You can say AT&T makes "stupid ass moves", but you're the one who renewed his cell phone service with a company in a place where you knew you didn't get good cell phone service.

1/12/2011 7:02:07 PM

Until this year, I didn't really have a choice. There was no other DEVICE that could do what I needed. Which has been the case for a lot of people.

I'm going to be switching carriers and devices (for a Windows Phone).

Also I bought my iPhone before I moved out west. AT&T's service in NC is a lot better than out here (although still shitty as hell compared to the other carriers). Once I got here, it was a case of lock-in. I simply couldn't switch to another device on another carrier, because nothing worked for me. Android just frustrated the everliving shit out of me (granted this was a year+ ago), and Blackberry is a non starter.

1/12/2011 8:51:42 PM

Quote :

"you would think that New York and San Francisco"

I think you listed the two cities AT&T has spent the most money on improving in the last year. It might have been pretty bad in NYC and SF in the past, but I do believe today things aren't nearly as bad.

1/12/2011 8:52:04 PM

^Yeah it's gone from 60% dropped call rates to 20-30%. Much improved, still 20x worse than Sprint or Verizon.

1/12/2011 9:05:46 PM

Of course those numbers were higher on people with iPhones than non-iPhones. If 100% of iPhone owners were on Verizon in NYC [still using iPhones] i bet people would be complaining about dropped calls and whatnot around as often.

1/12/2011 9:21:35 PM

I haven't had a call drop since I switched to Windows Phone 7.

It's pretty awesome, to be honest.

1/12/2011 9:45:23 PM

^^No they wouldnt. Because Verizon has a massively higher number and density of towers. And Verizon hasn't oversold their network to a plethora of other devices.

And they just turned on a bunch of new towers in NYC anyway.

1/13/2011 12:08:00 AM

i'm blown away that people are actually defending ATT

1/13/2011 1:16:57 AM

I live in a newly incorporated area of West Cary. My Verizon connection is spotty and AT&T is non-existent. I'm going to sit on it at least until the iPhone 5 comes out.

1/13/2011 1:38:38 AM

are dropped calls really a function of the device? i thought that was the fault of the network.

1/13/2011 9:36:40 AM

Quote :

"are dropped calls really a function of the device? i thought that was the fault of the network."

I've never had an issue with dropped calls except when I've used an iPhone.

Maybe I was just holding it wrong!

1/13/2011 10:06:57 AM

lol

1/13/2011 10:10:54 AM

I just asked Steve and he says yep, user error.

1/13/2011 10:28:38 AM

Quote :

"^^huh?? the only thing close is the google maps app, but that's not like a true navigation type app. i'm not sure what makes you think it's trash, but it functions the exact same way google maps does. if you're looking for turn by turn directions, you've got the wrong app."

I know that it's not turn-by-turn; I never said it was or expected it to be.

Quote :

"oh and you may know this already but cell coverage != gps coverage. i was able to get a gps connection & accurate location the whole AT trip."

I do know that. That is why the included iPhone google maps app (touted to be a navigation app) is awful. It does not have stored maps on the phone, so you need cell coverage to do any navigation. Also, I don't know how many other people have this problem, but my phone often has difficulty getting a GPS signal.

1/13/2011 10:42:36 AM

My iPhone used to have issues where it had a lot of trouble pinpointing my location. It really enjoyed telling me I was somewhere within a 5 block pulsing circle.

1/13/2011 10:58:15 AM

Quote :

"I know that it's not turn-by-turn; I never said it was or expected it to be."

Quote :

"touted to be a navigation app"

does not compute, unless turn-by-turn != navigation ?

idk. i never expected to use google maps for directions unless i'm plotting it out before i leave, while on wifi, bc i know the maps aren't loaded on the phone. i wasn't expecting anything more out of it than what it can do, so i use other apps.

Quote :

"I've never had an issue with dropped calls except when I've used an iPhone. Maybe I was just holding it wrong!"

i've maybe had 2-3 dropped calls while on verizon (had a moto q) or att. it was always due to signal. my 3gs doesn't have problems relating to how you hold it (yes i know the 4s did w/o the case if you gripped it right, but of the people i know personally who have them, they haven't had this problem). the verizon version won't do that according to the press conference.

1/13/2011 10:58:22 AM

Quote :

"the verizon version won't do that according to the press conference."

Pretty sure no one announces when their product has a potentially crippling fault.

1/13/2011 11:03:46 AM

of course not, but the question was asked.

1/13/2011 11:11:03 AM

Quote :

"i'm blown away that people are actually defending ATT"

I've received outstanding customer service from AT&T, including on multiple occasions giving me a plan retroactively, or reducing a $600+ phone bill back down to earth after using my phone in Europe for close to a month for voice&data, with just a mere phone call. I had an iPhone (original) in NY a few years ago, and even borrowed a charger from a local store. They've given me sim cards for free, etc. They also don't nickel and dime you to death. I also use the voice call/internet surf at the same time very often.

The hotspot feature that Verizon's offering is pretty cool though, that I will be envious of -if it doesn't come to AT/T (for free).

1/13/2011 3:57:31 PM

Quote :

"are dropped calls really a function of the device? i thought that was the fault of the network."

It's been documented somewhere that people with iPhone tend to have more problems with dropped/missed calls than their att non-iPhone counterparts. Also in high people density events (like music festivals) often iPhone users have trouble making/receiving calls/texts when non-iPhone att users retain more functionality of their phone.

Don't know why, but the actual phone part of the iPhone wasn't designed very well in those regards, especially factoring in antenna-gate.

Quote :

"I do know that. That is why the included iPhone google maps app (touted to be a navigation app) is awful. It does not have stored maps on the phone, so you need cell coverage to do any navigation."

It's not a navigation app. It's a map app. Google Maps Navigation is a navigation app, and only available for android users with 1.6+

1/13/2011 4:20:49 PM

I was on Verizon but jumped ship for the iPhone 3G a few summers back. i've had AT&T since and honestly have maybe dropped ~3 calls.

I don't hate AT&T or Verizon and honestly don't really care (although I do take advantage of simultaneous voice and data so probably can't live without that at this point)......it just blows my mind to see so many people having issues

O WELL

1/13/2011 4:25:02 PM

Consider this, if you live & work in the same area, your experience (whether good or bad) will be distorted. There are 311 million people in the US and even if you live in Charlotte with a population of 1 million people, the entire city is 0.03% of the coverage area (in terms of population, not land area).

It's really not that hard to imagine people having issues, even if you don't. Neither should it be hard to imagine that other people don't have issues when you do. This is where polling helps give people an idea of the overall population.

I don't understand why this concept is so hard to understand.

1/13/2011 4:36:14 PM

Quote :

"It's been documented somewhere that people with iPhone tend to have more problems with dropped/missed calls than their att non-iPhone counterparts. Also in high people density events (like music festivals) often iPhone users have trouble making/receiving calls/texts when non-iPhone att users retain more functionality of their phone. "

i didn't know this. thank you for answering my question.

1/13/2011 4:44:22 PM

"it's been documented somewhere" is what people without proof of documentation say

[Edited on January 13, 2011 at 5:23 PM. Reason : .]

1/13/2011 5:23:27 PM

Quote :

"This is where polling helps give people an idea of the overall population. I don't understand why this concept is so hard to understand."

It only helps when the poll is actually representative of the populace, which I don't believe are "the opinions of more than 58-thousand ConsumerReports.org subscribers, who provided feedback on their customer service and overall satisfaction." This wasn't the same type of polling they do in politics. This is "hey, I put a poll up on my website can you dudes please vote!!!!".

The only people I've ever really heard bitch about regular dropped calls are iPhone users and Sony Ericsson phone owners back when their software had a glitch that caused it to mess up switching cell towers.

Not to mention I don't understand how people can go "RAWR THIS IS AT&T'S FAULT" when even Apple says that the iPhone 4 drops more calls than it's predecessor. At some point you have to start looking at the hardware in your hand.

But not your left hand.

[Edited on January 13, 2011 at 6:53 PM. Reason : .]

1/13/2011 6:47:26 PM

^Around the time that antenna gate started, Steve Jobs says the 3GS has similar antenna problems to the iPhone4. Then again, he made some bogus claims afterward about a blackberry phone and I believe a Motorola phone, neither of which had any issues with their antennas (and their respective CEOs made public statements basically calling Jobs a douche/liar)

Quote :

""it's been documented somewhere" is what people without proof of documentation say"

Or someone who is too lazy to google. If you know what to google it's out there, I found it last summer during antenna-gate, and if you want to, you can find it now.

1/13/2011 7:28:15 PM

^Doesn't mean anything. Consumer reports very likely screened the respondents.

And there have been MANY polls, surveys and metrics published and leaked about the horrific reliability of AT&T's network. North Carolina is NOT an area that has substantial problems with AT&T. There isn't enough population density or geographic limitations for it to matter in most circumstances.

AT&T's reception and coverage is shitty in high density urban areas, both because of data volume AND because they can't add capacity at a sufficient rate to cope with growth. It's shitty in areas where geography prevents them from putting down more towers (like Seattle and San Fran). It's shitty in rural areas because of the much more limited range of GSM as compared to CDMA.

1/13/2011 7:34:15 PM

Quote :

"The hotspot feature that Verizon's offering is pretty cool though, that I will be envious of -if it doesn't come to AT/T (for free)."

It's a new feature of iOS and has nothing to do with Verizon(aside from the fact that they're deciding to support it). The feature will be available for any carrier that chooses to support it when 4.3 comes out (Which may end up being before the VZW iPhone even gets released).

Also, you're a god damn idiot if you think that AT&T, Verizon, or any other phone company on the planet will offer the hotspot feature for free.

If you really want the feature for free on any carrier, jailbreak and install MyWi.

1/13/2011 7:50:43 PM

Quote :

"Consumer reports very likely screened the respondents."

Screened for what?

1/13/2011 8:53:51 PM

^^I don't want to jailbreak my phone, I don't have the time to play w/it nor the desire.

I know that this is a feature that the OS will get, but just like tethering, AT/T may choose to not support the feature. As for it not being paid, if I pay for a certain bandwidth, I feel that I ought to be able to use it any way that I choose.

1/13/2011 10:07:31 PM

Want in one hand and put what AT&T gives you for free in the other and I think you'll be fairly evenly balanced.

1/13/2011 10:25:01 PM

yeah good luck with that.

1/13/2011 11:13:14 PM

I know how much y'all love surveys...

16% of AT&T customers ready to jump ship for Verizon iPhone
http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2011/01/survey-att-customers-ready-to-jump-ship-for-verizon-iphone.ars

Quote :

"The top three reasons for switching, according to ChangeWave's data, are poor reception or coverage area, dropped calls, and cost.... When that question was asked to current iPhone users on AT&T, the percentage climbed up to at least one-in-four, at 26%, who claimed they were jumping ship. "

[Edited on January 14, 2011 at 4:03 PM. Reason : .]

1/14/2011 3:52:04 PM

Well if 16% of 0.004% of AT&T's subscriber base are ready to jump ship they might as well just file for Chapter 11 now.

[Edited on January 14, 2011 at 4:08 PM. Reason : 0.004% is 4.36e-5, right? I'm not good with numbers so insignificant.]

1/14/2011 4:06:44 PM

The ignorance ITT is astounding. If you can't understand how surveys work you should go back to Chit Chat. It's not that they are 100% accurate, but they are accurate enough to be relevant to the discussion and to make reasonable conclusions. +/- 3%

[Edited on January 14, 2011 at 4:22 PM. Reason : .]

1/14/2011 4:20:54 PM

Seriously. Hell, a lot of usability studies we do are based on 5-7 participants, and even with that TINY sample size, you would be surprised how damn accurate the results are.

As long as you SCREEN the participants in a survey properly, you do not need a large sample size to be accurate and effective. I would imagine one of the most important screening elements for a cellular survey or study would be geography, followed by devices. (And actually, I know both are, having participated in several cellular research studies through Fieldworks).

1/14/2011 10:37:14 PM

Quote :

"Also, you're a god damn idiot if you think that AT&T, Verizon, or any other phone company on the planet will offer the hotspot feature for free."

It's free on the Palm Pre on Verizon.

/irrelevant detail

1/14/2011 11:20:42 PM

And free on pretty much every rooted Android device.

1/15/2011 12:09:11 AM

And free on a jailbroken iPhone. But that's not exactly what we were talking about, was it?

1/15/2011 8:48:58 AM

Does anyone think Apple will release a new ATT iPhone prior to June 2011? I know a bunch of people (incl. myself) that haven't bought the iPhone 4 due to its problems, and I can't imagine they will introduce a defective phone to Verizon. So why not just change the aspects and fix the issue with ATT too?

My iPhone 3G is about to crash. 2 1/2 years hard on it, and I thought I could hold out for the iPhone 5 but I think I'll have to cave and get the iPhone 4. I'd be pissed though if a new iPhone 4 or 5 came out weeks after I bought it. It seems like stores like radio shack and ATT are dumping inventory of the older models as if a newer edition is coming soon. you thoughts?

1/17/2011 1:02:54 PM

Apple doesn't dump models, so I doubt you'll get any sort of discount. They also never come out with a new version mid-year. It's always been June, every year for the last 4 years.

I'd wait til the iPhone 4G (or whatever they call it) this summer... it may also be a 4G phone, then you'd REALLY regret settling for the iPhone 4

[Edited on January 17, 2011 at 1:23 PM. Reason : .]

1/17/2011 1:22:43 PM

The most recent talk suggests a redesigned iPhone5 announced this summer...not LTE/4G etc.

1/17/2011 1:37:13 PM

The original iPhone to iPhone 3g was the smallest leap, and the 3GS to the 4 was the biggest IMO. I'd suggest switching to the 4 today, it's not an incremental upgrade. The camera is good enough to not need a second point/shoot, the battery life is amazing and the computing power is superior (I believe it has 4x an iPhone 3G and 2x the iPad's ram).

1/17/2011 1:48:33 PM

Well if the iPhone 5 is redesigned... I dunno

[Edited on January 17, 2011 at 1:53 PM. Reason : .]

1/17/2011 1:52:45 PM

Is radioshack offering the best current iphone4 deal? I saw they would give a credit for a 3G plus a discount on the iphone4 to price it at $150.

1/18/2011 10:03:41 PM

Put me down as someone who has had Cingular/AT&T for over 11 years and has had excellent customer service and just good service in general for that whole time. I get no service for about 15 miles when I'm going back home to BFE Eastern North Carolina...but I'm passing horse drawn carts when I'm doing it...so it doesn't surprise me.

I've also had no problems with numerous phone replacements (I fuck up my phones a lot) and have had 2 or 3 disputes over charges that they've gotten rid of or helped me get around (by temporarily switching my plan then quickly switching back)...all taking about 15 minutes each time.

Have fun at Verizon. I bet their customer service drops a tad when they have to start dealing with all of these new iphone customers and problems.

1/19/2011 10:44:21 AM

In Boston on an iPhone 3GS i'd say that 1/4 calls drop, 1/4 break up, cut in/out, 1/4 have weird echos and other annoying sounds, 1/4 are great.

the only saving grace is that i rarely make voice calls and the data is fine. I'll hold out for an LTE Verizon phone i think.

1/20/2011 12:03:32 AM

1/21/2011 12:07:30 PM

I currently have a droid with verizon. I want to get the new iphone for verizon but i'm not eligible for the upgrade price until october...

let's say that i bought a verizon iphone on ebay for cheap....could i take it to verizon and get it activated or would they say no? How much does that cost?

1/23/2011 11:23:51 AM

Quote :

"let's say that i bought a verizon iphone on ebay for cheap"

this doesn't sound likely

1/23/2011 11:26:52 AM