yeah our civpro exam was long as fuck, but i nailed everything, even the extra stuff. just took forever...

12/10/2010 11:03:11 PM

Bar Application is just about ready to mail. Need to get fingerprints taken tomorrow, and then have it notarized, and it should be good to go out with the mail tomorrow. I hate this feeling that I've forgotten something, but I am so ready for this to no longer be hanging over my head.

12/29/2010 9:47:30 PM

^Congrats on getting that POS done. Inevitably, they'll send you a letter saying some petty bullshit is missing, but the hardest part (aside from the exam itself) is over.

1/3/2011 3:39:14 PM

LOL ^ they must have sent me 10 letters claiming other things were needed.


And make sure not to bring in a prohibited item. On the second day, my gf and I went to lunch at the applebees. I accidentally forgot that I put my wallet in my back pocket and walked in the exam room with it. Despite the fact I immediately turned it in to a proctor (a good 10 minutes before the exam was even handed out) and was told everything was fine, they sealed my records for 2 months.

1/7/2011 12:07:25 PM

Does anyone have kaplan or barbri South Carolina distinctions books. I've got to take the Feb exam and really need to start studying

1/7/2011 12:43:44 PM

^ You don't have the ones from the first time you took the exam? Or was your wallet story from the NC exam?? (which is a tad outrageous...I don't remember it being like that during the SC exam. I'm pretty sure I had my wallet with me the whole time)

Wish I could help you with the SC Barbri books. Gave mine away once I found out I passed. Honestly wish I had them during law school, because they condensed everything better than any outline I ever came upon.

1/7/2011 12:54:08 PM

^ yeah, that was in North Carolina (which hallelujah, I did pass). So I do have the MBE stuff, just need the SC distinctions.

If you come across anyone that has them, even older copies, please let me know.

Oh, and I was definitely furious about the whole ordeal. I'm just now getting set up because of the wait.

1/7/2011 6:56:06 PM

Finally got grades back, and I'm pretty satisfied. Based on numbers from the past, should be in the top 10% of the class, maybe top 5%, although we don't get our rankings until next week or so.

1/8/2011 6:10:55 PM

got half of my grades back just now

how did i kickass in the class i absolutely hated and paid little attention to and just average in the class i absolutely loved?

1/12/2011 6:08:11 PM

i did really well in one class, good in another, and not so good in a third. odd since the third is the most straight forward. Ill have to go talk to the prof about it.

1/12/2011 7:28:24 PM

^You're not in college anymore Dorothy.

1/13/2011 10:30:26 AM

I wish I didn't have to come up with a different reason every day why I shouldn't just drop out of law school. I'm so bored with my fucking life right now. I'm half way through, but I'm already over it. Next year I won't get my merit scholarship no matter how well I do, and I've finished my core classes... This shit just sucks now. I even picked up a fucking x-game to try to make my life more interesting. I go snowboarding twice a week. I'm still always bored though.

ugh... well, it's 11:35 so it's about time to go to bed so I can wake up early and read for property II c and iron my clothes to meet with someone who I can't tell anybody anything about.

1/13/2011 11:36:17 PM

You need a good job. Work some through the school year too. That will make ALL the difference, and give you some sense of purpose outside of your homework.

1/14/2011 8:12:48 AM

I'm in a 7 credit Low Income Tax Clinic, which requires 25 hours of my time a week. A job this semester isn't feasible, but I'm looking for something this summer. Hopefully I can move down to NC for the summer and work down there for a few months. DC's cost of living is ridiculous.

1/14/2011 10:06:40 AM

Quote :

"Guy goes to law school, guy racks up a huge amount of debt, guy has no idea how he’ll pay off his debts. Sound familiar? Okay, here’s the twist: the guy failed the “character and fitness” component of the Ohio bar because he has no plan to pay off his loans. What the hell kind of legal education system are we running where we charge people more than they can afford to get a legal education, and then prevent them from being lawyers because they can’t pay off their debts? Because it’s not like Hassan Jonathan Griffin was in a particularly unique situation when he went before the Ohio bar. A year and a half ago, we wrote about a man who was dinged on his character and fitness review because he was $400,000 in debt. That’s an extraordinary case. Hassan Jonathan Griffin owes around $170,000. He has a part-time job as a public defender. He used to be a stockbroker. He’s got as much a chance of figuring out a way to pay off his loans as most people from the Lost Generation. If Griffin can’t pass C&F, Ohio might as well say that half of the recent graduates in the state don’t have the “character and fitness” to be a lawyer…"

http://abovethelaw.com/2011/01/character-fitness-fail-for-graduate-with-no-plan-to-pay-off-his-debts/

oops...

1/14/2011 2:29:55 PM

^ Yeah, ever since I registered with the LSAC to take the LSAT and paid all those fees, I got the feeling that I was getting had by a racket. That's all it is, a fuckin racket.

1/14/2011 6:58:47 PM

Law school to me so far is what you make of it. I see plenty of people around me who are considering dropping out, but then there are others who are loving it. I am in the latter boat. I spent a lot of time working hard last semester and enjoying the conversations and the involvement, and it paid off.

I definitely see how getting a job is hard, but for some people law school is exactly what they thought it would be. Yes, I will likely owe a lot of money when I get out of school, but I knew that going in, and I have a plan to pay that money back as soon as possible. Even if I got the lowest paying job in law possible, I can still have it paid off in ten years based on the new repayment plans.

Law apparently isn't for everyone, and to sell it like it's a golden ticket is irresponsible, but it's not a trick, either. For a lot of people, it's everything it's advertised to be.

[Edited on January 15, 2011 at 3:04 AM. Reason : j]

1/15/2011 3:04:04 AM

it bounces back and forth between being interesting and being boring.... then again much of what I'm doing this semester is the base for everything else.

oh and choadcheese, i bet i pull a higher GPA this semester than you ever did.

1/16/2011 2:38:46 AM

^???

1/16/2011 8:50:00 AM

Quote :

"oh and choadcheese, i bet i pull a higher GPA this semester than you ever did."

I had my dean's list semesters and my struggling semesters....I also worked 30+ hours a week and pretty much continued my college method of cramming for exams. You just make sure your grades are high enough to get into that prestigious law school so you can get your LLM and make your $120K first year out....right... Can't suck off the wifey's money teet forever!

[Edited on January 17, 2011 at 2:11 PM. Reason : .]

1/17/2011 1:45:38 PM

You worked 30+ hours a week? ABA Standards for Law Schools 304(f) says that you are not allowed to work more than 20 hours a week whenever you are a full time student. How did you get around that?

1/17/2011 1:54:28 PM

lol @ LLM

^ and i know several people who got around that rule...probably by not saying anything or because i thought you could get around it if you had special circumstances (like a single parent w/ family or something). i dunno. i'm sure the people i know just didn't disclose it...

[Edited on January 17, 2011 at 1:59 PM. Reason : .]

1/17/2011 1:58:48 PM

Quote :

"You worked 30+ hours a week? ABA Standards for Law Schools 304(f) says that you are not allowed to work more than 20 hours a week whenever you are a full time student. How did you get around that?"

In my opinion, they don't really care unless your grades suffer. I was told that as long as I kept my 3.0, they wouldn't say anything.

I mean, the bar I worked at was maybe half a block from the law school. Several faculty members came into my bar several times a week. It was well known that I worked 3-4 nights a week, but there was never a problem with it.

1/17/2011 2:10:27 PM

Quote :

"^ yeah, that was in North Carolina (which hallelujah, I did pass). So I do have the MBE stuff, just need the SC distinctions. If you come across anyone that has them, even older copies, please let me know"

are you taking the February exam in SC or July?

I assume February, but if you're taking July, I can get these materials for ya. Hell, I may be able to get copies now, I just need to check with the guy.

A friend of mine from law school who has been doing P.I. in Charlotte for about 6 years now is finally taking the SC bar in February. He shouldn't have any issue passing and will be willing to pass them along in July.

The SC bar is ridiculously slack, at least from what I hear. (no offense to anyone who may have been snake bitten by the SC bar, just the feedback from friends who have taken it).

1/17/2011 5:08:12 PM

i got a 3.0 for first semester, let's assume i can get that up to at least a 3.25 for the year (which i believe i can). does anyone know what the chances are to transfer to a T2 from a T4? (LSAT was 161 if they care about that for transfers)

i won't know rank before applications are due since they aren't calculated by semester

1/18/2011 6:16:20 PM

You should be able to access prior year averages to evaluate your approximate rank. Your school will have a breakdown somewhere of expected rank based on prior years. It really comes down to your percentage, not the overall GPA, because every school is different. You should know generally where you fit, and to not provide a rank of any kind for the semester is kinda foolish for the school, for purposes of getting jobs. For example, how is someone to know whether they are in the top 5% of the class or top 25%? This matters to a potential employer, and a potential transfer program.

Anyway, look at previous stats for grads and how that correlates, it should be roughly similar. I am not sure what the numbers are for T4 to T2, but I'd anticipate you are solid if you end up in the top 10-20% of the class to move up somewhere. Beyond about 20%, I'd say it's not likely.

1/18/2011 7:35:34 PM

^I don't think it's uncommon not to provide a rank after the first semester. At UNC, we only get rankings at the end of each year.

1/18/2011 7:37:33 PM

well my class ('13) is the first to use the new grading scale of 4.0 versus the previous classes using 4.3 so I don't know how previous grades would help me unless they converted all of them to the new scale

1/18/2011 11:36:45 PM

Has Elon gotten accredited yet?? (I think that's where you said you were going).

My first year at Charleston, we were still going through provisional accreditation and schools wouldn't even accept our 3.75 GPA transfers. After we got accredited it lifted the bar and I knew a guy with a around a 3.2 transfer. Depends on the school you want to transfer to as well. Some are more accepting of others...I think you can check on how many transfers a school has accepted in the past. I'm guessing you want to transfer to Campbell (isn't it in Raleigh)?

Why do you want to transfer? Just want to go to a more prestigious school? Closer to home? How's the distance thing working out for you?

[Edited on January 19, 2011 at 8:17 AM. Reason : .]

1/19/2011 8:16:31 AM

as far as i understand it Elon will get it's accreditation at the end of my 1st year meaning in time to transfer

it's money-related, it's more established school-related, it's location-related, it's a combination of all things especially the fact that since my wife works in raleigh i have two apartments, two sets of bills, and frankly my grades could be better if i wasn't living a double life. her moving to greensboro means moving from raleigh with a fantastic job to an area with next to no jobs, it just doesn't make sense for us

plus i would like to stay in raleigh after graduation and ill be doing my summer positions there

I'm also thinking about just applying as a visiting student. even one year off from running around like a chicken with my head cut off would be immensely helpful and the reasons i see listed for schools granting transfers include spouses with jobs so hopefully its compelling enough, only problem is do they have the space for me

[Edited on January 19, 2011 at 4:59 PM. Reason : j]

1/19/2011 4:58:21 PM

Well good luck. I think you're S.O.L. until Elon gets accredited, which might hurt you depending on when you can apply for transfer. But just keep your grades up (or get them higher I guess) and keep your fingers crossed.

1/19/2011 5:40:16 PM

we had people in my class transfer to campbell, wake, and i think a few other places while i was at elon

so i know they have taken people in the past from elon (campbell has)

they were REALLY understanding of my situation, of course it was a really special situation (mom was sick and hospitalized in durham. no worries i ATTEMPTED to transfer to central, but they were huge dicks to me...sucks for me i guess...but campbell was SUPER nice). i ended up not transferring (obviously because i just ended up dropping out of school for a hot minute) but another girl in my class that transferred there i think just wanted to go to a different school...somewhere accredited maybe, and she hated elon...they took her, too. of course i don't know her EXACT situation (why she said she wanted to transfer). i also know some other people that got accepted there but chose to stay at elon.

but i like your idea of a visiting student too. i know people that did that, also in my class for various reason (not at campbell but other places...georgetown andddd i can't remember the other one...tulane maybe?). even if that could help alleviate your stress, then it could be worth it for sure. it will def alienate you from your classmates though, which has positives and negatives (just like every other decision)

obviously the process is probably individual...like what are your personal circumstances, etc. like the guy that did his 3rd year at georgetown had gotten a job offer there so he was able to work and go to school during his 3rd year. but i haven't heard any stories of elon's accreditation status hindering one's ability to transfer/study elsewhere. i think the big kickers are: personal circumstances and grades, grades, grades!

GOOD LUCK!!!

[Edited on January 19, 2011 at 6:50 PM. Reason : .]

1/19/2011 6:45:44 PM

Quote :

"ou just make sure your grades are high enough to get into that prestigious law school so you can get your LLM and make your $120K first year out....right... Can't suck off the wifey's money teet forever!"

wtf are you babbling about?

I'm gonna do patent law numbnuts.

quit being such a obnoxious, stuckup jackass all the time. cutting back on the douchebaggery would help as well.

^ and yeah I would think that would be the deal mostly. I can totally understand the distance issue thing, I did that during orientation and I thought i was losing my damn mind.

1/20/2011 12:11:04 PM

Quote :

"quit being such a obnoxious, stuckup jackass all the time. cutting back on the douchebaggery would help as well."

Glass houses, kid, glass houses. Not my fault you can dish it out but can't take it.

And with your spouting off about making over a 100K straight out of law school, I figured that meant you were going to get an LLM degree in IP and then go into patent law. You're going to need something like from a better law school, because you're not going to get that kinda job making average grades at Elon (no offense to Elon, only people getting jobs even close to that range are top of the class from tier 1 schools). But don't let me shatter your dreams...you stay positive.

^^I take back my comment about the transferring from a school not yet fully accredited. Must have been a USC/Charleston thing. I do know that they opened the transfer gates once we got full accreditation.

^^^Good luck. I couldn't imagine doing the traveling thing for law school. That has to be tough.

1/20/2011 12:31:52 PM

i got the grades i did without touching a single book on the weekends. i had to ignore my wife during the weekdays but i didn't want to isolate myself when she's right there with me for the little time we had.

1/20/2011 3:09:57 PM

Why not commit to school for the next year or two during the semesters? I mean, I know that family time is important, but at the same time, this is the foundation for a lot of your future in the legal field. If you have the potential to get amazing grades, it opens up a lot more doors. In a couple of years, you'll get your weekends back, and either way you'll still have the long Christmas holiday and the summer break to spend more time together.

I'm not talking about devoting every moment of your life to law, but why shell out a shitton of money and three years of your life to give less than total effort?

1/20/2011 6:32:13 PM

^Definitely not a good idea to put your everything into law school. You need to have separate partitions in your life.

^^This is a better idea. Trust me. If you can focus and study your hardest during the week, then do that, and take your weekends off. It will keep you sane, keep your marriage in line, and give you something else to look forward to, other than just constant studying. I really think I did so well in law school because it wasn't the only thing in my life at the time. I *couldn't* pour everything into it, so I gave it my all, but only during certain hours, and the rest of the time I could devote my time elsewhere, without feeling guilty about it.

1/20/2011 8:17:37 PM

Are you kidding me? It's more than possible to put a hell of a lot of effort into law school and maintain a life. Let me preface what I'm going to say with a statement: Everyone can do their own thing, and I'm not trying to tell anyone how to live their life.

I came to law school to bust my ass and set myself up for a successful future. I try to get as far ahead on my readings each weekend as possible, and my general plan is to read ahead for the entire week over the weekend. I also participated in intramural sports, tutoring at a community center, and was regularly involved in legal functions afterschool. In addition to classes, today I went to two Lexis training session, an employer meet and greet, and then played in an IM basketball game. On Saturday I'm spending the day working with Habitat for Humanity, which means my night and all Sunday will be work.

But I also fucking study. I don't go out on weekends very often, and I rarely go out drinking with folks and do the social thing. And as a result, I am in the top 10 of my class, and truthfully, I could have even worked harder last semester, and I plan on doing so this semester.

I love my life. I love law school, I love the people, the discussions, and the future I know I am building for myself. The idea that by spending your time working hard you are going to go crazy is foolish. My two best friends here are also in the top 10, and they love it, too. I see people who are half assing it and complaining about how horrible law school is, and generally NOT putting forth great effort. Well, you can only get out what you put in. For fuck's sake, we have like 4 hours of class a day, maybe 5. How the hell can you not manage to study hard and still get in enough free time when you have 19 hours left? When I was a teacher I put in 14 hour days during coaching season. Shit, I still have time for afternoon naps now.

I apologize for ranting, but seriously, what we do now determines the kind of job we'll get in two and a half years, or whether we'll be bitching about not finding work, like so many graduates.

[Edited on January 20, 2011 at 9:58 PM. Reason : sdf]

1/20/2011 9:56:07 PM

yeah my wife actually is encouraging me to do that this semester and see what happens

she won't be happy until i get straight A's so that's what i'm gonna shoot for

1/20/2011 10:15:44 PM

Please don't think I'm saying half-ass it. I just don't think that law school needs to be anybody's entire life. I think you should make your time worth it, and put your all into it, I just don't think you need to neglect other areas of your life. That said, I made it into the top 10%, and always felt like I had a well balanced life. I just caution people from thinking that by doing homework and studying 12 hours a day, 7 days a week is the only way to succeed in law school, I think a bit of balance is important.

1/20/2011 10:23:49 PM

Quote :

"Please don't think I'm saying half-ass it. I just don't think that law school needs to be anybody's entire life. I think you should make your time worth it, and put your all into it, I just don't think you need to neglect other areas of your life. That said, I made it into the top 10%, and always felt like I had a well balanced life."

agreed. like 150%. you can do well in school WITHOUT neglecting family life (or whatever else is important to you). i was in the top 20% (top 15, actually) until my mom got sick, and i still graduated in the top 1/2 of my class (not exactly the best but, whatever...i'm happy with that and think i had a pretty well rounded 2.5 years in school). i also worked during law school...both at a regular PT job AND volunteering.

i'm so happy i DID NOT just put my life to the side for 3 years. i did enough to have a great average, great relationships with profs, and contacts in the legal field. but i still came home on weekends, had a PT job outside of the legal field, a volunteer position within the legal field, spent time with my family, friends, boyfriend. i'm so glad i did too. because if i didn't, i'd be seriously regretting a lot of the past 3 years right now. and i'm glad i don't have to look back on law school and regret what i did. either by not putting enough effort in OR by neglecting other things in my life that i care about....happy medium and all that? yea, find it. you can. its possible.

[Edited on January 20, 2011 at 10:56 PM. Reason : .]

1/20/2011 10:54:06 PM

i also want to add that balance is important. you're going to have to juggle multiple things for your ENTIRE life. law school is helpful in learning to balance the different aspects of your life so that you can have a well rounded life...and excel in more than just one area. if you have to give up EVERYTHING every time you want to accomplish one task or excel in one area...well...good luck to you. but i don't think that approach will work out so well in "real" life. employer's are also going to expect you to be able to multi-task effectively and not have to wall yourself off just to complete one project.

1/20/2011 11:56:22 PM

Plus the balance makes you a generally more pleasant person, people are more inclined to enjoy being around you (and help you find a job), and you'll enjoy law school more too

1/21/2011 1:30:13 AM

i don't know if it'll ever be common news but Elon just bought 3(!) new buildings in downtown greensboro, they're not next to the existing law school but diagonally and across the street. it's a good thing too because space is really cramped for how new everything is.

1/21/2011 1:52:03 PM

^ yea i think that is pretty cool!! i read about that the other day. it was definitely getting cramped once three classes were sharing the space. i had a class at the building diagonally across the street from it my last semester (the one where the law review offices were...dunno if they still are). i think they were really starting to get pressed for space! and i guess as the course offerings grow and they add faculty, they kinda need more room.

news like that is bittersweet because i'm so happy i'm done with school, but every time i read about a new clinic or new course they've added i'm like "darn i would have liked that"

1/21/2011 2:28:44 PM

i've noticed that i need to make time to exercise specifically else i get crabby as fuck from stress (all subconscious). I try to read a day to a day and a half ahead, much more than that and I feel as though my command of the information gets kinda rusty (looking at it again 3+days later (notes) for class can feel more rushed than anything). I did pretty ok but let off the gas too much at the end of the semester when I needed to be pressing it down more. Overall I think we can both do much better than we did, even more so since working with you over winter term.

I forgot to ask you, and seeing as we have no classes in common (who's bright idea was that in scheduling?), what kind of law are you interested in pursuing? There is a small group of us that want to start, at first, a IP/Tech/Patent (something along those lines) student group. (ideally starting up a publication on the subject later on).

I'm glad they are actually expanding, i think there is a lack of study space in the main building as it is....

1/22/2011 2:42:19 AM

i would love to do IP/Tech/Patent stuff. I have Levine as my advisor which is great cause he's the go to guy for that stuff.

1/22/2011 1:50:09 PM

Plus patent lawyers can apparently make "$120K" first year out

1/22/2011 1:51:45 PM

i'm not in it for the money although my wife is actively avoiding pregnancy until i graduate so thats where all the money will go anyway

1/22/2011 2:25:46 PM

Worst case too, if life as a patent attorney implodes, you can always go hide in the USPTO for a few years until the economy improves.

1/22/2011 2:39:21 PM