winning the nit is better than losing in the 1st round of the ncaa as far as recruiting goes....as long as not making the ncaas is rare for your program.

3/19/2007 9:20:31 AM

i'll bet jackson state and central connecticut state will get better recruits than us next year since they were good enough to make the ncaa tournament!

60th place is totally so much better than 66th!

also when Thompson called it a losers tournament he had just come off an undefeated season and an NCAA CHAMPIONSHIP...he hadnt come off of Herb's last 2 seasons at State

[Edited on March 19, 2007 at 9:25 AM. Reason : .]

3/19/2007 9:23:09 AM

Quote :

"tell me state couldn't have done better than stanford or marquette "

they couldnt, because they didnt get in.

3/19/2007 9:24:31 AM

stanford and marquette have such an advantage over us now!

3/19/2007 9:25:30 AM

I HATE TO SAY BUT THIS IS THE END OF SYDNEY'S MAGICAL RUN IN THE NIT BUT WVU IS GOING TO ROLL TOMMORROW!!

3/19/2007 9:31:35 AM

^Ask Duke and Virginia if beating the Wolfpack earlier in the season means you will beat them when you play them again in the post season

and its Sidney Lowe...not Sydney Australia

3/19/2007 9:33:33 AM

I'm so confused now. Our entire fanbase has pretty much claimed the last year that it's our birthright to be one of the college basketball elites. I don't have a problem with that and I think it's great to have that aspiration. However, that doesn't jive with the pedastal the NIT has been put on this year. In the past 10 years it's been a 'loser tournament' for teams not good enough. In fact there have been TONS of threads and people making fun of Dave Odom and USC for winning it.

Winning the NIT is NO WHERE NEAR as prestigous or important as making the Sweet 16. I honestly have no clue how someone can think that. The Sweet 16 means you were a) one of the best ~30 teams all year to make the NCAA out of a power conference; and b) one of the top 16 teams in the country at the end of the year. The NIT is exactly what it is nicknamed. The Not [good enough to be] Invited [to the NCAA] Tournament. Period.

There is simply no equivalent b/t reaching any stage in the NIT and reaching any stage in the NCAA. Yes, it is better to be playing in the NIT this year for State than playing NO postseason basketball. You are seriously trying to place it on too high a pedastal if you are trying to claim that winning it is equal to making a Sweet 16 or even an Elite 8 (as some over on the scout.com board said). Personally I have my own theory as to why people are doing this and has to do with wanting to claim that Sidney has already passed the old coach by claiming some sort of NIT equivalency. In time, I have NO doubt he will, but I'm sure some people are dying to claim that right now for some reason..

[Edited on March 19, 2007 at 10:30 AM. Reason : x]

3/19/2007 10:29:24 AM

Yea but a lot of you aren't making the intuitive leap in logic required to understand my argument. An NIT bid is by no means better then an NCAA bid in any way or form and losing in the NCAA first round one year is better, IMO, then losing at any point in the NIT...ever. Now, consistently sucking ass in the first round of the NCAAT is shit and probably doesn't help recruiting that much but I can guarantee that going to the NCAA's 5 times in a row and 1 and outing is better for our image then going to the NIT five times in a row and even winning it all five times.

Its the perception of the NIT - only the teams that faltered during the year and were unable to win their conference tournaments (or are no names that overachieved) go to it. In that context, the NIT is a pretty much a LOLDONTFEELBAD tourney.

Now hows that fit with regards to our team? I personally am fucking thrilled that I got to watch NC State play a tournament game at Reynolds, regardless of how shitty the last five hours..er 3 mins of it was. Would I be just as happy doing it again next year with another NIT bid? Maybe. The year after that? No.

3/19/2007 10:34:52 AM

If we wanted NIT championships instead of NCAA bids and early outs, we would have hired Dave Odom. While the NIT champ is really better than the 66th, it still isn't a tourney bid for a major conference team. A strong NIT run will be a good outcome for us this year, but solid programs should count on NCAA bids every year, Sweet 16 appearances many years, and final four appearances now and then. I'm willing to call the NIT champ the ~45th best team in the country (behind the 34 at large bids, and 11 automatic bids from the ACC, Big East, Big 10leven, Big 12, SEC, Pac 10, MVC, CUSA-if it is Memphis, Mountain West, WAC, and WCC off the top of my head).

3/19/2007 10:46:53 AM

If we were content with being one (or two) and done in the NCAA tournament we wouldnt have run Herb off

not that the NIT is a step up...but its a necessary stepping stone

oh by the way...UNC has 1 NIT title....NCSU has zero...in case any of you care

3/19/2007 10:50:00 AM

1 and done

3/19/2007 10:58:18 AM

One and done

or revenge over Dominick Mejia, West Virginia, Florida State and Clemson

hmmmm

one loss that nobody outside of Raleigh cares about

or NC State's first ever NIT tournament while getting the chance to get revenge on multiple teams that defeated us in our only other contest vs them this year

hmmmmmmm

[Edited on March 19, 2007 at 11:06 AM. Reason : .]

3/19/2007 11:05:33 AM

It's like I said earlier. If we had beat teams like West Virginia, Florida State, and Clemson, we'd be in the NCAA tournament and wouldn't have the need for revenge.

As it stands, we didn't, and I'm excited about having the chance.

3/19/2007 11:14:49 AM

I would have to say that the first game of the season, the aspiration is obviously the NCAA's. BUT, after losing some tough games on the road and having our only senior hurt, I think that our run in the ACC tourney and a quality NIT showing, with a home game in Reynolds, is just as gratifying as losing the first round of the NCAAs on some court far away b/c we got screwed in the seeding.

3/19/2007 11:16:23 AM

Quote :

"Given all the stuff we endured this season, and all the stuff we were up against even at "full" strength, I'm okay with making the NIT. It's not the Big Dance and certainly nobody should aspire to make the NIT, but if the NIT is what you get then you at least want to perform well. Say we lose Monday -- it's not like anybody will say, "Let's stumble through another season and show that we CAN win the NIT next season!" The second this season ends the guys will be busting their tails, shooting for the '08 NCAAs."

quoted for truth

3/19/2007 11:18:33 AM

Quote :

"I'm so confused now. Our entire fanbase has pretty much claimed the last year that it's our birthright to be one of the college basketball elites. I don't have a problem with that and I think it's great to have that aspiration. However, that doesn't jive with the pedastal the NIT has been put on this year. In the past 10 years it's been a 'loser tournament' for teams not good enough. In fact there have been TONS of threads and people making fun of Dave Odom and USC for winning it. Winning the NIT is NO WHERE NEAR as prestigous or important as making the Sweet 16. I honestly have no clue how someone can think that. The Sweet 16 means you were a) one of the best ~30 teams all year to make the NCAA out of a power conference; and b) one of the top 16 teams in the country at the end of the year. The NIT is exactly what it is nicknamed. The Not [good enough to be] Invited [to the NCAA] Tournament. Period. There is simply no equivalent b/t reaching any stage in the NIT and reaching any stage in the NCAA. Yes, it is better to be playing in the NIT this year for State than playing NO postseason basketball. You are seriously trying to place it on too high a pedastal if you are trying to claim that winning it is equal to making a Sweet 16 or even an Elite 8 (as some over on the scout.com board said). Personally I ......blah blah blah...."

who in the hell ever said being in the NIT is better than being in the sweet 16 or elite 8?

The title of this thread is "Still playing in the NIT or 1 and done"

We arent glorfiying the NIT this year, but we are sticking by our team that showed tremendous improvement over the course of the season and started peaking about 2 weeks too late.

NyMnumbers, you try to over anyalyze the situation a bit too often.

Support The Pack, dammit.

3/19/2007 11:19:52 AM

Quote :

"Winning the NIT is NO WHERE NEAR as prestigous or important as making the Sweet 16"

Captain obvious #1, No one is disagreeing or even said as much on this thread. However one and done in the NCAA is not as good to me as winning the NIT, sweet 16 is obviously better than winning the NIT. However with regards to a one and done and winning the NIT, you are on ESPN 4 more times a year, and commentators in our situation always talk about the great job lowe has done with the horendous circumstances he's faced this season whereas I looked at a few teams one and done and did not even know they were in the tournament or see a single highlight.

Quote :

"I can guarantee that going to the NCAA's 5 times in a row and 1 and outing is better for our image then going to the NIT five times in a row and even winning it all five times"

2 points for captain obvious #2. No one has stated their content to go to the NIT for 5 straight years, everyone expects the NCAA next year, where did you read people making comments about multiple returns tot he NIT, and especially consecutive returns over the next 5 seasons.

Quote :

"but solid programs should count on NCAA bids every year, Sweet 16 appearances many years, and final four appearances now and then."

Show me the list of schools that have made the NCAAs for the last 12 seasons in a row and then tell me how many schools can realistically expect to make the NCAA every year, I don't think you will find even one member of the almighty ACC in this category. In fact, I believe DUke and UNC would only be 10 out of 12 the last 12 seasons. Dry spells are going to become more prevalent at the collegiate level especially witht he one and done players. What Hansbrough, Lawson, and Wright leave, or McRobert's for Duke. Not saying they won't reach the NCAA next season, but a sharp decline would certainly follow.


[Edited on March 19, 2007 at 11:32 AM. Reason : .]

3/19/2007 11:25:10 AM

I was at a client of our's open bar party friday night after work and left around 9:15. When asked why I was leaving I said I was going to watch my team play their NIT game. I was made fun of

3/19/2007 12:22:21 PM

Quote :

"winning the nit is better than losing in the 1st round of the ncaa as far as recruiting goes....as long as not making the ncaas is rare for your program."

NO. NCAA appearances>>>>NIT championships.

This thread is stupid. If you just make the NCAAs you had a successful season and had a CHANCE at the title.

3/19/2007 12:31:24 PM

lots of teams go one and done every year in the tournament

teams like Wright State, Charlotte and Old Dominion

clearly their annual one-and-done significantly helps their recruiting

3/19/2007 12:37:14 PM

the NCAAs are obviously gonna get everyones vote, but its crazy to say NIT champ is the 66th best team, at least until the NCAAs cut out this inviting every champion of every shitty little conference and giving them 16, 15, and 14 seeds and just starts inviting the best teams in the country based on their talent and SOS

3/19/2007 12:39:31 PM

I'd also like to see 3 more play in games for the 16 seeds but thats another story

3/19/2007 12:40:04 PM

Quote :

"Captain obvious #1, No one is disagreeing or even said as much on this thread."

Read page 1 again. And I read that all the time over on scout.com.

Quote :

"NyMnumbers, you try to over anyalyze the situation a bit too often. Support The Pack, dammit."

I'm not overanalyzing it at all and I'm not saying I'm not supporting the team for their NIT run. Just saying, generally, whether it's NC State we're talking about or not, making the NCAA FAR FAR FAR outweighs doing anything in the NIT. It's just the way it is..

Quote :

"the NCAAs are obviously gonna get everyones vote, but its crazy to say NIT champ is the 66th best team"

I was careful in my posts not to say that. From a power conference, making the NCAA means you are one of the top 30-35 teams in the country that year..

[Edited on March 19, 2007 at 12:49 PM. Reason : x]

3/19/2007 12:48:04 PM

Quote :

"I was at a client of our's open bar party friday night after work and left around 9:15. When asked why I was leaving I said I was going to watch my team play their NIT game. I was made fun of"

NOW THAT IS THE ONLY QUALITY POST ON THIS THREAD...HA HA

3/19/2007 1:05:56 PM

Quote :

"Captain obvious #1, No one is disagreeing or even said as much on this thread."

from page one

superchevy

Quote :

"i think winning the nit is on par with making the sweet sixteen."

I really can not believe that people are trying to say that still playing in the NIT is better than actually making it to the NCAA tournament. If we would have gotten a seeding of even 16 and had to play Florida or Ohio St. the first round would anyone have said "hey lets go to the NIT instead that way we have a chance to win games". No every single person here would have wanted us to go to the NCAA tournament no matter how bad we might get beat.

No one outside of the teams playing in the NIT care about it and winning it only gets you mocked by every team that made it to the NCAA tournament. Going to the NIT is not going to help recruiting because hopefully the players we are recruiting want to go the NCAA and not the NIT and making it to the NIT is not really going to sway them to come here.

Whether or not making it to the NIT this year is acceptable has no bearing on the prestige or rankings of the two the tournaments. Sure making it to the NIT is acceptable for this team I didn't expect us to make it to the NCAA tournament, but that doesn't make it better than making it to the NCAA.

Lets say we do win the NIT is anyone really going to brag about that? All someone has to say is "hey at least our team made it to the NCAA tournament".

3/19/2007 1:06:53 PM

Quote :

"Lets say we do win the NIT is anyone really going to brag about that?"

well it would be our first NIT ever

those tarhole faggots down the road have one...so we need a fucking NIT title just cause those cocklickers have one

3/19/2007 1:09:39 PM

no we dont

3/19/2007 1:10:54 PM

we dont need an NCAA title either

matter of fact, we dont need sports...this is an institution of higher learning

3/19/2007 1:14:12 PM

Quote :

"those tarhole faggots down the road have one...so we need a fucking NIT title just cause those cocklickers have one"

they also have sex with men... do we need to do that as well?

Also if we do win the NIT why don't you go up to the first Carolina fan you see and say "hey we won the the NIT" see if they don't laugh in your face.

3/19/2007 1:27:39 PM

exactly....i hate the "we have to do it because carolina did it" attitude people have.

we arent carolina, thank god.



[Edited on March 19, 2007 at 1:29 PM. Reason : d]

3/19/2007 1:29:25 PM

clearly having sex with men = winning a basketball title

they also have more NCAA titles than us...lets not want to win anymore NCAA titles since Carolina did

OMG Carolina beat Miami in football? Lets not try to beat Miami since we arent Carolina

[Edited on March 19, 2007 at 1:33 PM. Reason : .]

3/19/2007 1:32:48 PM

NIT is like having Major League talent in AAA. Sure, it's nice to be on the winning AAA team. But I'd rather be in the show on the worst MLB team.

That being said, I'd rather win the NIT than have a one-and-done in the NCAAs. But getting in the round of 32 in the NCAAs is better

3/19/2007 1:39:33 PM

btw I'm sure getting the shit smacked out of us by Texas last year really made some of those bubble recruits say "WOW I REALLY WANT TO GO TO NC STATE"

3/19/2007 1:41:14 PM

Quote :

"they also have more NCAA titles than us...lets not want to win anymore NCAA titles since Carolina did"

i know that's a joke, but that's how people at carolina think. they have a good basketball program so anyone who wants to have a good program just wants to be carolina. good god i hate them all.

3/19/2007 2:17:56 PM

Quote :

"goal is to make the tourney. if we do that, weve already surpasssed the herb era."

3/19/2007 2:45:03 PM

be glad the NIT gave us a chance for one more sweet game in reynolds

3/19/2007 3:31:09 PM

I don't think that anyone has said they'd rather have an NIT title than advance more than a round or two in the NCAA tourney...one and done is a different story

But RIGHT NOW we are in the NIT so lets enjoy the run...even though this isnt the real tourney, our season is still lasting longer than Maryland, Va Tech, etc...NIT isnt bad considering the scorers we lost last year and since many people picked us to finish last in the league...lets just enjoy where we are right now...lets go ahead and win this shitty tournament so we can do something that only 2 (well maybe 3 since consolation) teams will do this year...finish the season with a win

3/19/2007 4:05:45 PM

See you are missing the point of this thread. No one is saying that its bad we are in the NIT this year. I already said that I and most other people did not expect us to make it to the NCAA tournament. I'm glad we have won our games so far and I hope we win the NIT, but making it to the NCAA is better whether or not you lose your first game.

3/19/2007 4:12:35 PM

Nah I understand the point of the thread but think it got off track based on some peoples' misunderstanding of other people

everyone knows the NCAA > the NIT

but i think its a lot more impressive to win 5 straight post season games and the NIT tourney than it is to make the NCAA tourney and lose your first game by 20

course a lot of that depends on whats needed for each tourney...making the NCAA tourney means you've had a better season than making the NIT...however thats not always the case...its one thing if Florida or Kansas (this year) misses the NCAAs...its another if Syracuse or Drexel misses

3/19/2007 4:16:38 PM

yeah i'd much rather go to the tournament

but i enjoy it much more the way it is right now

3/19/2007 4:18:35 PM

this is not a conventional year. yeah it would've been better to qualify for the NCAA, but where we are is pretty good, and its exciting right now.

3/19/2007 5:13:01 PM

These types of questions are irrelevant, because you never know what games you will win or lose. I didn't think we had a chance to beat UNC this year, much less challenge them for the ACCT title, but we did. Now looking back, I think we could have actually 1 a game or two in the NCAAT. But...If you really want a comparison these 3-5 extra tournament games in the NIT are more valuable to our young team's development than a 1st round loss in the NCAAT would be. It also adds wins to our record rather than a loss.

3/19/2007 6:58:19 PM