What's your point?

5/16/2010 4:08:31 PM

Quote :

"I could criticize Israel in ways that would be infinitely more more damning - and infinitely more valid - than anything those two are rambling on about. Criticizing Israel doesn't make you a crackpot. Suggesting that the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were the results of a grand Zionist plot to help the United States steal some oil, on the other hand, does."

I wish the world were as black and white as you believe it to be but the sad truth is, Iraq was both an agenda of oil and setting up a military presence on all fronts of Iran (which i've said a half dozen times). Look it up after you pull your head out of the sand. Before Iraq the United States had bases and military presence established on all fronts of Iran EXCEPT to their eastern border with Iraq.

It would be nice though if their agenda was a noble one like spreading freedom and democracy through out the world!


Just to set the record straight, are you denying that Iraq is a staging place for Iran and that Iran is the real target here?

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 4:22 PM. Reason : .]

5/16/2010 4:22:12 PM

I do think that our intervention in Iraq was part of a larger effort to reshape the Middle East into a more free, more democratic region. And it's true that a more free, more democratic Middle East would mean a safer West, a safer Israel, and (although I think this is a less integral part of the equation) more security for a large chunk of the world's oil reserves.

What I don't see is how any of that implies a nefarious Zionist plot (or Christian crusade) to harm and exploit Muslims.

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 4:48 PM. Reason : ]

5/16/2010 4:46:43 PM

Quote :

"I do think that our intervention in Iraq was part of a larger effort to reshape the Middle East into a more free, more democratic region. And it's true that a more free, more democratic Middle East would mean a safer West, a safer Israel, and (although I think this is a less integral part of the equation) more security for a large chunk of the world's oil reserves. What I don't see is how any of that implies a nefarious Zionist plot (or Christian crusade) to harm and exploit Muslims."

I applaud your noble efforts but shit like this just doesn't work. Do you honestly believe spreading 'freedom' and democracy to the region will make it safer for you and your buddies in Israel? No. It will in fact make it far more dangerous. You are opening the door for the real crazies to take power because the only thing keeping them from taking over IS the 'not so free' government. The Middle East isn't America so stop trying to make it one.

Also freedom isn't really part of their religion and their religion isn't separated from their state. I mean a place like Afghanistan could definitely use some freedoms especially with how their women are/were treated. But there is only so much freedom that will be tolerated.

Quote :

"What I don't see is how any of that implies a nefarious Zionist plot (or Christian crusade) to harm and exploit Muslims."

p.s. I made no mention of any of this.


wait...isn't this thread about a Swedish Cartoonist?

[Edited on May 16, 2010 at 5:21 PM. Reason : .]

5/16/2010 5:19:36 PM

Quote :

"Do you honestly believe spreading 'freedom' and democracy to the region will make it safer for you and your buddies in Israel?"

It's a historical fact that democracies are far lest likely to go to war with each other.

Quote :

"No. It will in fact make it far more dangerous. You are opening the door for the real crazies to take power because the only thing keeping them from taking over IS the 'not so free' government. The Middle East isn't America so stop trying to make it one."

The crazies were already in control in Afghanistan, so that doesn't really apply there. As for the "not so free" regimes like Saddam's, history has shown that, throughout the Muslim world, those types of totalitarian dictatorships are actually the reason the Islamist groups are so popular, as they're seen as the logical alternative.

Quote :

"Also freedom isn't really part of their religion and their religion isn't separated from their state. I mean a place like Afghanistan could definitely use some freedoms especially with how their women are/were treated. But there is only so much freedom that will be tolerated."

Religion and sectarianism are certainly major hurdles. But establishing an inclusive constitution, holding several rounds of regular and legitimate elections, building a military and police force that's loyal to the country, and providing a reasonable amount of security for a decent amount of time seems to have proven to be a fairly successful (if majorly difficult and imperfect) strategy in Iraq.

5/16/2010 6:23:44 PM

Quote :

"I do think that our intervention in Iraq was part of a larger effort to reshape the Middle East into a more free, more democratic region"

our policies in iraq have always been about iran, its not about freedom its about security and national interests. you're 26, you should at least remember the tail end of the iran-iraq war or read about it at some point in class.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_support_for_Iraq_during_the_Iran%E2%80%93Iraq_war

5/16/2010 11:58:04 PM

As I've said, it is also about national security. But, as I've said, and indeed as you will find in the arguments of virtually everyone who supported the war in Iraq, democracy, freedom, and national security are inextricably linked.

As for Iran, I have no idea what you're getting at.

[Edited on May 17, 2010 at 12:40 AM. Reason : no]

5/17/2010 12:39:23 AM

South America is thriving with freedom and democracy thanks to the US...

5/17/2010 3:10:44 AM

but if its about freedom why didn't we did we have no problem aiding iraq in the past, we even let them accidentally fire on one of our ships with no consequences

5/17/2010 5:26:15 AM

I dont think Iran was the player it is now in 2002. They have evolved into a potentially destabilizing force over the past few years (filling the void left by Iraq). Iran was certainly growing into their current position, but I dont think they were anywhere near the threat to Israel then as they are today.

Iraq 2002 and Iran 2010 are markedly similar - domestic unrest, totalitarian saber-rattlers in charge and a history of making war with its neighbors.

I will say this, the last thing we need to do is to go into Iran.

5/17/2010 9:44:25 AM

Quote :

"STOCKHOLM -- The home of a Swedish artist who once drew a cartoon of the Prophet Muhammad as a dog has been hit by a suspected arson attack, police said Saturday. Lars Vilks, who lives in Nyhamnslage in southern Sweden, was not at home during the attack late Friday night and no one was reported injured. It was the latest in a week of attacks on the 53-year-old cartoonist, who was assaulted Tuesday by a man while he lectured at a university and saw his Web site apparently attacked by hacker on Wednesday. Police were alerted just before noon Saturday, as people passing by the artist's house noted that several windows had been smashed. When officers arrived, they discovered plastic bottles filled with gasoline and fire damage on the surface of the building. Attackers are also suspected of having tried setting the inside of house on fire, but the flames are thought to have fizzled out. "

AP - http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/05/15/AR2010051501524.html

5/18/2010 8:53:32 AM

God damn. Why don't they build a huge 24/7 "sting" around this guy?
If nut-jobs are constantly coming after him, trap those bitches and throw their puck asses in jail for life.
I mean, we know he's still gonna be targeted, so why the fuck wouldn't they set traps?

5/18/2010 10:49:58 AM

That would be discriminatory police tactics targeting the persecuted islamist extremists.

5/18/2010 11:06:08 AM

Pakistan to monitor Google and Yahoo for 'blasphemy'

Quote :

"Pakistan will start monitoring seven major websites, including Google and Yahoo, for content it deems offensive to Muslims. YouTube, Amazon, MSN, Hotmail and Bing will also come under scrutiny, while 17 less well-known sites will be blocked. Officials will monitor the sites and block links deemed inappropriate."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/south_asia/10418643.stm

Good luck with that, Crazystan.

[Edited on June 25, 2010 at 2:15 PM. Reason : ]

6/25/2010 2:14:49 PM

It is not only Muslims that threaten to blow people up in the name of their religion:

Spain’s Dr. Gabriel Calzada — the author of a damning study concluding that Spain’s “green jobs” energy program has been a catastrophic economic failure — was mailed a dismantled bomb on Tuesday by solar energy company Thermotechnic.

Says Calzada:
Before opening it, I called [Thermotechnic] to know what was inside … they answered, it was their answer to my energy pieces.

Dr. Calzada contacted a terrorism expert to handle the package. The expert first performed a scan of the package, then opened it in front of a journalist, Dr. Calzada, and a private security expert.

The terrorism consultant said he had seen this before:
This time you receive unconnected pieces. Next time it can explode in your hands.

Dr. Calzada added:
[The terrorism expert] told me that this was a warning.

The bomb threat is just the latest intimidation Dr. Calzada has faced since releasing his report and following up with articles in Expansion (a Spanish paper similar to the Financial Times). A minister from Spain’s Socialist government called the rector of King Juan Carlos University — Dr. Calzada’s employer — seeking Calzada’s ouster. Calzada was not fired, but he was stripped of half of his classes at the university. The school then dropped its accreditation of a summer university program with which Calzada’s think tank — Instituto Juan de Mariana — was associated.

Additionally, the head of Spain’s renewable energy association and the head of its communist trade union wrote opinion pieces in top Spanish newspapers accusing Calzada of being “unpatriotic” — they did not charge him with being incorrect, but of undermining Spain by daring to write the report.

http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/breaking-green-energy-company-threatens-economics-professor-with-package-of-dismantled-bomb-parts/

6/25/2010 5:12:19 PM

What's your point?

6/25/2010 5:49:08 PM