raleigh durham skyhawks

12/17/2007 9:48:03 AM

Quote :

"Duke was nothing before K"

stupid ass

12/17/2007 10:46:10 AM

Quote :

"My point is that if you drew a given year out of a hat for UCLA, UNC, Kentucky, or Duke then Carolina would have a better chance of having the better team Like I said earlier, UCLA, Kentucky and Duke all had SEVERAL years when they were below average. UNC has had ONE"

But on the flip side, UNC has only had 4 years that have been good enough to win a championship.

Kentucky has had 7, and UCLA has had 11.

When looking for the greatest team EVER, shouldn't we be looking at greatness, and not adequacy?

[Edited on December 17, 2007 at 12:59 PM. Reason : ]

12/17/2007 12:58:14 PM

daddytime sure does love sucking UNC's cock

12/17/2007 1:35:08 PM

no, just all state fans just hate being inferior to UNC and will never give them the credit they deserve just because all carolina fans are stuck up pricks

I hate carolina but i'm just being realistic and practical when it comes to admiting they are the best basketball program ever

They've been to the championship game just as many times as UCLA (which means more than kentucky and duke), and they've been to FAR many more NCAA tournaments than UCLA

12/17/2007 2:30:31 PM

well, I hate Kentucky as much as UNC... so that doesnt work for me... as I said before, I would have it:

Kentucky
UNC
UCLA

12/17/2007 2:42:30 PM

Quote :

"UNC has only had 4 years that have been good enough to win a championship."

Actually that's 2.


Two of them were given to them....err paid for by them (Chris Webber?)



....Okay, they actually should have about 8-10 championships by now but the great choke artist Dean Smiff screwed it up.


But i would agree, unfortunately UNC is the best NCAA basketball program

12/17/2007 3:18:27 PM

hate to say it but, state's 83 championship was more of a fluke than carolina's 93 championship (wasn't carolina up by 2 anyways when webber called that timeout?) and was def. more of a fluke than carolina's 82 jim brown passing it to james worthy for no apparent reason (82 tarheels have been argued by many writers as the best college basketball team of all time)

and even though 1924 wasn't a "national championship" they were obviously damn good enough to be considered the best in the country

12/17/2007 3:28:19 PM

you dont have to be a State fan to know UCLA is THE BEST COLLEGE BASKETBALL PROGRAM

UNC is a great program but I swear living down here you guys must hear so much shit from UNC fans that that somehow vaults them over superior programs like the Bruins and Wildcats

MLB: Yankees followed by Cardinals
NFL: Steelers/49ers/Cowboys/Patriots in whatever order you choose
NBA: Celtics followed by Lakers
NCAAFB: Michigan
NCAABB: UCLA

and yeah i'm pretty much basing it on most titles and general long term domination

12/17/2007 3:45:19 PM

I think there needs to be a more concrete definition here of what constitutes a "Great Sports Team". Is it the ability to show greatness over a long period of time? Or can it be (and should it be) confined to just one season?

I've seen both types of the definition used in this thread and I would say that it should be confined to one season.

Beyond that, can we rank one type of sport over the other? I would say, "Yes", but I would love to see everyone's thoughts on the greatest college basketball team or the greatest professional soccer team, etc.

Finally, I would love to engage in a discussion of the ultimate "All-Time All-Star" team.

12/17/2007 3:45:52 PM

Quote :

"hate to say it but, state's 83 championship was more of a fluke than carolina's 93 championship (wasn't carolina up by 2 anyways when webber called that timeout?) and was def. more of a fluke than carolina's 82 jim brown passing it to james worthy for no apparent reason (82 tarheels have been argued by many writers as the best college basketball team of all time)"

UNC was down when Webber called the timeout I believe. They were up when the errant pass occured.

The 83' championship wasn't as much of a fluke as most people believe. We were preseason favorites to win the ACC and were a very good team until we lost Whittenburg. When he came back right before the ACC tournament is when we went on our tear. Granted, Phi Slamma Jamma was one of the best teams in NCAA history and we shouldn't have beaten them... but we were one of the elite teams in the nation when healthy.

Quote :

"and even though 1924 wasn't a "national championship" they were obviously damn good enough to be considered the best in the country"

No one in their right mind would have voted them as such. The Helms foundation was run by a guy who ran a bakery in Los Angeles, and he obviously didn't know much about basketball.

They were awarded the '24 championship... but the Helms foundation wasn't founded until like 1940. Butler holds the championship that year for winning the only AAU sponsored basketball tournament.


I know it's biased, but this seems to be the general consensus on their 'National Championship'.

http://www.dukebasketballreport.com/articles/?p=19923

Quote :

"[Time out for a brief discussion about UNC’s so-called 1924 ‘Helms Foundation’ national title. UNC fans would have you believe that’s a pre-NCAA poll that’s similar to the championships awarded in college football today. It’s not. The Helms Foundation titles were awarded starting in the early 1940s. A committee of so-called experts went back and determined champions from the 1920s and 1930s. I have no idea who was on the committee, but I know their knowledge of basketball history is not very good. While UNC did go 26-0 and win the Southern Conference championship in Atlanta that season, the White Phantoms (as they were known) were strictly a regional phenomenon. They played nobody outside the South. The problem is that Southern basketball just wasn’t very good in that era. UNC found that out a year later when they repeated as Southern Conference champions, but ventured north and lost three straight — two by lopsided margins — to Eastern teams. The best basketball in 1924 was played in the East and Midwest. And what the Helms researchers ignored is that there was a national tournament that season, sponsored by the AAU. Butler, which beat the teams that were perceived as the best in the country, won that event and also claims a 1924 national title.] "

[Edited on December 17, 2007 at 4:03 PM. Reason : Eh, Butler, Baylor...whoever]

12/17/2007 3:54:29 PM

Quote :

"and yeah i'm pretty much basing it on most titles and general long term domination"

Isn't UNC the winningest program all-time?

(I think they have the most wins, win pct., and NCAA appearances, right?)

Although they obviously don't have the most Nat'l Championships

12/17/2007 4:10:46 PM

Quote :

"general long term domination"

1924 being voted on by so called "experts"- i mean, its whatever, they still had a dominant team that year and have continued to display dominance more years than any other college basketball team

To break it down
The ACC has been the best conference in NCAA history top to bottom
Carolina has the most ACC championships

[Edited on December 17, 2007 at 4:13 PM. Reason : .]

12/17/2007 4:12:30 PM

Quote :

"To break it down The ACC has been the best conference in NCAA history Carolina has the most ACC championships"

i'm not going to take sides, but this is terrible logic simply b/c the NCAA has its own championship, and unc doesn't have the most of these, so why would you ever look at a lesser championship to compare them to other teams?

12/17/2007 4:14:07 PM

Quote :

" * 26 wins: MLB - New York Yankees (39 total appearances) * 24 wins: NHL - Montreal Canadiens (33 total appearances) * 16 wins: NBA - Boston Celtics (19 total appearances) * 15 wins: CFL - Toronto Argonauts (21 total appearances) * 14 wins: NBA - Los Angeles/Minneapolis Lakers (28 total appearances) * 13 wins: CFL - Edmonton Eskimos (23 total appearances) * 11 wins: NHL - Toronto Maple Leafs (19 total appearances) * 10 wins: NHL - Detroit Red Wings (22 total appearances) * 10 wins: MLB - St. Louis Cardinals (17 total appearances) * 9 wins: CFL - Winnipeg Blue Bombers (21 total appearances) * 9 wins: NFL - Green Bay Packers (12 total appearances) * 8 wins: CFL - Hamilton Tiger-Cats (18 total appearances) * 8 wins: CFL - Ottawa Rough Riders (14 total appearances) * 8 wins: NFL - Chicago Bears** (10 total appearances) * 6 wins: NFL - New York Giants (12 total appearances) * 6 wins: MLB - Boston Red Sox (10 total appearances) * 6 wins: NBA - Chicago Bulls (6 total appearances) * 5 wins: NHL - Boston Bruins (17 total appearances) * 5 wins: CFL - Montreal Alouettes (15 total appearances) * 5 wins: MLB - New York Giants (14 total appearances) * 5 wins: CFL - Calgary Stampeders (11 total appearances) * 5 wins: NFL - Washington Redskins (11 total appearances) * 5 wins: CFL - B.C. Lions (9 total appearances) * 5 wins: MLB - Cincinnati Reds (9 total appearances) * 5 wins: MLB - Los Angeles Dodgers (9 total appearances) * 5 wins: NFL - Dallas Cowboys (8 total appearances) * 5 wins: CFL - Hamilton Tigers (8 total appearances) * 5 wins: MLB - Philadelphia Athletics (8 total appearances) * 5 wins: MLB - Pittsburgh Pirates (7 total appearances) * 5 wins: NHL - Edmonton Oilers (6 total appearances) * 5 wins: NBA - Minneapolis Lakers (6 total appearances) * 5 wins: NFL - Pittsburgh Steelers (6 total appearances) * 5 wins: NFL - San Francisco 49ers (5 total appearances) "

these are championships.

[Edited on December 17, 2007 at 4:18 PM. Reason : .]

12/17/2007 4:18:09 PM

when I said NFL, I meant Superbowl Era NFL cause I knew some teams like the Bears had a lot of titles before the 1st superbowl

12/17/2007 4:20:34 PM

Quote :

"Isn't UNC the winningest program all-time? (I think they have the most wins, win pct., and NCAA appearances, right?)"

Nope, Kentucky has the most wins and highest win %. Don't know about NCAA appearances.

12/17/2007 6:45:21 PM

Quote :

"they weren't ucla, carolina, kentucky, kansas, or even state"

this is what I meant

they weren't even mentioned as one of the great teams before coach k came along

12/17/2007 7:30:35 PM

unc womens soccer:

(1979-2007): 620-30-19 (.927)
19 of 27 total championships
103-game unbeaten streak
101-game unbeaten streak and 137-game home unbeaten streak
92-game winning streak

12/17/2007 7:59:19 PM

^ftw

A third of the '04 olympic women's soccer team played at UNC

http://www.heathermitts.com/press27.htm

[Edited on December 17, 2007 at 11:36 PM. Reason : .]

12/17/2007 11:35:51 PM

Still UCLA or Kentucky over UNC.

12/18/2007 3:53:33 AM

'51 Red Wings.

12/18/2007 4:07:31 AM

when the us beat china in the womans world cup...straight beat down on communism...what

12/18/2007 4:08:51 AM

Quote :

"Nope, Kentucky has the most wins and highest win %. Don't know about NCAA appearances."

I know that they did and that they are close... but didn't UNC pass them under Tubby?

Anywho... I think it's easy to argue UNC, UCLA, or Kentucky.

12/18/2007 8:39:57 AM

Quote :

"UNC was down when Webber called the timeout I believe. They were up when the errant pass occured. "

UNC was up by 2 or 3 points when Webber called the timeout

12/18/2007 8:52:45 AM

Quote :

"i'm not going to take sides, but this is terrible logic simply b/c the NCAA has its own championship, and unc doesn't have the most of these, so why would you ever look at a lesser championship to compare them to other teams?"

Without 7 game playoff series like the NBA, its hard to judge exactly who the "best" team is each year

UCLA winning those 10 within that small period of time is pretty safe to say that they were the best program at that time. (Even though carolina played UCLA several times in the championship game during that stretch, and could have possibly won a 7 game series against them during that stretch...there wasn't and they didn't)

BUT, UCLA failed to prove that they were good enough to make it to a hypothetical 7 game series playoff system in the years prior to and proceeding (FEW execptions) their 10 year dominition

12/18/2007 9:19:09 AM

the acc does not play a 7 game playoff either, so what's your point?

12/18/2007 9:22:22 AM

any argument you can make against UCLA, you can certainly make against UNC

daddytime is definitely a carolina fan

12/18/2007 9:25:47 AM

Quote :

"I would love to see everyone's thoughts on the greatest college basketball team or the greatest professional soccer team, etc. "

The funny thing about that, is I think its reasonable to say that there are several teams in the top 10 "greatest college basketball team's ever" that never won an NCAA championship

examples
92 UNLV (larry johnson...)
93 Michigan
99 Duke Blue Devils
73 NC State

12/18/2007 9:27:54 AM

Quote :

"92 UNLV (larry johnson...) 93 Michigan 99 Duke Blue Devils 73 NC State"

3/4 of those teams won a title within 2 years of the year you gave so that argument sucks

12/18/2007 9:33:41 AM

Quote :

"the acc does not play a 7 game playoff either, so what's your point?"

My point is that to dominate a conference like the ACC gives you more credit then dominating the pac-10 or sec.

12/18/2007 9:34:02 AM

92 UNLV - lost 4 starters from 1990 (92-still considered better team)
2001 Duke- had only 3 players from 99 team
93 Michigan- didn't have ANYBODY from 89 championship

12/18/2007 9:39:47 AM

Quote :

"My point is that to dominate a conference like the ACC gives you more credit then dominating the pac-10 or sec."

and my point is that to dominate the NCAA gives you more credit than dominating the acc. this is not hard logic, sir.

12/18/2007 9:42:24 AM

Quote :

"this is not hard logic, sir"

Sure it is

UCLA might not have made it to the NCAA tournament a few of those years they won the national championship had they played in the ACC

12/18/2007 9:46:49 AM

Quote :

"92 UNLV - lost 4 starters from 1990 (92-still considered better team) 2001 Duke- had only 3 players from 99 team 93 Michigan- didn't have ANYBODY from 89 championship"

who the fuck considers 92 unlv to be as good as the championship squad with LJ, Augmon, Anthony?

and 2001 Duke had Dunleavy, Boozer, Jay Williams...all current NBA players...not a team of scrubs

and state won the title the very next year

and yeah Michigan didnt win because they didnt have any longevity

find out some instances where the only reason your precious tarheels didnt go dancing was violations cause this argument of yours also sucks

12/18/2007 9:47:12 AM

its hard to find a time when the tarheels DIDNT go dancing, and don't say 2001, bill guthridge was a horrible recruiter, left doherty with shit

12/18/2007 9:49:20 AM

trying to say UNC is better than UCLA is like saying the Braves have a better franchise than the Yankees

12/18/2007 9:50:27 AM

Not at all, Yankees have shown domination since inception
UCLA hasn't

12/18/2007 9:53:29 AM

Quote :

"UCLA might not have made it to the NCAA tournament a few of those years they won the national championship had they played in the ACC"

yet, they nearly always fared better in the tournament than the acc representative.

12/18/2007 9:53:57 AM

^^get that unc shit off here you fucking faggot, go to another board and spread your homo aids, ucla is easily the most dominant college bball program in history to anyone with a brain cell so stfu

UCLA won 88 straight games and daddytime acts like they're the buffalo bills

[Edited on December 18, 2007 at 9:55 AM. Reason : .]

12/18/2007 9:54:41 AM

Quote :

"yet, they nearly always fared better in the tournament than the acc representative."

ACC has won more championships than UCLA and Pac-10

12/18/2007 9:56:30 AM

Quote :

"ACC has won more championships than UCLA and Pac-10"

dont try to use State and Duke and Maryland to make up for your faggy crush on the tarheels and their sheer inferiority to the bruins



Dean the red nosed drunk is my bitch

12/18/2007 9:57:53 AM

Quote :

"UCLA won 88 straight games and daddytime acts like they're the buffalo bills "

Carolina made 27 consecutive NCAA tournament appearences

Carolina beat UCLA in 1998 by 44 points in the Maui classic (thats buffalo bills as shit)

12/18/2007 9:59:12 AM

im talking about national championship titles and you're talking about tournament appearances (herb sendek must be the best coach ever) and the fucking maui invitational?

Quote :

"ACC has won more championships than UCLA and Pac-10"

10 for the ACC (UNC 4, Duke 3, State 2, Maryland 1)
14 for the PAC 10 (UCLA 11, Oregon 1, Standord 1, Cal 1)

stfu with your blatant lies and go back to chapel hill and get that shit off tww

12/18/2007 10:02:13 AM

^regardless
are you really going to sit there and try to argue that the pac-10 has better basketball history than the ACC

12/18/2007 10:08:26 AM

herb sendek was a great fucking coach
just cause he couldn't beat carolina year in and year out
and just cause he couldn't make a final four
state fans hated him
i mean do state fans really think they deserve a final four, they are an inferior school that celebrates the shit out of mediocraty in every sport

12/18/2007 10:10:59 AM

how come you were trying to convince us earlier that you "despised" carolina when you clearly cheer for them? i know UNC fans who admit that UCLA is a better program, but you claim to be unbiased and claim UNC is "clearly" the best program?

12/18/2007 10:12:15 AM

how come UNC is so jealous of UCLA and Kentucky
is it because UNC and Kentucky own them in basketall
and clearly in football
since UNC is one of the worst football programs in the country

12/18/2007 10:13:01 AM

i mean don't get me wrong
state must be a really desirable coaching job
didn't calapari and steve lavin turn down the job?
two coaching gems right there

12/18/2007 10:13:46 AM

i love state now cause i graduated from here (when we were good at sports 2002-2006)
but i still do love state, and pull for them over carolina
but yes, i grew up a carolina fan
and the only team i hated was duke, cause they gave carolina competition year in and year out
i didn't give a shit about state cause they always sucked

12/18/2007 10:16:08 AM