^^ Ha yeah I remember the old NES days, when you almost expected half the games you bought to be total crap, and couldn't have cost more than a few thousand to make, and you still paid like $30 for them (which would probably be equivalent to $50 today).


My post count:



[Edited on November 13, 2007 at 3:51 PM. Reason : ]

11/13/2007 3:50:25 PM

^^I mean, I don't have any definitive proof. It might just be MS and Sony jewing all of us. But personally, I blame Gamestop/EB Games for the increase in price. Their whole trade in/buy back bullshit leads to basically everyone who doesn't buy a game day one buying it used from one of their stores instead. Hell, thats what I do. It's what made them the juggernaut of specialty game stores. But it also means that the game companies don't get a dime for all those games being bought used from Gamestop. So they figure they'll get us much money as they can from all the hardcore gamers who buy the games day one and don't care about the cost.

^^^Well one thing is that optical media is an order of magnitude cheaper to produce than cartridges, so that helps. Also, not every game was that cheap. Final Fantasy VII had a $40 million budget. Granted that was the exception, not the rule. Most games today definitely top out over a million dollars, and a lot of those goes into the marketing. Packaging for games and the amount of work that goes into the manual is crap. Remember those huge ass boxes we had for PC games and several hundred page manuals? The gaming market in general is so much bigger than it was in the 90s, so they can afford to keep prices the same simply because they are selling a lot more games than they used to.

11/13/2007 3:58:52 PM

Quote :

"^^I mean, I don't have any definitive proof. It might just be MS and Sony jewing all of us. But personally, I blame Gamestop/EB Games for the increase in price. Their whole trade in/buy back bullshit leads to basically everyone who doesn't buy a game day one buying it used from one of their stores instead. Hell, thats what I do. It's what made them the juggernaut of specialty game stores. But it also means that the game companies don't get a dime for all those games being bought used from Gamestop. So they figure they'll get us much money as they can from all the hardcore gamers who buy the games day one and don't care about the cost."

yeah I agree. What I do hate is how gamestop jews us when we trade in our games.

11/13/2007 4:01:13 PM

Sure, game development budgets have gone up, but the gaming population has increased since then, too--the first PlayStation brought gaming to the masses--so I'm pretty certain sales have gone up, too. I'm pretty sure that game developers and publishers are still turning a healthy profit.

11/13/2007 4:12:06 PM

^^^ I disagree with that. The price of games have gone up because it flat out costs a hell of a lot more to make them.

and with this whole in-game advertising (Madden, etc.), I just can't stand that. I would rather pay extra cash for a game than be subjected to the 'Under Armor" Red Zone stat shit. Anyway, I think we are getting off topic.

Don't think I'm going to even try out this game. If a buddy has it I'll play it or watch him play it, but there are just too many other titles right now.

11/13/2007 4:21:24 PM

Quote :

"and wth did all these previews on ign say it was this awesome amazing game, and then "oops, real review says it's not that fun""

They did the same thing with Lair. All I can say is that the review summed it up fairly well when they said that if you just play the first hour or two, you'd think it is a great game. Previews aren't the full game and something that's fun for the 30-60 minute demo, might suck for an entire game (see GTA in my opinion).

11/13/2007 4:24:45 PM

^^

Quote :

"^^^ I disagree with that. The price of games have gone up because it flat out costs a hell of a lot more to make them."

I don't think they've really gone up that much compared to other forms of media:

http://www.gamepro.com/gamepro/domestic/games/features/141348.shtml

Quote :

"The best argument for justifying $60 games is the inflation of other mass media entertainment. Since 1984, the average cost of a movie ticket has nearly doubled. A hardcover book costs 30-50 percent more than it did in the same year, and cable prices have nearly tripled for the same period. Console video games, by comparison, tarried at a steadfast $50 per game for more than 20 years."

[Edited on November 13, 2007 at 4:34 PM. Reason : ..]

11/13/2007 4:34:42 PM

I guess the reason I was wary of the 1up review is that they gave halo 3 10/10

11/13/2007 4:36:54 PM

hm I was really looking forward to this game...does being blown away for at least half of it warrant a purchase?

11/13/2007 6:48:13 PM

i think it warrants a rental

11/13/2007 11:51:17 PM

well, i'm guessing since it was released yesterday, and no one on my list was playing and there has been zero comments in here, everyone has completely ditched this game?

11/14/2007 7:46:57 AM

a guy posted at shacknews yesterday that said it was boring.

Which wouldnt be a big deal except a couple others with the game agreed with him.

He said:

"Each Assassination needs intel before you can go kill them. You basically climb up these high towers and synchronize your map. You will then see markers pop up on the map. You need a set # of "Required Intelligence" before you can activate the actual "boss" to assassinate. These could be anything from pick-pocketing some information, beating up a guy until he talks, eavesdropping from a bench. You then complete the required amount to activate the assassination. After you did those, you go to the Assassin's Bureau and get approval to assassinate this guy. Then you go and assassinate them.

Repeat x 9. It gets a little stale after #2. "


Hope that's off....

11/14/2007 7:51:53 AM

Technically its only hitting shelves today...so wait a little longer and I'm sure you'll hear something!

11/14/2007 7:52:47 AM

^^ Actually, that's what every single review says

We were hit with the hype hammer again

Time to tear up the credit card and pull out the blockbuster card from now on

[Edited on November 14, 2007 at 7:59 AM. Reason : .]

11/14/2007 7:59:26 AM

hmm i'm thinking i might stick with drake's fortune

11/14/2007 8:00:38 AM

fwiw, the gamespot jews gave it 9

http://www.gamespot.com/video/930278/6182851/assassins-creed-video-review

11/14/2007 8:50:50 AM

just came out today in stores. Going to pick up a copy and try it out. If its as boring as everyone says it is at least I will know for myself. I enjoyed prince of persia a lot and it seems very similar minus the alien monsters.

11/14/2007 9:11:48 AM

^ lemme know how it goes

...the video reviewer on ign was borderline hateful about it

11/14/2007 9:13:54 AM

will do.

11/14/2007 9:18:53 AM

Quote :

"there are just too many other titles right now."

such as? all i hear about is Halo 3, COD4, and pirated Mass Effects...

11/14/2007 12:08:54 PM

https://www.gameinformer.com/Games/Review/200712/R07.1106.0938.00452.htm

Quote :

" 9.5 Assassin’s Creed is the type of game that comes along only rarely – a title that innovates in so many areas it helps to set a new bar in various aspects of gameplay, storytelling, visuals, and controls. Simultaneously, it’s an imperfect game in which the small flaws that mar its sheen are all the more noticeable because so much of the rest of the game shines so brightly. Deep, engaging, and surprising from beginning to end, Assassin’s Creed’s merits will be debated for a long time. However, as a brave attempt at delivering something unique and audacious, it excels. The surprises start right off the bat, when you power on the game and spend several minutes second-guessing if they put the right disc in your case. Many of you will have already heard about this opening twist, but if not, I won’t be the one to ruin it for you. Suffice to say, the context in which you find yourself a medieval assassin is more complex than it appears. Once the real action gets going, you’ll wander a huge open world – three massive cities and the connecting countryside. It’s a strange mix of meticulous historical recreation and totally open level design. Climbing and leaping can get you to almost any place in the world – usually by any number of different paths. Hero Altaïr is as much ninja as medieval warrior as he goes about the grim business of hunting down evil men who are oppressing the people of the Holy Land. Rarely has a character without superpowers or magic been quite so powerful and exciting to vicariously inhabit, whether he’s perching on a high tower of the Acre Cathedral or countering the blows of a Templar knight. With its intuitive puppeteering button scheme, there’s a fundamental shift in play control at work. Where most games are primarily concerned with the question “Where do you want to go?”, Assassin’s Creed puts equal weight on “How do you want to get there?”. By designating all actions as high or low profile, movement becomes less about individual button presses and more about situational observation. Further, each face button is like a part of the body that changes contextually to match the situation. In a fight, your open hand button might grab a foe, but when running along rooftops the same button will reach for a distant ledge. While seemingly a minor variation on a familiar theme, this approach to control is one of the game’s greatest triumphs. Through a long and complex narrative, you’ll repeatedly play through what might be loosely called levels. This gameplay arc is split into several components. The first involves the journey to and exploration of a location, followed by an investigation of the target. With the knowledge gleaned, you’ll finally make the hazardous approach to your well-protected victim to complete the murderous deed, before sprinting away to safety. While this design is a lot of fun, it eventually feels mildly repetitive – particularly the investigations. More variety in these activities would have been welcome. When you’re ready for a break from the story, a huge number of collectibles are scattered through the game – over 400 hard-to-find pick-ups and 60 secondary assassinations. It’s a great addition only marred by the fact that none of these collectibles ever yield any genuine reward beyond Gamer Points and Achievements. If only to experience the unique world and amazing movement and combat, gamers owe it to themselves to try Ubisoft’s big holiday release. Its stunning visual style, high concept story, and wildly open level design are like nothing else, even if too much repetition begins to frustrate in the later hours. It’s a game people will still be talking about five years from now. Come to think of it, they may have a lot more to talk about by then. -MATT MILLER Second Opinion JOE JUBA 9.5 Taking a life is not a task to be accepted lightly. While some games trivialize the act, none infuse it with haunting gravity more elegantly than Assassin’s Creed. As you guide Altaïr through his missions, the game transforms you into an angel of death; the puppeteering control scheme and cinematic camera makes every kill feel significant, and every leap of faith a triumph. The gameplay can instantly transform from careful, measured movement to a heart-pounding escape with a dozen city guards on your trail. The chase is enhanced by the seamless integration of free-running, which has you traversing towering spires and residential districts in exhilarating ways you have to see to believe. With its excellent mechanics and surprising story, the only area where Assassin’s Creed leaves itself vulnerable is in the variety of environments and investigation missions. The crowds and architecture provide endless opportunities for experimentation, however, so there are always ways to stay entertained. Death is an inevitable part of life, so make sure you cross Assassin’s Creed off of your to-do list before your time comes. Sooner would be better than later."

[Edited on November 14, 2007 at 2:12 PM. Reason : b]

11/14/2007 2:12:24 PM

^ hm i still dunno

11/14/2007 2:14:57 PM

just picked up a copy at lunch...can't wait to get home and try it

[Edited on November 14, 2007 at 2:26 PM. Reason : asdf]

11/14/2007 2:26:00 PM

At this point I've read so many negative reviews, as long as the game plays I'll probably enjoy it

Besides, I have a feeling most of you will tear it up by the time I get mine. Hit shelves on 14th, liongames ships on the 16th, 5 days shipping

I'm gonna be about a week behind on this and Mass Effect...guess it gives me enough time to beat bioshock since I rented that, lol

11/14/2007 2:29:18 PM

somebody play this and let me know how it is

11/14/2007 2:41:56 PM

I'm think ^^^ is going to be our first reviewer

11/14/2007 2:44:51 PM

I think the hype definately got a hold of this one... I think this is more of a rental game especially if the replay is non-existant.

11/14/2007 2:46:44 PM

I'll post a review as soon as I get home. and then a updated review a few hours in.

11/14/2007 2:55:31 PM

let me know something before 5pm. if you don't like it i may hold off on picking up my copy at gamestop.

11/14/2007 3:22:34 PM

I doubt he gets off before 5

11/14/2007 3:35:52 PM

REPLAY:
High

so says that review :X

11/14/2007 3:38:37 PM

I usually get off around 5 so it will be after that before I can post a review.

11/14/2007 3:45:46 PM

I played through up to the first real assassination kill.

So far the controls did not take very long to get used to.
Sneaking at absurdly slow speeds to not get noticed is ridiculous. Apparently you'll be noticed if you walk like everyone else around you.

combat system takes some getting used to as it is a lot of timed fighting.

i don't see a lot of free range travelling at the moment, very linear.

there are a number of "collect X flag of this type" (so far 3 different types, the achievement imply somewhere between 6-8 different types though.

Unlike the reviews I read of it I didn't feel extremely clumsy after long which was a primary concern.

I do not like having to hold the left thumbstick to walk and the A button to blend. Both while walking and on horseback.

Cities are fairly large, but the dialogue gets quickly repetitive for missions (i suppose this could be to let you know that the specific mission type is nearby if you're on rooftop)

So far I've had fun with it, need more time to know just how linear the game will be and what replay value there will be.

11/14/2007 4:22:45 PM

hows the wall climbing etc? is that pretty linear or as the deverlopers diary stated...climb on anything thats 3d

11/14/2007 4:42:39 PM

i'm not going to buy it tonight. i'm going to stick with cod4 and read this again tomorrow.

11/14/2007 5:13:07 PM

i think i'm going to wait now after hearing all the negative things being said

mucho disappointing, this one

11/14/2007 6:13:46 PM

For anyone awaiting a positive review from someone reliable, Gabe at Penny Arcade just posted a pretty good review (and also stated why he thought it was getting some sub par reviews).

11/14/2007 6:18:33 PM

Cons: First cut scene is way too long. I've been waiting for sometime now ~5 min and haven't even started playing.

11/14/2007 7:27:36 PM

^^don't post a link or anything

[Edited on November 14, 2007 at 7:28 PM. Reason : ^^]

11/14/2007 7:28:20 PM

very good in depth tutorial. alot to take in but it really helps you better understand the game controls.

11/14/2007 7:34:51 PM

didn't read up on the story before hand but apparently it involves a lot of science fiction/present day story line. Very curious about the story now and where it leads.

Initial reaction to the controls/enviorment. Its very very similar to prince of persia. Before you get to a new area/room/tower to climb...the camera pans out and shows you the whole structure or area before you start interacting with it...just like prince of persia minus the flash forward stuff.

Fighting is really cool although i haven't fully grasped the controls for it. I can't seem to block consistently yet. It is a fun game. Very slow start. I have been playing since I got home and have yet to actually really get started. Played the first intro mission and just now completed it. It seemed very scripted and you really only have one choice to do. Kind of like watching a movie with a controller in your hand.

11/14/2007 8:23:51 PM

actually now that I think about it, i'd be more interested to hear a review once one of you guys has gotten a few hours deep into the game to like the 4th or 5th assassination

11/14/2007 9:44:13 PM

i'm probably about 6-8 hours into the game now. first 2 assassinations down, on the third city now. spent a lot of time exploring out the view points (where you unlock the map).

you can climb on just about anything 3d, they do a good job of letting you see enough that you can tell if you can actually climb on something or not.

combat takes some getting used to still, i unlocked the counter attack and just use that for the most part, the combo is somewhat difficult to attack with.

11/14/2007 10:03:11 PM

interesting take on the reviews from gabe @ penny arcade

Quote :

"I want to talk about Assassins Creed but first I need to get something out of the way. I have a lot to say about the game and I want to talk about some of the bad reviews it's getting but I want to make sure everyone understands I'm not saying this because of the comic we did for them. So I'm going to link you to an old set of news posts about Prince of Persia 2. Feel free to read those and come back if you like. Now I'm going to tell you how advertising on PA works. Every other game site out there takes ads for whatever game they can get. It doesn't matter if it's a pile of crap, if the publisher pays for the spot IGN or Gamespot or whoever will run the ad. That's fine but that's not how we do it and the news posts you just read are part of the reason why. We were huge fans of the first Prince of Persia game so when Ubi came to us and wanted to run ads for the second we said yes. We had no idea they were going to completely fuck it over. So from then on we started demanding playable copies of games before we'd agree to advertising. No matter how early the build we tell the publishers that unless we can see it played in front of us or play it ourselves we won't run ads for it. Obviously a lot can still go wrong during development but we make the best decisions we can. We do not think of the ads you see on our page as ads. They are recommendations and we try extremely hard to insure that anything we put over there is worth your time. When Prince of Persia 2 came out and we saw that it was crap we said as much on the site. Ads for the game appeared right next to those news posts slamming it. Needless to say Ubi wasn't very happy and Robert got some angry phone calls but our loyalty is to our readers not the people paying the bills. We explained to Ubi that the reason our ads perform better than any other site out there is because our readers trust us and that means we have to admit when something we advertise doesn't turn out as good as we hoped. Obviously they understood because we're still advertising their games but like I said this isn't the way other sites operate. I actually give Ubi a lot of credit for not just telling us to fuck off and buying more ads on IGN and Gamespy with the extra money. I'm telling you all this because I want you to understand that if Assassins Creed actually was a 7.0 game I'd tell you. I also want you to know that when I tell you it's fucking incredible I'm not bullshitting you because we're running ads for the game. There are about four or five reviews of the game with scores in the low to mid 7's. I want to cover some of the common complaints these reviewers had in case anyone out there is worried about them. Many of the reviews say that the ending is bad. Obviously I don't want to give away any spoilers but I will say that the final confrontation was exciting and gratifying. It was an extremely satisfying ending to this chapter of the game. Chapter is the important word here. This is a huge story, probably a trilogy at least. The game does end with a cliff hanger and it certainly sets up the rest of the arc but that's how the first part of any multi part story ends. If Star Wars had ended with Luke jumping into his X-Wing to go take on the Death Star that would be a shitty fucking ending. It doesn't though, Luke destroys it and then we get hints about what's in store for our heroes. I'm telling you right now Altair destroys his Death Star. I also can't be 100% positive but I'm guessing that some of these reviewers didn't let the credits role. Again, I don't want to spoil anything but wait for the credits to end. Until reviewers start posting their Gamertags along with the review we'll never really be able to tell how much of a game they played. But I'd be willing to bet some of them are missing the "Visions of the Future" achievement. I'm not gonna say why but If you don't have this achievement you can't say jack shit about the ending. I think the biggest complaint I saw was that the missions become repetitive and boring. I actually didn't understand this complaint at all until just the other day. I had gotten an early copy of the game just like everyone else in the media but I was just playing it for fun. I'd cracked into it over the weekend and when I got into the office on Monday I started seeing these negative reviews. When I saw the low scores I was actually really upset and I wanted to talk about the game here on the site. I wanted to tell everyone that these guys were full of shit. However, since so many of the complaints were based on the ending I wanted to beat it first so I was sure I wasn't missing anything. I attacked the game again but this time with the goal of beating it as fast as I could. I was determined to get a post up on Tuesday and I was pushing through the game as fast as I could. I went from finding every high perch in a district to only getting the ones I needed to advance the story. I stopped saving every citizen and avoided any unnecessary confrontations. The informer missions that I had really enjoyed before, I now avoided because I knew they took too long to complete. I did the bare minimum of missions to progress the story and anything that "hindered" my progress was frustrating. Monday night after skipping over another combat (something I used to really enjoy) I stopped myself. What the fuck was I doing? I wasn't playing the game because I wanted to I was playing it because I had a deadline and I needed to beat it. I stopped immediately and decided I'd write about the game whenever I got around to beating it. I spent another day and a half with it and during that time I hunted for hidden flags and explored the cities again. I came in this morning and finally did beat it but I did it at my own pace and I enjoyed every part of it. Imagine what an open ended sandbox title must look like to a reviewer especially right now. How many games do they have piling up on their desks? A game like Assassins creed isn't meant to be played under a deadline. You shouldn't be trying to beat it as fast as you can so you can move on to Mass Effect or Mario Galaxy. As soon as I gave myself a deadline all of a sudden I understood all their complaints. It was like a fucking Escher painting. I had put myself in their shoes and suddenly the landscape flipped and I could see games from their perspective. In the end I wasn't angry at them for their bad reviews. I actually just felt bad for them."

http://www.penny-arcade.com/

11/14/2007 11:03:59 PM

^ pretty good....I think a lot of the complaints raised are really dependent on the gamer's personality

...if you look back at hitman 2 and 3, there was a lot of the same repetitive dialog, dumbass AI who would just walk unknowingly into obvious traps, and many of the same stuff people complain about here....the difference was, at least to me, it was still absolutely fun as shit, no matter what

11/14/2007 11:18:25 PM

completed 1st assasination. So far so good. I am really enjoying the game now. At first it was a bit slow but the main purpose intended was to learn the controls. Story is evolving and is very intriguing. Still haven't a clue WTF is going on etc.

Getting better at the combat and I am really liking it. Not too complicated but still very entertaining. It is a bit repetative within 1 city when you have to climb several towers to get a 'map sync' accomplished...but at the same time the climbing is fun and the view is stunning. Also you have to save citizens from these goons every now and then and its pretty much the same thing over and over again. The point of saving the citizen is to unlock future help in that particular area. For example: If you save 1 citizen the near by citizens will help you if you need to escape the guards by blocking their path for you. So its really not a requirement to do but it does come in handy when being pursued.

Also some of the other side missions to gather clues are pretty cool but again, repetitive. You either have to sit on a bench and ease drop. Follow someone and pickpocket them. Follow someone until they're down a dark alley and beat them up for information. I can see where some of the negative reviews have come from just from this alone. Although so far its still 'fun'.

Riding a horse is a lot of fun too and its probably the most realistic horse riding animation/controls i've seen in a game. Oblivion's horse riding sucked hardcore compared to this.

Graphics: A+ Awesome visual effects, environments, characters, cloth, cities etc.

More to come soon. I have yet to travel to other cities so maybe the missions change. Also traveling to other cities is very similar to oblivion where you are pretty much riding your horse out in the open country until you get to your destination. But the traveled distance isn't nearly as far and there are cool hidden objects to collect along the way. I'm guessing for unlocking new moves/gamerscore achievements etc.

11/14/2007 11:19:12 PM

^ keep em coming

11/14/2007 11:36:46 PM

agreed. def keep updating us on what you're doing

11/15/2007 12:58:15 PM

Through Acre and Jerusalem the missions remain mostly the same, the boss fights are the only bit that really variate. I'm about to start the 4th part though when I get home today. Hopefully get some more variation. Then I'll probably go back and scour down all the different missions in each area.

I've missed 2 missions in both Acre and Jerusalem now

11/15/2007 1:21:47 PM

Ill be playing again after work. The way I am playing is completing every mission in each area in detail so that I don't miss anything and I can also better review the game and its full content.

I'll post an update after I complete the next mission/assassination later today

11/15/2007 1:25:38 PM