where was sawyer during all this? just chilling in the cave?

3/3/2010 10:07:28 AM

I told you man

He can't get outta there

3/3/2010 10:11:22 AM

We have no idea whether Sayid is dead or not. But, my guess is that if he's dead, so is Claire.

But we don't know whether Sayid was *actually* brought back to life, or if the MiB did the same thing he did to him that he did to Locke; that is, simply use his body. But there are two reasons to think that he isn't/can't be doing this. The first is that Ilana told us that the MiB is "trapped" right now in Locke's body (he seems to be trapped in two ways-trapped into Locke's body AND trapped on the island). The second is that we have no reason to believe that the MiB can "control" two or more bodies at once.

On the flip side of that...Miles did say that the magic water did not bring Sayid back to life, that something else did. So, he could be dead and he could not be. Who knows.

3/3/2010 11:34:13 AM

Quote :

"But we don't know whether Sayid was *actually* brought back to life, or if the MiB did the same thing he did to him that he did to Locke; that is, simply use his body."

you have to be trolling, seriously. there are two john locke's on the island right now, a dead one six feet in the ground and the smoke monster impersonation of him. at no point in time did sayid's dead body leave the sight of the losties before coming back to life

3/3/2010 11:40:47 AM

What makes you think I'm trolling? I'm just trying to figure out something based on what we've seen. There is a very real chance that Sayid could actually be dead. Come on, you've seen this show, you know how they operate. Don't act like it's out of the realm of possibility that Sayid would be dead.

3/3/2010 11:52:36 AM

honestly, with this show, I don't even think it matters if you die at any point in time. people are always coming back to life

3/3/2010 11:57:26 AM

Quote :

"Well Dogan said so and I can't think of a motive he would have to say "the same thing happened to claire as Sayid" plus she is worried about finding her son."

dogen could've said the same thing about sawyer since he obviously had



inside him as well. it doesn't mean claire died and was brought back to life.

Quote :

"honestly, with this show, I don't even think it matters if you die at any point in time. people are always coming back to life"

no, they're not.

3/3/2010 11:59:05 AM

Quote :

"also, does kate have the "darkness" now? She was hanging on that ladder and things got really weird/slow motion style and then all of a sudden she is in a trance almost walking out and joining locke, claire, and sayid."

I don't think so. I think she just doesn't quite realize what is going on. I don't think she was present for the "leave by sunset with this guy or you die" speech. She was off trying to talk to Claire at that point. She just knows Smokey attacked the temple. You probably noticed that she stopped and grabbed a gun, that's a normal Kate move. Plus MiB looked at her funny when she walked out of the temple, he wasnt' expecting her.

Quote :

"sayid should have stabbed locke before he said something to him... locke had time to say, "hello" and after that it was too late."

I don't recall MiB saying hello before he was stabbed, i may be wrong though. The wind was rushing around, then it stopped and suddenly Locke stepped out of the woods, and I think Sayid immediately ran toward him and stabbed him.

3/3/2010 12:39:31 PM

He said hello before he was stabbed

It didn't matter though, he is obviously stab-proof

3/3/2010 12:41:51 PM

The MiB definitely said "Hello" before Sayid stabbed him. I remember, because I couldn't help but wonder what would've happened if Sayid stabbed him before he said "hello." At this point, though, I don't think stabbing the MiB before he says a word will kill him. I think Dogen was just trying to get Sayid killed because he knew he would turn on him and Sol Star/Kenny's brother in "Eastbound and Down" (I don't know the character's name; Dogen's sidekick). Sucks that Dogen died so early on, I was starting to like him.

As far as whether or not Sayid is dead, I'm torn; however, I don't really think it matters, either. What matters is that, whether dead or alive, he's definitely a puppet for MiB right now.

[Edited on March 3, 2010 at 12:45 PM. Reason : .]

3/3/2010 12:43:37 PM

Quote :

"(I don't know the character's name; Dogen's sidekick)"

i saw on one of the enhanced episodes from this season that his name is Lennon

3/3/2010 12:46:52 PM

ok, i was just hoping to put an end to the "if sayid had stabbed him before hello, it could have killed him" notion. Oh well. I think dogen just wanted sayid dead anyhow.

3/3/2010 12:50:38 PM

That's right, Lennon. I remember reading that now. I always like that actor in all the shows I've seen him in.

On a side note...it looks like the producers of this show realize how bad they are at making the next-episode teasers/promos because they're asking the fans to do it for the series finale: http://abc.go.com/shows/lost/fan-promo-contest

[Edited on March 3, 2010 at 12:53 PM. Reason : .]

3/3/2010 12:50:50 PM

Quote :

"where was sawyer during all this? just chilling in the cave?"

likewise was hurley still watching jack stare at the ocean the whole time?

--

Quote :

"But we don't know whether Sayid was *actually* brought back to life, or if the MiB did the same thing he did to him that he did to Locke;"

Well, supposedly Dogen was the only thing keeping the MiB out of the temple, as Lennon told Zombie Sayid, so the MiB couldn't have brought Sayid back to life as his body was in the temple, and presumably out of the MiB's reach. Of course, I would not be surprised if the writers wrote in a loophole either.

Back in previous seasons, the Others were always retarded about burying the dead immediately.. this might be related to Sayid's situation.


Also, why did the baseball falling on the floor stop Dogen from killing Sayid? I get that it was a memory of the guy's son, but it still didn't explain why he decided not to kill him then, and then tried to kill him later by sending them to the MiB.

--

mambagrl shut the fuck up and stop whining about spoilers. If you don't want spoilers don't click on this fucking thread. For that reason, I never check this thread until after I've watched the latest episode. It's not that hard.

3/3/2010 1:27:23 PM

I think that it is interesting Jacob went to Japan to find Dogen after he and his son were in that accident. just as richard was brought there and made the way he was by jacob it seems dogen may have had the same.

as an issue that has been alluded to multiple times i wonder if this is the confirmation we need that involvement with the island is an opportunity to repent for your sins or misdoings.

3/3/2010 1:31:03 PM

Quote :

"likewise was hurley still watching jack stare at the ocean the whole time? "

I think some of that may have been going on somewhat simultaneously. Jack and Hurley couldn't have been that far from the temple when they ran into Kate. And she ran into Sayid (who was headed to see MiB) on her way back to the temple.

3/3/2010 2:06:51 PM

It could be worth noting that dogan died in the revival pond...

Quote :

"I don't think so. I think she just doesn't quite realize what is going on. I don't think she was present for the "leave by sunset with this guy or you die" speech. She was off trying to talk to Claire at that point. She just knows Smokey attacked the temple. You probably noticed that she stopped and grabbed a gun, that's a normal Kate move. Plus MiB looked at her funny when she walked out of the temple, he wasnt' expecting her."

thanks for repeating exactly what I said.

Quote :

"mambagrl shut the fuck up and stop whining about spoilers. If you don't want spoilers don't click on this fucking thread. For that reason, I never check this thread until after I've watched the latest episode. It's not that hard."

which is why imspecifically talking about spoilers for episodes that have not yet aired. just a common courtesy, thats all.

3/3/2010 2:08:12 PM

This season sucks so far - still a bunch of mysterious BS just for the sake of being mysterious. From just the last couple episodes, here's stuff I'm pretty sure will never be explained:

-Why did Jack have to be the one to give the pill to Sayid?
-Why did Jack have to come to Dogen on his own?
-Why does Dogen flip out when jack attempts to swallow the pill? Just earlier he was going to have the survivors killed on a whim.
-How did the "taint test" work? Was it even a test at all?
-If the listers are so important and ultimately free to do what they want, why doesn't Dogen just give it to them straight instead of lying and treating them like prisoners?
-Why didn't Dogen kill Sayid himself when he had the chance?
-How did Jacob's lighthouse work?
-Why did Jin suddenly change his mind about Claire knowing the truth?
-How was Dogen the only thing keeping the temple from falling? Why didn't he have bodyguards?

[Edited on March 3, 2010 at 2:45 PM. Reason : .]

3/3/2010 2:43:10 PM

Those are some pretty weak questions. Allow me to blow up your list.

-Why did Jack have to be the one to give the pill to Sayid?

Because Dogen knew Sayid would trust Jack

-Why did Jack have to come to Dogen on his own?

Don't know what you're talking about

-Why does Dogen flip out when jack attempts to swallow the pill?

Because Jack is a candidate

- Just earlier he was going to have the survivors killed on a whim.

Because he didn't know they were candidates

-How did the "taint test" work? Was it even a test at all?

Who cares how it works, it's just weird island voodoo magic. Of course it was a test.

-If the listers are so important and ultimately free to do what they want, why doesn't Dogen just give it to them straight instead of lying and treating them like prisoners?

Why didn't they just tell us all the answers in the first episode of season one. That would have made for a much better show.

-Why didn't Dogen kill Sayid himself when he had the chance?

He fully explained that in the last episode

-How did Jacob's lighthouse work?

Who cares

-Why did Jin suddenly change his mind about Claire knowing the truth?

Because Claire just axed a motherfucker in the chest

-How was Dogen the only thing keeping the temple from falling?

This is actually a semi-interesting question that hasn't been answered

- Why didn't he have bodyguards?

Why did he need bodyguards?

3/3/2010 3:06:34 PM

^ Good post. There are a lot of dumb questions and concerns in this thread (dead horse beating).

Quote :

"Back in previous seasons, the Others were always retarded about burying the dead immediately.. this might be related to Sayid's situation."

Interesting point.

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I want to say that they've hinted that someone is going to die in other previews and not followed through with it in the next episode. I don't see Ben biting the dust quite yet.
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3/3/2010 3:25:17 PM

Quote :

"which is why imspecifically talking about spoilers for episodes that have not yet aired. just a common courtesy, thats all."

post all of your comments, questions, concerns about the show in this thread you made

http://thewolfweb.com/message_topic.aspx?topic=588592

no one cares about what you post here. you bring nothing to the table.

Quote :

"-How was Dogen the only thing keeping the temple from falling? This is actually a semi-interesting question that hasn't been answered"

if dogen was enough to keep MiB away from the temple, i wonder why they even started spreading ash in the first place when they found out jacob was dead.

also, i don't think this will happen, but it will be interesting if kate sides with MiB since mikhail told locke, kate and sayid in season 3 that none of them were on jacob's list because they were too angry, flawed, and weak and afraid, respectively.

[Edited on March 3, 2010 at 3:34 PM. Reason : .]

3/3/2010 3:27:54 PM

obviously dogen thought the dagger would work. he took it out of an ornamental box that was buried under a plant... he must have thought it contained some type of magic powers..

but obviously MIB can't be killed that way... so i don't even know what to think anymore.

3/3/2010 3:37:34 PM

He knew it wouldn't work, he wanted smoke zombie Sayid dead and thought smoke Locke would do it.

3/3/2010 3:39:27 PM

Because Dogen knew Sayid would trust Jack
In other words, why the hell does that matter?

Don't know what you're talking about
When Jack came to ask about the pill, Dogen said something to the effect of "Good, I had hoped you came on your own initiative" in a way that suggested it was very significant.

Because Jack is a candidate..Because he didn't know they were candidates
Of course he knew they were candidates. Many "Others" know every candidate's bio in creepy detail, before even meeting them. I won't even entertain the possibility that Dogen and company don't know any of them by now.

Why didn't they just tell us all the answers in the first episode of season one. That would have made for a much better show.
Dogen's behavior towards the candidates works entirely against his own agenda. It just doesn't make a whit of sense. I'm not saying he should explain everything, but he could have explained a little bit and avoided all his current problems.

He fully explained that in the last episode
See the first complaint.

it's just weird island voodoo magic
There's a mechanical piece to the "voodoo magic" that needs to be exposed. Why a lighthouse instead of a crystal ball? Why a machine instead of a ouiji board?

Because Claire just axed a motherfucker in the chest
Wouldn't that be an incentive NOT to suddenly change your story?

Why did he need bodyguards?
Apparently he is the crux of the temple's defenses. Yet he is chilling, alone with his back to the tainted Sayid who he knows is working for Locke.

I'm not saying any of this stuff can't be explained, just that they probably won't be. They can't be taking these kind of liberties in the last season. In first seasons, it was easy to suspend disbelief because you could always say to yourself "OK that really makes no sense, but maybe it will be explained in the end".

[Edited on March 3, 2010 at 4:01 PM. Reason : .]

3/3/2010 3:52:09 PM

Quote :

"In other words, why the hell does that matter? "

Do you take pills given to you by people you don't trust? Are you more likely to take it from someone you not only trust but is a doctor?

Quote :

"Of course he knew they were candidates. Many "Others" know every candidate's bio in creepy detail, before even meeting them. How does Dogen and every guy with him not know these people by now?"

I'm not sure we know who knows about the candidates and who does not. We do know 100% that once Dogen read the note from Jacob (which was in the guitar case) he had no problem letting them in. So the answer to your initial question about this is that they were complete strangers, so he ordered them killed. However, he then read Jacob's note, then asked their names, and then let them in. For all we know, the note said.. "Hey D, these guys are candidates. Let them in and put Sayid in the healing fountain." At which point he asked their names because and since they said names of candidates (which he knew according to you) he let them in. Even if you're right about knowing the names of the candidates, that doesn't mean he would know what they look like.

Quote :

"Dogen's behavior towards the candidates works entirely against his own agenda. It just doesn't make a whit of sense."

What? I'm not sure we know Dogen's agenda.


And generally, i disagree about not explaining some of this. Some of it simply doesn't matter.

[Edited on March 3, 2010 at 4:00 PM. Reason : .]

3/3/2010 3:59:36 PM

Quote :

"Also, why did the baseball falling on the floor stop Dogen from killing Sayid? I get that it was a memory of the guy's son, but it still didn't explain why he decided not to kill him then, and then tried to kill him later by sending them to the MiB."

baseballs have 108 stitches.......











that proves nothing

3/3/2010 4:06:03 PM

Quote :

"Do you take pills given to you by people you don't trust? Are you more likely to take it from someone you not only trust but is a doctor? "

You're missing the point, which is why all this shady beat-around-the-bush stuff when they could just SHOOT Sayid? Why is it any different if he takes the medicine willingly? And what then? What if Dogen successfully tricked Jack into killing Sayid? That would just create a whole new set of problems for Dogen.

Quote :

"What? I'm not sure we know Dogen's agenda."

Here is what we KNOW his orders are:
-Keep people from leaving the temple
-The candidates are imporant and their assistance is essential
-Remove the tainted ones

Even if Dogen and Glasses had no idea they were candidates, it would just be incredibly lame. So many underlings knew their faces, history, and even their mental vulnerabilities, before they even met the candidates.

3/3/2010 4:19:41 PM

Why didn't Fake Locke just ask Claire to make a break in the line of ash around the temple? Oh and it STILL hasn't said anything about why he can't pass over ash. Or the sonic barriers around the Dharma camp.

3/3/2010 4:40:21 PM

Why's a tree good?
Why's a sunset good?
Why are boobs good?

They just are.

3/3/2010 4:47:28 PM

^obviously the sunset was not too good for the people in the temple this episode.

3/3/2010 4:48:18 PM

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/03/01/AR2010030103497.html

Quote :

"Many of the questions posed during the run of "Lost" that have been keeping you up at night are never going to be answered on the show but will instead be tossed on the compost heap like an old turnip, because, the writers say, they have run out of time. "There's a lot of little questions that unfortunately we just don't have time to answer in the amount of time that we have left," co-creator Cuse told the uber-fans."

welp, can't say this is surprising

3/3/2010 4:48:25 PM

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Unanswered_questions_by_episode
http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Mysteries

3/3/2010 4:50:24 PM

^^Maybe they will at least release some kind of statement saying what they had originally planned to do with the unanswered questions once the season is over?


Oh and what chance do you guys think that maybe Dogen and Lennon will come back evil? Sayid did throw their bodies into the healing pool afterall, and the water was still dark.

3/3/2010 5:23:00 PM

Quote :

"Oh and what chance do you guys think that maybe Dogen and Lennon will come back evil? Sayid did throw their bodies into the healing pool afterall, and the water was still dark."

certainly can't rule it out, but i don't know if sayid got



in him before he got drowned in the pool or not. it seemed like that might've been what alerted dogen and lennon, but claire and sawyer also have



and they weren't put it in it. or at least there is nothing to suggest that claire was.

3/3/2010 5:29:18 PM

plz to embed

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0O9NVCVMwo&feature=player_embedded

3/3/2010 7:13:12 PM

i guess my theory about dogen coming to the island on the black rock was wrong

3/4/2010 12:39:09 AM

I hope we get some more Alpert soon

He's the single most intriguing person left to me on this show

3/4/2010 9:04:47 AM

^march 23rd

3/4/2010 1:24:59 PM

so pumped for that one. it was rated the best episode of season 6 from people who read the scripts. i need it, especially since i haven't given a fuck about what has gone on in the flash sideways in every episode except for locke's and have been sort of disappointed with season 6 so far overall. the end of "sundown" was pretty good though.

and i just thought of this: assuming the color of the water in the temple and its healing properties changed after jacob died, is it possible that jacob knew about that before telling hurley to send sayid there to be healed? if he did then he might have orchestrated everything that happened and sacrificed one of his pieces (sayid) and a whole lot of other people for some purpose that hasn't been revealed yet.

[Edited on March 4, 2010 at 1:39 PM. Reason : ibt mambagrl bitchfest]

3/4/2010 1:37:13 PM

according to jorge garcia


SPOILER




















































































we will get to see how the statue crumbled
















































































/SPOILER






if mambagrl talks shit, so help me god....

3/4/2010 8:00:02 PM

^ was always wondering about that; glad to know it'll be shown

3/5/2010 8:41:28 AM

^^Wait a minute so you're saying that Vincent turns evil and kills Kate? THAT'S CRAZY! I liked Vincent a lot before but I like him a lot more now!!

3/5/2010 2:33:32 PM

way to ruin the finale for everyone

3/5/2010 2:59:19 PM

Serious question though, what the fuck happened to vincent. I haven't seen him all season AND IM PISSED

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1807667/

[Edited on March 5, 2010 at 3:09 PM. Reason : .]

3/5/2010 3:04:50 PM

he was living with rose and bernard. assuming they were thrown forward into 2007 like everyone else, they should be on the island somewhere. if they were somehow left behind then they're probably adam and eve from the caves.

3/5/2010 3:53:01 PM

Quote :

"^^Maybe they will at least release some kind of statement saying what they had originally planned to do with the unanswered questions once the season is over?"

Cuse & Lindelof have already stated that once the finale airs that the entire creative team is going dark and that there will be no further discussions or insight into what could be or what was left unsolved. which i like.


jesus the discussions after this episode have been the worst ones yet. i have a headache from some of you people

3/5/2010 5:31:41 PM

So for the 2 hour finale, I predict that the first hour will be again be a bunch of nonsense with no questions answered. Then the 2nd hour will begin with "Ladies and Gentlemen, Mr. Conway Twitty." (a la Family Guy)

3/5/2010 5:44:55 PM

Quote :

"jesus the discussions after this episode have been the worst ones yet. i have a headache from some of you people"

3/5/2010 10:03:18 PM

At this stage of the game it wouldn't surprise me if Sayid was actually dead dead. The "alternate reality" stuff is starting to get boring though as I seriously doubt it has any bearing or will be related to what's happening on the island.

3/5/2010 10:29:46 PM

it will. they wouldn't have it in there if it wasn't going to be important.

[Edited on March 5, 2010 at 11:45 PM. Reason : .]

3/5/2010 11:36:40 PM