Quote :

"Our freedom of religion, one of those freedoms that the terrorists hate so much...we just sacrificed it to the terrorists by kicking this man off the plane. And every single one of you are doing the same if you agree with his removal or get all wishy-washy about it."

He wasn't kicked off for being muslim, he was kicked off for suspicious activity that was reported by another passenger.

8/20/2006 4:41:56 PM

The problem is that the other passenger's a dipshit.

8/20/2006 5:05:57 PM

no, the problem is that in today's world hearing "allah ackbar" on a plane causes alarm and suspicion.

shouldn't be like that, but unfortunately that's just how it is, and justifiably so. just a dumb move on the doctor's part

8/20/2006 5:32:06 PM

I LIKE HOW NOBODY HAS ADDRESSED "PRIVATE" VS. "PUBLIC" ARENA

BUT HEY

THEN THERE WOULDN'T BE ANYTHING TO BE OUTRAGED AT

SO ARGUE ON

YOU GODDAMNED FOOLS

8/20/2006 8:39:07 PM

I think you're going to have to ask a lunch counter owner about that one, chief...

8/20/2006 8:48:59 PM

there's a difference between kicking out a black person and kicking out someone who's causing a ruckus

8/20/2006 8:54:05 PM

The Hon. Justice Excoriator, folks.

8/20/2006 8:55:04 PM

Quote :

"Haha, this thread is great... Americans telling people to practice their religion in secret."

8/20/2006 10:03:44 PM

Quote :

"Everybody is acting all confused and saying this is a tough situation. BULLSHIT The man was fucking praying. And he was kicked off a flight for it. That shit simply ain't right. And we all know it. And I'm gonna take this a step further and say that the terrorists have won here (in the GWB sense). Our freedom of religion, one of those freedoms that the terrorists hate so much...we just sacrificed it to the terrorists by kicking this man off the plane. And every single one of you are doing the same if you agree with his removal or get all wishy-washy about it. May we never make this mistake again. "

lol terrorists ftw!

8/20/2006 11:13:39 PM

hey guys, if you feel so strongly that UA had no right to kick this guy off the plane, I dare you to go to Sears and start walking around a tight circle while mumbling to yourself over and over.

if you're disturbing the other customers, prepare to be ejected.

8/20/2006 11:27:12 PM

OMF I DIDN'T GO TO SEARS

LOL I DON'T REALLY BELIEVE MYSELF

8/21/2006 12:01:19 AM

Quote :

"He was doing this to make a statement."

if he was, it was apparently a statement that needed to be made. the other people on the plane proved his point by reacting the way they did.

i doubt he was doing it just to make a statement though. praying when his beliefs dictate it is an everyday thing for him.

8/21/2006 1:37:41 AM

Which is why I continue to hope he sues UA.

8/21/2006 1:46:16 AM

If he wanted to pray, he should of done it in a school WHERE IT BELONGS!

8/21/2006 4:03:18 AM

Ok, now for those of you who think this inconvenience is suit worthy...what do you think its worth?

I'd say 5 free flights and a refund of expenses due to hotels/flight changes

This is not million dollar case.

8/21/2006 6:51:02 AM

Exatcly, I get inconvenienced on a nearly a daily basis by someone

doesn't mean I should not have to work the rest of my life because of it

8/21/2006 8:28:45 AM

^^i agree. it can be pretty traumatic to be hauled away for interrogation, but he doesn't need to become a millionaire just because he was practicing his religion.

8/21/2006 8:40:01 AM

Quote :

""The whole situation is just really frustrating," Farooq said. "It makes you uneasy, because you realize you have to essentially watch every single thing you say and do, and it's worse for people who are of colour, who are identifiable as a minority.""

1) Welcome to grown-up land.
2) Welcome to a world that people from your ethnic background helped create.

8/21/2006 8:40:07 AM

within this faith one has to proclaim submission to a higher authority

5 times a day

that is awful facist if you ask me

and i'm not a big fan of facism

8/21/2006 10:49:37 AM

^ Me neither, but most religions are fascist or at least heavily paternalistic. As such, he ought to be as allowed to pray according to his customs so long as he's protected by our Constitution...

Quote :

"2) Welcome to a world that people from your ethnic background helped create which means you're somehow culpable and less deserving of protection than my white, Christian ass."

[Edited on August 21, 2006 at 10:54 AM. Reason : .]

8/21/2006 10:54:17 AM

damn religion... always fucking something up

8/21/2006 10:56:48 AM

i don't know if this has been pointed out but

Quote :

"He's a doctor, what if the call to prayer is during the middle of a very important procedure...do you think he would wait?""

he's a radiologist...i don't think he's gonna be cutting someone open anytime soon

8/21/2006 10:59:14 AM

Quote :

"shouldn't be like that, but unfortunately that's just how it is, and justifiably so. just a dumb move on the doctor's part"

huh?

8/21/2006 11:08:46 AM

Quote :

"he's a radiologist...i don't think he's gonna be cutting someone open anytime soon"

I believe "important procedure" was the term used. But I think what is more important is the general case of any job where you need to do something during prayers.

My guess, moderates simply switch their prayer time (which is what drives extremists crazy and why they would want islamic states where everyone is off work to pray during those times)

8/21/2006 11:21:54 AM

You should be able to do whatever you want whenever you want. As long as religion is the excuse and it doesn't break any laws, go nuts.

My religion dictates that when I'm on an airplane I have to roll naked down the aisles and scream "MOTHERFUCKING BOMBS ON THIS MOTHERFUCKING PLANE".

It also dictates that when I'm in an icecream parlour and somebody orders mint chocolate chip, that I must take a dump on the tile floor and dance around it five times.

[Edited on August 21, 2006 at 11:25 AM. Reason : .]

8/21/2006 11:22:49 AM

i'm going to sind "Hare Rama Hare Krishna" and hand out flowers

8/21/2006 11:25:54 AM

Gamecat, if I was a minority in a country and white christian fundamentalists were known to blow up planes I would expect a full pat down and sideways glances if I showed up to the airport decked out in rosary beads. I'd probably refrain from sprinkling holy water on people during the flight as well.

8/21/2006 11:58:14 AM

Quote :

"ChknMcFaggot: My religion dictates that when I'm on an airplane I have to roll naked down the aisles and scream "MOTHERFUCKING BOMBS ON THIS MOTHERFUCKING PLANE". It also dictates that when I'm in an icecream parlour and somebody orders mint chocolate chip, that I must take a dump on the tile floor and dance around it five times."

Your religion sounds like it requires you to break a lot of laws in even my country, where they protect religious liberty. I've counted three separate crimes in your religious requirements. Perhaps you should go try and form your own country...

---

Quote :

"jbtilley: if I was a minority in a country and white christian fundamentalists were known to blow up planes I would expect a full pat down and sideways glances if I showed up to the airport decked out in rosary beads."

First off, I never believe anybody who fills in blanks with "if I were in that situation," just as a matter of policy. Fact is, you don't know what you'd do.

Secondly, would you honestly respond that way even if you lived in that country, and had your whole life?

Even when, as a citizen of that country, the Fourteenth Amendment mandates that you be treated equally to others--without regard to your religion or other minority status?

I mean, what you're saying here is that laws are only suggestions for ourselves and government. A fiercely intelligent point, but not the one I anticipate you were trying to make.

Quote :

"jbtilley: I'd probably refrain from sprinkling holy water on people during the flight as well."

Which correlates to what practice that Farooq did while on that plane...?

8/21/2006 2:22:27 PM

yea its pretty much complete bullshit.

8/21/2006 2:24:49 PM

Quote :

"shouldn't be like that, but unfortunately that's just how it is, and justifiably so. just a dumb move on the doctor's part huh?"

people shouldnt have to be afraid of a muslim praying

but in today's world it is completely justifiable

[Edited on August 21, 2006 at 2:27 PM. Reason : /]

8/21/2006 2:27:12 PM

if you think it shouldn't be that way, how is it justified?

Quote :

"jus·ti·fy Audio pronunciation of "justified" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (jst-f) v. jus·ti·fied, jus·ti·fy·ing, jus·ti·fies v. tr. 1. To demonstrate or prove to be just, right, or valid: justified each budgetary expense as necessary; anger that is justified by the circumstances. "

8/21/2006 2:29:56 PM

i dont know why we're arguing over this.

i think that it is unfortunate that people are afraid of muslims praying on a plane. it sucks. it shouldnt have to be like that.

UNFORTUNATELY, for reasons we all are aware of, people do get frightened and disturbed by it. and i can't really blame them for that. i understand their distrust/fear/uneasiness

8/21/2006 2:33:57 PM

public vs. private

8/21/2006 2:33:59 PM

Quote :

"it shouldnt have to be like that."

it doesn't "have to be like that." it is not "justified" if you think it shouldn't be like that. the flight attendants could have easily decided that praying is not a threat at any level. and if you say that flight attendants shoudln't be making that decision, okay, United Airlines could have said "we take security matters seriously. unfortunately this was taken too far in this occassion, for this we are sorry, etc etc."

people seem to think it's justified to take this guy's money for praying on a plane.

8/21/2006 2:42:15 PM

Samuel L. Jackson stars in

Prayers on a Plane

8/21/2006 2:45:31 PM

i've only been able to find ONE article on this. does anyone find it strange that no american newspapers or websites have carried this?

[Edited on August 21, 2006 at 2:49 PM. Reason : .]

8/21/2006 2:49:41 PM

Quote :

"Your religion sounds like it requires you to break a lot of laws in even my country, where they protect religious liberty. I've counted three separate crimes in your religious requirements. Perhaps you should go try and form your own country..."

I also get oppressed for the other part of my religion -- wearing a T-shirt to a fancy restaurant. They just don't respect my religious need to break dress codes.

8/21/2006 2:55:39 PM

he could have been like

"I gotta pray now, please don't take offense to it, I know some of my brothers have caused troubles for you and I understand your fears, but I am a good person and just wish to say my prayers in peace"

8/21/2006 2:56:05 PM

He could have but then he wouldn't have had all this sweet drama, publicity, and possibly loads and loads of cash at everybody else's expense!

8/21/2006 2:57:36 PM

public vs. private

8/21/2006 3:03:07 PM

I agree completely man

it's fucking private

they reserve the right to kick his ass off

8/21/2006 3:04:25 PM

and not refund his money? i think not.

so you're saying woolworth's can kick people out for being black?

we have rules about discriminating based on religion

[Edited on August 21, 2006 at 3:21 PM. Reason : .]

8/21/2006 3:20:35 PM

Quote :

"sarijoul: i've only been able to find ONE article on this. does anyone find it strange that no american newspapers or websites have carried this?"

Only one person I know finds it strange to be totally honest. And while it's anecdotal to you all (read: meaningless) his opinion doesn't comfort me at all. I know he's ex-air force intelligence, and was ranked rather highly, and to put it plainly, loves President Bush, so when he says something like: "This is the kind of tactic you can actually use to tell when things are being "hushed up" by the officials," sometimes, I take it seriously.

Anyway, this:

Quote :

"it doesn't "have to be like that." it is not "justified" if you think it shouldn't be like that. the flight attendants could have easily decided that praying is not a threat at any level. and if you say that flight attendants shoudln't be making that decision, okay, United Airlines could have said "we take security matters seriously. unfortunately this was taken too far in this occassion, for this we are sorry, etc etc." people seem to think it's justified to take this guy's money for praying on a plane."

Is almost the point. He's obviously already been coached by an attorney on this, but he phrased it exactly as it will appear in a courtroom, with standing: "institutionalized discrimination."

The point that seems to get ignored by the extremes in this debate is this: everybody understands why somebody on the plane might be concerned.

Got it?

Good. Now, we still must confront the obvious:

Did you know?
That man who got on the plane with you (yes! you), wearing a full beard and turban, carrying a suitcase, who was reading an Arabic newspaper, has as much a right to be on that plane, thinking Muslim thoughts about Allah while carrying an old copy of the Koran in his hand...as you do with your shaven face, novel, and cross on your neck?

I certainly hope so. Because up to this point, we'd have a lot more of these incidents if we let passengers play captain commando on every flight.

So. If a good number of people are edgy in that situation, and he has a right to be there, what went wrong?

Maybe that's too broad to address just, yet. Let's begin with a simpler question: What the fuck happened?

Information is scant. Feel free to do your own looking. I couldn't find much. Here's what the guy looks like:



And we have no account aside from his to go on in the reputable news. Until we know more from any source, and the only one we have--homeland security officials--says it was a misunderstanding and that the crew overreacted.

My question here is this: Why is anybody disputing Farooq's account in the first place?

Let's address that. Then we can probably solve the other problem by proxy.

8/21/2006 3:21:43 PM

Nobody's saying Muslims don't have a right to be on a fucking plane.

If people are concerned about a terrorism threat, they should report it. Then the airline should take action.

End
of
fucking
story.

8/21/2006 3:30:04 PM

Quote :

"First off, I never believe anybody who fills in blanks with "if I were in that situation," just as a matter of policy. Fact is, you don't know what you'd do. Secondly, would you honestly respond that way even if you lived in that country, and had your whole life?"

It would seem that you know nothing about my history. I've been a minority in a foreign country for a considerable about of time. But you're right. I can't truly say I've been in that situation because fundamentalist christians were not blowing up their planes at the time.

Quote :

"Which correlates to what practice that Farooq did while on that plane...?"

Meh, change it to hail marys for all I care.

8/21/2006 3:31:44 PM

so what was the terrorism threat again?

8/21/2006 3:32:16 PM

he was going to release islamic snakes from his mind, unleashed with prayer, on the plane

8/21/2006 3:36:06 PM

Literally run over by the threat of dying in a car accident. But wait a second. I'm getting ready to post Bush's latest nonsense trying to link a lack of resolve AND SOUL to the idea of considering ideas that don't involve barbarically trying to brutalize our way into the hearts and minds of the world.

Prepare the partisan attack engine!

8/21/2006 3:36:34 PM

that guy in the pic looks young. Most of the younger muslims in the West are more sympathetic to the more extreme brand of islam since allows them to be "different" and gets them involved with their "roots" since they grew up in the relative safety of the West.

8/21/2006 3:36:41 PM

so are you just totally pulling that out of your ass?

also, what does that matter?

can a shopkeeper throw out all young black males because they're more likely to rob them?

[Edited on August 21, 2006 at 3:38 PM. Reason : oh yeah and take the young black male's money without giving them what they paid for.]

8/21/2006 3:38:05 PM