Quote :

"What's stupid about wanting to curb gang violence? It's definitely a problem and it's getting worse in our area with the Mexican gangs coming around to do their thing. I'd love for gangs to get the domestic terrorist label so they can be dealt with quickly and harshly. New recruits should be second guessing themselves when it comes to joining up. I know it sounds rather aggressive, but I'd rather have violence and drug issues fixed at home first before he go somewhere else to deal with someone else's problems. "

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic, but this is a stupid idea because of the absurd amounts of collateral damage. You don't think we're capturing and killing any innocent people in Iraq? it's acceptable because it's over there and it's a "war" but Americans wouldn't tolerate this.

Secondly, I can't believe you people are seriously misunderstanding this issue to the level that you are. It's like nothing that you read here sticks in your brain, you just blindly charge ahead.

Quote :

"I just heard an Ad about obama voting against the death penality for gang members in chicago who commit gang related murders. His reason, according to the writer, was bc it would target mostly blacks, since most gangs in chicago are made up of blacks. If they can produce a tape or quote of him saying that, this could do some damage."

His reasoning wouldn't be that it's okay for blacks to commit crimes; only a racist, or a blind partisan, would interpret it this way.

Secondly, since when do politicians decide when someone gets the death penalty, isn't this up to the judges?

And as sarijouli just noted, it's pretty clear that the justice system routinely traps innocent people on death row, and that the justice system is also heavily biased against blacks, so it wouldn't be too illogical to be against death penalty partially because a system is more likely to kill your people disproportionately.

ANd to whoever says death penalty deters crimes, you're an idiot. No research has ever conclusively shown this, and considering the US has one of the highest crime rates for developed countries, while also having one of the highest death penalty rates (most other developed countries have done away with the death penalty), the only reason you would continue to believe this is pure delusion. ANd on top of this, a gang member in the business of killing people is not going to sit around and wonder what happens when he gets caught. Because no matter what, if he gets caught, he's screwed.

4/26/2008 12:17:27 AM

^about the death penalty thing......you can never, ever, ever, ever prove a hypothesis.

Lets say our hypothesis is, "the death penatly reduces murders"

If you follow proper scientific method, there is no way you can prove this theory; you can only disprove the hypothesis. So from our hypothesis above, does the current data disprove the theory? If it does, then you have an argument..if it dosent, the hypothesis still holds until disproven.

Politicians (and people in general) tend to "prove" things. Nothing is ever proven.

Remember, we accept Einsteins theory of relativity simply because no one can disprove it at the moment, not because it is proven......the same goes for the laws of thermodynamics, physics, mathematics....

4/26/2008 12:38:06 AM

Quote :

"His reasoning wouldn't be that it's okay for blacks to commit crimes; only a racist, or a blind partisan, would interpret it this way. Secondly, since when do politicians decide when someone gets the death penalty, isn't this up to the judges? And as sarijouli just noted, it's pretty clear that the justice system routinely traps innocent people on death row, and that the justice system is also heavily biased against blacks, so it wouldn't be too illogical to be against death penalty partially because a system is more likely to kill your people disproportionately. ANd to whoever says death penalty deters crimes, you're an idiot. No research has ever conclusively shown this, and considering the US has one of the highest crime rates for developed countries, while also having one of the highest death penalty rates (most other developed countries have done away with the death penalty), the only reason you would continue to believe this is pure delusion. ANd on top of this, a gang member in the business of killing people is not going to sit around and wonder what happens when he gets caught. Because no matter what, if he gets caught, he's screwed."

Considering how many logical fallacies are in this post, it's amazing that you're in engineering. At best, you're purposefully being disingenuous. At worst you're just an idiot. Either way, it's tough to take your posts seriously when they have so many irrational conclusions and gaps in logic.

4/26/2008 1:57:15 AM

Quote :

"Random Strangers Hunted, Slashed With Razor Blades For Gang Initiations Police Issue Community Warning After Attacks DAYTONA BEACH, Fla. -- Men dressed in black with covered faces are hunting and then slashing random strangers with razor blades as part of a gang initiation, police warned residents. Investigators said a gang in Flagler County is sending its future members to Daytona Beach to seek out victims to cut. "

These are the types of monsters Obama would extend mercy to?


http://www.local6.com/news/15982985/detail.html

4/26/2008 11:09:54 AM

Quote :

"Either way, it's tough to take your posts seriously when they have so many irrational conclusions and gaps in logic."

So many you fail to point out a single one.

^ Take about being disingenous. So being against the death penalty is extending mercy now?

Quote :

"about the death penalty thing......you can never, ever, ever, ever prove a hypothesis. Lets say our hypothesis is, "the death penatly reduces murders" If you follow proper scientific method, there is no way you can prove this theory; you can only disprove the hypothesis. So from our hypothesis above, does the current data disprove the theory? If it does, then you have an argument..if it dosent, the hypothesis still holds until disproven"

There are many reasons to oppose the death penalty, where the main reason to support it is to satiate our desire for what we perceive as vengeance.

In any case, it's completely idiotic to assume that being against the death penalty is being pro-crime. I can't see how people like Prawn Star and Earthdogg can't see this. The only reason they would choose this line is because they're being purposefully disingenuous, or at worse, are idiots.

[Edited on April 26, 2008 at 6:07 PM. Reason : ]

4/26/2008 6:03:56 PM

cause he is a democrat and the democrats are more religious than a republican

4/28/2008 11:20:55 AM

suspend

4/28/2008 11:21:50 AM

yes, suspend trolltwista

4/28/2008 11:26:31 AM

Quote :

"democrats are more religious than a republican"

4/28/2008 11:27:37 AM

I didn't know where this might fit into the mix so I will toss it here. As a Barack Obama supporter I hope that either Hilary or McCain win the election. Here's why. The staggering problems that we face today are not going to magically be resolved in four year by anyone. Not to be a pessimist but I see things getting worse before they get better. Mainly in the areas of the economy/fuel prices. I would rather it be either Hilary or McCain who gets thrown under the bus as the next "do nothing" president so that if Hilary gets the nod then Barack can say "See democrats? This is why I would have been better in '08 and why I will be better in '12". And if McCain gets in then he can point to the fact that a democrat would have made better choices. The issue of "better choices" is certainly debatable but we all know that is what any good politician would say because it works.

I don't see either Hilary nor McCain being favorable to my chief concern which is the environment if times get tough and the OPEC cartel really does prompt prices to $200 a barrel (hell, that could happen before November anyways). Deep down I think that Hilary would advocate for oil drilling in the skull of baby seals if it meant getting her the votes to keep her in power and McCain would open up drilling in environmentally sensitive habitats just to appease the greed on the right to which the only green that appeals to them is money.

4/29/2008 11:57:16 AM

^yeah, it would be awful if we started drilling off our coast... the same coast china is now drilling for oil in.

Im kinda of hoping obama wins the nomination but the general. That usually ends any presidential shots. If he didnt win the nomination and then actually did something during those four years. He would be a sure thing in 2012.

4/29/2008 12:06:23 PM

Quote :

""See democrats? This is why I would have been better in '08 and why I will be better in '12". "

If Hillary wins in '08, you think theres any possible way she wouldn't be on the ticket in '12 as the incumbant? Do you know who we're talking about here? We're talking about Hillary Clinton, the woman who feels she's entitled to be president because her husband was.

If McCain wins this year, THEN Obama will get it in '12.

4/29/2008 12:26:16 PM

honestly i am almost 100 percent sure at some point barack obama will be president

if hes hillarys vp then he gets it, if mccain win he gets it

4/29/2008 12:30:32 PM

Quote :

"if hes hillarys vp"

neither Hillary nor Barack are going to take 2nd fiddle to the other

I'm still quite certain that either of them would pick a white male as their VP to try and get some of those votes that a woman or black guy might not necessarily get

Edwards? I dunno...but I'd guess a white male for either of their VPs on their tickets

4/29/2008 1:08:16 PM

i think edwards has been sitting on his hands until a nominee is clear so that he might go for VP. but i don't see either clinton or obama biting on that. he didn't bring much to the 2004 ticket, so it's unlikely that he would bring much to either 2008 ticket. i could see it more for hillary, but not much.

4/29/2008 1:11:28 PM

yeah i dont really think Edwards is the guy...but I'm convinced it will be a white male...on the other side, i wouldnt be surprised if mccain took some type of minority / non-white as his VP

4/29/2008 1:13:13 PM

i think biden would be a good fit but i dont want 2 senators in office and also i dont know if voters would go for him

4/29/2008 1:14:36 PM

Quote :

"on the other side, i wouldnt be surprised if mccain took some type of minority / non-white as his VP"

i think that would be a serious mistake and would be viewed as a stunt.

4/29/2008 1:21:17 PM

[Edited on April 29, 2008 at 2:06 PM. Reason : oops wrong thread]

4/29/2008 2:06:24 PM

2pac was so ahead of his time, in so many of his songs, it sounds like he was straight up speaking of future events

Quote :

"And even though it seems heaven-sent, we ain't ready to see a black president"

---- Changes, Tupac Shakur - posthumously released 1999

How many jokes and comments have you seen/heard about how Barak Obama SEEMS HEAVEN-SENT? (walk on water, jesus, etc...)

And with all the bullshit smokescreens through up by Clinton and McCain, often it just seems the collective "we" aren't ready for it.

5/1/2008 4:46:40 PM

I dont know about tupac, but im not ready for a socialist.

Ive said many times, I like obama. I just hate his politics.

5/1/2008 4:51:35 PM

2pac is a prophet - he hit the nail on the head 13 years before this shit happened

and he made it rhyme

5/1/2008 4:54:40 PM

http://www.traffickingmedia.com/index.php?id=426

1:16 in

5/1/2008 5:20:03 PM

he's on the wall like a menu

5/1/2008 5:21:09 PM

Worse than the others -- Bill Clinton, Mr. Bob Dole
You're too old to understand the way the game is told

5/1/2008 5:32:45 PM

Terp, I hope you are right if Tupac is a prophet. That way Obama will not be the next president.

5/1/2008 10:28:37 PM

I support El Presidente Bush

5/1/2008 11:35:07 PM

Quote :

"Terp, I hope you are right if Tupac is a prophet. That way Obama will not be the next president."

Just because we aren't ready doesn't mean it won't happen.

5/2/2008 12:44:18 PM

President Bush was a good president. i hate when people bash the guy for no reason. I'd rather have 4 more of Bush than . . . 4 of McCain would suck worse.

5/2/2008 2:18:41 PM

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5hL-pVQpoMiWAhFrb82fQV_oxGLUwD90CF25O0

Quote :

"Obama's campaign lawyer, Robert Bauer, filed a complaint Wednesday with the Federal Election Commission, accusing the pro-Clinton American Leadership Project of violating campaign finance laws by running ads against Obama. The group is spending $920,000 for an ad in Indiana questioning Obama's economic policies. "

5/2/2008 3:50:52 PM

5/5/2008 11:10:14 PM

yeah i never thought of it like that...i almost would rather just keep bush than go to mccain...if a repub is gonna win just let bush stay in

5/6/2008 3:06:08 AM

Quote :

"Barack Obama Election Night Event On Tuesday May 6, 2008 Senator Barack Obama and Michelle Obama will hold an election night event in Reynolds Coliseum at North Carolina State University. The event is open to the press and otherwise by invitation only. Doors will open at 8 p.m. Reynolds Coliseum is located on the NC State University campus at 2411 E. Dunn Ave. in Raleigh, NC."

5/6/2008 9:25:32 AM

I voted in the Democratic primrary this morning, mostly because I wanted to put my support behind Bev Purdue for Gov and Pat Smathers for Lt. Gov (we need someone from fucking WNC for once).

But I also voted in the Presidential primary and I actually had to think about who I wanted to pick. I mean, if McCain loses in November, I want the winner to be someone I can trust will do a competent job. And I kept thinking about one of those Obama speeches about changing the world and his recent (and smart) opposition to the gas tax holiday. I guess even I can be swayed by someone with intelligence and charisma.

Of course, I eventually penned in Hillary--mostly out of loyalty to Bill. I can't tell you how much I love Bill. Bill Clinton was and I hope still is the future of the Democratic Party in a way Obama is not. Clinton didn't just talk about working across the isle, he actually did it. He did it on NAFTA, he did on Welfare Reform, he did it on Tax Reform, on and on. Clinton was a Democrat with new ideas that didn't just cling to memories of Johnson's Great Society. He envisioned America not as a nation of victims of circumstance, he saw a dynamic people that could stand up to foreign competition. A nation of people that didn't need hand outs, but government programs that would actually make them a more flexible and productive work force. That's why he focused on national health care, improving America's infrastructure, and reforming aging programs like AFDC. I couldn't see Obama doing any of this (at least not competently). He's still intellectually trapped in the Democratic party of the 1970s--he hasn't mentioned a single non-military program he would change, only listed more programs he would add. Obama is not a reformer.

Now, Hillary certainly hasn't been talking anything like her husband this election, but I like think she might govern more moderatley than she preaches. At least with Bill in the White House, I feel like we would have a better a shot at a return of the Third Way Democrats.

[Edited on May 6, 2008 at 10:27 AM. Reason : ``]

5/6/2008 10:24:30 AM

Bev Perdue is bringin back the Dixiecrats

5/6/2008 10:31:50 AM

change! he's going to bring change!

5/6/2008 10:38:55 AM

Socks, that's probably the best post from you I've seen in a long while. I'm glad you've dropped the 'Obama is the devil' stuff.

Whoever wins, I hope it's not McCain

5/6/2008 10:44:32 AM

lol @ ppl voting for the same guys and gals that wanted to take away our garbage disposals

5/6/2008 10:46:07 AM

i dunno about you guys, but i'm supporting obama because i don't feel the feds are taking enough of my income as tax already...they really need to take a few thousand more each year...THAT is whats important to ME

5/6/2008 10:46:52 AM

treetwista, are you seriously arguing that you aren't a troll in another thread?

5/6/2008 10:49:49 AM

+1 for operation chaos


down with the tax-ocrats

5/6/2008 10:51:30 AM

^^you sure have trouble reading, dont you troll

DAMMIT TREETWISTA HOW DARE YOU MAKE FUN OF OBAMA, THATS NOT ALLOWED...ALSO ITS FORBIDDEN TO TALK SHIT ABOUT DEMOCRATS' TAX POLICIES, RAW HOW DARE YOU

This thread is for all the good things about Obama...theres no place for dissenters!

5/6/2008 10:52:53 AM

Sure it's fine, but what it's called on forums is 'trolling.'

5/6/2008 10:54:28 AM

oh you mean that shit that you do all the time...now i understand what you mean

but of course, when you do it, it isnt trolling...only when a conservative does it

5/6/2008 10:56:17 AM

Quote :

"DAMMIT TREETWISTA HOW DARE YOU MAKE FUN OF OBAMA, THATS NOT ALLOWED...ALSO ITS FORBIDDEN TO TALK SHIT ABOUT DEMOCRATS' TAX POLICIES, RAW HOW DARE YOU This thread is for all the good things about Obama...theres no place for dissenters!"

The soap box is

Quote :

"politics, social issues, financials. basically anything serious."

5/6/2008 10:56:52 AM

yeah, we all know those rules are followed to a tee

whats important though is getting back on track of completely fellating obama...thats what this thread is about! serious business!

5/6/2008 10:59:02 AM

i refuse to take this section seriously

especially when the serious posts go on like they do

5/6/2008 11:00:18 AM

where is your god now?

5/6/2008 11:00:36 AM

We got chlorophyll guy up there talking about god knows what and all this girl wants to do is make out with me. I am here to learn everybody, not to make out with you...proceed with the chlorophyll

5/6/2008 11:06:20 AM

i'll say it again...if obama wins it all, the country has gotten even dumber than when they re-elected bush

5/6/2008 11:10:22 AM