maybe

2/1/2008 7:53:48 AM

everyone in sports talk knows that i pull for state and duke and have allmy life...that isn't breaking news.

there were some really bad calls, like the kick ball, but you guys are forgetting that duke penetrates a ton which draws lots of fouls (see nelson and henderson).

the thing that is sad about our fan base is that a 20 point loss falls on the officials...especially if it is a road game. the game was called too tight and there were ticky tack fouls, but it was 20 points. any player or fan that thinks a 20 point loss where you are outscored by 29 in the 2nd half is 'home cooking' is insane.

the positive takeaways are that grant, costner and javi all had terrific games...that is something we can build on. fells won't have another game like he did last night.

2/1/2008 8:27:12 AM

Anyone who says the refs had nothing to do with us getting blown out by 20 points didnt watch the game.

I said it before, I'm not mad that we lost. I expected to lose, but we outplayed them for most of the game, and had nothing to show for it, so when they got their little run, the game was over. Its as simple as that.

I'm mad that the refs LET duke stay in the game in the first half...

And I'm mad that the refs DIDN'T LET us stay in the game in the second half. It wasnt a fair fight, so our guys gave up. End of story. The difference in the game doesnt do it justice.

2/1/2008 8:44:45 AM

Stop complaining about the bad calls.

The "bad calls" generated maybe 6 points at most.

We lost by 20.

Did you even see our defense? They were taking three point shots that were so open I could have made them.

2/1/2008 8:45:53 AM

you guys really thought we had a chance against the #3 team in the nation?

2/1/2008 8:48:05 AM

i'm pretty pround of Grant though last night....he soldiered up when others weren't doing it

2/1/2008 8:49:20 AM

Fells play #8 on top 10

2/1/2008 8:52:19 AM

^^^ bullshit. 6 direct points and how many points because players got in foul trouble and had to sit/play less agressively.

I don't think anyone is blaming the loss solely on the refs, and probably we still would have lost if the game had been called fairly, but we would have had a chance. That kind of bad call bullshit swings the momentum.

2/1/2008 8:52:56 AM

There were bad calls all around (on both teams) but it seemed like when we got a call we didn't make much of (cept for Gavins and one)

And they constantly got great looks, bigs shot, and charging calls that killed us early in the second half. Then they would go down and hit a 3, but a lot of that had to do with the D giving a wide up shot or lane to the basket.

Our D stayed in the looker room the second have.

2/1/2008 8:59:54 AM

^^^ redemption?

[Edited on February 1, 2008 at 9:00 AM. Reason : fdss]

2/1/2008 8:59:56 AM

Quote :

"That kind of bad call bullshit swings the momentum"

it damn sure does and they were calling a bunch of bullshit
the refs, to me, made sure to keep the momentum in favor of d00k

one of the worst no-calls ever changed the entire game against state
that kick ball led to 4 points and another d00k run.

what really pissed me off was when WRAL was replaying the highlights of the game, they showed the kick ball STEAL and the lay up but edited out the part where that little bitches actually kicked the ball...i was furious that they edited the most important part out and didnt even mention the bad no call

Quote :

"And I'm mad that the refs DIDN'T LET us stay in the game in the second half. It wasnt a fair fight, so our guys gave up. End of story. "

i agree 100% with this

[Edited on February 1, 2008 at 9:02 AM. Reason : sdf]

2/1/2008 9:01:51 AM

for those of you that watched the game on espn2, did they mention "kick" at all about that play?

i know raycom was baffled and expressed that, but what did espn think? (probably thought it was an awesome steal)

2/1/2008 9:03:25 AM

freestyler, yes after the replay the espn2 announcers said 'that looked like it was a kicked ball actually'

2/1/2008 9:14:17 AM

ahh, ok. i thought i remember people saying last night that they didn't acknowledge it was a kick/missed call.

2/1/2008 9:35:00 AM

i usually never care about the refs, or use that as an excuse. as a coach, i tell my players control what you can control, and you can't control the refs so you have to learn how to play and deal with it.

HOWEVER, when you miss an easy call like that kick ball that directly leads to a shift in momentum and the game, it is tough to not point to it. We weren't the same team after that call, I don't give two shits about any of the other calls because they didn't change the game and that one did, and that really sucks.

2/1/2008 9:37:51 AM

Quote :

"The game first turned on a hard foul by Duke guard Greg Paulus with 3:56 to play in the first half. Already, the teams had traded insults and a few pushes, nothing major. Already, referees had broken up minor skirmishes and separated red jerseys from blue and generally made Duke coach Mike Krzyzewski uneasy about things. He stood on the sideline with open arms and a wry smile through much of the game, demanding explanations on more than one incident and freely questioning a few of the details. And then Paulus took down Brandon Costner. The play was harmless as it unfolded, then Paulus found himself mismatched against the big State forward deep in the lane. Costner turned, lowered his shoulder and began to go up just as Paulus leaped. In an instant, Paulus was on Costner's back and they were both going down. Now, here's where the intent differed from the perspective. Costner hit the floor with Paulus appearing to take him down. Costner came up steaming, pushing to get to Paulus who had walked away toward the Duke bench. As teammates and the officials began to realize what was happening, a drama began to unfold as coaches and reserves began wandering onto the floor. "WHAT'S THIS?'' Krzyzewski asked as the entire State bench emptied and walked single file toward Costner and a gathering of officials and Duke coaches. Monte Towe, the State assistant and a veteran of this rivalry going way back, stood grim-faced, staring down Krzyzewski as the Duke coach demanded to know why the entire State team was suddenly standing in front of him. Towe stood stone like, glowering at Krzyzewski as officials congregated and explained and generally tried to defuse the situation before it got out of hand. Though most of it was dramatic rendering, the officials took firm control of the game in its most fragile moment. And then State took over the game. After a season of incoherent basketball, after breakdowns of team unity and a general malaise that seemed to take over the State team at times, the Wolfpack was suddenly unified and taking its key from Towe. Lowe eventually joined his assistant near midcourt, staring down the Duke bench as a packed house of would-be environmentalists rained down insults on the State coaches and the State players as they filed back to the bench. Krzyzewski watched the procession and asked again, with arms outstretched, WHAT'S THIS? He never really got an answer. State led by nine at halftime. Krzyzewski said it was his fault, that his team hadn't come down from a big win at Maryland and wasn't entirely ready for State's aggression."

2/1/2008 9:44:49 AM

where the heck is that from?

2/1/2008 9:51:38 AM

Quote :

"you guys really thought we had a chance against the #3 team in the nation?"

thats the thing. I didnt expect to win. But we clearly outplayed them for over half of the game and had nothing to show for it. We beat any other team besides UNC by 20 last night.


And if thats the 3rd best team in the nation, I'll kiss your ass. They are a good team, but they're not that damn good.

[Edited on February 1, 2008 at 9:56 AM. Reason : ]

2/1/2008 9:55:50 AM

^^^ yes, link plz

2/1/2008 10:07:37 AM

Wolfpack’s performance showed signs of promise

http://www.news-record.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080201/NRSTAFF/802010302

2/1/2008 10:10:47 AM

I know it's early, but is it too hard to ask for a team that you have no doubt is going to make it to the postseason?? Seems like that's been the whole deal here for the past few years. Wait until the last possible week or weekend to make a move or completely screw up.

[Edited on February 1, 2008 at 10:26 AM. Reason : a]

2/1/2008 10:26:27 AM

Quote :

"nifty soccer moves"

lol

and throwing the green shirts on the floor because you are losing? This shows that leftist and liberalism in general is based on a self centered attitude. You know if NC State fans ever did something like that we would be blasted.

2/1/2008 10:31:37 AM

Duke's always played like this, I don't know why alot of you people are just now figuring it out. Yankees are yankees.

2/1/2008 10:47:23 AM

^^
Dook's student body is hardly liberal. It's full of spoiled, self-centered, trend-hopping rich kids, and the irony of one-time t-shirt to "go green" was only missed by the announcers. I guess those traits are only associated with liberalism.

2/1/2008 10:58:55 AM

Quote :

"the irony of one-time t-shirt to "go green" was only missed by the announcers"

truth.

2/1/2008 10:59:56 AM

^ Sure Duke always plays like this and it always pisses me the fuck off.

It's the same fucking story every year. They get away with more crap in conference play than any team should, and then they don't get those same calls in the NCAA tournament, and they come up short. Their most recent championship in 00-01 was more of the same. Maryland was taking it to them in the final four game and then Duke starts to mug every other Maryland player to get the ball, they get away with it, and Maryland falls apart.

Duke makes the conference look bad. Every conference opponent of their's has to beat Duke and the refs before they can win. Sure most teams couldn't beat Duke by themselves anyways, but the ones that look like they may have a chance are usually tripped up by a bullshit call or no call by Duke here or there. Without the benefit of ACC refs, Duke loses in the NCAAs much sooner than their conference record suggests they should. And then people wonder about the ACC being that good, if one of their top teams can't get in done come Tourney time.

[Edited on February 1, 2008 at 11:04 AM. Reason : /rant]

2/1/2008 11:04:27 AM

^Good point. I am convinced that the biased ACC officiating hurts them come NCAA Tournament time, when they have to adjust to not getting the benefit of those calls. Part of the blame certainly lies with Coach K, as he clearly coaches them to take advantage of the ACC officiating at both ends of the court (be it moving screens and push offs on offense, or hand-checking and flopping on defense). This leaves them poorly prepared for March.

2/1/2008 11:19:41 AM

Quote :

"Lowe eventually joined his assistant near midcourt, staring down the Duke bench as a packed house of would-be environmentalists rained down insults on the State coaches and the State players as they filed back to the bench."

lol

2/1/2008 11:45:55 AM

time to move on and hopefully build on the first decent half of basketball we've played this year.

2/1/2008 11:52:16 AM

The real irony of the "Go Green" t-shirts is that all the ones thrown on the court during halftime were collected and promptly shipped to a landfill.

GG you fake-ass environmentalist, privileged douchers.

2/1/2008 12:09:34 PM

http://www.newsobserver.com/sports/college/duke/photos/story/916718.html

Check out the 20th picture in the gallery. McCauley isn't cringing b/c Henderson is about to throw the ball back at him you idiots, he just got smacked up side the head.

2/1/2008 12:18:25 PM

i've never been less upset about a 20 point loss.

i was expecting to be straight up embarrassed like we were against msu and unc, but we at least showed that we could play decent basketball from time to time. hopefully we run w/ it.

2/1/2008 12:43:01 PM

scheyer looks like bugs bunny in picture 3 where king fouled grant

picture 10 is funny...javi isn't even looking at the ball.

[Edited on February 1, 2008 at 12:47 PM. Reason : /]

2/1/2008 12:45:55 PM

honestly... what happened to Sidney's promises of "exciting up and down basketball" where he blatantly told us we would not do a half court "herb" offense as he started his coaching tenure here... I haven't seen it once... and that's ok though, I'm not criticizing him right now b/c I'm sure Sidney knows this team better than I... but what I'm asking the other fans is... will he EVER break out with this? Is he waiting on HIS players or what? 2 more guards coming in next year with the loss of Grant and probably Hickson. "I" really don't see this half court stuff changing.... do you?


I might find another thread to post this in if I see no responses

2/1/2008 1:02:57 PM

you need guards to run fast. i thought we'd do it with degand but maybe hes waiting on great guards.

2/1/2008 1:04:59 PM

we tried to do it w/ degand, but costner wasn't having any of that.

2/1/2008 1:11:17 PM

Run and gun without quality guards is a recipe for disaster.

2/1/2008 1:13:55 PM

sure is. we're doing the smart thing this year by slowing it up. maybe we'll run when we get all sid's players on the court. but that takes some time obviously.

2/1/2008 1:16:20 PM

^,^^,^^^ We are averaging way less points than Herb did in his last few years and that was the reason most of the haters wanted him gone. The offense wasn't exciting but it worked for the most part.

Quote :

"And I'm mad that the refs DIDN'T LET us stay in the game in the second half. It wasnt a fair fight, so our guys gave up. End of story. The difference in the game doesnt do it justice."

/thread.

2/1/2008 1:19:11 PM

well, personally, i wasn't fed up w/ herb due to the lack of scoring. i was fed up b/c he ran a system that would regularly break down and lose games that we had no business losing.

we've seen glimpses of the offense that lowe wants to run, and when they do it right it's beautiful (see: first half last night, unc/vt games last year, acct last year).

the problem right now isn't his xs and os, it's that he can't get his team to really go out and play for him.

2/1/2008 1:23:04 PM

Does anyone have a recording of the game online?

2/1/2008 1:25:30 PM

Quote :

"We are averaging way less points than Herb did in his last few years and that was the reason most of the haters wanted him gone. The offense wasn't exciting but it worked for the most part. "

It worked when we had good three point shooting nights. It's hard to count on an offense that doesn't work at all without the three.

2/1/2008 1:42:20 PM

^^ it's on espnu right now

2/1/2008 2:07:43 PM

Quote :

"honestly... what happened to Sidney's promises of "exciting up and down basketball" where he blatantly told us we would not do a half court "herb" offense as he started his coaching tenure here... I haven't seen it once"

we were on track to score 92 points last night after the first half

our offense is nothing like herb's offense

we're not scoring 100 points a game like carolina because we don't have multiple quick ball handlers

2/1/2008 2:14:21 PM

The problem came when we didn't understand how to defend shots coming off of screens and let them hit 9 three pointers in the second half.

2/1/2008 2:45:41 PM

This offense would be a thing of beauty if we had shooters that could knock it down when they're open. The problem is that we have 2 guys that can do that about 1/3 of the time. Gavin is the most consistent 3 point shooter on the team. Thats sad.







edit: we need a point guard that can start the offense for my theory to work. Javi is getting better but he has a ways to go.

[Edited on February 1, 2008 at 3:18 PM. Reason : ]

2/1/2008 3:18:05 PM

would be great to see some of our highlights on tv or somewhere......at least see that sick steal by Fells again, but it's all about dook everywhere I look

2/1/2008 5:29:46 PM

Quote :

" our offense is nothing like herb's offense"

I was debating with myself the other day about who's offense looks worse when its not working.

When Herb's offense didn't work, we would just pass the ball around and jack up a contested three or one that was about 5 feet behind the line.

In Sidney's offense, we try to go one-on-one, or just drive blindly at to the basket and get a charging foul, get blocked, or throw up a horrible shot.

Both are extremely painful to watch. But that first half against UNC is ten times worse than anything I've ever seen at State. It definitely got me thinking about "unwatchable State basketball" which includes about 75% of everything State basketball I've witnessed in my lifetime.

2/1/2008 5:39:53 PM

^^http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/recap?gameId=280310150 has fells block/steal

2/1/2008 5:41:37 PM

^^ well be glad the St. John's game from a few years ago wasn't on TV. we scored 10 points in the first half. 10 MOTHERFUCKING POINTS! also being there in person for the Seton Hall game where we got blown the fuck out at home which snapped a really long home winning streak against non-conference opponents nearly made me go crazy. i wanted to rip my eyes out after watching that.

2/1/2008 8:15:29 PM