GG Mr. Gibson, on showing how unprepared Palin is to lead, and how unprepared her fans are to vote.

9/13/2008 9:55:10 AM

So, I see you've decided to stop even responding to anything posted now.

9/13/2008 9:57:07 AM

You guys do a fine job making up for DNL's MIA status.

GG.

As for Palin:

keep up the attacks. have fun making up your lies and praising obama on all his experience. lol. it'll be fun.

9/13/2008 10:02:06 AM

It's a lie... that she... didn't know the answer to a high schools US History exam... ?

9/13/2008 10:06:52 AM

I doubt %20 of americans even know the name of the democratic vp pick. lol

9/13/2008 10:22:44 AM

I bet 100% of American know where to put the percent sign.

I also thought Barack Obama was this huge celebrity, at least that is what the McCain camp wants me to know, and now you are telling me 60,000,000 don't know who he is? What type of celebrity is that?

[Edited on September 13, 2008 at 10:25 AM. Reason : .]

9/13/2008 10:23:16 AM

which question did she not know the answer to?

9/13/2008 10:55:22 AM

The question about the Bush doctrine. It's clear she didn't know what it was. You can say there have been numerous meanings of the phrase over the course of his presidency. Fine. She could have picked one. She didn't. She doesn't know what it is, and for all the people saying "well, I'm ignorant too, so it's okay," I can't help but think that the people running our country should be a little more informed than we are.

Mechanic doesn't know how to replace my timing belt? Fuck it, neither do I.

Doctor doesn't know this combination of medications could kill me? Fuck it, neither do I.

Presidential candidate doesn't know the meaning of Habeas Corpus? Fuck it man, who the fuck does? Let's go watch some fuckin' football, dudes.

Is it alarming to anybody else to see the shockingly low standards some of us have for the people we raise to positions of power? Doesn't anyone else think that if you're running for president you should have at least a basic grasp of how the country works?

But who cares? Seriously. It is already overwhelmingly obvious to anybody thinking rationally that Sarah Palin is in no way equipped to be the president of the United States should she be called upon to do so. It is overwhelmingly obvious that the McCain campaign, as a whole, will shove as many lies down the throats of the voters as they possibly can and hope that it doesn't catch up to them until November 5th. None of that really seems to make a difference.

The fact that McCain even has a chance--not based on his policies, mind you, but based on the way he's running this election--absolutely sickens me. I'd like to say we're smarter than this, we're better than this, but if the last eight years have proven anything, it is that we clearly are not.

9/13/2008 11:11:19 AM

Thanks spooky. Here is a good read on it.

"There is no single meaning of the Bush doctrine. In fact, there have been four distinct meanings, each one succeeding another over the eight years of this administration -- and the one Charlie Gibson cited is not the one in common usage today. It is utterly different."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/12/AR2008091202457.html?hpid=opinionsbox1

I too am concerned that we have someone that wants to take this country a huge step towards socialism with no experience is the hands on favorite of winning the presidency. I still feel that obama will win in nov, but im a little more optomistic about mccains chances. I think both are moving in the wrong direction. Its just mccain is 3 steps and Obama is a marathon worth of steps in the wrong direction.

9/13/2008 11:16:28 AM

I seriously wish we could just get back to OMFG SOCIALIST vs. OMFG FASCIST because it was a lot more fulfilling than all of this soul-killing "gotcha" crap.

9/13/2008 11:19:48 AM

well im sorry I dont have another name for wealth redistribution.

Our govt needs to CUT spending, not increase it..(massively). We dont have an income problem, we have a spending one. I dont care how much money our govt takes in.. they will find away to spend it. that is the truth, as shitty as it is.

I wont vote for obama #1 because of his spending proposals and increasing govt esp with yet another entitlement.

id love for mccain to come out adn say he is going to not only freeze discretionary spending, as he has, but say every program will be cut 10% next year.. across the board. That would be true leadership, unfortunately they both are in pandering mode.

9/13/2008 11:26:35 AM

^^^ While it does sounds as if Gibson set up Palin, Krauhammer needs to calm down. As there are multiple definitions or aspects to the doctrine, the one Gibson used wasn't wrong. Please. I, for one, still think of preemptive strikes as the Bush doctrine.

[Edited on September 13, 2008 at 11:27 AM. Reason : set up]

9/13/2008 11:27:03 AM

spookyjon,

you mean the same "gotcha" crap you are trying to play on Palin's response on the Bush Doctrine?

Anyways, she actually used a version of the Bush Doctrine that Gibson has used himself in the past.

Quote :

"GIBSON: The president in his speech last night, very forceful. Four out of five Americans watched it. Everybody gathered around the television set last night. The president issued a series of demands to the Taliban, already rejected. We'll get to that in a moment. He also outlined what is being called the Bush Doctrine, a promise that all terrorists organizations with global reach will be found, stopped and defeated."

http://www.weeklystandard.com/weblogs/TWSFP/2008/09/what_exactly_is_the_bush_doctr.asp#more

Not the most objective source I know, but no one seems shy about quoting the DailyKos or TPM, so I'm sure you won't bitch about me using the Weekly Standard.

PS* Please don't bitch about how modern politics "sickens" you. Until Barry started falling in poll numbers the only thing you have done is post link after link of bullshit scandal and trite non-sense about John McCain. "HEY JOHN MCCAIN MAY HAVE FLIP-FLOPPED ON SOCIAL SECURITY!!! GOTCHA!!!!!!" Grow the fuck up, man. You don't actually give a fuck about "gotcha games" unless you're losing them. You're just upset your candidate is falling behind (and you really shouldn't invest that much of yourself in politician).

[Edited on September 13, 2008 at 11:44 AM. Reason : ``]

9/13/2008 11:35:42 AM

correct socks, now that they are worried and down in the polls the whining has really started. I tried to watch bill mahr last night. Its the same ole shit. Look how stupid everyone is on the republicans. Morons, idiots, etc... Palin makes bush look like a professor.. etc. They do this third grade name calling every year. Thier guy is the smartest man ever, the other is the dumbest.

P.S. I hope they keep it up.

9/13/2008 11:49:18 AM

Quote :

"“The last month, for sure,” said Don Sipple, a Republican advertising strategist, “I think the predominance of liberty taken with truth and the facts has been more McCain than Obama.” Indeed, in recent days, Mr. McCain has been increasingly called out by news organizations, editorial boards and independent analysts like FactCheck.org. The group, which does not judge whether one candidate is more misleading than another, has cried foul on Mr. McCain more than twice as often since the start of the political conventions as it has on Mr. Obama."

Quote :

"Mr. McCain came into the race promoting himself as a truth teller and has long publicly deplored the kinds of negative tactics that helped sink his candidacy in the Republican primaries in 2000. But his strategy now reflects a calculation advisers made this summer — over the strenuous objections of some longtime hands who helped him build his “Straight Talk” image — to shift the campaign more toward disqualifying Mr. Obama in the eyes of voters. “I think the McCain folks realize if they can get this thing down in the mud, drag Obama into the mud, that’s where they have the best advantage to win,” said Matthew Dowd, who worked with many top McCain campaign advisers when he was President Bush’s chief strategist in the 2004 campaign, but who has since had a falling out with the White House. “If they stay up at 10,000 feet, they don’t.”"

Quote :

"Mr. Sipple, the Republican strategist, voiced concern that Mr. McCain’s approach could backfire. “Any campaign that is taking liberty with the truth and does it in a serial manner will end up paying for it in the end,” he said. “But it’s very unbecoming to a political figure like John McCain whose flag was planted long ago in ground that was about ‘straight talk’ and integrity.”"

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/13/us/politics/13mccain.html?pagewanted=1&_r=3&hp

Even the republicans are starting to see that the McCain campaign isn't who they claim, on several fronts.

9/13/2008 11:57:43 AM

McCain will just "disown" the statements... then all will be ok.

9/13/2008 12:02:27 PM

Quote :

"PS* Please don't bitch about how modern politics "sickens" you. Until Barry started falling in poll numbers the only thing you have done is post link after link of bullshit scandal and trite non-sense about John McCain. "HEY JOHN MCCAIN MAY HAVE FLIP-FLOPPED ON SOCIAL SECURITY!!! GOTCHA!!!!!!" Grow the fuck up, man. You don't actually give a fuck about "gotcha games" unless you're losing them. You're just upset your candidate is falling behind (and you really shouldn't invest that much of yourself in politician)."

To me, "gotchas" are more along the lines of pig in lipstick, five million dollars, 100 years, shit like that. Sorry if my definition doesn't mesh with yours, Socks``. I'm a maverick in that respect.

And if by "modern politics" you mean "incessant lying", then, yes, it sickens me. As to whether I didn't give a fuck, and whatever that may have to do with posting about the numerous reasons why people shouldn't be voting for McCain, all I can say is that the McCain campaigns lies bothered me a lot less when they weren't working so well. That has less to do with this election than it does with my perception of how fucked America is in the long run.

As for being "too invested" in Barack Obama, I'm not. I was quite invested in him until the whole FISA thing. Now I'm less of an Obama supporter and more of a McCain detractor.

9/13/2008 12:03:16 PM

Quote :

"Capitalizing on errors, rumors and perceived sexism in the frenzied first round of reporting on Palin, the McCain campaign has taken advantage of a changing media landscape, grouping together blogs and supermarket tabloids with mainstream newspapers and television to tar the media as one corrupt monolith, stirring up the conservative base and working to pressure the media from further aggressive reporting on Palin."

Quote :

""The smearing of the Palin family must end," McCain communications guru Steve Schmidt said in that statement. "The efforts of the media and tabloids to destroy this fine and accomplished public servant are a disgrace." But the McCain camp didn't push back only against those media flubs. It moved seamlessly against many legitimate questions posed about Palin's record and experience. When CNN pressed a McCain spokesman to identify an example of Palin's experience commanding the Alaska National Guard, one of her bragging points, the campaign retaliated by ruling out a McCain interview with Larry King. It turned out that Palin never has commanded the Alaska National Guard to do anything, according to the Anchorage Daily News. When other reporters asked questions about Palin's experience, McCain's campaign accused the media of being sexist, charging that "nobody" had ever asked about Barack Obama's experience, despite thousands of articles mentioning Obama's relative inexperience. [haha] Accusing the media of smearing a candidate is "a standard tactic" for politicians who don't want scrutiny, according to Brooks Jackson, director of Annenberg Political Fact Check, which operates the non-partisan voter resource FactCheck.org."

+ http://www.mcclatchydc.com/227/story/52394.html

9/13/2008 12:28:31 PM

fuck sarah palin

9/13/2008 12:52:52 PM

spookyjon,

Wait wait wait. So, Obama lies about McCain's position (saying McCain wanted to stay at war in Iraq for 100 years or more when he said nothing of the kind making it an outright lie) and you call that a distracting "gotcha game".

McCain takes the text of some sex ed legislation at face value (not giving it the most fair or interprutation but not outright lying about it) and that is an incessant lie that sickens you?

Yah, you really are maverick. You have one set of rules for the candidate you like and another set for the one you don't. MAVERICK!!!

Please quit trying to pretend that you actually spend time thinking about the issues in question. Up until now, your most frequent contributions to discusisons about the eleciton have been quoting partisan articles against McCain and screaming "maverick". Now that Obama is dropping in the polls you want to talk about issues and character? Give me a break. You are not knowing cynic you wish you were. You apprently just can't help youself from "belieeeevvving".

[Edited on September 13, 2008 at 12:56 PM. Reason : ``]

9/13/2008 12:53:37 PM

Quote :

"McCain takes the text of some sex ed legislation at face value (not giving it the most fair or interprutation but not outright lying about it) and that is an incessant lie that sickens you? "

You are delusional if you don't see that as outright lying. Have you watched the ad about that? It's absurd.

9/13/2008 1:00:37 PM

Quote :

"(saying McCain wanted to stay at war in Iraq for 100 years or more when he said nothing of the kind making it an outright lie)"

He supported keeping American troops for a hundred years. Hell, he even increased that to a thousand or million when asked again.

9/13/2008 1:17:37 PM

9/13/2008 1:50:14 PM

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=a5OmYQ2mpOaw&refer=us

Quote :

" Barack Obama asked New Hampshire voters to help victims of Hurricane Ike and said he will work to address the ``quiet storms'' and economic woes affecting Americans. ``This could be a very difficult and trying time for the people who live in the Gulf,'' the Democratic presidential candidate told more than 7,000 people today at a rally in Manchester, New Hampshire. ``We may end up needing volunteers and supplies, and I know that all of you will be there if that should become necessary.'' ... Asked by a supporter in Dover when he was going to ``start fighting back'' against attack ads, Obama said he would stick to the issues while answering attacks with ``the truth.'' ``I'm not going to start making up lies about John McCain,'' Obama said. ``If they lie about us, then we will correct the record.'' Americans, he said, ``are looking for a serious statement about how I can make your lives better, how you can live out your American dream.''"

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalradar/2008/09/obamas-change-s.html

Quote :

" ABC New's Sunlen Miller reports: Hey, what happened to "Change We Can Believe In?" Barack Obama has suddenly changed his campaign slogan and signage replacing the 19 month Obama campaign event staple with a new one: "Change We Need.""

[Edited on September 13, 2008 at 1:58 PM. Reason : ]

9/13/2008 1:57:14 PM

eh, it was time for a change.

9/13/2008 2:17:51 PM

9/13/2008 2:21:12 PM

thx for discussing the issues. like about Palin's daughter and shit

9/13/2008 2:24:30 PM

^ perfect example of a McCain supporter. The only ones to mention palin's daughter in the past few pages has been McCain supports.

9/13/2008 2:29:15 PM

Quote :

"``I'm not going to start making up lies about John McCain,'' Obama said."

Does he mean anymore lies (since has indeed lied about McCain's positions)? If so that would be great.

[Edited on September 13, 2008 at 2:42 PM. Reason : ``]

9/13/2008 2:41:33 PM

Haha, So Obama's statements are "lies" now but McCain's are "not the most fair interpretations"?

It's clear who the one that is "so invested" in their candidate is. Like McCain's lies are to him, delusion is not very becoming of you.

9/13/2008 2:45:31 PM

When both sides are bringing changes...it all feels the same again

9/13/2008 2:50:51 PM

GoldenViper

Tell that to FactCheck.org. Here they are referring to Obama's use of the lie during one of the debates, but he used it routinely on the stump until reporters started asking him about it during interviews.

Quote :

"Obama twisted the words of John McCain, the likely Republican nominee: Obama: We are bogged down in a war that John McCain now suggests might go on for another 100 years. Actually, McCain suggested no such thing. "

http://www.factcheck.org/mobile/article.php?id=500&page=2

PS* moron, As I understand it, McCain's ad doesn't actually say anything untrue. But even if it did, the election wouldn't be about liar v. uncomprosing truth teller. It would be about which liar you agree with more. I don't like McCain's current campaign strategy. But I don't see him doing anything Obama didn't do first. That doesn't make it right, of course. But I understand McCain can't allow himself to be slimed by a huckster from Hawaii without responding. Look what happened to Bill Bradely in 2000. Gore went negative, Bradely didn't. Who won the nomination? You have to fight fire with fire, my friend.

[Edited on September 13, 2008 at 2:58 PM. Reason : ``]

9/13/2008 2:51:04 PM

^ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NxioiwqufU

You don't see any blatant lying in that ad? really?

9/13/2008 2:57:25 PM

^ nope. And nothing the video says latter shows other wise. At worst, you can say the video leaves a false impression because it doesn't go into detail about what would be included in "comprehensive sex education." It's unfair, very unfair. But a lie? No.

9/13/2008 3:02:35 PM

9/13/2008 3:11:02 PM

To say that they'd be learning "about sex" is definitely an outright lie.

Will any of the children leave the room knowing what sex is?

9/13/2008 3:15:05 PM

Quote :

"`I'm not going to start making up lies about John McCain,'' Obama said. ``If they lie about us, then we will correct the record.''"

well with that attitude, and going up against the republican machine that is running McCain's campaign, he will lose.
The public listens to and believes lies, but and they don't listen to "record corrections" or even recants. It's simply a political calculation that any candidate makes, and McCain has chosen his path - lie about Obama and even about his and Palin's own records, then when called on their lies, either deny or slightly backpedal. Either way, the original message (the lie) is the one that people will remember.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/joseph-romm/obama-and-biden-go-back-t_b_124788.html

9/13/2008 3:17:27 PM

Both engage in double-speak. The McCain campaign is worse. That's largely why they are leading in the polls.

9/13/2008 3:27:26 PM

^^ The problem with that strategy is that debates are coming up, that these same people will watch hopefully, and McCain is going to have to answer for the lies.

9/13/2008 3:28:59 PM

Not really. When did Bush have to answer for his attack ads?

Did he ever get back to us on McCain's black baby?

9/13/2008 3:31:56 PM

The black baby didn't come from Bush.

This kidnergarten sex ed IS coming from McCain.

9/13/2008 3:34:17 PM

so, if you get the bloggers and the media to do your dirty work, then you don't have to answer for it, right?

9/13/2008 3:46:48 PM

If you want to bring bloggers in to it, McCain has a LOT more to worry about than Obama.

[Edited on September 13, 2008 at 3:49 PM. Reason : and media]

9/13/2008 3:48:58 PM

Charlie Gibson should have been a little better prepared. He ask her about the "God's will piece in Iraq". He got trapped by leftwing nutjob jounalism. She made him look like a fool.

[Edited on September 13, 2008 at 4:16 PM. Reason : .]

9/13/2008 4:16:32 PM

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/13/campaign.wrap/index.html

Quote :

"Obama aide: McCain campaign 'sleaziest' in modern history # Story Highlights # Barack Obama rails against John McCain in New Hampshire rally # Obama aide: McCain running "least honorable campaign" in modern history # McCain spokesman: Obama comments shows "zero restraint" during hurricane # McCain releases ad blasting Obama on immigration although he voted the same"

I found that amusing. How hurricane sensitive do you have to be during hurricane season? Is that more important than a presidential election?

9/13/2008 4:25:42 PM

this campaign is really showing that "political correctness" is not solely a whining liberal trait

9/13/2008 4:31:37 PM

Quote :

"McCain releases ad blasting Obama on immigration although he voted the same"

STRAIGHT TALK

9/13/2008 4:31:49 PM

Quote :

"Tell that to FactCheck.org."

Uh, the linked page doesn't disagree with what I posted. John Sidney McCain supports keeping American troops in Iraq indefinitely.

9/13/2008 4:47:21 PM

Bill Maher on Elitism:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=NBzYSUI5_GM

9/13/2008 5:33:27 PM

Read this entire article, it's telling:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/14/us/politics/14palin.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

Quote :

"WASILLA, Alaska — Gov. Sarah Palin lives by the maxim that all politics is local, not to mention personal. So when there was a vacancy at the top of the State Division of Agriculture, she appointed a high school classmate, Franci Havemeister, to the $95,000-a-year directorship. A former real estate agent, Ms. Havemeister cited her childhood love of cows as one of her qualifications for running the roughly $2 million agency. Ms. Havemeister was one of at least five schoolmates Ms. Palin hired, often at salaries far exceeding their private sector wages. When Ms. Palin had to cut her first state budget, she avoided the legion of frustrated legislators and mayors. Instead, she huddled with her budget director and her husband, Todd, an oil field worker who is not a state employee, and vetoed millions of dollars of legislative projects. ... Ms. Palin walks the national stage as a small-town foe of “good old boy” politics and a champion of ethics reform. The charismatic 44-year-old governor draws enthusiastic audiences and high approval ratings. And as the Republican vice-presidential nominee, she points to her management experience while deriding her Democratic rivals, Senators Barack Obama and Joseph R. Biden Jr., as speechmakers who never have run anything. But an examination of her swift rise and record as mayor of Wasilla and then governor finds that her visceral style and penchant for attacking critics — she sometimes calls local opponents “haters” — contrasts with her carefully crafted public image. Throughout her political career, she has pursued vendettas, fired officials who crossed her and sometimes blurred the line between government and personal grievance, according to a review of public records and interviews with 60 Republican and Democratic legislators and local officials. ... In Wasilla, a builder said he complained to Mayor Palin when the city attorney put a stop-work order on his housing project. She responded, he said, by engineering the attorney’s firing. Interviews show that Ms. Palin runs an administration that puts a premium on loyalty and secrecy. The governor and her top officials sometimes use personal e-mail accounts for state business; dozens of e-mail messages obtained by The New York Times show that her staff members studied whether that could allow them to circumvent subpoenas seeking public records. Rick Steiner, a University of Alaska professor, sought the e-mail messages of state scientists who had examined the effect of global warming on polar bears. (Ms. Palin said the scientists had found no ill effects, and she has sued the federal government to block the listing of the bears as endangered.) An administration official told Mr. Steiner that it would cost $468,784 to process his request. When Mr. Steiner finally obtained the e-mail messages — through a federal records request — he discovered that state scientists had in fact agreed that the bears were in danger, records show. “Their secrecy is off the charts,” Mr. Steiner said. ... Ms. Palin ordered city employees not to talk to the press. And she used city money to buy a white Suburban for the mayor’s use — employees sarcastically called it the mayor-mobile. The new mayor also tended carefully to her evangelical base. She appointed a pastor to the town planning board. And she began to eye the library. For years, social conservatives had pressed the library director to remove books they considered immoral. “People would bring books back censored,” recalled former Mayor John Stein, Ms. Palin’s predecessor. “Pages would get marked up or torn out.” Witnesses and contemporary news accounts say Ms. Palin asked the librarian about removing books from the shelves. The McCain-Palin presidential campaign says Ms. Palin never advocated censorship. But in 1995, Ms. Palin, then a city councilwoman, told colleagues that she had noticed the book “Daddy’s Roommate” on the shelves and that it did not belong there, according to Ms. Chase and Mr. Stein. Ms. Chase read the book, which helps children understand homosexuality, and said it was inoffensive; she suggested that Ms. Palin read it. “Sarah said she didn’t need to read that stuff,” Ms. Chase said. “It was disturbing that someone would be willing to remove a book from the library and she didn’t even read it.” “I’m still proud of Sarah,” she added, “but she scares the bejeebers out of me.” ... Not deeply versed in policy, Ms. Palin skipped some candidate forums; at others, she flipped through hand-written, color-coded index cards strategically placed behind her nameplate. Before one forum, Mr. Halcro said he saw aides shovel reports at Ms. Palin as she crammed. Her showman’s instincts rarely failed. She put the pile of reports on the lectern. Asked what she would do about health care policy, she patted the stack and said she would find an answer in the pile of solutions. ... Many lawmakers contend that Ms. Palin is overly reliant on a small inner circle that leaves her isolated. Democrats and Republicans alike describe her as often missing in action. Since taking office in 2007, Ms. Palin has spent 312 nights at her Wasilla home, some 600 miles to the north of the governor’s mansion in Juneau, records show. During the last legislative session, some lawmakers became so frustrated with her absences that they took to wearing “Where’s Sarah?” pins. Many politicians say they most often learn of her initiatives — and vetoes — from news releases, including her decision to veto $237 million from last year’s budget. Mayors across the state, from the larger cities to tiny municipalities along the southeastern fiords, are even more frustrated. Often, their letters go unanswered and their pleas ignored, records and interviews show. ... The administration’s e-mail correspondence reveals a siege-like atmosphere. Top aides keep score, demean enemies and gloat over successes. Even some who helped engineer her rise have felt her wrath. Dan Fagan, a prominent conservative radio host and longtime friend of Ms. Palin, urged his listeners to vote for her in 2006. But when he took her to task for raising taxes on oil companies, he said, he found himself branded a “hater.” It is part of a pattern, Mr. Fagan said, in which Ms. Palin characterizes critics as “bad people who are anti-Alaska.” ... As Ms. Palin’s star ascends, the McCain campaign, as often happens in national races, is controlling the words of those who know her well. Her mother-in-law, Faye Palin, has been asked not to speak to reporters, and aides sit in on interviews with old friends."

9/13/2008 5:34:42 PM