go back and look at the starting lineup and bench....gerrard and carragher are the only 2 from that lineup still on the team....players coming and going so quickly could be a problem as to why he cant win a season that grinds away at squads and needs a lot of team unity.

[Edited on November 6, 2009 at 3:42 PM. Reason : f]

11/6/2009 3:36:33 PM

Quote :

"Babel, Agger, Lucas, all of them haven't progressed in their development at all. Lucas was supposed to be one of the top young midfielders at the time, but he is a joke now. Rafa has alienated so many players and brought in so many shitty players, it doesn't make any sense at all. "

No argument on Babel, that is looking like a ridiculously horrible signing. Agger's been hurt for the last two years. And since it's become another cliched talking point for Liverpool haters now, let me ask; how many Liverpool games have you even watched to know that Lucas is a joke? He certainly wasn't a joke in the one game I'm sure you got a chance to see. He's not Alonso, but he's not as bad as people make him out to be. I thought he was very very poor the first few games but he's definitely gotten better as the season has gone on.

Quote :

"Rafa may have developed Xabi Alonso some, but he is also a big part of the reason he left, with his big push for gareth barry. I know Alonso wanted to go to real, but i bet he would've stayed too."

Him leaving and why he left is irrelevant in this particular discussion. You said he hasn't developed a single player since he's been at Liverpool and Alonso is a perfect example of a player just good enough for a mid-tier La Liga team who became a must-have 30 million pound piece in one of the biggest clubs in the world.

Quote :

"correct me if im wrong, aimorris, but rafa came in and won in europe with players that were already there right? all these players he has brought in now havent won him anything i think....i could be wrong about this, but im fairly certain that is correct."

Yeah, but I'd argue that highlights his coaching ability even further. Taking a team not even close to a European Cup to a title in his first year, without his players. And anyways, the FA Cup was won with all his players and he also reached a European Cup final with his players so it's not exactly like he's doing poorly. He's only been there five seasons and look at the trophies they have and the consistent success they've enjoyed in the Premier League. You can't just ignore all that because they've been decimated with injuries and had a bad run of form (and they still managed to beat United!)

Also, you can point at his poor transfer history all you want but the fact is he's not playing in the same ballpark as United and Chelsea. He has to try to find some deals - sometimes they work out and sometimes they don't.

After all this defense of Rafa, let me remind you that I did say I think it's time they get something different. It's just at this point I'm not sure they have the money or the options available to make an improvement over what Rafa gives them.

11/6/2009 4:49:32 PM

you're right that pool doesnt make as much money, but looking at the past couple of seasons, liverpool has spent just as much as united and chelsea in the transfer market.

11/6/2009 6:50:57 PM

Here's a good analysis of Rafa's transfer history

http://studsup.wordpress.com/2009/11/05/rafael-benitezs-transfer-dealings-in-focus/


He's made some mistakes but I don't think it's as bad as everybody says.

11/6/2009 8:18:21 PM

are you KIDDING me?


Take off the fucking rose colored glasses, man.



There is not one Manager in EUROPE, let alone ENGLAND who has made as many poor purchases as Rafa has. This isn't even a DEBATE. The fat man throws money at anything.


The only thing he's been adept at is FAILING TO DEVELOP TALENT.



His issue with Rick Parry's guy who ran the LFC academy is perfect example. For the better part of 3 years there had been TWO different Liverpool Academies - Rafa's, and the other guy's. That's up until 2007, when Rafa finally forced him out and shut down. You wonder why Liverpool doesn't have youth players? Look to Rafa. He brings in tons upon tons of shit European players to the Academy, and NONE of them have made it through the ranks to the first team.

11/7/2009 2:25:45 AM

Thanks for the UNBIASED contribution to the discussion with all the FACTS you've given about how horrible Rafa has been in the transfer business.

11/7/2009 12:31:08 PM

Are you speaking to the mirror? That link you posted was the definition of utter bullshit. Some dude with a blog, who is most likely a Liverpool supporter. Right.

Not only that, but he rates players who spent less than 3 years there as "good" buys. Unless that player performed magnificently, you can't say that.

He rated Crouch as a good buy, but then bemoans the fact that he was sold. That doesn't equal out to a good buy. That equals out to idiotic fucking management.


If you want UNBIASED views on what I'm talking about, look right here:

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=427432&cc=5901

http://soccernet.espn.go.com/feature?id=693168&sec=england&cc=5901



But don't let my facts cloud your vision, oh no. Benitez is such a conniving shit that he can't even let the man who built the Academy into what it was do his fucking job, and as a result sabotaged the development of players over the course of his tenure. Agents wouldn't bring their players to LFC because they didn't have a shot if Rafa didn't hand-pick them - and we've all seen how shitty his talent identification ability is.


[Edited on November 7, 2009 at 1:19 PM. Reason : .]

11/7/2009 1:14:25 PM

I guess I missed the part where you made me look like an idiot. All you're going on about is how poor their youth academy is and how Rafa's done a poor job of handling it. Which I've said NOTHING about because it's obvious he's had some problems there.

The argument was that he hasn't had a single player get better under him at Liverpool which is just simply wrong and that he hadn't won anything with his own players, which is also wrong.

11/7/2009 1:30:08 PM

no, your argument was that "he's not doing that bad"


The facts point quite to the contrary.


In danger of crashing out of the Champions League, and in real danger of not qualifying for it next year.


This is due, in whole, to his inability to identify and cultivate talent.


Seriously dude, take off the rose-colored glasses. He's doing a poor job, and I've been saying that for years.

11/7/2009 1:46:20 PM

Take off what glasses, the ones I'm wearing because I'm a Liverpool fan? Why would I blindly support Rafa over the good of the club? That doesn't make any sense.

I guessed you missed the part where I thought the club needed to find somebody else, it's just that I don't think they have the money or the options available to make an improvement at this point. Because firing him and just replacing him with anybody else won't solve their problems. They're going to miss the knockout stages of the Champions League, they're not in danger of relegation - let's get a little perspective is all I'm saying.

11/7/2009 1:57:13 PM

I hate both Lolverpool and Man Love, but is this what life looks like through those aforementioned "rose colored glasses"?



[Edited on November 7, 2009 at 9:14 PM. Reason : .]

11/7/2009 9:14:31 PM

Quality yellow on Drogba, lol.

Goal for Terry


Evans is a menace.

[Edited on November 8, 2009 at 12:44 PM. Reason : b]

11/8/2009 12:37:30 PM

not that great of a game to watch as a neutral honestly, both teams looked sloppy... I was hoping for a draw but I'll take a United loss any day

I fucking hate Darren Fletcher

11/8/2009 1:37:15 PM

Referee decided that game, not the teams. Epic bullshit.


PS: John Terry's dad: a class act.

http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/news/587550/John-Terrys-dad-sells-cocaine-in-bar.html

[Edited on November 8, 2009 at 2:06 PM. Reason : ahaha coke dealer]

11/8/2009 1:57:08 PM

Haha, you bitter bitch.

11/8/2009 2:31:22 PM

I find it funny that whenever ManUre loses Fergie and their fans bitch about the ref.

11/8/2009 2:59:29 PM

you can't tell me that ref wasn't shit.


I watched it at the pub and even the Chelsea boys were bitching about him. I'm not saying we would've won, I'm saying the ref was shit and HE decided the game.

He made tons of bad calls the entire game, and it just so happened that Chelsea scored off of a resultant free-kick made from a make-up call that he gave because he wrongfully gave Drogba a card.

Believe me, I'd rather see a pk given in the box because of Johnny Evans' judo kick to the chest than ever see a fucking free kick given because a player won the ball fair and square.


Call a spade a spade, what's fair is fair, and what's not is not. Martin Atkinson blew the game and became a spectacle, and that could've gone either way.

[Edited on November 8, 2009 at 3:29 PM. Reason : .]

11/8/2009 3:25:56 PM

Fair enough.

11/8/2009 4:05:03 PM

The ref was pretty bad, but it doesn't mean the ref decided the game. I actually thought the foul that led to the goal wasn't all that bad of a call. It was definitely harsh but I could see where he might have seen something to make him think it was a foul.

He was poor for both sides and didn't give a bad penalty or a red card to either side, so both sides had plenty of opportunities to win it for themselves, which Chelsea did in the end.

You gotta love the FA's crackdown on referee bashing, except for when Ferguson does it every single time a decision doesn't go his way. Ridiculous.

[Edited on November 8, 2009 at 8:15 PM. Reason : saf]

11/8/2009 8:11:29 PM

either team couldve won today. im about tired of fergie's ridiculous substitution method this year, though...why hes waiting till late as shit to change anything up is beyond me. and nick is right, the ref decided this game and had a shitty game. wtf was he doing giving drogba the yellow there when johnny evans was trying to sweep the leg chest...not sure what he was looking at. then come terry's goal he mustve been looking at the same thing again cause somehow he missed drogba foul brown in the box then try to play the ball from terry's header in an offsides position...had 2 chances to blow the whistle and decided to miss everything. the ball flew right into that path too so i have no idea what he was looking at. and for the first time in a while, giggs actually looked his age. he looked slow in play and decision making

lol at hating fletcher, hes pretty much the same player as mascherano except he actually scores goals...

[Edited on November 8, 2009 at 9:51 PM. Reason : edit]



gahhh...you know its an epic weekend when paul scharner leads your fantasy team
not too worried though, looks like cody and nick had bad weekends too.

[Edited on November 8, 2009 at 9:56 PM. Reason : f]

11/8/2009 9:49:41 PM

Somehow Obertan gave me more points than Drlolgba.



Epic.

11/9/2009 12:12:31 AM

that evans kick on drogba was the most ridiculous thing i've seen, how did drogba get carded for that? if the fa takes another look at that, i can see evans getting suspended.

11/9/2009 2:51:21 AM

Quote :

"lol at hating fletcher, hes pretty much the same player as mascherano except he actually scores goals"

lol, exactly

he's the player you love if he's on your team but absolutely hate if he's on any other

11/9/2009 7:44:56 AM

the best part about the Evans kick was how Vidic was smiling on the sideline like "Oh hey, I gotta try that shit next time"



except Vidic is like Chuck Norris, and would probably kill a man.

11/9/2009 8:00:44 AM

wow wow triple wow. ngog now surpasses eduardo with the dive of the century....what are the refs doing this year? and how did the sideline ref miss that ridiculously blatant dive. if diving was a problem before, i dont even know what you can call it now. something has to be done. i hate when players from my teams dive too, it makes me cringe. this is out of control


cant say birmingham deserved to win without that uber controversial penalty because they played 11 in the box after they took the lead, but liverpool didnt deserve to be gifted a goal for so many wasted chances. also, birmingham displayed probably some of the worst clearances ive ever seen in EPL history. i have no idea how liverpool could only get 1 goal in the first half


also. lolverpool to field an entire reserves team next game as riera went back out with hamstring injury and benayoun also went out with what looked like a hamstring injury too. terrible liverpool warm-up/stretch regime exposed????


[Edited on November 9, 2009 at 5:00 PM. Reason : edit]

11/9/2009 4:49:17 PM

cameron jerome with goal of the season????

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmLs1gOlwyc

11/9/2009 5:14:20 PM

and triple post for the dive: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ttlkk4dKM8

11/9/2009 5:53:10 PM

Fucking awful.


Ngog should be ashamed of himself.




Send Eduardo and Ngog to Siberia.

11/9/2009 6:41:08 PM

that shit was horrible, its an embarrassment to the game

11/9/2009 7:44:05 PM

i came in here to post pretty much that exact (^) comment.

11/9/2009 7:44:53 PM

"You'll Never Dive Alone."

lol youtube comments

[Edited on November 9, 2009 at 8:08 PM. Reason : random question marks]

11/9/2009 7:57:39 PM

yep, that's a pretty awful dive

but the dive was so well executed that you can't fault the ref for missing it from his angle, and the assistant's on the other side so he doesn't have a clear view. this is where referees behind the goal would help but better yet, 5 game bans for shit like this


[Edited on November 9, 2009 at 9:40 PM. Reason : blah]

11/9/2009 9:38:10 PM

Quote :

"i hate when players from my teams dive too, it makes me cringe. this is out of control."

Seriously. This stuff pisses me off to the extent that if a player on a team I supported were to dive in an Eduardongog-esque manner, I could not root for that player at all anymore. Actually, I would hope for him to break his fucking legs. This kind of shit gives soccer haters a leg to stand on.

It's one thing to have some kind of contact and embellish it. This is an entirely different level of bullshit.

11/10/2009 12:24:22 AM

yeah, it's much easier to hate because I never liked Ngog much anyways

now if Gerrard had done this, you probably wouldn't see me in this thread for a while

11/10/2009 7:46:49 AM

fucking lol to Nani, what a bitch

11/12/2009 9:03:55 AM