black pride is being aware of your culture and history

white pride is akin to the KKK, lynching blacks, aryan nation, etc

but no....theres no double standard......

3/27/2008 10:41:56 AM

GoldenViper is a good example of somebody who takes pride in his heritage, but isn't akin to the KKK, etc that you named.

He makes a good point too. "White power" typically is reactionary in this country, while "black power" is revolutionary. Black power movements have accounted for more of our social equalities than anything else, while white power movements fought them at every turn.

Is this that hard to understand? Or will you continue to look purely at the present and claim to not understand the double standard which has been built upon history?

3/27/2008 10:45:37 AM

Quote :

"black pride is being aware of your culture and history white pride is akin to the KKK, lynching blacks, aryan nation, etc but no....theres no double standard......"

Maybe that's because the "white pride" alludes to early America where you were beating, owning, trading, and raping slaves. "black pride," though doesn't have nearly as much place in today's society, has more to do with overcoming that oppression. If you want to celebrate your heritage, why not celebrate your western european ancestry? like Irish or British pride? Blacks would do the same, but most of them had their heritage stolen from them.

3/27/2008 11:04:36 AM

Quote :

"like Irish or British pride?"

I'm American, not Irish or British

Quote :

"you were beating, owning, trading, and raping slaves"

No I wasn't born then so I wasn't doing any of those things

Quote :

"will you continue to look purely at the present and claim to not understand the double standard which has been built upon history?"

Like I said...I wasn't around for slavery...none of us were...and yes we live in the present...so what the fuck do I have to do with the double standard

3/27/2008 11:09:20 AM

America does celebrate white pride. It's called world history and it's very biased towards western civilization. I think the West is the best, but we're terribly ignorant of other cultures.

3/27/2008 11:10:56 AM

3/27/2008 11:12:00 AM

Quote :

"America does celebrate white pride. It's called world history and it's very biased towards western civilization. I think the West is the best, but we're terribly ignorant of other cultures."

I dont buy this. History is what it is. Ive taken several history courses and have studied all kinds of civilizations and cultures throughout the world. Modern history is dominated by large wars and those really havent included African nations.

3/27/2008 11:55:20 AM

African nations are constantly at war, I guess that's the point. It isn't in our history classes, or on the news often.

3/27/2008 12:00:09 PM

they are constantly fighting...on a small scale and it is in the history class. however, it is not covered at the length the world wars or vietnam are because the US is not involved in them. not to mention that the fighting rarely results in anything tangible on a global level historically.

I am not minimizing the sad situations over there, just stating as to why they are not covered with the same ferocity. teachers have to choose the main topics to cover in their classes because they have such a short time to do it in.

it has nothing to do with race. the struggles of the IRA and the UK are given about the same amount of time.

[Edited on March 27, 2008 at 12:08 PM. Reason : .]

3/27/2008 12:07:43 PM

haha, ok

3/27/2008 12:09:07 PM

glad you agree.

3/27/2008 12:11:37 PM

Quote :

"hell even japan, they hate outsiders. "

yeah, i've heard this, too. like, they bar whitey from going to a lot of restaurants and bars.

i've heard that if you just barge your big American ass in there, they'll serve you anyway, and usually quite politely (because culturally, while they are ok with not letting you in in the first place, they would consider it rude not to serve you if you're in there).

i don't know if that's true...just what one person told me.

3/27/2008 12:33:45 PM

From my time in Japan...

I wouldn't call it a lot places, but I certainly came across a handful of places that wouldn't let me in. On the other hand, there are a mountain of places that were more than happy to take my yen.

Shit like 'just barge your big American ass in there' always pissed me off.

3/27/2008 12:43:33 PM

i'm not advocating doing it (and for the record, neither was the person who told me this)

3/27/2008 12:50:24 PM

Remember, folks, Obama was talking about his own grandmother. If a fully white politician called their grandmother a typical white person, would anyone care? If not, why should anyone get upset about Obama's remark?

I wouldn't be surprised if fully white politicians have said similar things. I know many folks who've noted common prejudices in groups they belong to, often using family members as examples.

Quote :

"I dont buy this. History is what it is. Ive taken several history courses and have studied all kinds of civilizations and cultures throughout the world."

Name some important historical figures. Just folks who come to mind. I suspect you'll find most are white.

3/27/2008 1:18:07 PM

Quote :

"Name some important historical figures. Just folks who come to mind. I suspect you'll find most are white. "

what does that prove? my knowledge of influential black people or the lack thereof?

3/27/2008 1:53:01 PM

I'm just a typical American boy from a typical American town. I believe in God and Senator Dodd and keeping ol' Castro down.

3/27/2008 1:57:52 PM

Quote :

"If a fully white politician called their grandmother a typical white person, would anyone care? "

what people are arguing is what would happen if a fully white politician called his grandmother a "typical black person".

of course, that's kinda tough, because even at 25% black, I'm don't think our culture would consider the politician in question "fully white".


and again, i personally don't really give a shit. there are dozens of reasons I don't want him to be President, but they're ALL policy-driven. As far as I'm concerned, the only issue here is just that of a double standard.

3/27/2008 1:58:43 PM

i'd vote for mccain if he was better on the economy and wasnt so stubborn on iraq

[Edited on March 27, 2008 at 2:23 PM. Reason : and i still might vote for him...seeing as the election is still like 9 months away]

3/27/2008 2:22:45 PM

^ Have you ever voted? Serious question.

3/27/2008 2:27:25 PM

Quote :

"what people are arguing is what would happen if a fully white politician called his grandmother a "typical black person". "

if this white politician followed up the "typical black person" with a who... and then pulls the phrase into an intelligent argument, there wouldn't be a problem.

3/27/2008 2:56:16 PM

yeah right.

3/27/2008 3:04:21 PM

^^can you give an example of a hypothetical intelligent answer that would work in that scenario? doesn't have to be anything real, just something that sounds intelligent and doesn't come across as racist...i figure as a black guy, you have a better idea of what would be an acceptable finish to that "typical black person" statement

[Edited on March 27, 2008 at 3:04 PM. Reason : ^^]

3/27/2008 3:04:26 PM

Okay

"The point I was making was not that my grandmother harbors any racial animosity, but that she is a typical black person. If she sees an angry mob on the streets with burning crosses approaching her, there's a reaction in her that doesn't go away and it comes out in the wrong way."

There would have to be some social relevance though, of course.

[Edited on March 27, 2008 at 3:08 PM. Reason : ]

3/27/2008 3:07:49 PM

Quote :

"what does that prove? my knowledge of influential black people or the lack thereof?"

That white folks are far from oppressed or ignored in this country. It's one of the many reasons why I laugh at people who complain about the supposedly raw deal whites get in modern America.

Quote :

"of course, that's kinda tough, because even at 25% black, I'm don't think our culture would consider the politician in question "fully white"."

This does indeed complicate the issue. Our racial categories are a wonky legacy of white supremacy. In any case, it's key that Obama wasn't talking about a stranger. He was talking about a relative. His own flesh and blood. And, in my view, he's completely correct. Most of us, of all races, have been culturally conditioned. Whether we like or not, we have deeply ingrained prejudices.

Quote :

"As far as I'm concerned, the only issue here is just that of a double standard."

I believe moron suggested earlier, some double standards are natural and reasonable. America doesn't have a history of black supremacy. An honest racial dialogue can't ignore this.

3/27/2008 3:30:10 PM

I'm deeply offended by Obama's blatantly racist comments.

3/27/2008 5:09:59 PM

^ Obama never made such comments.

3/27/2008 5:17:43 PM

Quote :

"if this white politician followed up the "typical black person" with a who... and then pulls the phrase into an intelligent argument, there wouldn't be a problem."

not academically, and not to me, and maybe not to you, but in reality, there would be a problem.

Quote :

"I believe moron suggested earlier, some double standards are natural and reasonable. America doesn't have a history of black supremacy. An honest racial dialogue can't ignore this. "

It may be "natural". "Reasonable" is a stretch, but whatever. It is not, however, correct.

And it wouldn't only be black people who would miss the forest for the trees and overreact--a whole shit-ton of well-intentioned, white-man's-burden feeling whiteys and/or opportunistic members of the political opposition would do the same thing.

3/27/2008 6:44:10 PM

Quote :

"not academically, and not to me, and maybe not to you, but in reality, there would be a problem. "

True, but the fact that there would be a problem, is the problem.

3/27/2008 7:21:15 PM

That's what I'm saying.

3/27/2008 7:50:16 PM

Quote :

"It may be "natural". "Reasonable" is a stretch, but whatever. It is not, however, correct."

Why not? Things aren't equal. As I said, the country doesn't have a history of black supremacy. This has to affect the dialogue on race.

Quote :

"a whole shit-ton of well-intentioned, white-man's-burden feeling whiteys"

Are you intentionally conflating the white man's burden with white guilt? They're not quite the same.

3/27/2008 8:00:06 PM

4/7/2008 2:11:55 PM