Nuts, what about them???

Obama recieves more funding from the Commercial Banking industry, period. That includes PACs.
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/select.php?ind=F03

If you ask me, it's no surprise he's playing things close to the vest. I wouldn't bite the hand that fed me either.

[Edited on September 23, 2008 at 4:48 PM. Reason : ``]

9/23/2008 4:47:56 PM

Quote :

"Obama did not disagree with Biden's position. Obama has NO position on the AIG bailout. He simply has not said what his position is one way or the other. This is simply a fact. Here is Jake Tapper at ABC on a speech Obama gave last week."

Obama did not disagree with the bailout, that's what I said. He has a position, it just doesn't happen to be as simple as "yes" or "no". If you'd listen to what he's said, you'd understand what that position is. Wow, who woulda thunk complex questions have complex answers?

..

Quote :

"Maybe he is actually discussing the real situation today (i wont know till i get home). Stating what's wrong and how we should fix it *in detail*. But everything I've heard come out of the man's mouth has been vague platitudes about how this is Republican's fault (or rather, their "philosophy" whatever the fuck that means). That is NOT what I call thoughtful answers. "

Just admit it, you haven't paid any attention to what he's been saying, have you? Here's some vague statements from last week where all he does is blame Republicans.

Quote :

" 1. If you’re a financial institution that can borrow from the government, you should be subject to government oversight and supervision. Taxpayers who have now been called upon to spend nearly a trillion dollars to save our economy from the excesses of Wall Street have every right to expect that financial institutions are not taking excessive risks. 2. We need to reform requirements on all regulated financial institutions, investigate rating agencies and potential conflicts of interest with the people they are rating, and establish transparency requirements that demand full disclosure by financial institutions to shareholders. 3. We need to streamline our overlapping and competing regulatory agencies that cannot oversee the large and complex institutions that dominate the financial landscape. 4. We need to regulate institutions for what they do, not what they are. Over the last few years, commercial banks and thrift institutions were subject to guidelines on subprime mortgages that did not apply to mortgage brokers and companies. This regulatory framework failed to protect homeowners, and made no sense for our financial system. 5. We need to crack down on trading activity that crosses the line to market manipulation. We need regulators that actually enforce the rules instead of overlooking them. The SEC should investigate and punish all market manipulation. 6. We must establish a process that identifies systemic risks to the financial system like the crisis that has overtaken our economy. We need a standing financial market advisory group to meet regularly and provide advice to the President, Congress, and regulators on the state of our financial markets and the risks they face. It’s time to anticipate risks before they erupt into a full-blown crisis. "

..

Quote :

"But maybe there is a reason Obama is treading lightly, not wanting to piss-off people that may not understand why some companies should be bailed out at tax payers expense and others shouldn't...."

SERIOUSLY? The man has raised $390 million and you're telling me he's worried about pissing off some dudes who gave him a few hundred thousand? Please, stop reading Drudge.

[Edited on September 23, 2008 at 4:51 PM. Reason : ..]

9/23/2008 4:50:06 PM

In other news, our little state may actually be in play this election

http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/polltracker/ncpres/

The three most recent polls show two ties and a 3 point McCain lead.

9/23/2008 4:59:15 PM

Shrike

hhaha yes, let's look at these specifics. We're going "reform", "streamline", "crackdown", and subject financial institutions to "government oversight and supervision". HOW MANY MORE SPECIFICS COULD A PERSON NEEED!!!!!!

Quote :

"" 1. If you’re a financial institution that can borrow from the government, you should be subject to government oversight and supervision. Taxpayers who have now been called upon to spend nearly a trillion dollars to save our economy from the excesses of Wall Street have every right to expect that financial institutions are not taking excessive risks. 2. We need to reform requirements on all regulated financial institutions, investigate rating agencies and potential conflicts of interest with the people they are rating, and establish transparency requirements that demand full disclosure by financial institutions to shareholders. 3. We need to streamline our overlapping and competing regulatory agencies that cannot oversee the large and complex institutions that dominate the financial landscape. 4. We need to regulate institutions for what they do, not what they are. Over the last few years, commercial banks and thrift institutions were subject to guidelines on subprime mortgages that did not apply to mortgage brokers and companies. This regulatory framework failed to protect homeowners, and made no sense for our financial system. 5. We need to crack down on trading activity that crosses the line to market manipulation. We need regulators that actually enforce the rules instead of overlooking them. The SEC should investigate and punish all market manipulation. 6. We must establish a process that identifies systemic risks to the financial system like the crisis that has overtaken our economy. We need a standing financial market advisory group to meet regularly and provide advice to the President, Congress, and regulators on the state of our financial markets and the risks they face. It’s time to anticipate risks before they erupt into a full-blown crisis."

Look, I know you don't really post here all that often. You're just inspired by Barry and sweet, sweet talk. I get that. So I will let this go. But you should really realize that "oversight" and "regulation" could mean anything. These are not specifics in any shape or form.

And just so you, know. I don't read drudge. I tell drudge what to say and then tell him he's wrong. I'm the most intelligent, most informed, and possibly most good-looking of the posters you will be meet in the SoapBox. I'm kind of a Big Deal.



[Edited on September 23, 2008 at 5:03 PM. Reason : ``]

9/23/2008 5:01:40 PM

House conservatives Tuesday urged Congress to "take a breath" and consider other alternatives before rushing to pass a $700 billion plan to bail out Wall Street, a measure the White House says must pass by the end of the week.

"I must tell you, there are those in the public debate who have said that we must act now. The last time I heard that, I was on a used-car lot," said Rep. Mike Pence, R-Indiana. "The truth is, every time somebody tells you that you've got to do the deal right now, it usually means they're going to get the better part of the deal."


This gives me a little hope for our future.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/23/congress.bailout.reax/index.html


socks, you forgot "fairness".. another great specific plan of action.

[Edited on September 23, 2008 at 5:05 PM. Reason : .]

9/23/2008 5:04:34 PM

Quote :

"Look, I know you don't really post here all that often. You're just inspired by Barry and sweet, sweet talk. I get that."

This is when you can tell you are getting to socks, shrike. He starts acting like a rock wielding 4th grader. He's trying to knock you out of the tree.

9/23/2008 5:10:50 PM

Quote :

"hhaha yes, let's look at these specifics. We're going "reform", "streamline", "crackdown", and subject financial institutions to "government oversight and supervision". HOW MANY MORE SPECIFICS COULD A PERSON NEEED!!!!!!"

I thought you said all he did was blame Republicans? Now the problem is that he's not being specific enough for you, in a 10 minute speech? Keep moving the goalposts, just means I win.

Quote :

"Look, I know you don't really post here all that often. You're just inspired by Barry and sweet, sweet talk. I get that. So I will let this go. But you should really realize that "oversight" and "regulation" could mean anything. These are not specifics in any shape or form. And just so you, know. I don't read drudge. I tell drudge what to say and then tell him he's wrong. I'm the most intelligent, most informed, and possibly most good-looking of the posters you will be meet in the SoapBox. I'm kind of a Big Deal."

Actually never mind, that means I win.



^Haha yeah, I got that

[Edited on September 23, 2008 at 5:13 PM. Reason : :]

9/23/2008 5:12:31 PM

Quote :

"Nuts, what about them???"

I means that corporations give to candidates all the time, through pacs.

9/23/2008 6:17:04 PM

Shrike,

Obama talks in vague platitudes about serious issues and refuses to offer real solutions. That is my problem with him and you have only re-enforced my conclusion. There is no moving goal posts.

This is not "zen-time" economics. The AIG bail-out is either a good idea or a bad idea. You can say it has its pros and its cons, but when it comes to moving forward we have to decide whether it is something we want to continue doing and that mean making a fucking decision. So far, Obama has refused to make a decision. And he has nothing new to add to the conversation.

That is why it scares me to vote for Obama. This is not being thoughtful. This is being political (if he takes the position Joe Biden outlined, Obama can no longer attack McCain on this issue, because Biden's position was the SAME as MCCAIN'S--so Obama's solution is to have no clear position and continue attacking McCain).

And that has been the defining characteristic of Obama's campaign--politics trumps policy.

BELIEVE THAT!

PS* Don't mind Kainen. He's just tired of me shredding his arguments to pieces, so he wants to say that I am unfair because I make fun of the Obama-faithful for being, well, faithful to Obama. It's a little game we play.

PPS* When you've spent some time in the soapbox, you'll find out no body wins.

[Edited on September 23, 2008 at 6:41 PM. Reason : N00bs]

9/23/2008 6:31:31 PM

Quote :

"Obama recieves more funding from the Commercial Banking industry, period. That includes PACs."

From your source:

Quote :

"Source of Funds Individual contributions $426,902,991 94% PAC contributions $450 0% Candidate self-financing $0 0% Federal Funds $0 0% Other $27,152,882 6%"

[Edited on September 23, 2008 at 7:40 PM. Reason : Overall, not just commercial banking.]

9/23/2008 7:25:29 PM

why cant they just fund that bailout with all the money obama raised

9/23/2008 7:27:03 PM

Socks everytime I go easy on you you turn it around an act like an arrogant ass.

Quote :

"PS* Don't mind Kainen. He's just tired of me shredding his arguments to pieces"

YET

Quote :

"PPS* When you've spent some time in the soapbox, you'll find out no body wins."

I'm confused, contradict yourself much? So let's get this straight.....you win but nobody wins? OK, I thought so. Got it.

All you've shredded is your image of being fair and intellectually honest. By no means Mr. Junior Self Declared Debate Queenie have you ever won any debate nor shredded any argument, well that is, unless you are using your own vain scoring system. That usually involves thinking you are way smarter than you think. Keep in mind folks that this is coming from a guy who backed Hillary before she got worked and then moved to McCain like a little wounded whining PUMA. And from a guy who says policies before politics yet all McCain has done this entire freaking campaign is lie, cheat, and smear the fuck out of Obama with all he's got. He's also flipped on damn near every issue that he claimed dear at the start of this thing from regulation, immigration, foreign policy, domestic policy, science, to you name it. He's also the candidate getting railed by all corners of the media and instead of giving it any small quarter of the critique one inch of credence you'd rather be in denial and in turn withdrawal a mile of blame.....you know, DAT DER LIEBRAL MEDIA

The funniest thing is that you are so stricken by your own self righteous convictions that you see none of that in McCain. If anyone is a loser it'd be you.

[Edited on September 23, 2008 at 8:46 PM. Reason : - removed some acid]

9/23/2008 8:41:17 PM

Kainen

Quote :

"I'm confused, contradict yourself much? So let's get this straight.....you win but nobody wins? OK, I thought so. Got it."

haha good catch. I didn't even notice that.

But with regards to the other content of your post, you're right that McCain's political tactics did go negative. But what does that have to do with policy? His policies are just as strong as they ever were, even though he apparently prefers to make his case to the American people based on sex-ed.

Like wise, the reason I don't like Obama is because of his policies and the way he apparently formulates them. I dislike the fact that he lies about McCain's record, mocks McCain's war injuries, and prefers to make his case to the American people based on the number of houses McCain's wife owns. But that's politics. That isn't why I'm not voting for him.

And my rants on the media are unrelated to both subjects. Hope that clears things up.

PS* I like to think that I am smarter than I think I am.

9/23/2008 9:33:10 PM

Quote :

"Palin is not my favorite person on earth. I think she is more pragmatic than the folks on DailyKos and TPM make her sound, though she's still a bit too conservative for my tastes. But, honestly, the fact that she is saying "Fuck You" to the press only makes me like her MORE. Things have changed in the press. For the better part of the decade, the press spent all their time doing "he-said, she-said" journalism and no time checking facts of a story. This led to a lot of people being widely misinformed about a number of issues (e.g., initial lead up to Iraq War). But now they're swinging the other way. 90% of coverage these days is opinion. It's all commentary. And almost all of that commentary has been Pro-Obama. Maybe that's because Bush radicalized the press. Maybe it's because they realized that commentary sells better than straight news (see success of Fox News). Either way, the press should not be rewarded for this kinda behavior. WTG Palin!!"

Haha, after making posts like these, how do you expect people to take you seriously?

I can tell that you yourself are even skeptical of your own line of reasoning here... You shouldn't invest so much of yourself in this candidate

9/24/2008 1:45:15 AM

I just want to stick my dick in campbell brown repeatedly. I'm in love with her.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/09/23/campbell-brown-rips-mccai_n_128782.html

9/24/2008 9:24:35 AM

For the McCain supporters, do you agree with him that CEO pay should be limited to 400k? Doesn't seem like fiscal conservative politics to me.

9/24/2008 9:32:59 AM

campbell brown is a dude.

9/24/2008 9:33:47 AM

TWW photoshoppers, get to work! I want to see a giant dick in her hand by lunch time.

9/24/2008 9:36:35 AM

Quote :

"campbell brown is a dude. "

If she is a dude, then she is the sexxiest dude ever.

9/24/2008 9:38:53 AM

Sexy dudes, huh? okay...nutsmacker.

9/24/2008 9:40:08 AM

warwick, no I dont agree that the govt should tell any company what they should pay someone.

BTW, have you looked at the fairpay act? its fucking absurd


Obama is up 9 now in some polls. Its been a great week for socialism in america.

9/24/2008 9:40:28 AM

Are you having a laugh, or do you really not know who Campbell Brown is?

Quote :

"Its been a great week for socialism in america"

You an thank Hank Paulsen for that.

[Edited on September 24, 2008 at 9:41 AM. Reason : .]

9/24/2008 9:40:47 AM

^yep, among others.

9/24/2008 9:42:30 AM

If I didnt, that would only make this line from the article even funnier.

Quote :

"especially when they come from a well-known female news anchor"

[Edited on September 24, 2008 at 9:43 AM. Reason : ``]

9/24/2008 9:42:31 AM

I see you didn't get my Extra's reference.

9/24/2008 9:49:52 AM

anybody see Bill Clinton on The View yesterday?

obviously I didn't watch the fucking View, but I saw some commentary on it last night... apparently he didn't exactly give Obama a ringing endorsement and complimented McCain/Palin and the McCain campaign thinks the more he's out in the media, the more he will help them.

And the conclusion by whatever "experts" that were on (I can't even remember what show or channel I was watching) said it's all a huge theory by the Clintons -- she's saying the right stuff and supporting Obama, and not upsetting the party while letting Bill pretty much do the opposite because the Clintons hate Obama, and they're actually hoping McCain will win so he'll be stuck with the whole mess of the economy and everything else and look horrible and she can swoop in next election as the savior.

Bullshit? Possible?

9/24/2008 9:50:24 AM

Quote :

"obviously I didn't watch the fucking View, "

lawl

9/24/2008 9:52:29 AM

Quote :

"For the McCain supporters, do you agree with him that CEO pay should be limited to 400k? Doesn't seem like fiscal conservative politics to me."

yeah, McCain didn't sound too conservative to me either

his quote on NPR this morning was something like "It was deregulation that got us into this mess, it will be regulation that gets us out of it"

9/24/2008 10:01:48 AM

that is especially funny coming from a guy who is all for deregulation.

9/24/2008 10:03:57 AM

I haven't followed the thread, but I can only hope someone pointed out that both candidates will say whatever they need to to get elected, political ideology be damned.

I kinda fell off the McCain bandwagon, but he could have gotten me right back on it if he would have said we need to let these corporations die on their own, not with taxpayer money. Instead, he's just repeating Washington, gotta have this fixed now rhetoric, because he and everyone else knows if the economy starts pissing even worse leading into the election, he's fucked.

[Edited on September 24, 2008 at 10:11 AM. Reason : a]

9/24/2008 10:10:47 AM

On the subject of Bill, here he is doing the same thing on Letterman:



and here's Chris Rock calling him out



edit: Apparently he made up for it on The Daily Show later

http://www.thedailyshow.com/sitewide/video_player/view/default/swf.jhtml' quality='high' bgcolor='#cccccc' width='332' height='316' name='comedy_central_player' align='middle' allowScriptAccess='always' allownetworking='external' type='application/x-shockwave-flash' pluginspage='http://www.macromedia.com/go/getflashplayer'>

[Edited on September 24, 2008 at 11:34 AM. Reason : .]

9/24/2008 11:10:53 AM

Biden on coal:

Quote :

"Biden's apparent answer: He supports clean coal for China, but not for the United States. "No coal plants here in America," he said. "Build them, if they're going to build them, over there. Make them clean." "We’re not supporting clean coal," he said of himself and Obama. They do, on paper, support clean coal."

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0908/Biden_No_coal_plants_here_in_America.html?showall


on Obama's ad about McCain

Quote :

"In an interview broadcast on CBS Monday, Biden said a campaign ad that mocked Republican presidential candidate John McCain as an out-of-touch, out-of-date computer illiterate was “terrible” and would not have been done had he known about it."

http://news.bostonherald.com/news/2008/view.bg?articleid=1121079&srvc=2008campaign&position=2

Maybe Obama's campaign should do the same as McCain and get their STUPID VP candidate out of the media

edit: he's had other gaffes recently, but these were the two that directly contradicted Obama and their campaign... see the other thread for others

[Edited on September 24, 2008 at 11:42 AM. Reason : .]

9/24/2008 11:39:20 AM

^^stupid link tags, here's the daily show clip

http://www.comedycentral.com/videos/index.jhtml?videoId=185198

9/24/2008 11:55:15 AM

The reason Biden keeps "gaffing" is that he actually talks to voters and reporters without reading a teleprompter - unlike a certain VP candidate who has given only two interviews and a town hall meeting stuffed with Republican faithful. Sarah Palin says she has guts, but she's afraid of a little ole microphone.

9/24/2008 12:13:43 PM

Biden...lol

9/24/2008 12:15:55 PM

The way the McCain camp is treating Sarah Palin is extremely sexist.

9/24/2008 12:23:42 PM

Quote :

"The reason Biden keeps "gaffing" is that he actually talks to voters and reporters without reading a teleprompter - unlike a certain VP candidate who has given only two interviews and a town hall meeting stuffed with Republican faithful. Sarah Palin says she has guts, but she's afraid of a little ole microphone. "

Talking to voters and reporters without a teleprompter isn't an valid excuse to completely undermine your presidential candidate's campaigning strategy and your own ticket's policy on energy. It's one thing to just misspeak and think FDR was president in 1929 or tell somebody in a wheelchair to stand up. These are just two examples that a president and his running mate aren't exactly in agreement on some issues.

Whine about Palin all you want, but the bottom line is that Biden is making himself and Obama look stupid.

AND

if this was Palin, all I would be reading right now is how Palin wasn't vetted and doesn't have experience and is an idiot

[Edited on September 24, 2008 at 12:43 PM. Reason : .]

[Edited on September 24, 2008 at 12:43 PM. Reason : blah blah]

9/24/2008 12:41:09 PM

Whine about Obama/Biden all you want, but they're creaming McCain in the polls right now.

9/24/2008 1:20:43 PM

what is creaming? like 51% to 49%?

9/24/2008 1:37:14 PM

http://www.usaelectionpolls.com/

Looks like creaming to me.

9/24/2008 1:40:41 PM

weighted national average is 46.5% to 46.3%

looks like creaming to me

btw i'll gladly wager any amount of money that whoever wins the election does it by less than 10% (ie 55% to 45% is the largest possible margin)...any takers? anyone?

[Edited on September 24, 2008 at 1:42 PM. Reason : .]

9/24/2008 1:41:50 PM

I wonder if its true that obama wanted to use 4 teleprompters during the debate but was denied. If true it should make the news tommorrow. Not that its terribly important, but its funny.

Also, does it bother anyone that both mccain and obama are skipping the vote for the bailout?

9/24/2008 1:45:30 PM

Well, for Obama it makes sense. If he votes "no," it means he isn't for helping the economy. If he votes "yes," it means he's supporting Bush policies.

9/24/2008 1:48:16 PM

is that just a rumor that you're trying to start here?
why in the hell would Obama need a teleprompter during a debate. Unless, you know he got the evil liberal overlords at PBS to slip him the questions before Friday

9/24/2008 1:51:13 PM

Quote :

"Talking to voters and reporters without a teleprompter isn't an valid excuse to completely undermine your presidential candidate's campaigning strategy and your own ticket's policy on energy."

Uh, two comments on relatively minor issues (lol coal, seriously?) is now tantamount to undermining the entire campaign? Look, lets be real here, the mainstream media (rightfully) isn't reporting these "gaffes" so they may as well have not even happened.

Quote :

"what is creaming? like 51% to 49%?"

http://abcnews.go.com/PollingUnit/Politics/story?id=5866046&page=1

Before you cry bias, this same poll had McCain up by 2% a couple weeks ago. Also, the McCain camp seems concerned has they held a media call earlier today trying to alleviate concerns over their poor showings in polls.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/09/24/polls-show-mccain-obama-nearly-tied-in-virginia/

9/24/2008 1:51:25 PM

Actually, I'm referring to the electoral college. As we found out in 2000, the popular vote doesn't matter in our 'democracy.'

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/ reports 309 to 229 right now
http://www.intrade.com//?request_operation=main&request_type=action&checkHomePage=true Intrade shows 291 to 247
http://electoral-vote.com/ Shows 282 to 256

9/24/2008 1:51:51 PM

Quote :

"Look, lets be real here, the mainstream media (rightfully) isn't reporting these "gaffes" so they may as well have not even happened."

wonder why they aren't reporting it...

9/24/2008 1:59:41 PM

Quote :

"Uh, two comments on relatively minor issues (lol coal, seriously?) is now tantamount to undermining the entire campaign? Look, lets be real here, the mainstream media (rightfully) isn't reporting these "gaffes" so they may as well have not even happened."

Most anthracite coal is found in Pennsylvania.
Pennsylvania has 29 billion tons of coal reserves, or 6.1% of the country's reserves.
The combined direct and indirect contributions of the coal industry to Pennsylvania's economy are more than $10 billion.
Using more than 57 million tons, Pennsylvania ranks fourth in coal use.
Pennsylvania employs more than 9,300 miners.
Pennsylvania distributes more than 75 million tons of coal each year.
Pennsylvania has 82 underground mines and 225 surface mines.
About 58% of the electricity used in Pennsylvania is produced by coal.
Pennsylvania produces about 7% of the country's coal supply.
Pennsylvania has 23 coal-fired power plants.

pretty important to PA, no? I think we'd all agree PA is a pretty important state in this election.

Rightfully, because it's Biden and not Palin, amirite

also I don't understand the usage of "gaffes," there's no debate they're gaffes and pretty obvious ones at that

[Edited on September 24, 2008 at 2:05 PM. Reason : .]

9/24/2008 2:04:11 PM

I know im looking forward to the imax video of washington freeing the slaves.

It is funny how Biden can say so many stupid things... yet they will try to paint palin as the idiot.

You really cant deny the media bias anymore.

9/24/2008 2:06:55 PM

Quote :

"why in the hell would Obama need a teleprompter during a debate"

probably so he doesnt say 'uh' 17 times in every answer

9/24/2008 2:09:11 PM