I got pulled because I was really used to driving a car with automatic headlights and all that. I was in a really well lit area and didn't really notice that I just had the running lights/dash lights on but not the head lights (one more click of the nob) and immediately blue lights went on behind me.

Luckily I hadn't had anything to drink or anything and they didn't write me a ticket- they seemed disappointed I was sober.

3/26/2008 12:19:22 AM

Quote :

"i wouldn't expect a private security company to have more "rights" than the police. unless its on some kind of private property where you have to sign away your rights or something."

Well, i guess it depends on the person.

The way I look at it is that a hour of a cop searching my car is as much or maybe more of an inconvenience to him, as it is to me, and i'd have a pretty smug look when he didn't find anything. But i've never done drugs and don't drink, so there's practically no chance of him finding something on me. And unless I was going to a job interview or my mom's deathbed, i really don't mind being late to work/class for a cop searching me.

And for most (actually all, but I only know 3 people that have been asked to search and refused) people I know that have refused a search, the cop dicks around in his car for a few minutes, and lets them go (because they know it's probably a waste of time). So it's a THREAT of time wasting, but for most people, nothing bad will happen that probably wasn't going to happen anyway.

Quote :

"if you refuse a search most cops find a way to do it anyway (or as I said earlier an illegial search becomes your problem to prove). Also I read some were that 80% of dui's come from a driver not breaking any (moving) traffic laws, but they get caught with a headlight, breaklight, or a plate light out."

^ for my friend, he was driving home, was pulled for a busted tail light, the cop asked if he was drinking, and he admitted he was, the cop made him blow, and he blew a .08 . And this guy was lucky that the cop didn't find anything. If he had deflected the question (because you don't have to answer it, but you shouldn't really lie), he'd more than likely have been okay, and just got the ticket for a bum light.

And despite horror stories, you'd probably be more likely to be able to prove an illegal search than not, if you do everything right.

[Edited on March 26, 2008 at 12:22 AM. Reason : ]

3/26/2008 12:21:04 AM

60% of dui's come from popeyes (a headlight you don't know is out), for them its like winning on a a scratch off ticket (sir your lights out, oh by the way you appear to be drunk).

3/26/2008 12:22:08 AM

Quote :

"Well, i guess it depends on the person."

And the place. You want to refuse a random search at an airport?

3/26/2008 12:24:02 AM

^ as the video notes, airports are a different story

[Edited on March 26, 2008 at 12:26 AM. Reason : seriously that video is fairly thorough]

3/26/2008 12:26:33 AM

even when i was doing bad things, i never carried stuff on me in the car. cause if you're ever gonna get caught with something, thats where it would be. and the cops know that shit, which is why they push so hard to search cars. i always said no cause i could, not cause i had something to hide.

but thinking back on it, i feel kinda dumb for going to jail twice just because i got into a pissing contest with RPD and wouldnt let them just search my car. its just hard for me to waive my rights - even if i have nothing to hide.

btw, the last time i got arrested due to not letting the cops search - we told the judge what happened, and he got pissed and threw the charges out and said he didn't want to see that in his courtroom again. it was a small moral victory but still not worth a night in jail and whatever bond money i paid

3/26/2008 12:29:29 AM

Quote :

"so there's practically no chance of him finding something on me. And unless I was going to a job interview or my mom's deathbed, i really don't mind being late to work/class for a cop searching me."

This is what I hate about this argument, because you're basically agreeing with the whole I won't deny a search unless I'm doing something wrong. You have the right to deny a search in theory at any time if there is no practical reason (being pulled over/stoping at a check point don't count as valid reasons).

More evidence for guilty until proven innocent.

[Edited on March 26, 2008 at 12:37 AM. Reason : .]

3/26/2008 12:30:36 AM

Yeah, which goes back to my problem with them even asking to perform a warrantless search in the first place. I'm not saying they shouldn't, I just have somewhat mixed feelings about the practice. It's naive to think that it's not more probing and coercive than many people claim. Simply asking it gives them information- either permission to search or some information about you personally if and how you refuse.

3/26/2008 12:37:23 AM

^ I personally would deny a search all the time, but I can understand the stress of being in one of those situations would cause someone to comply with a search. Outside of something life/death like that, i'm pretty laid back enough to where a cop just pulling me for speeding or something asking to search my car wouldn't freak me out.

^^^ i'm sure you've explained the whole thing behind that, but one critical aspect is to keep your temper in check. Don't shout/bitch at the cops, say sir and stuff like that.

^^ well, the thing is, the cops are very careful with their wording, and they're also very aggressive. What kind of put it in perspective for me was that in the video, they pointed out that it's basically the cop's job to bust you and everyone for whatever he can. So he's going to say things and be deceitful, but usually stay within the bounds of the law. It's kind of like talking to a used car salesman or something. They might pretend they're your friend or whatever, but you've got to decode whatever they say to what they are really getting at (like my friend guessed maybe the cop thought he smelled like alcohol so he answered the question, where he probably asks that to everyone esp at 2 AM). So a cop is going to make it seem like you're going to get raped in the ass fi you don't comply, but it's his job to sell that idea to you, not to educate you on the laws of our great country and what your rights are. It's YOUR job to know your rights, and usually, a cop won't dick you over when you do (because he can't).

[Edited on March 26, 2008 at 12:45 AM. Reason : ]

3/26/2008 12:40:13 AM

Quote :

"i'm pretty laid back enough to where a cop just pulling me for speeding or something asking to search my car wouldn't freak me out."

i just dont understand that mentality. i don't want strangers going through my shit, period. especially strangers who are currently being paid by my tax dollars to fight crime... and not waste an hour digging through a car instead of disarming robbers.

its pretty much as simple as that. but i'm a cynic i guess.

3/26/2008 12:43:01 AM

^ i'm not saying i'd let him search my car, i'm saying i'd be perfectly comfortable refusing a search and not get nervous or anxious.

IOW, i wouldn't be intimidated by his BS.

[Edited on March 26, 2008 at 12:46 AM. Reason : ]

3/26/2008 12:45:51 AM

oh, yeah, there's no reason to get nervous. but, once again, you get into that whole thing where the cop is gonna take confidence as disrespect... just like they take non-compliance as guilt. so if you dont squirm a little, then you're definitely a seasoned criminal.

pretty much, once the cop's mind is set on searching you, he/she has already decided that you are a criminal... and there's no way you can act that will reverse that.

but i hear ya

3/26/2008 12:50:58 AM

^ yeah I guess I can see that.

But on the flip side, i'm a minority (not black though), so I pretty much assume he thinks i'm a criminal anyway

3/26/2008 12:59:18 AM

^^ ^

Well I was on my way to an interview and I think refusing a search (even if I was somehow managed to get where I needed to be and on time) would preclude me from employment. Had it been a cop (and I was pulled for speeding about 10 miles earlier) I would have complied as well because:

I wouldn't want him making me late
I was honest about where I was going, and even if he let me go after refusing a serach I knew he'd contact them. Come on, guy heading to nuclear facilities and doesn't want his car searched? Oh I would have had big hands with rubber gloves digging up my ass then.

The thing about how much of a threat the loss of time is- it's not depending on the person as much as it is the situation. Say you'd been late for a job (that you happened to like) a couple times and were told the next time you'd be fired. It's not right to be put in such a position where to keep your job you might have to cede your constitutional rights. I don't know many of my employers who'd accept "I refused to let my car be searched" as an excuse for being late. I know some former employers that would have probably fired me for knowing I had or would refuse a police search. They're the minority of course.

3/26/2008 1:00:56 AM

Quote :

" I don't know many of my employers who'd accept "I refused to let my car be searched" as an excuse for being late. I know some former employers that would have probably fired me for knowing I had or would refuse a police search."

See, maybe it's just me, but I'd think most places would be more lenient if a cop searched your car. It's better than "i had a flat tire."

3/26/2008 1:08:02 AM

Oh yeah, more lenient if the cop searched- but not as much if you were held up while you refused the search and they hassled you. People think they'll have more of their time wasted if they refuse- I'm not sure though since I've never had a COP ask that.

3/26/2008 1:12:08 AM

^ oh you will, it becomes a situation were denying a search becomes a you're hiding something. Pretty much as soon as you deny a search your guilty of something, until you can show otherwise.

3/26/2008 1:19:45 AM

^ it's the cops job to presume you're guilty. He just can only act on that within the law. It's really not that big of a deal, because it's his job.

3/26/2008 1:37:49 AM