A Dunkin Donuts franchise owner has more executive experience that a Microsoft VP. Who do you want running your company?

10/16/2008 9:08:56 AM

10/16/2008 9:47:43 AM

10/16/2008 1:38:11 PM

10/16/2008 1:41:07 PM

That is a natural reaction when one gets too close to a socialist.

10/16/2008 1:41:23 PM

HAHAHAHA

10/16/2008 1:51:08 PM

^^That was actually funny.

That was another one of his unpresidential moments tho.

10/16/2008 2:02:49 PM

Quote :

"BTW, FWIW, I think Palin gets the last laugh on a lot of women in entertainment who mock her through imitation. Palin happens to be better looking than all of them."

Now we all have proof you've lost your mind.

10/16/2008 2:02:50 PM

What IS up with that troops to teachers thing? My wife's a teacher, and she turned to me in horror when McCain mentioned allowing soldiers to return and become teachers without passing any tests. What the FUCK kind of horrible idea is that? Like there aren't enough shitty teachers out there already?

10/16/2008 2:18:04 PM

Quote :

"Katie gets the first interview with Joe Wurzelbacher and, like everyone else in America, he talks like a pundit. "McCain was solid in his performance," he says. "I still don't know where he stands," he says of Obama. "I'm middle class. I can't have my taxes raised any more." He also says he actually isn't in the bracket where Obama would raise his taxes -- but he's worried that Obama will shift the bracket down. He also said that, in his encounter with Obama, the Illinois Senator "a tap dance...almost as good as Sammy Davis, Jr.""

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1008/Joe_speaks.html?showall

So basically Joe the plumber (a registered Republican, btw) is very clearly in McCain's corner, lied about how much money he makes, and, well, you can draw what conclusions you will about the Sammy Davis, Jr. remark.

And I'll second/third the troops to teachers thing is fucking bizarre.

10/16/2008 2:31:13 PM

wait, that can't be true. you heard McCain:
"Congratulations Joe, You're Rich!"
he said that like 3 times. must be true. Joe is misinformed

10/16/2008 2:35:15 PM

so having like 250k to buy a business is middle class?

10/16/2008 2:35:51 PM

well this whole "joe the plumber" talk is bullshit anyway. They took a 10 second sound bite from a guy in a line, and they (both guys) are trying to extrapolate his situation to their entire economic policy, when in fact neither of them actually know exactly what circumstances "Joe" is in.

Quote :

"so having like 250k to buy a business is middle class?"

it might be. This is where, again, we and the candidates just do not have enough information. There is a huge difference between "having 250k to buy a business" and making 250k a year, either on your own or as a small-business owner. With smart planning and fiscal responsibility, a middle-class worker could easily save $250k, or at least borrow $250k if he has good credit, to buy a business. This has nothing to do with what he makes per year now, or what he would make after buying the business.
I think neither candidate really knows what Joe's situation is, and should really stop talking about it and just stick to explaining exactly what their plans are.

10/16/2008 2:51:54 PM

Quote :

"What IS up with that troops to teachers thing?"

Really. Anyone advocating this doesn't understand that pedagogy is a distinct skill set.


Hell, dairy farmers are great, hard-working people. Let's allow them to become doctors without all that extra paperwork.

10/16/2008 3:43:23 PM

Quote :

"Joe the Plumber said Thursday he doesn't have a license and doesn't need one. Joe Wurzelbacher, better known as Joe the Plumber, the nickname Republican John McCain bestowed on him during Wednesday's presidential debate, said he works for a small plumbing company that does residential work. Because he works for someone else, he doesn't need a license, he said. But the county Wurzelbacher and his employer live in, Lucas County, requires plumbers to have licenses. Neither Wurzelbacher nor his employer are licensed there, said Cheryl Schimming of Lucas County Building Regulations, which handles plumber licenses in parts of the county outside Toledo. ... Wurzelbacher said Obama's tax plan wouldn't affect him right now, because he doesn't make $250,000. "But I hope someday I'll make that," he said."

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2008/10/15/politics/p192345D24.DTL

lolwut? So Joe the Plumber isn't so much a plumber as he is a dude who's doing plumbing work without a license.

I seriously think the mindset of the bolded remark is responsible for 95% of the Republican party who aren't insanely religious or wealthy.

10/16/2008 3:55:31 PM

And they don't realize that the "but I hope someday I'll make that" undermines a large portion of their argument.

There's clearly still incentives to earn more, even with higher taxes on the rich.

10/16/2008 3:57:35 PM

As if higher taxes are a good reason to not become rich?

"Don't start making 250 grand a year, Joe! They'll increase your taxes by a few percent, and then you'll only be pulling in 175 or 200 Grand! You'll go hungry!

10/16/2008 4:02:08 PM

I missed the teachers/soldiers part of the debate, what's that all about?

McCain wants to make soldiers in to teachers?

10/16/2008 4:10:37 PM

Yeah, without the licensure process.

10/16/2008 4:12:25 PM

Quote :

"We need to encourage programs such as Teach for America and Troops to Teachers where people, after having served in the military, can go right to teaching and not have to take these examinations which -- or have the certification that some are required in some states."

Those darn examinations!

http://www.wkrg.com/news/article/mccain_obama_last_debate_transcript_page_2/20027/

This page, at least

http://www.dpi.state.nc.us/troops/

Makes it sound like you do have to get certification. Maybe he's talking about letting troops do lateral entry. "Lateral entry allows qualified individuals to obtain a teaching position and begin teaching right away, while obtaining a license as they teach"

If that's what he's talking about, that makes much more sense, but boy did he portray that badly.

10/16/2008 4:17:43 PM

Soldiers can already enter via lateral entry just like anyone else can.

After looking in to it, it appears that McCain doesn't really understand what Troops to Teachers is about. I think the point of the program is to recruit troops into education and to prepare them for the classroom and the licensure process. Their website doesn't say anything about bending education or license requirements.

[Edited on October 16, 2008 at 4:30 PM. Reason : ]

10/16/2008 4:25:21 PM

I have no problem with troops wanting to be teachers, but why exactly is there a special website and stuff for them? Can they not just use normal procedures to be teachers?

10/16/2008 4:30:37 PM

No, you need to get them in the classrooms right away, licenses be damned!!!

10/16/2008 4:33:09 PM

As described by the Troops to Teachers website, it's a swell idea.

As described by McCain, it's a terrible, terrible idea.

Quote :

"not have to take these examinations which -- or have the certification that some are required in some states"

\/ durrrrr

[Edited on October 16, 2008 at 4:45 PM. Reason : ]

10/16/2008 4:35:54 PM

Quote :

"Their website doesn't say anything about bending education or license requirements"

what did McCain say about bending education or license requirements?

10/16/2008 4:44:16 PM

Joe the Plumber not a plumber, and not named Joe.

And he owes back taxes.


http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/10/16/joe-in-the-spotlight/?hp

10/16/2008 4:44:38 PM

Quote :

"After looking in to it, it appears that McCain doesn't really understand what Troops to Teachers is about. I think the point of the program is to recruit troops into education and to prepare them for the classroom and the licensure process. Their website doesn't say anything about bending education or license requirements."

McCain ignorance does seem to be the best explanation.

10/16/2008 4:47:54 PM

^^So it turns out the guy is just some republican tool who isn't who he says he is. Ironic now that McCain has made him the centerpiece of his stump speeches.

10/16/2008 6:13:50 PM

ummm. he's a plumber. he's just not a licensed plumber. I was not aware that doing all the job requirements of a position but not jumping through all of the hoops for full union membership meant you weren't actually doing that job. wow.

10/16/2008 6:19:06 PM

lol...yeah...lets just disregard that hes full of shit, and say he didnt jump through hoops

10/16/2008 6:23:17 PM

if the media gave 1/100th of the scrutiny to Obama that they're giving to Joe the Plumber, I'd be happy with the media

10/16/2008 6:24:15 PM

or....how about instead of the ad hominem attack on "Joe the Plumber," we focus on what Obama said to him...

Quote :

"It's not that I want to punish your success, I just want to make sure that everybody who is behind you, that they've got a chance for success too...I think when you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody."

Democrats Defending Obama/Attacking Joe: Who's talking about the issues now?

10/16/2008 6:28:33 PM

so, dumbassNloaded, how exactly is joe not a plumber? does he not fix toilets? does he not fix drains? does he not fix pipes?

10/16/2008 6:29:42 PM

Quote :

"lets just disregard that hes full of shit"

forgot to mention he owes taxes also

10/16/2008 6:31:31 PM

i'm still waiting for you to explain how he is not a plumber.

10/16/2008 6:37:30 PM

lol keep waiting you fucking choad

10/16/2008 6:38:18 PM

Quote :

"and not named Joe"

OMG JOE IS HIS MIDDLE NAME AND NOT HIS FIRST NAME, THEREFORE HIS NAME ISN'T EVEN JOE, STOP THE PRESSES

and how do any discrepancies or technicalities change Obama's comment about redistribution of wealth?

oh i get it, lets nitpick about this guy so we can continue to ignore obama's socialist policies

10/16/2008 6:51:40 PM

Quote :

"or....how about instead of the ad hominem attack on "Joe the Plumber," we focus on what Obama said to him..."

Already been discussed. Obama's tax plan will benefit him. He presented a misleading hypothetical to make it look like it wouldn't.

10/16/2008 6:53:13 PM

talk less about how joe the plumber will be benefited, and more about obama endorsing redistribution of wealth

10/16/2008 6:58:59 PM

The government already redistributes wealth. Our economy is a hybrid of socialism and capitalism. Obama might, depending upon congressional approval, move it slightly more to the socialism side.

Next.

10/16/2008 7:02:18 PM

well he'll definitely have congressional approval...D President D Congress D House...theres no if about that

and theres also no if about moving taxes more towards the socialism side either...i just dont see how people can be so nonchalant about that, especially if they understand it

how are we going to "unlock the innovation of the american people" (which mr. obama...has always been unlocked...) if we dissuade people from becoming more succesful? why should i want to work harder and longer to make more money if more of the money i make will be taken from me? counterintuitive to production and success

10/16/2008 7:03:53 PM

Having a D next to their name doesn't necessarily mean they will side with the president.

Why am I talking to you...

10/16/2008 7:06:11 PM

so having a Democratic House and Senate doesn't mean Congress will go along with a Democratic President?

That kind of discredits your side's whole argument about the Democratic Congress not being able to get anything accomplished at all in the last 2 years because Bush is a republican...

10/16/2008 7:07:46 PM

didnt bush have republican majorities in both houses like his first 4 years or something?

10/16/2008 7:09:15 PM

also as long as the company he works for has a license, he is legally a plumber...if/when he starts his own business, he will need his own license

i swear if the media put 1% the effort towards honestly scrutinizing obama that they do towards trying to lie about how joe isn't a plumber...

10/16/2008 7:21:01 PM

what more do you need to know about Obama? He was conceived by rainbows and bunnies in a river of lollipops. Lollipops, man. Lollipops.

10/16/2008 7:26:08 PM

Holy crap you all are bitter.

Your main critique of us is that we actually like our candidate.

Sour grapes, man. Sour freakin' grapes.

10/16/2008 8:17:48 PM

Joe would get a tax break from Obama. He is a perfect example of the people who have been deceived by the Republicans into thinking that raising taxes on rich is wrong b/c they hope to one day be rich. Instead, they want to pay more than they can afford now so that they can keep money they don't need later. But this is the type of backwards logic that will keep them from ever becoming rich.

10/16/2008 8:36:16 PM

yes. Joe would get a tax break. If Obama could be trusted. which he can't. Obama will raise taxes on Joe. and that is a fact.

10/16/2008 10:38:59 PM

^ haha

10/16/2008 10:54:51 PM