It shouldn't matter who makes more, or who has ambition. There shoudn't be a problem as long as both partners are making the same effort towards paying the bills, cleaning the home and raising the kids. That effort may not produce the equal amounts of money between two people, but as long as he or she is making that effort, you cannot fault them.

8/10/2009 9:37:55 AM

Yes, you can, actually.

8/10/2009 9:41:13 AM

I have to say that the couple that this particular thread was made about doesn't have much ambition that I can see. And he definitely is the laziest man I know. He is not performing up to his true potential, nor does he really care to. She works a lot because she has to, because she has the degree, because she pays the bills. He could work 10-15 hours of overtime every week to make more money - but he doesn't.

8/10/2009 9:43:14 AM

Quote :

"I know what you're sayin son. I'm a janitor right now and I'm swimming in fucking money and bitches. It's hard when so many people are tryin to get at my fucking janitor bank son."

8/10/2009 9:46:28 AM

Personally, I don't believe men and women should have defined roles in the family. I don't believe the man should be expected to make more money than a woman and I don't believe a woman should be expected to stay home and take care of the kids.

Ambition is an admirable quality to have, but be honest - how important is it beyond MAKING MONEY? When women say they admire a man with "ambition", they are really saying they admire a man "who can provide the lifestyle I want, so that I don't have to". You don't need ambition to be a good father or a good lover.

Thumper: I can't really fault her for wanting her spouse to make as much money as she does, but expecting him to work overtime so she can have that much more money coming in is a little much. If she's opposed to being the breadwinner, she shouldn't be in this relationship.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:09 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:07:33 AM

I am fairly certain she didn't choose to be the breadwinner. And in their specific case, she doesn't win enough bread. They are not living comfortably, in fact I am willing to bet they barely make it paycheck to paycheck. They seriously do need the money, and he just won't work extra for it, so she's forced to pick up extra shifts in order to make the extra money they need just to stay afloat.

But hey, he was like this when they met, and like this when they got married. I guess maybe she's OK with it. I certainly would not be.

8/10/2009 10:12:58 AM

^^

^ Sounds like the bullshit in that situation is that he could be helping out, but isn't. Not that he's a dude and makes less than his woman.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:20 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:20:05 AM

Quote :

"Ambition is an admirable quality to have, but be honest - how important is it beyond MAKING MONEY? "

I feel like you can have ambition without wanting to make a ton of money... For example, if you're really passionate about a non-profit agency that allows you to make jack shit, but you want to move up and help lead that organization, knowing you're still going to make jack shit.. I think that's pretty admirable

8/10/2009 10:22:38 AM

^^The whole point is that she tolerates it. She lives with it. She doesn't seem to care or mind that he acts this way. Which is why I posed the question - ladies, could you do it?

8/10/2009 10:23:44 AM

Quote :

" Ambition is an admirable quality to have, but be honest - how important is it beyond MAKING MONEY? When women say they admire a man with "ambition", they are really saying they admire a man "who can provide the lifestyle I want, so that I don't have to". You don't need ambition to be a good father or a good lover"

This is what I was getting at. It's basically women saying they want a man with money, but not feeling bad about it.

Quote :

"I feel like you can have ambition without wanting to make a ton of money... For example, if you're really passionate about a non-profit agency that allows you to make jack shit, but you want to move up and help lead that organization, knowing you're still going to make jack shit.. I think that's pretty admirable"

I still don't see how this is important in a relationship.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:26 AM. Reason : ]

8/10/2009 10:25:09 AM

It's a cultural thing, I think. Women don't want to be embarrassed when they are asked what their man "does", since what we "do" is what defines us in this society.

8/10/2009 10:27:46 AM

^2 It may not be important to you but it's important to me -- I want to be with someone who has drive and wants to be the best at what they can. If they fail, then that's fine as long as they TRIED.. I guess one of my biggest pet peeves is when someone is just like "eh, whatever" and skates through life, not giving a shit about how influential they are in their life, job, etc

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:29 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:28:44 AM

More to being influential and important in life than busting your ass in an office or other workplace.

What's wrong with just living?

8/10/2009 10:29:40 AM

I think there's a difference between "just living" and being a damn bum.

8/10/2009 10:31:16 AM

Yeah there is a difference but I'm not really willing to judge people one way or the other.

Some people like to sit around after work, drink some, talk to friends, play poker, play pool, whatever. Why should they be stressed and coerced into "doing something" when it appears as if they already are? Not everybody has to buy into the rat race.

8/10/2009 10:32:40 AM

HEY SON, I'M NO BUM...

JUST BE LIVIN SON...


JANITING SON.

JANITING.

BEING A JANITOR HAS SOME SERIOUS PERKS BTW. LIKE THE MONEY AND THE BITCHES SON.

8/10/2009 10:33:00 AM

Quote :

"I think there's a difference between "just living" and being a damn bum. "

Sure there is, but neither require you to be ambitious about what you do.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:33 AM. Reason : ]

8/10/2009 10:33:10 AM

^3 What? Who said anything was wrong with the things you listed?


I don't see why it's such a big deal for me to want an ambitious man Excuse me if I want to be with someone who wants to make something of himself

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:35 AM. Reason : .]

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:35 AM. Reason : ^ To some, being ambitious is "just living" ]

8/10/2009 10:33:49 AM

Recession hits men harder
Men's unemployment rate outpaces women's at steepest level ever

Quote :

"'The gap between female and male unemployment has never been as large as it is now,' said Sophia Koropeckyj, an economist with Moody's Economy.com."

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/why-this-recession-is-hitting-men-harder

As Layoffs Surge, Women May Pass Men in Job Force

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/06/business/06women.html

You wanted to wear the pants, now deal with it.



Am I right?

8/10/2009 10:34:26 AM

Quote :

"^3 What? Who said anything was wrong with the things you listed? I don't see why it's such a big deal for me to want an ambitious man Excuse me if I want to be with someone who wants to make something of himself"

Lol you mean someone who wants to make something out of you

Otherwise you wouldn't really care


EDIT: ^ Nope you're practically never right, fuck off old man

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:36 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:36:15 AM

Quote :

"I don't see why it's such a big deal for me to want an ambitious man Excuse me if I want to be with someone who wants to make something of himself"

Nothing wrong with at all, it's just I think what Lunex said applies to you also.

Quote :

"When women say they admire a man with "ambition", they are really saying they admire a man "who can provide the lifestyle I want, so that I don't have to"."

I mean there is a reason you want an ambitious man, it's not 'just because.'

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:37 AM. Reason : ]

8/10/2009 10:36:40 AM

I prefer if my lady is the breadwinner

I'm AstralAdvent and i approved this message.

8/10/2009 10:39:31 AM

^2 Actually that's not the case at all.. Like I said, I wouldn't care if my s.o. made $20K a year, as long as they were doing what they love and has drive. Besides, I'd rather be broke as a church mouse and happy than rich and miserable.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:39 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:39:47 AM

^if thats what makes you feel good.

I'm AstralAdvent and i approved this message.

8/10/2009 10:40:24 AM

So I guess it also doesn't bother you that an ambitious person is probably gonna spend a lot less time with you at home?

I won't say anything else to prevent a circular argument

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:41 AM. Reason : ]

8/10/2009 10:41:02 AM

You can be ambitious and still have a good balance Although, I understand that in the beginning of a career you may have to pull way more hours than normal, so I wouldn't be terribly upset about it.

8/10/2009 10:44:19 AM

Quote :

"ragged is single?"

nope

8/10/2009 10:45:21 AM

My husband is extremely ambitious. He's always trying to drum up more business and move up in his company, take on more tasks, make more money, etc etc. He knows what he wants and he's aiming for it. As a result, he works close to 60hrs most weeks and is out of town a lot. But I'm fine with that, because it means when we decide to have a family he will be more than able to provide for us and take care of us.

Work hard now so you can play hard later. With boats and beach houses and shit.

8/10/2009 10:45:21 AM

Quote :

"^2 It may not be important to you but it's important to me -- I want to be with someone who has drive and wants to be the best at what they can. If they fail, then that's fine as long as they TRIED.. I guess one of my biggest pet peeves is when someone is just like "eh, whatever" and skates through life, not giving a shit about how influential they are in their life, job, etc "

If you're ok with someone expecting the same career drive from you, then thats fine.

8/10/2009 10:46:05 AM

Quote :

"Work hard now so you can play hard later. With boats and beach houses and shit"

The only justice in these situations is that dipshits like you waste your best years chasing material

8/10/2009 10:48:14 AM

^2 Well I guess it's a good thing I have found someone who feels the same way as I do, huh?

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:49 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:48:53 AM

Quote :

"You can be ambitious and still have a good balance Although, I understand that in the beginning of a career you may have to pull way more hours than normal, so I wouldn't be terribly upset about it."

Chances are you work a lot of hours early in your career, then you'll probably work a lot of hours later in your career.

8/10/2009 10:49:08 AM

^^^ They still have a fun life, so don't jump to judge.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:49 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:49:14 AM

Quote :

"Nope you're practically never right, fuck off old man."

It was a rhetorical question, Captain Logic. And fuck you very much, too.

8/10/2009 10:50:05 AM

^3 Actually, in the career path I have chosen it's easier to switch to less hours once you have been there for a while. Also, the career path my s.o. has chosen is definitely going to have a lot of hours in the beginning but it could go both ways as far as staying the same in hours or decreasing.. and that's fine with me, because if he loves doing it I'm not going to stop him.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:51 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:50:46 AM

Quote :

"I am fairly certain she didn't choose to be the breadwinner. And in their specific case, she doesn't win enough bread. They are not living comfortably, in fact I am willing to bet they barely make it paycheck to paycheck. They seriously do need the money, and he just won't work extra for it, so she's forced to pick up extra shifts in order to make the extra money they need just to stay afloat. But hey, he was like this when they met, and like this when they got married. I guess maybe she's OK with it. I certainly would not be. "

Ah, ok. If she's working extra shifts to make ends meet and he's not putting in his share of effort, then he is the problem.

Is she working in her degree's field? If she's "a college graduate...got a career making good money", as you say, then why does she need to work extra shifts? Are they spending more money than they should be?

8/10/2009 10:51:46 AM

Quote :

"The only justice in these situations is that dipshits like you waste your best years chasing material "

wow, seriously? why so bitter? we like having a good time, we like to spend money on having a good time. we make enough money to warrant spending it on having a good time.

if you could afford a beach retreat and a boat, why they hell wouldn't you?

Quote :

"Is she working in her degree's field? If she's "a college graduate...got a career making good money", as you say, then why does she need to work extra shifts? Are they spending more money than they should be? "

Yup, she's in her field. However she has a Masters and I really don't think she uses it to it's full potential. She could be making a lot more money, though I'm not really sure she knows how to go about finding something better for herself. And yes, they definitely spend more than they should be.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:53 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:52:14 AM

^^ She has a master's degree and is working in her field. She's super ambitious. The guy doesn't have a degree.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:53 AM. Reason : I have insider knowledge]

8/10/2009 10:53:08 AM

THAT IS ILLEGAL SON.

INSIDER TRADING KNOWLEDGES SON.

8/10/2009 10:54:03 AM

Quote :

"The breadwinner can't exactly take off work for a few months to care for a newborn."

Why couldn't the guy take the time off to care for a newborn?

8/10/2009 10:54:20 AM

^^ I love janitors, son.

Will you come clean my haus?

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:54 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:54:41 AM

Quote :

" if you could afford a beach retreat and a boat, why they hell wouldn't you?"

Better shit to spend money on than powdering your own ass to that degree

8/10/2009 10:54:57 AM

^ Like what?

8/10/2009 10:55:16 AM

Quote :

"Why couldn't the guy take the time off to care for a newborn?"

In this situation, that would not be adviseable.

However in the real world, it's certainly feasible that Dad could stay home to take care of the child. But I would think in the first 6-8 weeks it's best to have the Mom around since she carries the food in her boobs.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:55 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:55:21 AM

Quote :

"^3 Actually, in the career path I have chosen it's easier to switch to less hours once you have been there for a while. Also, the career path my s.o. has chosen is definitely going to have a lot of hours in the beginning but it could go both ways as far as staying the same in hours or decreasing.. and that's fine with me, because if he loves doing it I'm not going to stop him."

Ah because your career field is representative of everyone else.

See. You care about the lifestyle. I can't believe you are still denying this. You care more about his 'ambition' (aka money) more then seeing him or enjoying time with him since.

You would rather break up with a guy who just worked to make ends meet and didn't like his job then someone who loved his job and never saw you.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:56 AM. Reason : \/Have today off since I have a SAS certification exam]

8/10/2009 10:55:28 AM

Good Lord, I had no idea TWW was packed with so many ambitious, motivated women.

You fuckers are posting on TWW in the middle of the day on a workday. I don't care if you're sitting in an executive chair on the top floor of an actual ivory tower, y'all need to bring your asses back down to earth.

I mean, Jesus Christ, it's 11 o'clock on a Monday, folks. Get back to work.

8/10/2009 10:55:42 AM

Quote :

"^^ I love janitors, son. Will you come clean my haus?"

Yeah son, but I am A SERIOUSLY BAD ASS JANITOR SON and if I clean it it's gonna cost $ son.




^ You sound a lot more ambitious than all of those women posting on tdub. Oh wait.....

8/10/2009 10:56:11 AM

Quote :

"Better shit to spend money on than powdering your own ass to that degree"

haha, i smell jealousy.

want me to throw a few benjamins your way son?

8/10/2009 10:56:31 AM

^^^ Flex sched ftw

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:57 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:56:47 AM

^5 Yeah, no... but I can see the trolling really starting to come out, so I'm just gonna go with.. whatever you say holmes

But that last part -- completely untrue. Although, I'm glad you think you can tell so much about me from a few posts on a message board.

^4 Some of us are already done with our work.

[Edited on August 10, 2009 at 10:58 AM. Reason : .]

8/10/2009 10:57:55 AM