so we're back to twista overexaggerating other people's stance.

4/11/2007 2:29:59 PM

like what sarijoul just did to me? no, cause im the only one who does that

4/11/2007 2:30:29 PM

^^that never left

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 2:30 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 2:30:36 PM

i was wronging in saying you think that the "iraq [war] is a war on terror" ?

4/11/2007 2:31:15 PM

^^sup kettle

(i figured you'd want to call me 'pot'...you know, cause of my screenname? so i took the preemptive step and called your troll ass 'kettle' to try and not confuse things)

^no, its a part of the war on terror...obviously

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 2:32 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 2:31:31 PM

so as a part of THE war on terror, iraq is A war on terror, right?

4/11/2007 2:32:44 PM

does this bullshit semantics lecture have a point

4/11/2007 2:33:34 PM

that i didn't misrepresent you at all

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 2:35 PM. Reason : you just said that i did and hope i wouldn't notice after the ensuing semantic argument YOU started]

4/11/2007 2:34:52 PM

I want to know why the fuck Pelosi is paying visits to Syria...seems to me like that isn't in her job description, stupid cunt.

4/11/2007 2:36:15 PM

^^well i was simply defending myself from wlb's claims

4/11/2007 2:36:59 PM

^^do you really want to know? because there is a thread on it somewhere. and multiple articles you could find on THE INTERNETS.

or did you just want to call her a cunt?

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 2:37 PM. Reason : m]

4/11/2007 2:37:46 PM

^^so what does

Quote :

"like what sarijoul just did to me? no, cause im the only one who does that"

mean?

4/11/2007 2:39:58 PM

its in reference to the last 2 posts of the last page and then the first post of this page

holy shit are you this fucking stupid

shall i spell out everything for you? it was in regards to three consecutive posts...notice that no carats were needed...jesus

4/11/2007 2:40:37 PM

jesus. i'm saying that i didn't misrepresent you. you just made it up.

4/11/2007 2:41:36 PM

no actually you put words in my mouth right here

Quote :

"so we're back to the "iraq is a war on terror" thing? "

you completely misrepresented what i said, but do you know what? i could give two shits...im not still harping on some meaningless bullshit

but thats me...some other people love to harp on shit for years and years and years

4/11/2007 2:42:17 PM

9/11

never forget!!1

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 2:45 PM. Reason : ,]

4/11/2007 2:45:36 PM

Quote :

"im not still harping on some meaningless bullshit"

what do you think soapbox is?

and i'll recap the whole exchange

someone said "the war in iraq is won"

then you said "we won the war on terror?" [obviously implying that the iraq was in some way part of the war on terror]

to which i made a reply of saying you were back to saying "iraq is a war on terror"

i don't see how that is a misrepresentation.

you just keep saying it is.

4/11/2007 2:45:55 PM

page 3 is always where TSB threads come unraveled.

4/11/2007 2:48:46 PM

ok...the iraq war is A war on terror

although i'd prefer to call it a battle in the war on terror

but just because we "killed saddam" doesnt mean "we won the war"

also we're not exactly fighting uniformed iraq national soldiers...we're fighting terrorists...you can call them insurgents or whatever...i call people who blow themselves up in marketplaces terrorists

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 2:53 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 2:52:48 PM

4/11/2007 2:59:36 PM

troller46an3

4/11/2007 3:00:55 PM

i see what you did there.

4/11/2007 3:02:44 PM

Quote :

"i call people who blow themselves up in marketplaces terrorists "

as do i, but was this happening there before we went in?........NO, so by that logic, we're in worse shape now than then.

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 3:14 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 3:14:38 PM

there were suicide bombers in iraq before we went in...not as many, but it had happened

its not like suicide bombers are something that only happens after the US invades some place...its not the US's fault that people get tricked into radical religions that convince people to blow themselves up

4/11/2007 3:17:15 PM

so it's the RELIGION that convinces people to blow themselves up. i see it's all clear now. then why don't we just fight a war on islam then? wouldn't solve all our problems?!

4/11/2007 3:29:24 PM

simple yes or no question:

Are there more suicide attacks, civilian deaths, and military deaths in Iraq now than there were say 5-6 years ago?

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 3:31 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 3:31:32 PM

^^while i dont agree that any type of 'religious war' would be good, you gotta admit some of the more radically fundamental muslims are fucking crazy as shit

^couldnt answer that...saddam didnt keep good records on the deaths his secret execution squads committed like CNN, etc does currently

do i need to quote Patrick Swayze's character from Road House again?

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 3:35 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 3:35:17 PM

Quote :

"saddam didnt keep good records on the deaths his secret execution squads committed like CNN, etc does currently"

Good cop out, but nobody could hide hundreds of thousands of deaths, not to mention you only addressed one aspect of the question.


I know Sadam's death squads didn't kill thousands of US soldiers, not to mention there is a larger death squad presence there now than then.

Quote :

"you gotta admit some of the more radically fundamental muslims are fucking crazy as shit "

as are some of the more radically fundamental christians, or jews.

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 3:40 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 3:39:30 PM

i'm agnostic so i'm not offended by any of that

but next time a couple crazy christians or jews blow themselves up, let me know

i think i'll be waiting awhile to hear about those

and yeah maybe it was kind of a copout, although i wouldnt put anything past saddam

but just because there are more deaths now than there might have been before the war doesnt mean the overall effort isnt working

4/11/2007 3:42:11 PM

4/11/2007 3:45:49 PM

^so the last time a christian or jew blew themselves up was Waco (1993) or Oklahoma City (1995)?

exactly...doesnt happen too often does it since it hasnt happened in the US in the last 10 years

if you posted pictures of all the muslims who have blown themselves up in the last 2 years i'm sure the page would become way too long to even navigate

4/11/2007 3:58:41 PM

^ Terrorism correlates more strongly to certain economic and social conditions more than it does to religion.

4/11/2007 4:00:05 PM

Quote :

"i'm agnostic so i'm not offended by any of that but next time a couple crazy christians or jews blow themselves up, let me know "

it wasn't meant to offend, but it's true

and while it might not be common place for christians or jews to use suicide attacks, the crazy fundamentalists in each group have done some damage in the past.

Quote :

"if you posted pictures of all the muslims who have blown themselves up in the last 2 years i'm sure the page would become way too long to even navigate "

so is blowing oneself up the most important criteria here? So if the muslims had created the same amount of destruction with conventional bombs, it wouldn't be as bad??????

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 4:02 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 4:00:28 PM

^not disagreeing

but if you're trying to say that in 2007 the most violent radical religious people arent offshoots of Islam, i think you're just trying too hard to be politically correct or something

Quote :

"So if the muslims had created the same amount of destruction with conventional bombs, it wouldn't be as bad??????"

the destruction would still be just as bad...but they wouldnt seem as crazy...they'd at least appear to value their own lives

^^I think its a combination...I mean there are poor countries in Africa and other parts of Asia (not the Middle East), etc that dont seem to have the suicide bomber problems that the predominantly Muslim world has

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 4:02 PM. Reason : .]

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 4:03 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 4:01:43 PM

Quote :

"the destruction would still be just as bad...but they wouldnt seem as crazy"

one of the best ways to intimidate a foe is to appear bat shit crazy.

4/11/2007 4:04:21 PM

and one of the best ways to get 373,248 virgins is to kill yourself for Allah

but i dont buy that shit

4/11/2007 4:06:34 PM

Quote :

"and one of the best ways to get 373,248 virgins "

I would like to hear of the other ways as well.

4/11/2007 4:10:01 PM

^^^^ As you should know from the climate change debate, correlation is not causation.

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 4:11 PM. Reason : ]

4/11/2007 4:11:35 PM

ps: thats 72 houses, each with 72 bedrooms, each with 72 virgins in them

cause one of the common myths is that muslims who kill themselves in the name of allah get "72 virgins"

just an fyi although its still a load of crap!

^specifically what? i agree fundamentally that correlation doesnt equal causation

all i'm doing is pointing out right now that the raw data shows muslims are committing most of te suicide bombings nowadays...im not really trying to determine why although i think its essentially people getting falsely indoctrinated with hatred from a very young age

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 4:13 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 4:11:54 PM

same principle as "Good" Christians getting a mansion in Heaven. i don't really see a difference.

Most forms of religion are fundamentally the same.....and the fatal flaw is that the lore is in man's hands to preserve.....then man twists the teachings to fit his current agenda, and the initial purpose is lost. then religion becomes merely a reason to disagree and fight.

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 4:16 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 4:14:01 PM

same principle i agree

but luckily the Bible doesnt say you have to kill someone in a jihad to get into Heaven...it says you have to do nicer things, like be kind to your neighbors and whatnot

mind control aspect might be similar...luckily the Christians just arent as inherently violent about it

4/11/2007 4:16:02 PM

Quote :

" all i'm doing is pointing out right now that the raw data shows muslims are committing most of te suicide bombings nowadays...im not really trying to determine why although i think its essentially people getting falsely indoctrinated with hatred from a very young age"

That's probably true, but you're looking at a very specific set of criteria there.

It's like saying people with red hair have more freckles... no shit, but how does that help us?

You have to look at a broader spectrum of terrorism, not just suicide bombs. And as far as actually solving a problem, you must look for causation. Correlation can point you in the right direction, but it won't get you all the way there.

I brought the climate change in mostly as tounge-in-cheek, but you're very skeptical about climate change despite massive amounts of statistical data, yet you readily accept the muslims-are-terrorist line with very little, specious data.

4/11/2007 4:17:15 PM

^^the bible also says it is not murder to kill in battle, and tells of a time when the jews were punished by god for not exterminating every single human in a certain village.

the violence is there. Its just not exploited in the current manifestations of christianity.

Quote :

"It's like saying people with red hair have more freckles... no shit, but how does that help us"

thank you...

[Edited on April 11, 2007 at 4:19 PM. Reason : .]

4/11/2007 4:17:46 PM

Considering the historical spread of christianity and angl-saxon culture, I think it can be argued that Christianity is at least as violent as Islam (but in a different way).

The current political situation is a manifestation of the success of this violence of Christianity, where the muslims are still fighting a war they lost a long time ago.

4/11/2007 4:19:38 PM

^^well for whatever reasons, most of the christians i've seen dont think we're in battle in the sense that they're going on killing sprees

let alone many of the muslim suicide bombers....kill mosly muslims in the blasts

and the current manifestations of the violence are what matter...i could give two shits if you have some violent thoughts in your head as long as you dont act out on them

^^^if you're seriously trying to compare muslim suicide bombers to global warming...where do i begin? i just wont even go there cause those are completely unrelated

if anything i dont need millions of individual pieces of data to show me that "suicide bomber sets off blast in market; kills 7"

4/11/2007 4:21:30 PM

i would say the violence of a given religion is correlated to the position of that religion in the social hirearchy


i.e. christians were historically very violent untill they laid claim to the most popular religion in the world, then calmed down b/c they were on top.....many of the radical muslims see islam as not being taken seriously on a global scale, so there is a need to fight for "pride and power"

4/11/2007 4:23:23 PM

Quote :

"I brought the climate change in mostly as tounge-in-cheek"

4/11/2007 4:23:39 PM

i'm just saying

pointing out that most of the suicide bombers nowadays are muslim is like saying "its 52 degrees outside right now"

you dont really have to look around

^^probably

4/11/2007 4:25:14 PM

^i don't think anyone is disagreeing with that, just that the end is more relavant than the means in this situation.

i.e. it doesn't matter how they are killing people, just that they are killing people.

4/11/2007 4:26:44 PM

true that

4/11/2007 4:32:11 PM