Quote :

"the medical schools are forced to select less qualified students and as a result, the advancement of medicine will slow."

that's a horribly incorrect assertion.

Medical advancements do not come from your garden variety clinical MDs but generally from MD PhDs who are focused on research from the get go. These doctors are not in it for the money because regardless of malpractice insurance, they make less than clinical doctors unless they develop some medical breakthrough. Duke has one of the best research oriented medical schools in the country, but also a very sub-par clinical program whereas UNC's med school focuses on clinical medicine.

1/16/2006 8:28:14 AM

Quote :

"I have come to realize that every man's worst enemy is a lawyer because they can mess your life up so much."

yet everyone needs one at some time or another...so don't go knocking lawyers all together. when it comes time for you to buy a house--the biggest investment of your life probably--you'll see how a lawyer can "mess up your life so much."

1/16/2006 10:15:13 AM

I think it can be assumed that when people knock lawyers in general they're referring to litigation attorneys rather than real-estate, tax, and others that simply provide services for facilitating everyday legal procedures.

1/16/2006 10:26:48 AM

litigation plaintiff attorneys that focus in personal injury and tort liability...not defense representing insurance agencies of course.

1/16/2006 11:06:13 AM

Its lawyers that advertise that give such a bad name to the profession. People get the impression that they can sue for just about anything and do not realize that a lot of problems cannot be solved in a court room. Lawyers that advertise are willing to weed out the crazy calls in order to find that one decent size case that will come along every so often.

[Edited on January 16, 2006 at 1:11 PM. Reason : k]

1/16/2006 1:07:34 PM

WTF is this crazy talk about people who want to be doctors switching to dentistry because of the insurance/malpractice costs? Thats the biggest load of crap I've heard in a while. I've actually heard that the number of people applying to medical school is dropping (or has been dropping until recently), but I dont have any stats to back that up...just word of mouth from doctors. I dont think that someone who wants to be an MD will just up and switch to dentistry because of insurance costs though. Find me one doctor who doesnt make a good living...you cant do it.

The thing is, people who go to medical school dont do it for the money. Yeah sure, you might do it because you're almost guaranteed to make a decent living once you're done, but if money is your motive, how the hell are you going to make it through the stress of medical school and a long residency once you're done?

1/16/2006 1:35:37 PM

Quote :

"Medical advancements do not come from your garden variety clinical MDs but generally from MD PhDs who are focused on research from the get go. These doctors are not in it for the money because regardless of malpractice insurance, they make less than clinical doctors unless they develop some medical breakthrough. Duke has one of the best research oriented medical schools in the country, but also a very sub-par clinical program whereas UNC's med school focuses on clinical medicine."

The first part is true, but in terms of money you should also consider student loans. MD/PhDs often get tuition waivers & stipends (just like typical grad students), and there's also an NIH program that will pay off MD student loans entirely for qualified researchers. So yes, they make less money, but they also have less debt.

UNC's med school is also pretty highly regarded in terms of research. A better comparison might be Duke vs. ECU, because ECU is considered a good school in terms of being oriented to primary-care (although they also have some very interesting research going on there). A caveat, though: the rankings in general are pretty crappy and I don't consider them a very accurate reflection of the schools in question.

Quote :

"I've actually heard that the number of people applying to medical school is dropping (or has been dropping until recently), but I dont have any stats to back that up...just word of mouth from doctors."

A lot of practicing doctors exaggerate. They'll say, "Medicine sucks these days, don't go into it." It's not that the money's bad, it's just that it isn't the same as it was when they got started. Medicine still pays very well in comparison to other fields.

Quote :

"Find me one doctor who doesnt make a good living...you cant do it. "

Depends on how you define it. A primary care practice that takes mostly Medicare/Medicaid patients will have trouble even covering its staff and expenses, let alone paying the doctors well. There's a wide salary range out there.

Quote :

"The thing is, people who go to medical school dont do it for the money. Yeah sure, you might do it because you're almost guaranteed to make a decent living once you're done, but if money is your motive, how the hell are you going to make it through the stress of medical school and a long residency once you're done?"

Well said.

1/16/2006 4:26:22 PM

Quote :

"Depends on how you define it. A primary care practice that takes mostly Medicare/Medicaid patients will have trouble even covering its staff and expenses, let alone paying the doctors well. There's a wide salary range out there. "

would it be better if I said that there are no doctors struggling to support themselves?

I see what you're saying though. There are a lot of doctors that are more than well off, and others that make about an average living. Now unless they have extravagant lifestyles, I would consider making over 50K doing well enough.

Quote :

"A lot of practicing doctors exaggerate. They'll say, "Medicine sucks these days, don't go into it." It's not that the money's bad, it's just that it isn't the same as it was when they got started. Medicine still pays very well in comparison to other fields. "

you just described my uncle to perfection. He's an orthopedic surgeon...loves what he does...but what he hates is all of the extracurricular BS involved in medicine these days that he didnt have to deal with when he first started practicing. The things he hates are exactly whats being discussed in this thread...insurance companies, politics, and lawyers. He's asked me a few times why I'm trying to go to medical school because he doesnt understand why anyone would want to deal with the crap anymore.

[Edited on January 16, 2006 at 4:43 PM. Reason : ]

1/16/2006 4:34:13 PM