page 2...cant wait for sunday media to analyze this shit...monday is gonna be a good news day...i hope he gives a speak that clearly states his opinion like last time...hes good at articulating shit...makes him look presidential and shit...unlike some people lol

4/13/2008 5:26:06 AM

I think the majority of the people Obama is speaking about won't vote for him.

so who gives a fuck.

4/13/2008 8:29:44 AM

^if by majority you mean the majority of the people in the nation, then I agree with you.

Outside of NY and Los Angeles and a handful of other large cities, America is Pro-Gun, and religious. And Obama is clearly out of touch with these Americans values.

4/13/2008 11:22:35 AM

He has too much time left to continue to make mistakes. How many more "what I meant to say" and "I think I have been consistant with my views on..." speeches will he have to do?

I think there is no doubt he will win the nomination, but probably lose the general. Americans seem to wise up when it comes to presidential elections. I think most realize that we cant afford this guy, literally. However, we are breeding more gimmecrats so eventually that will change. I just hope not anytime soon.

4/13/2008 11:41:05 AM

Yeah, we need the fiscal responsibility of McCain, a guy who claims he'll cut the deficit just like Reagan did!!!

Quote :

"When Senator John McCain was asked here this afternoon how he plans to balance the budget, he said that he hoped to do so by stimulating economic growth – and approvingly cited the example of President Ronald Reagan. There was one thing he did not mention during his response: the deficit nearly tripled during the Reagan presidency, partly due to tax cuts and increases in military spending. "

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/04/09/asked-about-the-economy-mccain-cites-reagans-example/

O WAIT.

4/13/2008 11:49:48 AM

^^^ being pro-gun/religion and understanding how they can be misused when added with anger and confusion are two different things.

the majority of the people who dont understand this will be voting republican anyways or dont even vote.

[Edited on April 13, 2008 at 11:54 AM. Reason : .]

4/13/2008 11:54:10 AM

Quote :

"it's not that people react to hardship with bitterness and gun purchases, it's that people vote for their interest issues before they vote on economy because no one ever goes to bat for them for economics."

a) I'm not buying this back-pedaling, I'm no longer inclined to give Obama a free pass.
b) This still misses the point. Guns and religion are tools of independence. While I myself am an agnostic, I can clearly see the value of appealing to a higher, righteous power, when faced with the challenges of trying to live as independently as possible. Guns are supremely useful tools to the independent man. It can be a source of protein and it can be a source of self-preservation.

Quote :

"Here's a radical thought - some people out there genuinely don't think it's Washington's job. (The horrors!) In that sense, Obama's sin isn't elitism, it's hubris - the hubris of thinking everyone buys into the same value system that he does."

Exactly. This seems dangerously backwards to someone who tosses their lot in with "the system"* and is also a hard group for politicians to buy, which is why they're generally underrepresented and misunderstood.

Its ok though, they know they'll never have anyone stand up for them, they know that they'll be mocked by suburbanites, they just want to be left alone with their freedoms to live life as they see fit. That would be the original American dream. Not this house and 2.5 kids crap that was sold to us in the 50s.




* and I use this very broadly simply to name the quasi-centralized, industrialized infrastructure of early 21st century America that satisfies the wants of the consumer.



and for Socks``

4/13/2008 11:56:12 AM

^So.... would rural people would rather live in log cabins in the woods and go back to the hunter/gatherer lifestyle? It's not a question of independence--someone asked why "rural folk" don't support him at a town hall and he tried to answer it honestly: because they care about economic issues but nothing ever gets changed, so they vote on social issues instead, which are usually more in line with conservatives. Which is true. But praying isn't going to get these people jobs.

4/13/2008 2:16:12 PM

Quote :

"^So.... would rural people would rather live in log cabins in the woods and go back to the hunter/gatherer lifestyle?"

There are some who would.

I think the majority just want to have an honest job and live their lives the way they want. They distrust the Democrat party because they generally don't want hand-outs and don't want some well-meaning but ultimately ignorant and condescending liberal to swoop in and save them from their ignorance. They would like an honest shot at life, which is where they distrust Republicans and free-trade.

My problem is with the way he phrased it when he was talking to people who can't seem to fathom why these backwards hillbillies just don't "get it" give up their guns, get rid of their faith, and climb aboard the great shining steamroller of progress. He made it seem like guns and God were a last resort for hopeless people left behind (as opposed to traditions they had inherited, and clung to in the absence of economic prosperity) and the great citizens of Marin, Co California had a duty to vote for him so that he could save them from their ignorance.

4/13/2008 2:31:55 PM

In response to ^

There's a great essay from way back when that applies probably more today than it did then:

Quote :

"The type and formula of most schemes of philanthropy or humanitarianism is this: A and B put their heads together to decide what C shall be made to do for D. The radical vice of all these schemes, from a sociological point of view, is that C is not allowed a voice in the matter, and his position, character, and interests, as well as the ultimate effects on society through C's interests, are entirely overlooked. I call C the Forgotten Man. For once let us look him up and consider his case, for the characteristic of all social doctors is that they fix their minds on some man or group of men whose case appeals to the sympathies and the imagination, and they plan remedies addressed to the particular trouble; they do not understand that all the parts of society hold together, and that forces which are set in action act and react throughout the whole organism, until an equilibrium is produced by a readjustment of all interests and rights. They therefore ignore entirely the source from which they must draw all the energy which they employ in their remedies, and they ignore all the effects on other members of society than the ones they have in view. They are always under the dominion of the superstition of government, and, forgetting that a government produces nothing at all, they leave out of sight the first fact to be remembered in all social discussion — that the state cannot get a cent for any man without taking it from some other man, and this latter must be a man who has produced and saved it. This latter is the Forgotten Man. "

http://www.mises.org/story/2485

[Edited on April 13, 2008 at 5:45 PM. Reason : .]

4/13/2008 5:44:35 PM

Quote :

"You know, he [Bush] wants to divide us over race. I'm from the South. I understand this. This quota deal they're gonna pull in the next election is the same old scam they've been pulling on us for decade after decade after decade. When their economic policies fail, when the country's coming apart rather than coming together, what do they do? They find the most economically insecure white men and scare the living daylights out of them. They know if they can keep us looking at each other across a racial divide, if I can look at Bobby Rush and think, Bobby wants my job, my promotion, then neither of us can look at George Bush and say, 'What happened to everybody's job? What happened to everybody's income? What ... have ... you ... done ... to ... our ... country?'""

- Bill Clinton, 2001

Quote :

"If [Republicans] could cut funding for Medicare, Medicaid, education, and the environment, middle-class Americans would see fewer benefits from their tax dollars, feel more resentful paying taxes, and become even more receptive to their appeals for tax cuts and their strategy of waging campaigns on divisive social and cultural issues like abortion, gay rights, and guns."

- Bill Clinton, 2004

4/13/2008 8:14:47 PM

yeah but bill clinton is white so its ok

4/13/2008 8:49:04 PM

people gettin all PC and shit on Obama.

lighten up.

we all know you love guns and religion and know nothing about higher learning because you're too busy reading the bible and cleaning your rifle.

4/13/2008 9:29:12 PM

LOL!

Dude like it or not but Obama is not backing down and is returning the heat on this PC gotcha politicking bullshit.

Watch this video from today, especially at 4:15 mark....dude i was totally suprised he went into that but I could not stop laughing. The line about Clinton in 'duck blinds every day' had me rolling. Whether you support him or not, you have to give him credit for calling her out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NIxmi3e2Vmo



[Edited on April 13, 2008 at 10:54 PM. Reason : ]

4/13/2008 10:26:26 PM

Kay_Yow

None of those Bill Clinton quotes are anyting like what Obama said (the second quote is even less relevant than the first). Clinton is clearly saying that Republicans want to play off people's economic and racial insecurities for their own political advantage (I think that's an over statement but whatever).

Obama was saying that small town ppl in PA "cling" to guns and God because they are "bitter" about not having good jobs. Sounds like two totally different statements because they are. One is a description of how Republican political strategy appeals to our most base fears, the other is an attempt to explain why some people believe what they believe.

And that's why a lot of people take are taking offense. No one wants to be told that they are only religious because they are "bitter" over being poor. And that's what Obama said regardless of whether he meant to say it.

PS*
You also screwed up the dates. That first quote is from 1991 not 2001. I guess, that's what you get for copying and pasting things from blogs you feel too ashamed to link to.

[Edited on April 14, 2008 at 4:24 AM. Reason : ``]

4/14/2008 4:06:02 AM

PPS* JCASHFAN

Thanks for the video. DBT kicks total ass. They're comming through Chapel Hill next month and you better believe I will be there.

4/14/2008 4:42:06 AM

I know some of you that are experiencing Obamagasms don't want to hear it, but this story has legs--the portrait of Obama becomes clearer still. And Hillary wants to keep it alive:

Clinton keeps alive Obama's comments about bitter voters in small towns

Quote :

"SCRANTON, Pa. (AP) — Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton tried to portray herself as an ally of the middle class on Sunday by keeping alive Barack Obama's comments about bitter voters in small towns while taking her campaign door to door in her late father's boyhood hometown. She said Obama's words were 'elitist and divisive' and warranted further explanation. Obama has been on the defensive for telling a private audience in California that economically frustrated people in small towns get bitter and 'cling to guns or religion' to express their feelings. Obama since has said he could have chosen better words and that he regretted offending anyone. Clinton didn't think that was enough. 'Senator Obama has not owned up to what he said and taken accountability for it,' she told reporters during an informal news conference outside a home. 'What people are looking for is an explanation. What does he really believe? How does he see people here in this neighborhood, throughout Pennsylvania, Indiana, North Carolina, other places in our country? And I think that's what people are looking for, some explanation, and he has simply not provided one.' Clinton also said Obama's comments feed into long-held stereotypes of the Democratic Party as being out of touch with regular people, suggesting the party may have a tough time winning the election in November if Obama becomes the nominee. 'I think his comments were elitist and divisive,' she said, noting the party's battles with the perception that it is out of touch [emphasis added]. 'You don't have to think back too far to remember that good men running for president were viewed as being elitist and out of touch with the values and the lives of millions of Americans,' she added, referring to John Kerry, the defeated 2004 Democratic nominee [emphasis and Ha-ha! added]. 'I think it's very critical that the Democrats really focus in on this and make it clear that we are not (elitist). We are going to stand up and fight for all Americans,' Clinton said."

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5g-qGLDs-gAnZiUXD2NU51ry3j3dwD901DFV00

And if Obama didn't say anything wrong, why is he expressing regret for what he said?

Obama expresses regret for remarks on small towns

Quote :

"'Obviously, if I worded things in a way that made people offended, I deeply regret that,' he told the Winston-Salem Journal of North Carolina."

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-na-obama13apr13,1,6505389.story

4/14/2008 6:02:34 AM

that was earlier in the weekend. Look, she's overplaying this and you'll see. She's desperate, no pathetically lashing out desperate, to damage him any way she can. Scouring over each and every word. All the while grandpa McBush sits around and has his press person say dumb ignorant shit backing her up. Hillary and the republican alliance is sickening.

This picture will sum up what I think will happen in this situation. And there's already hints of it.

4/14/2008 7:37:27 AM

^ WTF with the "grandpa McBush"? Had to get the stupid little shot in, didn't you? McCain isn't having to do shit, Obama's making his own problems--and every time he does, the picture gets clearer.

In any event, when I posted the first article it was only five hours old. FYI.

4/14/2008 7:46:34 AM

HC is pretty stupid

4/14/2008 8:28:35 AM

^^ hooksaw having a problem with nicknames? Last I checked, you couldn't go 2 posts without inserting some stupid little nickname you heard on Rush or O'Reilly
Reverend Wrong, Obamagasms, defeatocrats

4/14/2008 8:50:04 AM

Also there's a big difference between apologizing for wording and apologizing for a message

He didn't back down from the message

4/14/2008 8:55:12 AM

Here's what I'm confused about... Does anybody actually believe that small town Americans aren't bitter towards politicians on the national scene?

4/14/2008 8:58:28 AM

^ word up

everything he said is TRUE

4/14/2008 9:06:11 AM

^ well, Obama didn't say they were bitter toward politicians. He said they were bitter about their economic situation and that's why they "cling" to religion and guns.

Now, of course, he's backtracking a bit and saying that he what meant to say was that people seek comfort from their religion during hard times (and guns too?). But most people read the headlines and not the retractions. So we'll just have to see if his "clarification" works on voters b4 upcomming primaries.

Really, it just makes me chuckle. Obama likes to grab sound bytes from his opponents out of context and then hammer them over the head with them (see his accusation that McCain wants 100 years of war, which ABC news eventually called him out on). So seeing him get hit with the exact same tactic really me think he's getting what he deserves.

"new brand of politics" my ass.

[Edited on April 14, 2008 at 9:08 AM. Reason : ``]

4/14/2008 9:06:32 AM

you're one bitter mother fucker dood

4/14/2008 9:08:12 AM

^^ You have a good point there. Upon revisiting the transcript, you are correct.

And with that said, I'd say that it's an even more true statement (Though I still fail to see how guns fits in between religion and xenophobia, but I digress)

People do get bitter and angry in hard times. Not all people obviously, but I still think the crux of the statement is true. As is this:

Quote :

""new brand of politics" my ass."

He's not quite as in-the-pocket for the lobbyists, but he's certainly not Mr. Smith goes to Washington either.

4/14/2008 9:13:22 AM

Here's a nice post from Mickey Kays' blog over the Obama-loving Slate magazine. It points out some of the 4 problems Obama will have in backtracking from his original remarks.

Quote :

"1) It lumps together things Obama wants us to think he thinks are good (religion) with things he undoubtedly thinks are bad (racism, anti-immigrant sentiment). I suppose it's logically possible to say 'these Pennsylvania voters are so bitter and frustrated that they cling to both good things and bad things,." but the implication is that these are all things he thinks are unfortunate and need explaining (because, his context suggests, they prevent voters from doing the right thing and voting for ... him). Yesterday at the CNN "Compassion Forum" Obama said he wasn't disparaging religion because he meant people "cling" to it in a good way! Would that be the same way they "cling" to "antipathy to people who aren't like them"--the very next phrase Obama uttered? Is racism one of those "traditions that are passed on from generation to generation" that "sustains us"? Obama's unfortunate parallelism makes it hard for him to extricate him from the charge that he was dissing rural Pennsylvanians' excess religiosity. 2.) Even if Obama wasn't equating anything on his list with anything else, he did openly accuse Pennsylvanians of being racists ("antipathy to people who aren't like them"). 3) He's contradicted his own positions--at least on trade and (says Instapundit) guns.. Isn't Obama the one trying to tar Hillary as a supporter of NAFTA? Is that just 'boob bait.' 4.) Yes, he's condescending. It's not just that in explaining everyone to everyone Obama winds up patronizing everyone. He doesn't patronize everyone equally. Specifically, he regards the views of these Pennsylvanians as epiphenomena--byproducts of economic stagnation--in a way he doesn't regard, say, his own views as epiphenomena.** Once the Pennsylvanians get some jobs back, they'll change and become as enlightened as Obama [and] the San Franciscans to whom he was talking. That's the clear logic of his argument. Superiority of this sort--not crediting the authenticity and standing of your subject's views--is a violation of social equality, which is a more important value for Americans than money equality. Liiberals tend to lose elections when they forget that. "

http://www.slate.com/id/2188487/

4/14/2008 10:16:06 AM

lol, looks like Hillary isn't the only desperate one looking for controversy where there is none

4/14/2008 10:19:07 AM

any of you guys hear the mp3 of rev wrights speech yesterday?? lolol

it's an instant classic, mother russia would have loved this guy.

4/14/2008 10:23:28 AM

Quote :

"lol, looks like Hillary isn't the only desperate one looking for controversy where there is none"

hahaha, that's like what 90% of Socks only useful function in soap box is just to sling mud at Obama. he's a one note tenor right now because the guy frustrates him. What he's degenerated too is what you'll find from the right wing on the radio dial - LIBERALS LIBERALS BLAH BLAH LIBERALS. ANTI AMERICAN ANTI PATRIOTISM COMMIES

He's still sour that his girl Hillary is getting bounced so it's like throwing blinders on an enraged bull - just bucking around trying to find something to stick, searching for the silver bullet gaffe of doom.

Cmon, Socks - how about talk more about grandpa bush part deux? Let's talk about how he'll invade Iran, see how that plays? Or him not knowing shit about the economy? He's a real ace with the top two issues in Americas minds right now isn't he?

[Edited on April 14, 2008 at 10:32 AM. Reason : d]

4/14/2008 10:31:52 AM

Quote :

"All the while grandpa McBush sits around and has his press person say dumb ignorant shit backing her up. Hillary and the republican alliance is sickening."

all part of the "vast right-wing conspiracy" no doubt. I'm pretty sure I heard that somewhere.


Although, I agree that the McBush epithet isn't deserved. McCain's biggest problem amongst Republicans is the fact that he doesn't enjoy the support of the Bushmerga.


I'd rather have a president that admitted that he wasn't an economic genius and surrounded himself with people who were, than one who was on a crusade to "fix" America's ills using the bully pulpit.


Obama supporters need to get used to the idea of their guy being called out more and more in the future. Right now, he's playing to his own party, which is a fairly easy crowd, and as good of a speaker as he is, he's going to keep screwing up from time to time. I don't think this will substantially hurt him in the end, in all likelihood he'll be the next POTUS, but don't get all huffy because we don't want to suck the dick of your golden child.

4/14/2008 10:44:27 AM

I like posts that are about me.

Anyways, aside from one bad joke at a ralley, no one has been able to provide any credible reason to think McCain would actually invade Iran.

And I think McCain understand economics more than gives himself credit for and more than Obama at least (which is the real question we should ask ourselves). Obama seems to think you can lower health care costs by getting people to purchase more health care. Obama seems to think that increases taxes on oil companies will lower gas prices. Obama seems to think that subsidizing ethanol will help create a sustainable alternative to motor gasoline. None of this really makes since to me or John McCain.

McCain has proposed a health care plan that provides incentives for the healthy and wealthy to consume fewer health care resources, which would both help make insurance cheaper for the working poor and middle class.

John McCain knows you don't lower prices by raising taxes. McCain is also (and has always been) against subsidizing ethanol. At the same time, he realizes the toil fossil fuels have on the environment and introduced the first legislation to cap carbon emissions.

Does John McCain say things I disagree with? You bet, yah. But I disagree with him less than I do Obama. So my choice is a no brainer.

4/14/2008 10:44:53 AM

Quote :

"but don't get all huffy because we don't want to suck the dick of your golden child."

watch it man, that's taking it a little overboard. I'm not some zombie fuck who follows Obama becuase I don't have a clue nor don't agree with his policies. It's a trite point of view for you to make and you'll get no productivity out of any argument or disagreement when you spout crap like this.

I'm not getting huffy I'm just pointing out what this whole stupid drama is about. Attack politics chatter and 'gotcha' politics. It's the lowest common denominator of actual productive discourse, and anyone that thinks what Obama is going through with having every word parsed over by BOTH the Clinton Machine and the unified Right wing crowd is easy is simply deluding themselves.

If it was 1v1 this would be far easier than having a rabid Hillary AND McCain on you, and worse, Hillary stooping so low to even ally with the republicans to forward her own clearly failed nomination bid. At least then McCain could finally be called to question over all the crap he's getting a free pass on -

* In November 2007, reversed his previous position on a long-term presence for U.S. troops in Iraq, arguing that the “nature of the society in Iraq” and the “religious aspects” of the country make it inevitable that the United States “eventually withdraws.” Two months later, McCain reversed back, saying he’s prepared to leave U.S. troops in Iraq for 100 years.
* was a co-sponsor of the DREAM Act, which would grant legal status to illegal immigrants’ kids who graduate from high school. Now he’s against it. On immigration policy in general, McCain announced in February 2008 that he would vote against his own legislation.
* In 2006, sponsored legislation to require grassroots lobbying coalitions to reveal their financial donors. In 2007, after receiving “feedback” on the proposal, McCain told far-right activist groups that he opposes his own measure.
* went from saying he would not support repeal of Roe v. Wade to saying the exact opposite.
* went from saying gay marriage should be allowed, to saying gay marriage shouldn’t be allowed.
* criticized TV preacher Jerry Falwell as “an agent of intolerance” in 2002, but then decided to cozy up to the man who said Americans “deserved” the 9/11 attacks.
* used to oppose Bush’s tax cuts for the very wealthy, but he reversed course in February.
supported a major campaign-finance reform measure that bore his name. In June 2007, he abandoned his own legislation.
* opposed a holiday to honor Martin Luther King, Jr., before he supported it.
* was anti-ethanol. Now he’s pro-ethanol.
* was both for and against state promotion of the Confederate flag.
* bomb bomb bomb bomb bomb Iran (beach boys)
* can't tell the difference between a sunni and shiite (multiple gaffes)
* can't even come up with a foreclosure proposal, took him three tries to even admit it's a problem

4/14/2008 11:06:10 AM

Quote :

"watch it man"

awww, my first personal e-threat.

Quote :

"Attack politics chatter and 'gotcha' politics. It's the lowest common denominator of actual productive discourse"

I used to think politics was about the issues. Its not. Elections are all about sales. The candidate is the product and the job of a campaign is to sell that product to the public. It does somewhat matter what a politician thinks / says / does, but only insofar as that will hurt the brand the campaign manager is trying to present.

Obama hurt his brand with the Pennsylvania comment and, while you might find it trite and irrelevant, the voters in Pennsylvania won't since he is talking about him. At this point in the election, small amounts of voters have a big political impact so this discussion is perfectly relevant.

McCain is getting a "free pass" right now because he isn't news. He will quickly become news after Obama locks up the nomination. Right now, Obama and HRC are news so they're going to get attention. Sure, it is easy to say Obama has remained consistent on his positions because, well, he has almost no record before this election. Obama is running, and winning, based on his speech-making ability, that is the best product feature Obama v.06 has for his campaign to sell.


Live by the sword, die by the sword . . . or at least get wounded.

4/14/2008 11:20:16 AM

Hillary now up 20 points in PA with 10 days to go. You obama supports can try to justify it, but politically it was a huge mistep..as the polls are showing.

Personally this ranks number 1243243432 in the list of reasons he should not be president, but if it touches a nerve with voters.. Im all for it.

4/14/2008 11:20:35 AM

yeah the truth isn't always the best political move

4/14/2008 11:25:23 AM

^^^^ Was that a one-two combination of complaining about attack campaigns and in the same post a list of attacks against McCain? I'm not a McCain fan, but how many of those are real issues, and how many are McCain playing to the base, just like every presidential candidate does to win his nomination... and how many of them are nuanced stances à la John Kerry, where a piece of legislation has changed substantially between initial support and later statements?

Not proposing that anybody gets a free pass... just struck me as a pot-kettle moment.

[Edited on April 14, 2008 at 11:25 AM. Reason : .]

4/14/2008 11:25:34 AM

Quote :

"You obama supports can try to justify it, but politically it was a huge mistep..as the polls are showing. "

hahaha. nice try!

Yeah, this seems to be hurting him so bad!!!



http://www.gallup.com/poll/106435/Gallup-Daily-Obama-Maintains-Solid-Democratic-Lead-50-41.aspx

still 9 points ahead

4/14/2008 11:33:32 AM

No it's simply saying that the swerving political eye and MSM criticism would be all over these issues if Obama vs. Clinton wasn't all the rage and drama right now. They'd stand the same type of criticism....hell if it was a Democrat with that list you don't think the right wing machine wouldn't go nuts over these items? You're deluding yourself if you think they wouldn't.

4/14/2008 11:34:55 AM

Oh and this picture is really funny regardless of who you support.

4/14/2008 11:37:35 AM

I do think this has hurt him terp. Notice I said, she took opened up a 20 point lead over him in PA? So you post a national poll.. solid. haha

http://americanresearchgroup.com/

According to this poll he was tied with her on april 6.. now is behind 20 points. For the life of me, I cant understand why someone would think these comments hurt him.

4/14/2008 11:38:59 AM

^ What are the chances of the April 5-6 number being a statistical anomaly? I mean, if you take that out the numbers are pretty consistent all the way across.

4/14/2008 11:41:05 AM

Quote :

"I do think this has hurt him terp. Notice I said, she took opened up a 20 point lead over him in PA? So you post a national poll.. solid. haha"

oh, my bad - sorry that I responded to the more relevant part of your post.

Quote :

"as the polls are showing."

Obviously not all the polls, including the NATIONAL poll that I just posted.

4/14/2008 11:49:09 AM

^ considering his comment was aimed at people in PA, it would likely do the most damage in that state and its upcomming primary. The fact that it has not hurt him nationally (yet?) is still relevant, but less directly related to the question at hand and what eyedrb was saying.

[Edited on April 14, 2008 at 12:03 PM. Reason : ``]

4/14/2008 11:55:15 AM

For once i'll have to agree with socks on this. Specific state polling shows it might have done damage. Tough to say..this same polling group had Hillary up 9 in Iowa week of the primary and he won...so you have to take these things with a grain of salt.

HOWEVER it's just concern for Obama - could be some signs of fallout. I mean, she's going to win PA outright, no one thinks otherwise here...it's important to understand that line of expectations although I'm sure Hillary will come out like ZOMG COMEBACK KID, etc. But still, all the inroads he was making to put this at a single digit win which would be significant could have taken a big hit.

Tough to tell, we'll see what happens.

4/14/2008 12:01:04 PM

hahaha, Crowd jeers Hillary as she continues to attack Obama on bullshit

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/politics/2008/04/14/sot.clinton.acct.cnn

4/14/2008 3:05:24 PM

Quote :

"According to this poll he was tied with her on april 6.. now is behind 20 points. For the life of me, I cant understand why someone would think these comments hurt him."

As far as we can tell, at this time, that poll is a statistical anomaly. It will require a few polls to back that one up before we can put any credence into it.

4/14/2008 3:09:09 PM

^^ You're apparently the only one who saw the video that way. I'm sure if CNN could headline this "crows jeers Clinton" they would. But theyd didn't.

The crowd mumbled when she said "I understand my opponent was here earler today attack me...." and they were totally silent through the "bullshit" (where Hillary just repeated Obama's exact words, heaven forbid). And at the end they clapped.

*shrug* One could just as easily interprut the video to be Hillary supporters grumbling over Obama's earlier attacks.

[Edited on April 14, 2008 at 3:12 PM. Reason : ``]

4/14/2008 3:12:38 PM

Crowd jeers Hillary as she continues to attack Obama

[Edited on April 14, 2008 at 3:17 PM. Reason : .]

4/14/2008 3:16:27 PM