page 2 asks...

If this guy had not been gay and had not killed himself...

Would the "crime" have even been reported?
didn't this kid post on that forum that he knew his roommate had taped him before?

10/1/2010 2:36:57 PM

Quote :

"Misuse of technology led to suicide"

Making porn and then distributing it via the internet is not a misuse of technology.

Quite the opposite, actually...

10/1/2010 2:38:19 PM

^^^ I mean yeah I get your point. But at that moment, the roommate wasn't there and there's no way he would expect to be on camera, since I'm sure there was no ongoing room surveillance before that time.

Either way, I'm not saying that the roommate is responsible for his suicide. Someone snapped a pic of me banging out a fat broad and shared it with my friends when I was younger. Granted I wasn't banging a dude but it's not much better.

[Edited on October 1, 2010 at 2:39 PM. Reason : .]

10/1/2010 2:39:44 PM

Quote :

"Someone snapped a pic of me banging out a fat broad and shared it with my friends when I was younger. Granted I wasn't banging a dude but it's not much better."

now i want you to imagine it gets on the internet.
to your family, your friends, thewolfweb.


how effed up is that?!?!?!?

10/1/2010 2:43:03 PM

Quote :

"On Sept. 22, Clementi logged back on to the site at 4:38 a.m. with an update. "So I wanted to have the guy over again. I texted roomie around 7 asking for the room later tonite and he said it was fine," he wrote. "When I got back to the room, I instantly noticed he had turned the webcam toward my bed and he had posted online again … saying...'Anyone want a free show just video chat with me tonight.' " Then, Clementi apparently decided to get help. "I ran to the nearest R.A. and set this thing in motion," he wrote. "We'll see what happens." In a post two hours later, he wrote that his residence assistant took his concerns seriously. "He asked me to email him a written paragraph about exactly what happened," Clementi wrote. "I emailed it to him and to two people above him." "

so apparently he did seek out the RA.... maybe he got a response from them that tipped him over the edge.

while i won't say that the roommate "pulled the trigger" it was what set him in motion that led to his death. it's sad that people think it's okay to humiliate someone like that.

10/1/2010 2:43:56 PM

^^ Pretty f'ed up, no doubt.

Am I killing myself over it? No.

10/1/2010 2:45:37 PM

Quote :

"and there's no way he would expect to be on camera, since I'm sure there was no ongoing room surveillance before that time."

Quote :

"didn't this kid post on that forum that he knew his roommate had taped him before?"

I'm pretty sure he even asked for advise on what to do...
He listed his options as speaking to someone at campus housing, confronting his roommate, our just turning the camera's around/being more careful next time

10/1/2010 2:45:55 PM

Quote :

"Am I killing myself over it? No."

but those things didn't happen to you.
unless you wanna man up and post the pic of you banging the fat broad
and i am in NO WAY saying (for certain) that this caused the kid to commit suicide.

im just genuinely amazed at the lack of blame people want to put on the roommate.

(not you in particular, you just happened to bring up an incident that i thought hey-lets expand that )



and i think im also kinda surprised at the stance people are tkaing on this.
have you ever had someone publicly announce they were going to videotape you having sex with someone and then send it to people ? and then have it BROADCASTED TWICE. i'm willing to bet the numbers are few in here. i do think there is a girl or two that might be able to attest to what it feels like. so i think its an injustice for people who have never been in this type of situation to say "well i would just get over it"


[Edited on October 1, 2010 at 2:56 PM. Reason : once again, suicide is a pus way out, but don;t act like you know what you would do in that sit.]

10/1/2010 2:49:35 PM

Quote :

"im just genuinely amazed at the lack of blame people want to put on the roommate. "

others of us are genuinely amazed at the quickness people will point the finger at another person for their own problems.

Like i asked at the top of this page - I doubt this would even be a story if the guy 1) wasn't gay & 2) didn't jump off a bridge

neither of those 2 things have anything to do with his roommate - but the media and some of your are trying to say that they do.

10/1/2010 2:53:35 PM

^^^ Ok so maybe the kid is a little stupid. I still think it's a tricky legal matter.

Quote :

"unless you wanna man up and post the pic of you banging the fat broad "

Good try. I don't have it anyway. That shit was years ago.

[Edited on October 1, 2010 at 2:55 PM. Reason : .]

10/1/2010 2:55:31 PM

DAMNIT!!


i tried.



ok, ok im gone this time.


you know i <3 you guys (agree or disagree )

10/1/2010 2:56:42 PM

Quote :

"im just genuinely amazed at the lack of blame people want to put on the roommate. "

Because he was doing college prank stuff.

10/1/2010 3:01:11 PM

Hate charges considered over sex video student death

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-11454786

So yeah, they might be charged with a hate crime if it can be proved they filmed BECAUSE he was gay.

Anyway, I found this interesting:

Quote :

"Students Dharun Ravi and Molly Wei"

So it was an Indian dude and a Chinese chick... but they MUST have been Indian-American and Chinese-American, because no FOB Indian or Chinese dude or chick would ever do something like that.

10/1/2010 4:00:57 PM

so what would the hate crime be? Hate Invasion of Privacy?

10/1/2010 4:04:25 PM

http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/10/rutgers_student_commits_suicid.html

an interesting take on the case...with some new information that makes it seem not so cut and dry

10/1/2010 4:11:32 PM

Quote :

"so what would the hate crime be? Hate Invasion of Privacy?"

Quote of the Year! Kudos!

10/1/2010 4:17:00 PM

The videotaping is one thing (invasion of privacy), but they shared it with others, arguably for a laugh -- making fun of homosexuality. I don't agree with hate crime legislation, but I could almost see this counting as such...

10/1/2010 4:31:00 PM

Quote :

"arguably for a laugh -- making fun of homosexuality"

haha, homo's are funny...

wait... is that funny "haha" or funny "queer"

10/1/2010 4:39:25 PM

Quote :

"i'm just genuinely amazed at the lack of blame people want to put on the roommate."

personally, I just want to blame the roommate for what he did and not more. I think he should have what ever charges there are associated with what he actually did brought up against him.



Does anyone know if any actual sexual stuff was shared?

According to Clementi's internet posts, the camera wasn't in a position the first night to capture more than a little making out. Which he wasn't terribly upset about. The second night, when the roommate advertised it, he saw the camera before anything started, told the RA and shut the computer off.

So at the time of his posts, Clementi himself claimed nothing sexual could have been shared, just him and the guy making out maybe. I haven't seen anything to suggest he was embarrassed or ashamed of his own actions. It was the principle of what the roommate did that upset him from what I can gather. And the posts didn't suggest he was "distraught."

Did it turn out that the roommate saw more the first night than he believed and shared it AFTER the second incident?



Let me ask this to the blame the roommate for Tyler's suicide crowd: if some evidence suggests that it was not the roommate's acts, but the university's response which seems to have "triggered" his suicide or was the last bad thing that happened to him before he committed suicide, do you blame the university for his death? Do you charge them with something? Do you try to make it a hate crime?

[Edited on October 1, 2010 at 4:46 PM. Reason : .]

10/1/2010 4:44:51 PM

Quote :

"http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/10/rutgers_student_commits_suicid.html an interesting take on the case...with some new information that makes it seem not so cut and dry "

This is not new info, but most of the media outlets glazed over it in the beginning for the sensationalism.

10/1/2010 5:03:37 PM

Darwin. Glad this loser is out of my gene pool.

10/1/2010 9:40:26 PM

Duro has it right... nothing was ever broadcast because the gay kid was reading his roommates twitter feed and shut off the webcam.

So his roommate outed him and tried to film him. No, that's not anything more than invasion of privacy... or attempted invasion of privacy if there is such thing.

10/1/2010 9:47:09 PM

I have tape over the webcam on my company laptop just it creeps me out that they could remotely turn it on.

10/1/2010 10:13:53 PM

The intent to do it ia still enough to get slapped with invasion of privacy and potentially hate crime.

I'm not saying I think the roommate is to blame for the suicide, but he certainly helped bush the victim in that direction. what he did was fucked up and should be punished.

10/2/2010 1:34:47 AM

Quote :

"helped bush the victim"

Freudian slip?

10/2/2010 2:21:13 AM

The kid wouldve killed himself over something else anyways. It was just a matter of time.

10/2/2010 9:46:02 AM

Quote :

"Darwin. Glad this loser is out of my gene pool."

Darwin already took care of that once Tyler put another man's cock in his moouth

[Edited on October 2, 2010 at 10:41 AM. Reason : f]

10/2/2010 10:41:25 AM

This thread makes me want to saw NC off the eastern seaboard

you motherfuckers need to get moved to an island and fast

10/2/2010 12:53:42 PM

youve git a lot more to worry bout than nc

10/2/2010 1:16:02 PM

^^ its unsurprising common fucking sense is so offensive to someone as utterly stupid as you are. Why don't you go follow this guy over the bridge.

10/2/2010 2:43:05 PM

your positions on this matter are not "common sense" they are "what the other southener next to me also thinks"

10/2/2010 3:30:15 PM

shameful

10/2/2010 4:18:03 PM

^^ Honestly, why should this kid get anymore sympathy than the girl in the UT porn, or Paris Hilton, or anyone else who's private affairs have been made public? Is it sad that the kid killed himself? Sure. But that doesn't mean that his roommate is to blame for his death, or that he should be regarded as any more of a victim or sympathetic figure than any other person who commits suicide.

10/2/2010 7:31:12 PM

I'm not suggesting we string up his room mates, but the utter lack of sympathy in this thread is astonishing

10/2/2010 7:43:07 PM

good for him. im glad he died.

10/2/2010 9:49:56 PM

sticks and stone may break my bones
but words will never hurt me...

unless i'm a weak-minded emo pussy who's feelings get hurt by a stiff breeze

10/2/2010 9:59:56 PM

okay, first of all, people ITT who are not gay, and have not therefore been subjected to random harassment about their sexuality for a large part of their lives, should hesitate before judging this dude for reacting the way he did. walk a mile in his shoes, then judge him.

secondly, regardless of whether his reaction was justified, this is a complete slimeball thing to do to anyone. putting up a webcam to record somebody else's sexual exploits goes beyond assholeness...for me, it verges on evil.

10/2/2010 11:08:31 PM

i'm not saying an act like this couldn't amount to evil but freshman roommates does not warrant that situation

theyve known each other for what, 2 months? this case could just amount to him being insensitive to someone who is gay not insensitive or cruel BECAUSE he is gay

otherwise i think for everyone who committed suicide who also happened to be gay, we'd be seeing some actual charges come down the pipeline like this every now and again. they don't.

10/2/2010 11:31:50 PM

^^ I don't think anyone's judging this kid for being upset about being filmed and put on the internet, that's understandable. killing yourself over that (or anything else for that matter) is the weakest, most cowardly thing you can do.

10/2/2010 11:51:14 PM

^^
I see your point. but being insensitive, and being insensitive specifically because he is gay, amount to pretty much the same thing. it's an awful thing to do in this situation, whether you're being a bigot or just an asshole.

^
some people are thick-skinned....others are not. sensitive people cannot help their sensitivity, and are not any less intrinsically valuable for that. and there is a lot of gray area between "feelings getting hurt by a stiff breeze," and being absolutely impervious to the opinions of others (which no one is.) everybody is affected by criticism, to a greater or lesser degree.

Quote :

"killing yourself over that (or anything else for that matter) is the weakest, most cowardly thing you can do."

I agree that this dude should not have killed himself. but I would not support the "or anything else for that matter" bit. not everyone has the abilities/advantages you have, and sometimes life simply becomes insupportable.

10/3/2010 1:10:36 AM

^ I think what's really reducing the sympathy level for the guy is that he knew his roommate didn't respect his privacy, but tried again a second time anyway, and that from what has been reported of the things he said online, his thought process seemed to go something like this:

My roommate doesn't respect my privacy.
I'll give him one more chance.
My roommate still doesn't respect my privacy.
How should I best deal with this?
I should contact the university. Also I had a great time despite the camera.
The university is taking this seriously, good.
Actually, I think jumping off a bridge is perhaps the best solution for this.

It's also worth noting for the people that suggest that he was "ashamed" or didn't want people to know etc etc, his posts certainly don't seem to reflect that fact, he tells people he had a guy over, he tells them he had a great time. Certainly not the words of someone trying to hide the fact that they're gay.

10/3/2010 8:53:55 AM

Quote :

"your positions on this matter are not "common sense" they are "what the other southener next to me also thinks""

its common sense that suicide is the most weak minded and cowardly thing you can do. I dont give a fuck if your reasoning is sexuality, race, financial, marital, whatever. You're a chump.

and you're a douchebag and a chump so following this guy off the bridge will do nothing but help our gene-pool.

10/3/2010 9:04:04 AM

^^ Right. Nothing suggests he was ashamed of his sexuality. and nothing really suggests that he wasn't out with his friends and family about his sexuality. His response to his roommate's bullshit was very reasonable and rational.

People who are SO certain that what the roommate did led to the suicide are jumping to conclusions. As did the media though, but they probably did it more for sensationalism.

From what we do know about the webcam stuff and his response, the suicide is kind of out of the blue. If he hadn't killed himself and the story broke about the other stuff, I wouldn't think the guy was suicidal at all from what's actually available (the details of the webcam incidents and his posts). And I wouldn't be surprised at all if we find out something completely different was going on in his life that was much more influential in his decision than this webcam business.

[Edited on October 3, 2010 at 1:33 PM. Reason : .]

10/3/2010 1:32:30 PM

For the record anyone who films and and streams gay sex is gay in my book.

Not that there's anything wrong with being gay, just pointing it out that it's pretty fucking weird to try to embarrass someone for being gay when you're obviously gayer than he is.

Quote :

"or Paris Hilton"

You can't seriously be saying there isn't a difference between agreeing to license a sex tape to make millions of dollars and having a roomate tape you having gay sex?

I mean in one instance someone signs a contract agreeing to have themselves videod and distributed for personal gain and in the other scenario random people get to see you unknowingly being defiled by a dude.

That's a really tough stance to defend.

[Edited on October 3, 2010 at 1:44 PM. Reason : ...]

10/3/2010 1:38:43 PM

Neil Patrick Harris:


Ellen:


NC is a rarity for the south, in that we passed an anti-bullying bill to promote training educators on how recognize & deal with it (for all kids, not gay kids specifically, although they are certainly included), improve reporting mechanisms, and improve related policies and the like. There was some PPP polling on whether or not North Carolinians supported the bullying bill. Here is the break down (basically most do support the measure):



To my knowledge the GOP unanimously voted against it (same as they did for giving parents the option of having their kids taught more comprehensive sex ed which I discussed in the link below).
http://www.thewolfweb.com/message_topic.aspx?topic=601476

I worry, if the GOP wins the General Assembly, which seems likely, that they'll repeal these laws that they took unanimous stands against like comprehensive sex ed, & anti-bullying, and they'll finally pass that anti-gay marriage constitutional amendment bill that they introduce every year (but the dems kill it every year).

10/4/2010 4:58:55 PM

so why are conservatives not as much in favor of an anti-bullying measure as liberals?

10/4/2010 5:02:18 PM

Quote :

"You can't seriously be saying there isn't a difference between agreeing to license a sex tape to make millions of dollars and having a roomate tape you having gay sex? "

To my understanding, the tape was never intended for release, and I'm fairly certain she won a lawsuit over the tape's release. I could be wrong, I don't exactly follow these things, but that was my understanding of the situation.


^ Likely due to the view of being responsible for yourself and handling your own shit. You don't need a law to make it illegal for someone to call you a fat fuck, you need to learn how to deal with people being assholes and move on with your life. You can't legislate unpleasantness away. That said, I'm all for increased training/funding/authority for schools to handle bullies when it turns from simple bullying to out and out harassment or gets physical.

[Edited on October 4, 2010 at 5:37 PM. Reason : asdf]

10/4/2010 5:32:07 PM

Quote :

"1337 b4k4: ^ Likely due to the view of being responsible for yourself and handling your own shit. You don't need a law to make it illegal for someone to call you a fat fuck, you need to learn how to deal with people being assholes and move on with your life. You can't legislate unpleasantness away. That said, I'm all for increased training/funding/authority for schools to handle bullies when it turns from simple bullying to out and out harassment or gets physical."

When it comes to legislation, conservative anti-anti-bullying sentiment revolves entirely around their socially "conservative" (fucked up) views on homosexuality.

There have been so many stories about gay kids getting bullied...that passing anti-bullying legislation, in the minds of conservatives, is the same thing as passing pro-gay legislation (especially if that legislation includes any specific language about gay students). They can't have people thinking they support the gays...and they're willing to vote down anti-bullying legislation to that end.

Many of them also view anti-bullying measures for all kids (including gay kids) as some type of slippery slope. If we can't bully them, then maybe we shouldn't be such assholes about them getting married. And to perversely twist that up: If they can't get married, then why can't we bully them? I mean, if our governments won't openly recognize that it's a legitimate/natural orientation deserving of respect/rights, then why should our kids respect it?

[Edited on October 4, 2010 at 7:05 PM. Reason : Did I get this right?]

10/4/2010 6:56:13 PM

^ Maybe for the actual politicians and the GOP. I think most people are more along what I've described. Bullying sucks, but most people manage to get through it without killing themselves. Sometimes it means growing thicker skin, sometimes it means fighting back. Anti-bullying legislation to these people probably reads a bit like thought crime legislation (see also hate crimes). You might see some people object to specific language about gays (really, why should any law like that single out a particular group?) but I would be amazed if you find anyone short of Rush or Hanity or one of their ilk who would draw a connection between anti-bullying legislation and gay marriage.

In politics it rarely does good to attribute something to malice that is more easily attributed to stupidity or a mere difference of opinion. And that of course ignores all the people that might simply be opposed to it because they feel it isn't the responsibility of the government to be involved at all.

[Edited on October 4, 2010 at 7:41 PM. Reason : sdf]

10/4/2010 7:40:26 PM

^NC's anti-bullying law includes specific language about sexual orientation/gender identity (for obvious fucking reasons)--if I recall correctly, they gave different examples of bullying and one of those included sexual orientation/gender identity. Anyway, NC republicans bitched like babies about how it was a gay conspiracy to take a step toward legitimizing gay marriage. And the bill only passed by one vote.

As to your claim that average conservatives are against the law cause they think kids should handle their own shit...most conservatives, like most liberals, are stupid-crazy for protecting the children...it was the line about gay kids that turned conservatives off.

Your explanation definitely still flies though...but it's not unique to conservatives and certainly doesn't explain the huge numbers of conservatives that opposed the legislation.

[Edited on October 4, 2010 at 8:06 PM. Reason : ]

10/4/2010 8:03:31 PM