You'd better hope she's not a T-Dubber...

10/10/2006 11:08:32 AM

Why?

10/10/2006 11:10:36 AM

Quote :

"The way I see it though building a healthy relationship with the one I'm going to spend the rest of my life with is worth more than a few dollars for gas."

How is living together creating an unhealthy relationship?

10/10/2006 11:11:42 AM

You either know or you don't.

10/10/2006 11:16:22 AM

it adds uneeded stress to the relationship. i mean i've never done it so i can't speak from experience but just from living with my best friend in an apt for a year we had all sorts of issues. i could only imagine what it would be like with a girlfriend. i'm not going to type out a paper right now outlining all the reasons not to live together but if you want more details there are plenty of resources out there just waiting for a google.

[Edited on October 10, 2006 at 11:19 AM. Reason : sp]

10/10/2006 11:18:49 AM

So, once you get married are you not going to move in with this person thereby creating a stressful situation?

10/10/2006 11:19:31 AM

of course not. that's why premarital counseling is so important imo. you'll already know most of the issues you'll have and how to face them. you'll have a foundation and build the skills with your spouse to work through problems.

10/10/2006 11:22:21 AM

I wouldn't get engaged before you know the issues and how to face them.

10/10/2006 11:29:07 AM

once again gg super ben. do you even know what's involved in counceling? way to not know anything about it. wow, if you have to live with her to not want to cheat on her i'm very sorry.

^ exactly. i'm just saying that moving in together doesn't help to accomplish that in the long run.

[Edited on October 10, 2006 at 11:35 AM. Reason : ^]

10/10/2006 11:34:04 AM

Uhhhh, did I miss a post or something? Who's ben?

[Edited on October 10, 2006 at 11:36 AM. Reason : nevermind, previous page]

10/10/2006 11:36:16 AM

^^ Haha, your reading skills are impeccable! I’m done.

[Edited on October 10, 2006 at 11:37 AM. Reason : ^^]

10/10/2006 11:37:27 AM

^^^You have no idea what the issues of living with someone are until you LIVE with them. Now, I've never been to premarital counseling before, but I bet it's safe to say that you don't discuss whether you leave the toilet seat up after you're finished, how long it takes before the dishes get done, who gets the most room in the closet, etc. All of these mundane things are probably what caused so many problems when you lived with your friend and they will definitely cause the same problems when you live with your wife. It takes time to get used to sharing a living space with someone and it also takes time to get used to being married. Why make yourself have to deal with all of these things at once? Why not take it in steps and live together first, get used to it, then pledge your life to one another?

It's your choice whether you live with someone before you get married. However, to say that living with someone before marriage weakens a relationship, that's just recockulous.

[Edited on October 10, 2006 at 11:37 AM. Reason : ^]

[Edited on October 10, 2006 at 11:39 AM. Reason : a]

10/10/2006 11:37:28 AM

Quote :

"it adds uneeded stress to the relationship."

How so? I live with my gf and she works 2 nights a week and we hang out the other 5. Since we've moved in together by far the bigest change is the fact I am no longer living with the same guy I lived with for 3 years. No big changes have occured in our relationship.

10/10/2006 11:39:29 AM

Quote :

"Now, I've never been to premarital counseling before, but I bet it's safe to say that you don't discuss whether you leave the toilet seat up after you're finished, how long it takes before the dishes get done, who gets the most room in the closet, etc."

actually yes, you do talk about mundane stuff like that. that's the point. you talk about the kind of stuff you couldn't have forseen on your own with someone who is experienced in order to be ready to deal with it in an affective way.

^ that may be fine for you. its just very risky and the chances of a marriage (if you ever get to that point and i'm not trying to call you out here because i don't know you or your gf) ending in devorce are much higher solely because of the fact of living together before marriage.

10/10/2006 11:46:39 AM

Why do you think the chances are higher?

10/10/2006 11:47:45 AM

Well like i said, i don't want to restate everything that's already been published. just google "living together before marriage" for a list of sites that have done the studies and explain why the chances are higher. i'm not trying to dodge the issue, i'm just too lazy at the moment to put together a list.

super ben, would you care to explain?

[Edited on October 10, 2006 at 11:52 AM. Reason : .]

10/10/2006 11:51:47 AM

Have you ever thought that many people don't get live together first for religious reasons and these same people don't get divorced because of these same religious reasons? The stats aren't accurate.

10/10/2006 11:52:50 AM

http://jmm.aaa.net.au/articles/4903.htm

not true.

10/10/2006 11:57:53 AM

http://www.criticalthinking.org.uk/lisastigerrepellantrock.html

Then give me a logical reason supporting your statement.

10/10/2006 11:59:30 AM

well i'm out for lunch, but i'll be back to continue this discussion. provides a nice way to make the day go by fast (and appear like i'm doing some work at the same time )

10/10/2006 11:59:49 AM

I'm with battousai. I really don't think I want to live with my partner before getting married.

10/10/2006 12:05:24 PM

Check the link when you get back. Lunch time for me as well.

10/10/2006 12:05:55 PM

Bat, no I don't want to do your research for you, but if you're going to throw out specious claims with no support, then I at least feel obligated to tell you that you're buying snake oil (whether it's the religious kind or the psycho-science kind) by dragging your fiance to counseling (and hopefully you're paying a lot for it).

http://marriage.rutgers.edu/Publications/SWLT2%20TEXT.htm

Quote :

"The reasons for a negative "cohabitation effect" are not fully understood."

That doesn't need an explaination, but here it is anyway: They don't know why couples who live together get divorces. Even though 50% get married after three years and 70% get married after five years. They still get divorced for some reason. Although, only by about eight percentage points more often (I think it said 26% vs. 34%) than the rest of the population. So, if you're using statistics to determine the longevity of your relationship (which would be great, I can just see this engineer grad with a spreadsheet with the length of his relationship graphed against the intestity of his feelings and a formula calculating the chances of waking up next to a loving wife every morning) then yes, you're right. It's more likely that you'll be divorced if you live together and get married.

If that's the answer you were looking for, then you can stop reading. But I'll tell you a secret. It doesn't matter if you live together or not. It doesn't matter if 29% of Pepsi drinkers vs. 31% of Coke drinkers get divorced. It is not going to make your marriage last longer if you switch to Pepsi.

Now I'm done.


Oh wait, I'm not: http://www.psychpage.com/family/mod_couples_thx/cdc.html

Quote :

"It's better for your relationship to be educated, religious, living in a good neighborhood, from a two parent home, and never raped, and have no children "

How are you going to tell your wife that kids are out, because the chances of divorce are higher?

[Edited on October 10, 2006 at 12:35 PM. Reason : thenthan]

10/10/2006 12:34:03 PM

Quote :

"Hi from Melbourne, Australia! Here's a site for pastors, ex-pastors, church leaders and their spouses - indeed thoughtful people in or out of the church, who want to think more maturely/critically about the Christian faith."

Sheesh bat, could you have found a more biased site to use?

10/10/2006 1:05:28 PM

Sounds like someone has intimacy problems and is finding excuses for not giving up his bachelor pad...

10/10/2006 1:12:47 PM

Quote :

"Premarital counceling is the best way to ensure its the right time and that it will last. You learn a lot about your spouse's personality, temperament, habits, background, goals, future planning AND how to deal with them together rather than just throwing yourelves in the midst of it to sort it out after its too late."

hold the phone....

i thought you were supposed to know these things before engagement was even a consideration-- even before then!! marriage counseling is way to figure this out?? rotfl good luck with that

10/10/2006 1:20:00 PM

Yeah, that's basically what I said at the top of the thread.

On a sitenote, how long before... people start posting the entire fucking title in the god damn subject line.

10/10/2006 1:23:15 PM

I dont know about all this shit but unless she makes more money than you do a pre-nup.

10/10/2006 1:26:47 PM

^^ haha, hey holly. i think you missed the PRE in front of marriage counseling. the idea IS to learn these things before engagement or at the very least before marriage.

no i don't pay for counseling or "drag" my girlfriend (who isn't my fiance yet) to it. we spend time with a long time trusted friend who has been counseling couples for over 30 years.

http://marriage.rutgers.edu/Publications/SWLT2%20TEXT.htm, how does that in any way support your argument? because it says that one line? did you read the rest of it?

its not correlation between cohabitation and unsuccesful marriage. of course you can live together and make it. this isn't an absolute arguement where we will come to some scientific truth to prove with out a doubt one way or the other.

ya i realize that link i posted was of christian bias but it was the first source i found in a couple seconds.

10/10/2006 1:43:15 PM

I kind of assumed pre marriage meant after engagement.

I'm still waiting for that logical reason supporting your statement.

[Edited on October 10, 2006 at 1:47 PM. Reason : ]

10/10/2006 1:47:11 PM

When you don't ask yourself "are they the one"

I mean I'm pretty sure thats how it works out.

Its not like you're buying a used car, man.

10/10/2006 2:00:32 PM

-Met on new years over the phone, starting dating after 2 months
-After 4 months of dating, we had ideas about our marriage
-After 2 months of thinking about marriage, we got engaged
-After 2 weeks of being engagment, we got married
-All occurring over 10,000 cell phone minutes, 5,000 IM minutes, 1,300 miles, and 5 seperate visits.

Total time it took to "know if it's the right one": 8 months and 2 weeks

Of course, there is a lot more than meets the eye. We had quite a few dire circumstances that were ultimate deciding factors.

Been married a little over a year now. I love my wife more now, than when we got married.

10/10/2006 2:05:44 PM

sorry, work's keeping me busy now

Quote :

"I'm still waiting for that logical reason supporting your statement."

... and i'm still waiting on any evidence to suggest differently.

10/10/2006 2:56:59 PM

So, you are making a statement and saying it is true until I prove it is false?

Did you even look at the link I posted?

10/10/2006 3:00:34 PM

My parents lived together for seven years before they got married. And I have never seen a happier, more in love couple.

I plan on living with my boyfriend for a long time before even concidering engagement. I want to be sure that he is the person I truely want to be committed to, and know what I'm getting into instead of after the fact.

I agree with whoever said that he was afraid to give up his bachlor pad. If you're going to move in together, its going to happen sometime, why is it such a big deal to do it now?

I'm head over heels in love with my best friend though, so maybe thats part of the reason why I would have no problem living with him. Friendship comes first.

10/10/2006 3:16:06 PM

Here's a concept that people seem to have difficulty grasping: these things are different for every couple/individual. My grandparents got married after 3 months of dating and were together 45 years (until one of them died). My aunt lived with her boyfriend for three years before she got married and it wasn't until after they were married that he became abusive and they divorced. My mom dated my dad for a year before they moved in together and were married and they split 14 years later.

The point of all that being, things don't happen the same way for everyone. I personally dated my boyfriend for about a month before we moved in together and we've been living together happily for a year. Your milage, and everyone else's, may vary.

10/10/2006 3:44:39 PM

^^ i did, and it didn't help your argument. considering hundreds of studies have been done to relate cohabitaion and marriage its a little different than relating a rock and the absence of tigers. as far as not wanting to lose a bachelor pad to move in with a girlfriend would be a retarded reason, i'm in agreement there. of course everyone's experience will be different. like i said, there is no absolute in this topic from a practical perspective, somebody somewhere has been able to make a marriage work successfully in any situation. all am saying from the beginning is that saying you should definitely move in together before marriage to be sure when every study done everywhere shows that the devorce rate is higher for couples who marry under those situations leads to the conlusion that its not an effective way to judge a future spouse. that's it. and yes, i'm making a factual statement (once again based on the research done by professional journals and universities) so if you want to dispute it you'll have to find evidence contradictory to it.

10/10/2006 4:11:09 PM

Very well. In that case, I will make the factual statement that a couple living together before they are married who are, educated, religious, living in a good neighborhood, from a two parent home, never been raped, and have no children will lead to a better chance of not getting divorced.

[Edited on October 10, 2006 at 4:27 PM. Reason : ]

10/10/2006 4:27:30 PM

Wow Jesus christ both of you shut the fuck up.

10/10/2006 4:34:39 PM

I'll pass.

10/10/2006 4:39:02 PM

fuck you sand nigga

side note: spirituality and premarital cohabitation don't work well together...

[Edited on October 10, 2006 at 6:46 PM. Reason : but seriously, if you don't like it don't click on the thread.]

10/10/2006 6:44:55 PM

I've been in a relationship with my wife for almost 6 years. We were together for 2.5 years before getting engaged, engaged for two years, and have been married for 1.5 years. We didn't talk about it, but I knew within about two weeks of starting to officially "date" her that she was probably going to be the woman I married. If it's the right person, most of the time there's no gray area in the question of "should I marry this person." But before actually going through with it, you need to ask youself and your significant other some very serious questions and get the completely honest answers. Marriage counseling, talking to a member of the clergy, and cohabitating will all facilitate asking the right kind of questions as long as you both are open and honest about your relationship and your future together.

my $0.02

10/11/2006 12:42:29 PM