7 carries for 11 yds, long run of 7 yds.

10/15/2006 2:39:05 PM

4 catches, 35 yards punt return for 20 yards

Saints beating the Eagles 17 - 3

10/15/2006 2:46:46 PM

move him to wr on the depth chart, it'll make people happy and he'll be at a better position for his ability.

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 3:11 PM. Reason : ]

10/15/2006 3:10:59 PM

Not really. The only reason hes been catching the passes he has is because hes coming out of the back field and being picked up by a linebacker thats slower than him. If they move him to WR he will be going against CBs that are just as fast as him.

10/15/2006 3:14:27 PM

He's not doing well as AN NFL HALFBACK.

YOU KNOW, THOSE GUYS WHO TAKE HANDOFFS AND RUN FORWARD.

HENCE THE THREAD TITLE, "Bush = No pro RB"

10/15/2006 3:56:51 PM

You're right.

NFL HB's arent supposed to catch passes.


I guess we should strip Marshall Faulk of his MVP's.


While we're at it let's just downgrade LD Tomlinson for that 100 catch season

10/15/2006 4:03:55 PM

Marshall faulk and Lt both are proven "rushing backs" with substantial "rushing" stats. Recieving is just something they happen to be good at, along with rushing!

^You're really starting to look bad around here.

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 4:06 PM. Reason : .]

10/15/2006 4:05:01 PM

^that shouldnt be the only thing they're good at

10/15/2006 4:05:45 PM

^^ haha alright Earl.

Get back at me when NC State wins the ACC you loser.


Bush is still balling. NC State is not.

The Saints have another guy they are using to run the ball, idiot. They are using Bush as a receiving back.

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 4:10 PM. Reason : a]

10/15/2006 4:10:01 PM

He makes a good point though, rally.

If Bush doesn't get another carry today, he is gonna end this game averaging right at 3 yards per carry after five games.

194/64 = 3.03125

If he's this much better at catching (screens) than he is at taking handoffs and moving forward effectively...

10/15/2006 4:13:00 PM

then he's a good receiving back?

10/15/2006 4:14:11 PM

and a terrible RUNNING BACK

Which is what this thread is about

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 4:14 PM. Reason : ]

10/15/2006 4:14:38 PM

^ ftw

Ronnie Harmon, NFL running back, had 615 career rushes and 581 career catches... but hell, even HE averaged 4.5 over the course of his career

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 4:16 PM. Reason : Reggie Bush = Ronnie Harmon.]

10/15/2006 4:14:56 PM

Quote :

"then he's a good receiving back?"

With his nutty logic, you can place dante hall in the backfield and be a successful Rb. Why arn't the saints using him as a rusher? Answer, they try and he only gets 2 yds per carry. RDU is a state hater, and a terrible fan.

Quote :

"Get back at me when NC State wins the ACC you loser."

You would like nothing more than to see us fall short. All you do is hate on ncsu and pick a beef with everybody who disagrees with you. I read your post, and your claims are very weak. Fact.

10/15/2006 4:17:58 PM

Quote :

"Get back at me when NC State wins the ACC you loser. Bush is still balling. NC State is not."

Where the hell did this come from? Now you're just reaching...

10/15/2006 4:20:26 PM

I'm not reaching for anything.


He said I'm starting to look bad around here.


Last I checked the Saints are winning games. Last I checked NC State is not.

I said Reggie Bush would be good and Earl said NC State would win the ACC.

Who is looking bad?

Reggie Bush hasn't been AS good as I thought he'd be but he's been good. He won the game for them last week, remember?

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 4:22 PM. Reason : a]

10/15/2006 4:22:26 PM

^you have no credibility. You've been wrong about nearly everything you've posted in the last month. Face it.

10/15/2006 4:26:32 PM

^^ why bring up the ACC in a Reggie Bush discussion?

Not only would Reggie Bush have gotten eaten alive in the ACC, but he's getting eaten alive in the NFL AS THE GUY WHO LINES UP BEHIND THE QUARTERBACK, TAKES A HANDOFF, AND MOVES FORWARD WITH IT.


It's not that hard to figure out what the hell everyone else is saying, yet you keep responding with that uber-weak receiving back argument. Nobody is questioning his hands, what we are questioning is his ability to LINE UP BEHIND THE QUARTERBACK, TAKE A HANDOFF, AND MOVE FORWARD WITH IT EFFECTIVELY.

10/15/2006 4:30:02 PM

Listen you little fuck.

You are 18 years old.

You dont know dick about life or sports.

I could abuse you in any conversation about any topic except video games.

You keep drawing up your little imaginary playbooks that say "run left" and act like you are "breaking" down the playbooks of Div I football teams. That sounds fun.

Quote :

"Not only would Reggie Bush have gotten eaten alive in the ACC"

You have got to be kidding me. He destroyed the entire nation for two straight years.


And for god's sake he is a ROOKIE. They are USING him as a receiving back. Reggie Bush doesnt call the plays. Reggie Bush doesn't call the formations. You seriously don't think he'll emerge as a 1,000 yard back in the near future? REALLY? In the meantime are we okay with him putting up ~1,200 yards while SPLITTING time as the HB? Are we okay with him returning punts for TD's while the Saints rack up the 2nd best record in the NFC?

I'm just checking, but we're okay with a 3-13 team being 5-1 right now, right? We're okay with this???

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 4:34 PM. Reason : a]

10/15/2006 4:31:51 PM

if that was ALL a running back does then people would agree without question..

this is dumb though... btw your team won.

Earl get the fuck out of this conversation damn it..

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 4:33 PM. Reason : x]

10/15/2006 4:32:06 PM

^^^because RDU is a state troll and he's continues to reach for things. He's knows the truth, but he's just in denial. I doubt he even attends ncsu. His lack of support for us is obvious.

Quote :

" Listen you little fuck. You are 18 years old."

Don't you dare call me out of my name.Why do you desire a piece of beef with me? My age has nothing to do with this conversation. If you're wrong, you're wrong.

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 4:35 PM. Reason : .]

10/15/2006 4:32:23 PM

Quote :

"He destroyed the entire nation Pac-other9, Fresno State, and Arkansas for two straight years. "

10/15/2006 4:35:08 PM

his TD run against Texas was one of the most explosive runs I've ever seen in college football.

Is Texas any good?

Is an amazing 30+ yard TD run in the National Championship game even worth noting or is that pretty inconsequential?

10/15/2006 4:36:34 PM

and Notre Dame, and Oklahoma, and Virginia Tech. He's a rookie and isn't the feature RB right now. However they are using him, it's working.

10/15/2006 4:37:12 PM

^,^^Now you go back to college, when your argument about Pro fails. This is not a college thread. You guys need to really step your game up. This is just terrible...I don't know what to say at all.

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 4:41 PM. Reason : .]

10/15/2006 4:39:00 PM

Jesus Christ can we please suspend Earl.

Shit isn't even funny anymore.

10/15/2006 4:40:28 PM

Quote :

"And for god's sake he is a ROOKIE. They are USING him as a receiving back. Reggie Bush doesnt call the plays. Reggie Bush doesn't call the formations. You seriously don't think he'll emerge as a 1,000 yard back in the near future? REALLY? In the meantime are we okay with him putting up ~1,200 yards while SPLITTING time as the HB? Are we okay with him returning punts for TD's while the Saints rack up the 2nd best record in the NFC? I'm just checking, but we're okay with a 3-13 team being 5-1 right now, right? We're okay with this???"

Every other rookie RB getting significant burn is averaging more than 3 yards per rush.

They're using him as a receiving back? Fine. Those same 4 catches he had in the 2nd quarter, he finished with. He ran the ball 4 more times and got 8 more yards, with a long of 4.

He may not call the plays or formations, but another running back on his team is averaging nearly 5 yards a pop on similar playcalls. And he was the guy they said lost a step. He was the guy everyone said should just defer the starting postion to Bush. He was the guy everyone said was on a short leash.

Sure, he can return punts for TDs - Michael Lewis could do that. Tyrone Hughes could do that. Eric fucking Guilford could do that. Whoop-de-freaking-da.

Are you gonna try to do this direct correlation between Bush being on the Saints and them having a good record, the same way you do with Vick and the Falcons? If anything, I'd say that the Saints' good record is WAY more thanks to them having smart QB play, an overachieving front seven, and the return of McAllister.

Your argument about catching passes and returning punts making him a reputable NFL HALFBACK - in the face of his biggest deficiency, which happens to be the most important tenet of playing running back in the NFL - is dead in the water.

Quote :

"his TD run against Texas was one of the most explosive runs I've ever seen in college football."

Look dude, that he was a great college RB means nothing. He's at the next level, averaging (195/65) = THREE YARDS PER NFL RUSHING ATTEMPT.

Quote :

"He's a rookie and isn't the feature RB right now. However they are using him, it's working."

Catching screen passes - check
Returning punts - neutral (he has good ones at opportune times and horrible ones at the worst times)
Taking handoffs from Drew Brees and moving forward effectively - X. X. X. X. X. X. X. X. X. X.

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 4:47 PM. Reason : ~]

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 4:52 PM. Reason : ~]

10/15/2006 4:43:41 PM

Quote :

"Jesus Christ can we please suspend Earl. "

You have no reason for me to be silenced. You're another bad fan and statehater, I see.

10/15/2006 4:50:23 PM

Yeah don't you know, Earl is the model of a good fan.

if you drew irrelevant play sketches and predicted undefeated championship seasons against all evidence you too could be a good fan.

10/15/2006 5:07:43 PM

Dude I don't know how to argue with you anymore.

Quote :

"Not only would Reggie Bush have gotten eaten alive in the ACC"

Sleik

Quote :

"You have got to be kidding me. He destroyed the entire nation for two straight years. "

rallydurham

Quote :

"Look dude, that he was a great college RB means nothing."

Sleik


Then maybe you shouldn't be the one to bring up his college career...???

Quote :

"You have no reason for me to be silenced. You're another bad fan and statehater, I see."

Who is this guy? He sounds like Hitler, Stalin, or big brother.

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 5:13 PM. Reason : a]

10/15/2006 5:12:23 PM

When Deuce gets injured again and Reggie Bush becomes a 1,000 yard back, Sleik's head is going to blow right off.

I've never seen a fan hate the success of his team and current, effective use of a player so much.

10/15/2006 5:13:25 PM

Earl's NCSU fandom is ultimately irrelevant in this thread. He didn't even bring it up. Rally did after getting destroyed in this argument.

He really doesn't have anything to use against me, so he went after Earl.

10/15/2006 5:14:05 PM

Quote :

"He really doesn't have anything to use against me, so he went after Earl."

He went from bad to worse when he did that. I always make him look foolish.

10/15/2006 5:16:57 PM

haha i dont have to "go after you" because i dont have anything bad to say about you.

I just think you've got something against Reggie Bush and its causing you not to see that he's become an effective receiving back for a team that has completely turned their franchise around in ONE offseason.

What is it, unrequited love or something?


The only reason i went "after" Earl is because the entire contigent 48 US states know this guy is a clownshow. Its hilarious to hear him talk about anyones "credibility" when he is a noted whacko. This guy can't stop trumpeting his importance as a member of the NC State assistant coaching staff. He's actually breaking down footage and designing offensive plays and defensive sets to use from week to week.

He has implemented them into his dynasty mode on NCAA '07 for the Playstation 2 and the results have been spectacular thus far. Currently he's working on some new packages that can utilize the strengths of Marcus Stone's arm and Daniel Evans poise in order to create an uber-QB named White Chocolate.

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 5:30 PM. Reason : a]

10/15/2006 5:19:24 PM

all bushes runs in college were thru wide open holes. sprinting strait throught the los. never did he have to run trhough resistance and break tackles of linemen or lbs. all he did was run strait through the line or around it and make crap guys in the scondary pac 10 miss.

in the texas game he ran strait through sprinting. that is uscs o line not bushes running back ability. he has nice moves but that is more of a danta hall type thing and not running backish.

10/15/2006 5:24:59 PM

Quote :

"When Deuce gets injured again and Reggie Bush becomes a 1,000 yard back, Sleik's head is going to blow right off. I've never seen a fan hate the success of his team and current, effective use of a player so much."

See this is the type of shit I'm up against from other Saints fans.

If Bush fills in for an injured McAllister and does well, guess what? GREAT!! I sure as hell won't complain.

It's the fans who suggested that Bush should just be given the starting spot over McAllister that I'm constantly proving wrong. You've got Deuce averaging 4.9 yards per carry after this game, and Bush averaging THREE yards per carry after this game. Who's better at taking handoffs from the QB, again?

Bush catches the ball well? McAllister averaged 50 catches per season from '02-'04. I think he's pretty dependable in that department. Here's the killer, though: Deuce could also run effectively! Not only that, but Deuce averaged 7.3 yards per catch in that timespan - Bush is averaging .2 yards more per catch after six games.

Punt returns? You aren't about to suggest to me that a guy making $8.5 million a year should be most effective at punt returns. Special teams studs aren't picked second overall. They drafted him for what he brought to the table at the college level, and so far it has not translated over very well.

BUT SLEIK, HE'S JUST A ROOKIE!!!!1

Then god dammit, quit hyping him up so fucking much. Let him take his lumps, and quit spooging out potential failures every time he makes a guy miss en route to a -2 yard play.

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 5:26 PM. Reason : ~ ]

10/15/2006 5:25:08 PM

I dont remember anyone on this messageboard saying they should trade/bench/dump Deuce McAllister.

Its not uncommon for RB's to split carries now. Even LDTomlinson is spelled by Michael Turner.

Practically every team in the league implements 2 RB's or at least a 3rd down running back or goaline back.

Its working well. He may never be a "workhorse" back but not too many people are anymore. And the ones that are tend to break down very fast (guys like Cadillac).

Its okay to pay a PLAYMAKER $8.5 million. Sure he hasn't been the human highlight reel yet but he looks pretty damn good out there and the team is WINNING as he learns the position.

10/15/2006 5:29:23 PM

get that wr out of the backfield already!

10/15/2006 5:30:10 PM

^^ nobody here said these things, but Saints fans and some sports media suggested that Bush just be given the starting job this season.

He looks good on punts, and gets loose for first-down yardage occasionally on the screen. As far as taking those handoffs...

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 5:33 PM. Reason : ~]

10/15/2006 5:32:43 PM

The saints would be doing the same thing entirely if they had a bench warmer out there.

10/15/2006 5:55:45 PM

That's just stupid. Look, I've admitted that he hasn't done as much strictly getting handoffs as I thought he would (to this point -- I still fully expect for him to be a great running rb eventually).. but to say that he doesn't change the way a defense plays is just stupid.

The Saints have a formidable team thanks in large part to Deuce and Reggie playing together in the backfield..

10/15/2006 6:03:06 PM

Quote :

" He has implemented them into his dynasty mode on NCAA '07 for the Playstation 2 and the results have been spectacular thus far. Currently he's working on some new packages that can utilize the strengths of Marcus Stone's arm and Daniel Evans poise in order to create an uber-QB named White Chocolate."

LOL

10/15/2006 6:04:42 PM

^^Because Reggie catches it, its special. But if another rb did the same thing (which they do everyday in the nfl) its nothing. Good logic there kiddo. You're on your way to hollywood.

[Edited on October 15, 2006 at 6:06 PM. Reason : .]

10/15/2006 6:06:28 PM

I just want to know when is he going to get a TD from scrimmage.

10/16/2006 10:37:36 AM

Quote :

"^^Because Reggie catches it, its special. But if another rb did the same thing (which they do everyday in the nfl) its nothing. Good logic there kiddo. You're on your way to hollywood."

youre absolutely wrong

teams make sure to account for bush in a way they dont for other backups

if you dont know that you dont know anything important about football

coordinators and players dont prepare for or worry about Brian Calhoun the way they do Reggie Bush

if you think they do and you had to look up who he was and who he plays for

then you need to stop posting in this thread

10/16/2006 12:37:00 PM

ahahahha...

4 pages of rallydurham getting fucking pwned.

Its good to see that not much changes in Sports Talk.

10/16/2006 12:43:45 PM

^correct.

you're telling me if this was the seahawks we were talking about and it was Morris spelling Alexander, then he would get as much attention as Bush.

Why does everyone think that Marques Colston is having such a tremendous rookie year? Granted, there is talent there and I am not trying to deny that, but if Bush was not on the field and having guys spy him all of the time, would there be so many other openings?

Bush has not been great yet, and I believe that it is b/c he is trying to make too much happen. When he learns as Barry Sanders did that you can take 2-3 yards sometimes just hitting the holes, eventually one will open up for him and he will go for 40. no one can deny his speed. he just takes a peak and if there isn't a hole he immediately darts outside. he is only a rookie. he will learn these things with time.

10/16/2006 12:45:56 PM

just found this off of espn.com from sean salisbury:

Quote :

"Coach Sean Payton and the rest of his staff have done a fantastic job of putting him in space and making great use of his speed and agility. That is forcing defenses to have to game plan for him and leaving Deuce McAllister and Brees room to do what they do best. This team is one of the best in the NFC. "

bush is being game planned around and leaving more open room for everyone else. like i said above, he is still learning as well. he is still a rookie.

10/16/2006 1:04:16 PM

wtf are you people talking about? Do you honestly think tht any team that plays the saints is thinking we have to shut down Reggie Bush? Also what is this crap about team spying him? Do you honestly think that anytime a RB comes out of the back field that a linebacker or a defensive back is not suppose to pick them up? Its not anything special that someone is covering Bush, do you think they just let other running backs run down field uncovered?

ESPN and a lot of people have been hyping this guy up forever, saying hes the best player to ever come out of college and all that crap. Now all you people are saying hes just a rookie, he can't be expected to perform great yet. Well which is it? Is he the best player ever or just a rookie who has no real position on a football field.

Right now he can't be a full time reciever or running back, because he can't do either really well. All hes done half decent is return kicks. Rally keeps talking about how hes a great recieving back, but is that really why he was drafted so high and hyped so much, because people were expecting him to be a recieving back?

10/16/2006 1:20:04 PM

Quote :

"Do you honestly think tht any team that plays the saints is thinking we have to shut down Reggie Bush?"

No, I think they are thinking let's just let one of the most explosive athletes in the game loose in the openfield and see what he does... if he beats us oh well

10/16/2006 3:41:28 PM