night and day difference in quality? which one are you implying is better?

2/26/2010 9:57:37 AM

I'd imagine (read: hope) he meant the Prius.

2/26/2010 11:04:01 AM

have you driven a new jetta recently?

its funny cuz all i hear about lately are all these recalls on toyotas for unintended acceleration and brake failure.. awesome build quality guys.

2/26/2010 11:22:17 AM

you like vw's. we GET it.

2/26/2010 11:24:52 AM

you (and some others) obviously do not

just wondering what you were basing this on.. because if you're saying a vw diesel is not reliable you're just wrong.

[Edited on February 26, 2010 at 11:32 AM. Reason : .]

2/26/2010 11:26:28 AM

your link?

http://autos.yahoo.com/articles/autos_content_landing_pages/1161/volkswagen-steals-toyotas-crown-as-worlds-largest-automaker/

lol

2/26/2010 11:31:57 AM

man just buy a civic

2/26/2010 11:32:12 AM

yes.. that link may be kinda old, i realized after i posted it

[Edited on February 26, 2010 at 11:34 AM. Reason : may be? forbes published something similar nov 09]

2/26/2010 11:32:38 AM

Quote :

"because if you're saying a vw diesel is not reliable you're just wrong."

It's not so much the engine as it is the rest of the car.

2/26/2010 11:38:28 AM

i am basing it on experience i have had working on 5-10 year old VW's. They also make horrible horrible gas engines (1.8L with boost at 1BAR = 180hp WTF???? How can the timing belt prematurely fail and bend valves? How could an engine with performance like that even be interference? i can build you better in my garage.).

The only one I wouldn't immediately avoid is the TDI. I also like their marketing department. The price for a jetta coil pack at the dealership also wasn't outrageous.



[Edited on February 26, 2010 at 11:42 AM. Reason : Just buy a +|+|+|+|SUBARU|+|+|+|+]

2/26/2010 11:39:53 AM

stock boost is .8 bar on the 180hp version

you failed to acknowledge the 225hp version that was available in the TT

2/26/2010 11:46:37 AM

ohhhhhhhhhhhh 225hp!!!!!!!!!!!

With what ? 5 valves per cylinder and 1BAR? hahahahahhaha

2/26/2010 12:08:21 PM

so this is just another typical honda fanboy trying to turn a "prius vs tdi" comment into one about the performance of neither

2/26/2010 12:12:48 PM

Quote :

"I'd imagine (read: hope) he meant the Prius."

Shit no. Driven both, bought neither, but the Jetta was way more solid than the Prius.

But the Prius has push-button start, so rock on, there.

That said, the maintenance (special oil reqs., 60k transmission flush and filter change @ $$$, wtf) is a biiiiitch on newer TDIs.

[Edited on February 26, 2010 at 12:32 PM. Reason : ]

2/26/2010 12:30:09 PM

this isnt a prius vs tdi thread.

its turned into an

A) vwmsj padding (which they do)
B) Smores's inability to figure out how far you have to drive to save 11grand in fuel (which he still hasnt)
C) you promoting the TDI and VWs in general (SEE A)
D) jeepmknoobin looks to have no idea how long nickel has been mined in canada and what its used for (primarily how little is consumed by toyota)
E) BigEgo proposing the only decent car suggestion

All i did was
the prius isnt comparable to the yaris (it isnt)
express how flawed i think the crazy cnw dust to dust article is (it is)
help a kid learn math (he is getting closer)
ask why it takes 5 valves , 9:1 CR, and 14psi to make 220hp (im waiting)

Now im a honda fan boy. Did I even mention Honda at all here?

[Edited on February 26, 2010 at 12:48 PM. Reason : vwmsj]

2/26/2010 12:47:37 PM

[Edited on February 26, 2010 at 12:56 PM. Reason : got it]

2/26/2010 12:48:45 PM

wtf. nvm. I digress my statements.

I resent the communists


And I eat the cake that was given to me. K?

[Edited on February 26, 2010 at 1:07 PM. Reason : .]

2/26/2010 1:06:34 PM

That's not what "digress" means.

2/26/2010 1:12:02 PM

What ever happened to other automakers bringing diesels to the U.S.?

And why is it that current diesels get lower MPG than diesels of 5 years ago. People were talking about how ultra low sulfur diesel would result in 60+ MPG on jettas, but the new blueTDIs are rated in the high 30's/low 40's.

2/26/2010 1:28:48 PM

Because VW makes some shit ass engines?

2/26/2010 1:37:41 PM

a lot of it has to do with emission reduction equipment on the vehicles. at least that's what I think. and as far as no influx of diesel autos, the public's perception is really skewed. GM's massive failures in the 80s didn't help, either.

2/26/2010 1:38:00 PM

Quote :

"ask why it takes 5 valves , 9:1 CR, and 14psi to make 220hp (im waiting)"

there is a lot of debate on this in the vw community. some claim (will probably never be confirmed by vw) that vw reduced output because any more power would have reduced sales of the 2.8 VR6, which was supposed to be the "high end" engine option.

i know it seems low compared to some honda engine.. lower rev limit would be the biggest answer output does not seem comparable. i'm not even totally sure why then went 5/cyl, but now they are back to 4/cyl (16v). even flow bench testing did not show too much of a difference b/w the 16v and 20v head designs

its not the hardware.. a software upgrade (stock hardware) can get you 225+ bhp and 260+ btq on the 180hp engine (k03sport turbo)..

Quote :

"And why is it that current diesels get lower MPG than diesels of 5 years ago. People were talking about how ultra low sulfur diesel would result in 60+ MPG on jettas, but the new blueTDIs are rated in the high 30's/low 40's."

"are rated"
http://www.vwvortex.com/artman/publish/volkswagen_news/article_2508.shtml

2/26/2010 2:10:55 PM

Quote :

"exceeding 60 mpg on several legs of the record-setting run"

Wowzers!

[Edited on February 26, 2010 at 3:41 PM. Reason : Honestly, I thought it said "mph" at first, but I still don't find it terribly impressive.]

2/26/2010 3:39:39 PM

http://driving.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/driving/used_car_reviews/article3552994.ece

Worth a full read.

TimesOnline drives the Prius and the 520d 545 miles to Geneva. Here are the brief results:

BMW 520d:

3,494 lbs
Stereo ON
AC ON
Fuel used on test 10.84 gallons (50.3 mpg)
Fuel cost £54.19 (diesel)
Official fuel consumption: 55.4 mpg


Yota Prius:

2,921 lbs
Stereo OFF
AC OFF
Fuel used on test 11.34 gallons (48.1 mpg)
Fuel cost £54.64 (petrol)
Official fuel consumption: 65.7 mpg


If the numbers above are adjusted for stereo/AC use, vehicle weight, and drag coefficient, the BMW's engine would turn out to be something like 25-35% more fuel efficient, if not more.

Also:

Quote :

"The official fuel consumption figure for the Prius – supplied by Toyota itself – is 65.7 mpg in mixed motoring. That’s a claim not supported by many of the letter writers to The Sunday Times who say they get nearer to 50 mpg."

Quote :

"E) BigEgo proposing the only decent car suggestion"

He suggested a car (335d) that costs TWICE as much as what the OP's wife wants, so I don't see how it is a 'decent' car suggestion. It is a decent car, but completely indecent as far as the/OP are concerned.


[Edited on February 26, 2010 at 4:06 PM. Reason : ]

2/26/2010 4:00:16 PM

My grandmother's prius averages 45-50 in mixed.

You have to use an equal amount city and highway driving when comparing hybrids to non-hybrids. Most hybrids get better mileage in the city.

2/26/2010 4:48:05 PM

Quote :

""are rated" http://www.vwvortex.com/artman/publish/volkswagen_news/article_2508.shtml "

FTA

Quote :

"The Taylors have made a 26-year career out of driving economically and conducting workshops globally on fuel-efficient driving techniques. "

So I take this to be that their fuel economy has more to do with how they drive (likely like pussies) than the actual capability of the vehicle. Given that my '05 Jetta TDI is rated with a significantly higher fuel economy than the new ones, this same couple would get even better fuel economy with an older TDI.

Or, there is something else to this. The question still remains unanswered -- why are the current Jetta TDIs rated so much lower than the previous generation Jetta TDIs? Why hasn't ULSD resulted in significant fuel economy improvement?

These aren't meant to be loaded questions -- I really just am curious.

2/27/2010 10:20:26 AM

ULSD has nothing to do with fuel econ. It was purely for emissions reductions.

2/28/2010 9:16:07 AM

TDI

2/28/2010 12:24:36 PM

From what I've been reading about ULSD, the refining process that removes the sulfur also decreases the energy content (by how much I'm not sure), resulting in reduced power and fuel economy.

2/28/2010 1:53:05 PM

a friend of mine took his dad's Beetle TDI in for a new clutch and stage 1 flash and said he is now enjoying a consistent 60 mpg. I'd be on board for that all day over a prius..

2/28/2010 4:53:38 PM

2 door beetles for all!

2/28/2010 7:57:13 PM

^^^ it does. I noticed about 3mpg drop on my 2003 TDI jetta after the change. Averaging 47mpg now, used to be 50mpg on my commute. I wouldn't buy a gas VW, but haven't had any problem with either of my TDI's.

2003 Jetta Wagon ~240k
2006 Jetta Sedan ~80k

3/1/2010 7:50:46 PM

i thought the turbos were notorious for crapping out around or before 100k on TDIs...at ~$1k to replace them?

/noob

3/2/2010 8:54:29 AM

The turbo died on my '05 at ~46k, and VW replaced it for free. No other problems, and we're at 71k now.

3/2/2010 9:11:59 AM

Quote :

"A Toyota Yaris, for example, costs around $12k and gets 29/36 mpg. A Toyota Prius costs $23k and gets 48/51 mpg. To make up that extra $11,000 you'd have to drive a LOT of miles for a LONG time. The Yaris is a much better deal for fuel economy and overall cost. Then again, if she's just driving it to make a statement and be an environmentalist, the Prius is perfect."

shit you might as well compare a kia sorento and a lexus rx330 at that rate.

it's not ALL about the mpg, the Prius is a muuuuuuuuuuuch nicer car than the Yaris, and will obviously be worth more money than the Yaris when it comes time to resell...so it's pretty dumb to compare them in the way you did. There is value gained by spending the extra $11k, outside of MPG.

but then your stupid statement about being an environmentalist shows you have some nice political ideology being your "thinking" (using the term loosely)

it really is a dumb argument, but that doesn't stop everyone and their brother from making it.

3/2/2010 9:58:10 AM