what?

8/3/2007 6:20:27 PM

if you can get in before the ipo hits you can get it at 23-25 but you would have to be investing 50k plus to get on this...the market will push the stock much higher when it hits the market

8/3/2007 9:45:27 PM

50K? Where did you get that # from?

8/4/2007 11:48:28 AM

its just an approximate number, most brokerages just give ipos, especially high profile ones to their millionaire customers

8/4/2007 3:17:59 PM

So for an investing n00b, if the VMWare IPO hits on August 14, when will shares for the non-millionaire investor likely be available for purchase?

8/4/2007 5:34:50 PM

right after the institutional investors take all the profits

8/5/2007 1:12:02 PM

D'oh! But seriously, same day?

8/5/2007 1:33:33 PM

Oh dear god, Cramer in rare form, even for Cramer.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=452808336&

8/5/2007 1:49:44 PM

Wow, the guy has lost his mind.

Personally, I don't give a fuck if people lose their homes. They bought homes they couldn't afford. Why would anyone be in favor of bailing them out? They're learning whats called a "life lesson". I'll be damned if I'm the one who has to pay for their mistakes.

"Cut the interest rates" is just plain idiocy. All that would do is cause a fake surge in the market and set us up for an even bigger crash in the future.

What the fuck are people panicking about? They've had amazing returns for five straight years and all the sudden they lose ~3 months worth of gains and they act like the market is crashing.

These people who get too close to the market lose their minds and start thinking (in Cramer's case speaking) irrationally.

8/5/2007 3:05:37 PM

^^hahha

"Oh no, my millionaire buddies are losing some money. Won't the government help them out???"

8/5/2007 3:19:12 PM

I don't think the Fed gets enough credit for all the bullshit they put up with.

They get political pressure from all sides everyday pleading with them to cut interest rates.

Personally, I'd rather just enjoy steady gains for the rest of my life than go through turbulent swings, hyper-inflation scares, and massive corrections on a yearly basis.

You'd think people who work in the industry would be able to think rationally about what's in the country's best long term interest but its the exact opposite. Everyone's just looking for quick gains and opportunities and to hell with tomorrow.

[Edited on August 5, 2007 at 3:38 PM. Reason : a]

8/5/2007 3:37:58 PM

^, ^^

agreed, 100%. People are reaping the consequences for being greedy idiots, and I have no pity for them. I am tired of reading these stories and having the borrowers presented as victims. This shit makes me furious at these so-called victims who are anything but.

I don't see victims. I don't see financially illiterate. I see folks who thought that they could get something for nothing. Like a half million dollars in equity draw down, or ~$100K for a business loan. This is like a smoker claiming that they did not know cigarettes are dangerous.

8/6/2007 3:56:06 PM

Quote :

"I see folks who thought that they could get something for nothing. Like a half million dollars in equity draw down, or ~$100K for a business loan."

Oh come on. If you are basically a financial idiot and renting (you're living in socal for that great weather), and your cousin Bill who has a friend that got a loan on a house that is way out of his price range because of the appreciation (this is what your cousin Bill told you) and that all you have to do is go down to the bank...

and you go down to the bank, an institution you should be able to trust

.... and the slimy in it for a buck banker tells you "sure, you can afford this. The worst that can happen is the market will go down and you will be forced to sell, but that won't happen so don't worry"

and you trust him, or, maybe you go to another bank for a second opinion and get the same story (because all the scummy bankers are in it for the money)

... then what would you do, with the chance of actually owning your own home being a real possibility?


You do it. If you don't know, how are you supposed to know? You and I might be able to research and crunch numbers for ourselves to know when a banker is being a salesman and not looking out for our interests, but not everyone is as intelligent as you and I.


Now, this isn't to say that the couple that goes and pulls the equity out of his home to buy an escamalade (with rims!), granite counter tops, and additions isn't an idiot...but this isn't the only story out there.

Real people that trusted banks got took in this fiasco and they aren't going to have any recourse until the lawyers get involved (god forbid).

8/6/2007 4:23:11 PM

Quote :

".... and the slimy in it for a buck banker tells you "sure, you can afford this. The worst that can happen is the market will go down and you will be forced to sell, but that won't happen so don't worry""

What the hell kind of place do you bank at. I never had an experience like this. No bank will tell you such a thing.

Quote :

"You do it. If you don't know, how are you supposed to know?"

Uhhhh, you read all those papers you sign? You read every damn line. When you get to spots you don't understand, you ask for them to be explained and you keep asking until you understand everything you are about to sign. If you don't understand it then don't sign it.

Quote :

"Real people that trusted banks got took in this fiasco and they aren't going to have any recourse until the lawyers get involved (god forbid)."

Last I checked, I was a real person. I didn't get taken in any fiasco. Recourse? To hell with them. They don't deserve recourse. They deserved everything they got.

8/6/2007 4:32:48 PM

Quote :

" What the hell kind of place do you bank at. I never had an experience like this. No bank will tell you such a thing. "

You never had this experience, so obviously these guys selling this suspicious negative amortization loans must not exist, right?

Quote :

"Uhhhh, you read all those papers you sign? You read every damn line. When you get to spots you don't understand, you ask for them to be explained and you keep asking until you understand everything you are about to sign. If you don't understand it then don't sign it."

This is a catchall statement for personal resposibility. I'm sure when you were sitting in your closing, tearing your carpal tunnel up with all your John Hancocks, that you read everything you signed

Quote :

"Last I checked, I was a real person. I didn't get taken in any fiasco. Recourse? To hell with them. They don't deserve recourse. They deserved everything they got."

Well obviously, the statement wasn't targeted at you.

8/6/2007 4:37:12 PM

i'm not even going to get involved.

8/6/2007 4:41:49 PM

Quote :

"You never had this experience,"

I never had this experience because the banks I use don't have bars on their windows.

Quote :

" so obviously these guys selling this suspicious negative amortization loans must not exist, right?"

Uh, they do exist. They're called option arms. They works for a very small % of the population. I am familiar with them because I did this thing called r-e-s-e-a-r-c-h

Quote :

"This is a catchall statement for personal resposibility. I'm sure when you were sitting in your closing, tearing your carpal tunnel up with all your John Hancocks, that you read everything you signed"

Haha. Nice try pal, but I spent 6 hrs in the office reading everything when I first signed. When it was 6pm and I wasn't done I came back the next day. For closing, I got a pdf of all the documents to read beforehand and compiled a list of questions to ask during closing.

8/6/2007 4:47:00 PM

Yea, and everyone that wants to by a house should be able to read and comprehend language that they are paying a lawyer $500hr to interpret for them.

8/6/2007 5:02:44 PM

1. The language isn't the hard to comprehend.
2. The lawyer was more than happy to interpret it for me.

8/6/2007 5:05:14 PM

Quote :

"Oh come on. If you are basically a financial idiot"

...then it is on you to either do your research and not be an idiot anymore, or face the consequences.

this isn't mostly because people were mislead by those evil bankers. it's because they wanted something for nothing and were willing to roll the dice on a stupid gamble for a chance at it.

people who buy lottery tickets and don't win don't ask for or deserve recourse. People who bought tech stocks trading at P/E of several hundred, then getting promptly burned, don't deserve recourse either. This is no different.

Quote :

"Yea, and everyone that wants to by a house should be able to read and comprehend language that they are paying a lawyer $500hr to interpret for them. "

1. if they're employing a lawyer for buying a house, the lawyer should wade through the legalese for them.

2. yes, you damn well ought to read every single form you put your signature on when buying a house, or doing anything else.

3. this isn't a case of people getting mired in and misunderstanding legalese. it's a case of trying to be a hustler, but getting hustled by Murphy's Law and/or Reality because they were being idiots.

8/6/2007 5:08:23 PM

Intel and Cisco have two of the best Corporate Venture goups in tech. They know what they are doing.

http://soa.sys-con.com/read/411819.htm

8/6/2007 5:11:11 PM

Some people just dont understand that they are responsible for their own actions. Everything is somebody else's fault. Who can I blame for my own mistakes.

8/6/2007 5:12:03 PM

Quote :

"1. The language isn't the hard to comprehend. 2. The lawyer was more than happy to interpret it for me."

That wasn't really the point anyway. Anyone can read loan terms, not everyone can comprehend what they mean. If I go to a bank, and I trust them when they tell me the market has been going up for years, and I have nothing to really worry about, congrats on the new home, well the how the hell am I supposed to know not to trust them if I don't have a damn clue about the market?

If every Tom Dick and Harry in my hometown is suddenly able to 'afford' a home (thanks to sketchy low rate practices), then why would I question it?

Quote :

"this isn't mostly because people were mislead by those evil bankers. it's because they wanted something for nothing and were willing to roll the dice on a stupid gamble for a chance at it."

Many people that will get foreclosed on were not wanting something for nothing. They wanted the dream of home ownership that "get rich bankers" were way too eager to sell them for cheap. Thousands upon thousands of people that got caught in this were not gambling.^

[Edited on August 6, 2007 at 5:29 PM. Reason : ^ stop post stalking me you asshole]

8/6/2007 5:28:48 PM

Quote :

"If I go to a bank, and I trust them when they tell me the market has been going up for years, and I have nothing to really worry about,"

I still want to know what banks do this.

Quote :

"If every Tom Dick and Harry in my hometown is suddenly able to 'afford' a home (thanks to sketchy low rate practices), then why would I question it?"

When Tom is working at piggly wiggly making $8 /hr with 2 kids he should know that home ownership is not an options for him.

8/6/2007 5:34:27 PM

Sorry pal, but taking the extreme case isn't doing anything for your argument.

8/6/2007 5:40:46 PM

The point is, if you are barely getting by each month, you should know that home ownership isn't for you.

8/6/2007 5:43:42 PM

Thats exactly the point. When everyone around you has gone to the bank, and the bank has told them all that "they too can have live the dream of homeownership", then of course they are going to believe them.

8/6/2007 5:48:17 PM

nm

[Edited on August 6, 2007 at 5:54 PM. Reason : .]

8/6/2007 5:51:52 PM

^^ We all recognize the point you're making. It's not lost on us. We're just championing personal responsibility, while you're content to fall back on the nanny state every time the lowest common denominator manages to fuck the dog yet again.

8/6/2007 5:57:27 PM

Quote :

"We're just championing personal responsibility, while you're content to fall back on the nanny state every time the lowest common denominator manages to fuck the dog yet again."

Congrats on being that know it all asshole that can't moderate TSB correctly and can't get the point.

I am not nor have I ever made excuses for the idiots out there that thought a money tree grew up and started raining down on them.

I am speaking for the people (and there are plenty of them) that got lulled in by banks with loan officers out to make a buck and assured that "everything would be ok" and then it suddenly wasn't.

Why is it that you partisan hacks out there always assume everyone is talking in absolutes of black and white and then creates bullshit comments that are misrepresentations of peoples position?

Yes, personal responsibility is on one end of the spectrum. Douche bags thinking money rains is on the other end of the spectrum. Somewhere in the middle, there are folks that got lulled into a false sense of security and ended up getting bitten, just like you got bit by your baby momma.

8/6/2007 6:04:17 PM

Please, think of the children!

8/6/2007 6:16:17 PM

So, um....back to the markets....

8/6/2007 6:22:40 PM

Quote :

"I am not nor have I ever made excuses for the idiots out there that thought a money tree grew up and started raining down on them."

What the hell are you talking about? Your first post on this page blamed the

Quote :

"slimy in it for a buck banker "

8/6/2007 8:26:38 PM

dude, let it go...you've both voiced your arguments, let the public decide for themselves

8/6/2007 9:10:36 PM

Quote :

"So for an investing n00b, if the VMWare IPO hits on August 14, when will shares for the non-millionaire investor likely be available for purchase?"

8/6/2007 9:23:12 PM

time to buy some TIE?

8/7/2007 12:29:42 AM

I hear its a good time to load up on sub prime lender stock

8/7/2007 1:14:12 AM

Quote :

"If you don't know, how are you supposed to know?"

Good point. I wish there was a way for anyone to find information on anything, instantly. It would be nice if you could simply do something like type "mortgage" into a computer and instantly have a ton of information about it. Maybe someday...

Quote :

"Real people that trusted banks got took in this fiasco and they aren't going to have any recourse until the lawyers get involved (god forbid)."

Anyone who got "taken" got "taken" out of no one else's fault but their own. Anyone who signed ANY mortgage signed a Federal Truth in Lending disclosure form which when signed, states that those borrowing money knew what they were getting into. I don't care if you're a millionaire executive or a bus driver, it's not on anyone else but you to know what you're getting into.

It is convenient to blame others for enabling bad behavior. The starting point for all substance abuse programs is with the addict taking full responsibility for their actions. Part of being an adult is understanding consequences.

8/7/2007 5:29:05 AM

the hedge funds that collapsed...

there was an article about how the clients were already filling suites or exploring their options.

let me see if i can find the article...

8/7/2007 9:43:55 AM

http://uk.reuters.com/article/fundsNews/idUKNOA13732820070802

yup they say they were unaware of the exposure to subprime mortgages.

funny that the fund was named, "High Grade Credit Strategies Credit Fund"

8/7/2007 9:53:54 AM

"You don't know what you don't know."

- Donald Rumsfeld

8/7/2007 9:57:13 AM

Quote :

"Good point. I wish there was a way for anyone to find information on anything, instantly. It would be nice if you could simply do something like type "mortgage" into a computer and instantly have a ton of information about it. Maybe someday..."

Yea, that makes sense. These people that are certainly not financial experts and never will be can just go read whatever they want and become financial experts with a little googling. It's so easy, even a caveman could do it

Quote :

"It is convenient to blame others for enabling bad behavior. The starting point for all substance abuse programs is with the addict taking full responsibility for their actions. Part of being an adult is understanding consequences."

I'm sorry pal, but this nation isn't currently awash in trillions in bad debt because thousands upon thousands of people are wanting to blame someone else.

It isn't even about blame, or every issues being black and white, which is apparently how this site thinks about any topic. It's about lenders who assured people that shouldn't have been given loans, that they could afford it. Period.

8/7/2007 10:58:47 AM

Quote :

"So for an investing n00b, if the VMWare IPO hits on August 14, when will shares for the non-millionaire investor likely be available for purchase?"

be at your PC by 10am on Aug 14th. i'm most likely taking the day off to trade.

8/7/2007 11:05:35 AM

Why 10am?

8/7/2007 11:13:38 AM

because it may open for trading that early in the morning

8/7/2007 11:59:56 AM

Oh, are IPOs not available when the market opens?

8/7/2007 12:02:28 PM

not usually. they usually debut sometime in the morning post-opening bell.

8/7/2007 12:15:19 PM

Quote :

"These people that are certainly not financial experts and never will be can just go read whatever they want and become financial experts with a little googling. It's so easy, even a caveman could do it"

It doesn't take a financial genius to figure out what you can afford. Simple addition and subtraction will tell you that. Buyers were determined to get into the 'get rich quick' housing market. They didn't care what their payments would be in 2 or 3 years because their property would have appreciated by 20-30 percent or more by then. This is not a matter of being financially illiterate but gambling and losing.

Quote :

"I'm sorry pal, but this nation isn't currently awash in trillions in bad debt because thousands upon thousands of people are wanting to blame someone else."

No, this nation is currently awash in trillions of debt because of a complete lack of fucking personal responsibility. Just because someone offers you something, doesn't mean you should accept it. We have a nation of lemmings, one following the other off the cliff. Hell yeah, we're going to end up in a two tier society, those with no or little debt and those beholden to the lenders. The real definition of these groups are those that think for themselves and are smart enough to say no, and the group that can't stop buying and signs whatever is put in front of them - exclusions, people that are caught up in unforseen circumstances, health and injury, etc...

8/7/2007 12:48:28 PM

Poor Cramer, Fed leave rates unchanged.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20163222/
http://bankrate.com/brm/news/fed/main-aug07.asp?caret=1

8/7/2007 2:22:31 PM

got some JNPR and upped my EMC position at the days lows, and bought some ADRE for my dad (maybe i should've bought him some ILF instead).

went to the gym shortly after noon, and stayed long enough to intentionally avoid the garbage trading around the fed meeting.

i'll see about unloading some BHP and CHL in order to free up some cash for next week.


...and now that that bullshit is over, we can move on to the real deal: the CSCO call



[Edited on August 7, 2007 at 4:02 PM. Reason : CSCO]

8/7/2007 3:36:19 PM