I hope the kid actually has HFA or Asperger's. If otherwise, then this teacher is scum of the Earth for what she did.

6/2/2008 12:15:36 PM

mailto:portillow@stlucie.k12.fl.us


http://www.stlucie.k12.fl.us/mse/staff/kindergarten.html

everyone should send her an email

6/2/2008 12:28:48 PM

I went to that school's webpage.

i checked out the school's Technology Resource Teacher, who is the resource for parents and students to learn how "web technology" can assist learning.

the school page then links to this teacher's page, which has material about the Anti-Christ, Armageddon, and how Israel will be destroyed by Islam.






[Edited on June 2, 2008 at 2:40 PM. Reason : ]

6/2/2008 2:38:33 PM

assburgers is a fake desease used by goons to excuse their lack of social skills.

6/2/2008 3:55:06 PM

okay, Tom Cruise. now go dance on couches and rant about the fake science of psychiatric medicine.

meanwhile the DSM-IV classifies it as a disorder.

it's essentially high-functioning autism. there may be worse disorders, but i wouldn't wish it upon anyone.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asperger_syndrome

6/2/2008 7:07:46 PM

Quote :

"1) Having the kids critique Alex's behavior would not do any good because 5-year olds are sociopathic robots that don't care how others feel."

No, 5-year olds aren't sociopaths. They just aren't capable of gaining anything from such a "critique." Please, go back and take PSY101 to understand why.

Quote :

"2) Having the kids critique Alex's behavior was too harsh because 5-year olds feel bad if others don't like them."

No, it's too harsh because the ONLY thing it will accomplish is making him feel bad. That's it. It won't correct the behavior and it won't make the kid somehow see that he is hurting other people. It will just make him feel bad and embarrassed in front of his peers and give them something else to tease him about.

Quote :

"Aaron's characterization of 5-year children as being totally oblivious to the feelings of others (essentially making them sociopathic robots) is simply just dead wrong"

I'm glad to see that you are smarter than all of the psychologists who beg to differ.

Quote :

"As a teacher, I have to agree with this."

As a teacher, you should understand what a kindergartner is and isn't capable of.

6/3/2008 12:23:36 AM

the kid needs to get the shit beat out of him by mommy or daddy.

The school needs to call the parents and send his ass home if/when he severely disrupts class, case closed. Let the parents discipline the kid and remove him from the problem environment.

My parents giving me the occasional, well deserved spanking snapped me into shape real quick. Also I completely agree with Boone, it seems like most "problem children" are tested and tested until SOMETHING is found wrong with them and they can get a script for Ritalin or the like.

6/3/2008 5:31:59 AM

And this is the exact type of thinking that results in these children.
To the gentleman above me, much research has shown that an authoritative parenting style that provides structure without corporal punishment results in the most successful and well-behaved children. The authoritarian parenting style that thinks a kid just "needs to get the shit beat out of him" produce children with social phobias and very little independence. Corporal punishment is, in fact, bad for children.
Shaggy up there has obviously never met Wolfman. (Nor will he now.)
One thing does bother me, though.

Quote :

"I hope the kid actually has HFA or Asperger's. If otherwise, then this teacher is scum of the Earth for what she did."

So it's OKAY to discriminate against children with Autism and Asperger's? They will still feel bad if they are singled out by the class and publicly embarassed as this child was. It's incredibly bad to treat these children poorly, because they might not have the social learning to have an appropriate response to this, ESPECIALLY at age 5. At such a young age, that kind of treatment has a good chance of provoking a violent response from the kid.
And the next argument is, "if he can't control himself, he doesn't belong in that classroom." But, other research has shown that children with high functioning autism and asperger's can still socially learn and mimic other students very well. If they remain in a normal classroom environment, they will socially learn normal behavior, if given time. Expecting it out of a kindergardener is a little much. However, if they remain in a special education classroom, then the abnormal behavior is socially reinforced by their peers, and they will only get worse.
All in all, what the education system needs is patience. People go to public school to learn how to deal with other people, even if those people are very different from themselves. So keep with the goals of public school, and don't just send people out of of the classroom for being a little difficult.

6/3/2008 1:28:34 PM

in about 10 years, if someone else does this to him, he's going to shoot his teachers and classmates

6/3/2008 1:30:48 PM

Quote :

"My parents giving me the occasional assbeating"

yeah, me too... but neither you nor I have an autistic disability (high-functioning or otherwise) that i'm aware of.

i respectfully submit that you cant beat disability out of a kid.




[Edited on June 3, 2008 at 2:13 PM. Reason : ]

6/3/2008 2:11:32 PM

Quote :

"The authoritarian parenting style that thinks a kid just "needs to get the shit beat out of him" produce children with social phobias and very little independence."

I know some very independent people who got them shit beat out of them at a young age.

6/3/2008 2:12:40 PM

[Edited on June 3, 2008 at 2:15 PM. Reason : must. resist. stabbing. eyes. out.]

6/3/2008 2:14:09 PM

Quote :

"why cant we just kill everyone thats genetically fucked up...tired of worrying about these less fortunate people or at least devote one of the states to just all the messed up people"

ironic coming from you. You would have been one of those kids 'killed'

6/3/2008 2:18:04 PM

I find it very interesting that autism is getting diagnosed more and more frequently. I can draw only 1 of 3 conclusions:

1) Something in the environment is affecting the genetic material of gametes leading to more cases of genetic, developmental diseases like autism.

2) Autism was not fully understood and is now easier to spot after years of research.

3) Autism is overdiagnosed and many people with autism do not actually have it sort of like ADD/ADHD.

6/3/2008 2:25:20 PM

I have an Autistic cousin and I would be really pissed if this happened to him. Its not HIS fault he is that way. The teacher could have just simply asked for him not to be put back in his class without all the other bullshit. Not only did she teach a kid to hate himself but she also taught her class that its ok to alienate people because they are different. +1 for teaching

6/3/2008 2:28:00 PM

Quote :

"The teacher could have just simply asked for him not to be put back in his class without all the other bullshit."

Just because she asked doesn't mean the school admin is going to DO anything about it.

6/3/2008 2:29:11 PM

Quote :

"The teacher could have just simply asked for him not to be put back in his class"

I think her inability to do so was the cause for the whole incident.

6/3/2008 2:29:17 PM

you missed the whole point. The end result was him sitting in the nurses office all day. OBVIOUSLY that wasn't a result because the students voted...it was the end result of the teachers say so. The students can vote all they like, if the teacher wants him gone, he would have been gone.

6/3/2008 2:33:27 PM

^ you need to read the police report, friend.

[Edited on June 3, 2008 at 2:36 PM. Reason : ``]

6/3/2008 2:35:48 PM

I'm not going to read through all that shit.

6/3/2008 2:43:59 PM

Quote :

" 1) Something in the environment is affecting the genetic material of gametes leading to more cases of genetic, developmental diseases like autism. 2) Autism was not fully understood and is now easier to spot after years of research. "

researchers generally agree that both are likely contributing factors to the increase




[Edited on June 3, 2008 at 7:58 PM. Reason : ]

6/3/2008 7:55:43 PM

Quote :

" RSXTypeS : The students can vote all they like, if the teacher wants him gone, he would have been gone Socks`` : you need to read the police report, friend. "

is this another one of Socks`` pro-Hillary "every vote counts" campaigns?



seriously, though, don't listen to Socks. He's just about lost all his credibility around here.




[Edited on June 3, 2008 at 8:01 PM. Reason : ]

6/3/2008 8:00:48 PM

Quote :

"yeah, me too... but neither you nor I have an autistic disability (high-functioning or otherwise) that i'm aware of. "

The kid does not fucking have autism. I have known several kids with Aspergers, and my next door neighbor growing up had SEVERE autism from birth. From reading the documents, merely from the kids responses, he is not autistic, high functioning or otherwise. Being an attention whore is completely the opposite. Autistic kids retreat into their own worlds, they don't demand attention from those around them.

And I do not have autism, but I was tested multiple times as a child because of my own behavioral and concentration issues. I was never to the point of the kid in the incident, but I sure as hell tested the waters all the time.

Quote :

"And this is the exact type of thinking that results in these children. To the gentleman above me, much research has shown that an authoritative parenting style that provides structure without corporal punishment results in the most successful and well-behaved children. The authoritarian parenting style that thinks a kid just "needs to get the shit beat out of him" produce children with social phobias and very little independence. Corporal punishment is, in fact, bad for children. Shaggy up there has obviously never met Wolfman. (Nor will he now.) One thing does bother me, though. "

You can kiss my ass with this psychological bullshit. All that research you speak of is heresay at best, because none (to my knowledge) of the childhood parenting style research has followed through to adulthood to track actual merit. Most of the attempted correlations between kids who were spanked and their adult actions seem to completely ignore the rest of the equation: A stable home, stable and responsible parenting, and a healthy envrionment.

My parents and relatives all got beaten as kids for doing bad things, and they all turned out perfectly normal as far as that goes. No social phobias, no independent living problems. Corporal punishment isn't the only solution, but to say you should never hit a child is being an academic outside of reality. Of my friends throughout my life, the ones who were spanked as children did much better than the ones who ran fucking wild from parents who "didn't believe in spanking".

Yes I've met Wolfman. And wolfman knows right from wrong. High functioning autism does NOT excuse you from the rules. Full blown autism does, which this kid definitely doesn't have (unless the ENTIRE transcript was fabricated).

6/3/2008 8:50:07 PM

Quote :

"The kid does not fucking have autism. I have known several kids with Aspergers, and my next door neighbor growing up ..."

sincere apologies, Dr. Noen ... I did not know you were a practitioner from Teh Intarweb College of Medicine.

Quote :

"You can kiss my ass with this psychological bullshit. All that research you speak of is heresay"

oh hey, did Microsoft put a couch in your office? I'd love to see you say that while doing a little dance on it

Quote :

"And I do not have autism"

well, you did look a bit downy when we had lunch in Redmond that day... probably just the lighting though. You say you got beat up a lot as a child? I guess that could explain it.






[Edited on June 3, 2008 at 9:15 PM. Reason : ]

6/3/2008 9:05:17 PM

Quote :

"sincere apologies, Dr. Noen ... I did not know you were a practitioner from Teh Intarweb College of Medicine."

Look, you can go read about it. Like I said, I grew up with a kid with severe autism and babysat and played with the kid. It's a horrible debilitating disease. And if that kid had ever interacted with me the way those transcripts read (actual verbal, direct, conversational communication), I would have cried with joy.

So blow me, the fucking kid MIGHT have some kind of mild disfunction, but i'll be damned if it gives you a pass to fucking hurt other kids and act like an asshole. There's a medical condition for that too, it's called a kid who needs a whooping and parents.

Quote :

"oh hey, did Microsoft put a couch in your office? I'd love to see you say that while doing a little dance on it"

See the above. Psychology (yes I took courses and could have minored with another 3 credit hours) is a malleable science. Especially when dealing with complex issues like raising children and developmental disorders. Over just the past 10-20 years, common practices and long held beliefs have been turned on their heads more than once. I'm just trying to be the voice of moderation here. Being on the "cutting edge" of any of this shit is like doing the south beach or atkins diet, sure it works in the short term, but there is NO CONTROLLED DATA from longterm studies to validate or invalidate the claims being made.

Also how is your new job workin out Joe?

6/3/2008 10:30:11 PM

Quote :

"Also how is your new job workin out Joe"

very well, thanks!... building lifesaving medical devices is much more rewarding than designing spam filters for Mr. Gates. more money too. (you know, MSFT doesn't really pay all that great, they seem to think it's some sort of privilege to work there.)

6/3/2008 10:48:36 PM

maybe they don't for your position

6/4/2008 5:51:41 AM

aha. perhaps. i was just an SDE1, but it was just a temp gig anyhow. i'd rather build real things, you know. and, in addition to more money and greater satisfaction, i no longer have to apologize for working at MSFT.

so hey, what do they pay GUI designers over there, by the way? i've heard that the glut of self-trained and experienced "artsy" designers left over from Seattle's tech boom, has really pushed the wages down for all User Interface types.






[Edited on June 4, 2008 at 1:58 PM. Reason : ]

6/4/2008 1:53:22 PM

Quote :

"He'll grow up, shoot up a high school, and then we'll all talk about how senseless it was, what an evil person he was, and wonder why it happened..."

WE APPROVE OF THIS THREAD

6/4/2008 5:17:33 PM