When I see the "he's human" perspective equally applied to conservatives, maybe I'll buy it.

8/8/2008 4:41:35 PM

^ that argument doesn't work when you're borking underage males, and/or spend your life working to oppress a group, only to be a member of that group yourself.

8/8/2008 4:43:37 PM

Quote :

"Imagine the kind of personality that spends a majority of their life trying to rule other people, who then feels they should take the next step and rule the most powerful country on the planet. It's not your meek little "nice guy." As amiable as Obama (or Bush for that matter) comes off as being, I don't know anyone that had a coke habit that is not at least a little-bit insane."

Very well stated. It's definitely not an office that's about civil-service anymore.

Despite being a rabid lover of the constitution, I somehow doubt that our founding fathers were nearly as gracious and noble as we've been taught.

8/8/2008 4:44:21 PM

its been the subject of scientific study... leaders tend to be more sexually promiscuous than average folks. theres some connection in the brain.

if i cared enough i'd look for links.

8/8/2008 4:47:17 PM

^ you don't need a study, it's an intuitive concept, I think.

Although, to be clear, it doesn't excuse them.

8/8/2008 4:48:24 PM

That was one of the first big campaigns I was with. I shook the mans hand. I still value the ideals the campaign stood for, but its still hard not to feel wounded by hearing news like this.

8/8/2008 4:49:12 PM

Screwing around on his sick wife.....what a bastard.

8/8/2008 5:02:27 PM

gg on waiting till the first day of the olympics to put this out there. go usa

8/8/2008 5:28:22 PM

story was broken last october?

8/8/2008 5:30:46 PM

Disappointing. I feel the most for Mrs. Edwards.

8/8/2008 5:32:11 PM

Quote :

"story was broken last october?"

Exactly, he had a full your to fess up but did it today.

This "he's only human" or "it is typical of powerful positions" bit is complete horseshit. People definitely don't defend a police officer or soldier who takes excessive force too far because "it is part of their nature being in an enforcement position" or whatever. I don't care if 1 in 4 cheat.... 1 in 4 in this country are clearly selfish dipshits.

8/8/2008 5:44:09 PM

finally some fucking vindication...4 years i tell people this guy is "pond scum" and 4 years i wait for people to realize....god i hate this fucker...feel sorry for the people that supported/worked for him

8/8/2008 6:01:45 PM

i herd obama like white wimmen too

8/8/2008 6:15:45 PM

The woman he was supposedly fucking is pretty hot if its any consolation.

8/8/2008 8:06:25 PM

as if we needed more proof that edwards is a piece of shit

8/8/2008 8:08:11 PM

What a piece of shit. He should be McCain's veep. Apparently they have a lot more in common than I'd previously thought.




Holy shit....


SOCKS WAS RIGHT.

8/8/2008 8:11:44 PM

i mean his wife had cancer and stuff and hes cheating, thats pretty low even for a demoncrat

8/8/2008 8:13:39 PM

I know, that seems to a Republican thing to do... like when ex-Speaker of the House Newt Gingrich filed for divorce when his wife was in the hospital battling cancer.

8/8/2008 9:02:50 PM

demoncrat

clever

8/8/2008 9:04:42 PM

What a pathetic jerk. I know, I know.."All Politicians Lie" "He's Only Human" but this guy is such a tool. ..with that smug expression telling me what's moral and proper.

I feel sorry for good-hearted people like Supplanter who put his faith in Edwards...and for all the people who sent him campaign money that he used to set up his non-cancer-ridden woman in a fake cushy campaign job.

Hopefully now, he will go away and I won't have to listen to him making me feel guilty.

More evidence that we shouldn't be giving so much power to weak-willed humans. The founders were so wise in setting up a very limited gov't. Sad that we've turned it into the muck it is today.

8/8/2008 9:52:57 PM

edwards didnt campaign on morality issues

so his cheating was not hypocritical per his politics -- unlike the waves cheating, closeted-homosexual, pedophilic and meth-smoking republican moralists of late

anyhow, the man lost his son and is losign his wife to cancer. i cant even comprehend how devastating that is.

sorry if i dont' rush to crucify the man based on a moment of weakness and poor judgment in his personal life.

get that? i said, "In His Personal Life"

fuck all the rest of you hypocrites. who here knows about life and death?

8/8/2008 10:04:02 PM

so didnt lunak work for him? i hope she didnt like work for him voluntarily

8/8/2008 10:07:06 PM

i hope you go out and do your titty jiggling thing at Jackpot tonight. be sure to wear some outfit your moms bought for you at TJ Maxx

8/8/2008 10:13:11 PM

8/8/2008 10:14:33 PM

8/8/2008 10:21:00 PM

they are saying his political career is "now over"

but that happened in 2004

8/9/2008 12:07:44 AM

that chick is not really that hot, shes better than monica blue dress, but she aint hot

8/9/2008 12:19:09 AM

^^lol for real

8/9/2008 12:23:03 AM

that cnn picture is horrible

she doesn't look too bad here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G15nrlSO5hw

8/9/2008 12:27:42 AM

she seems like the campaign passalong

8/9/2008 12:33:56 AM

uhhh...why are you guys acting so surprised and/or disgusted? Are you surprised when an athlete cheats on his wife? Of course not. These guys are no different. They all do it. Only difference between the liberals and conservatives is that half the conservatives are undercover homos banging other dudes

8/9/2008 1:30:41 AM

P.P.S.

THE BABY IS NOT HIS!!!

P.S.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G15nrlSO5hw <--- if i was a woman and another woman was talking about my husband like that, i would totally suspect an affair, and hire a PI to find out.

*********************************

this is a very good read:

http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/08/08/america/edwards.php

Quote :

"The National Enquirer first reported on the affair in October 2007, and Edwards denied it. "The story is false," he told reporters. "It's completely untrue, ridiculous." He professed his love for his wife, Elizabeth, who had an incurable form of cancer, saying, "I've been in love with the same woman for 30-plus years and as anybody who's been around us knows, she's an extraordinary human being, warm, loving, beautiful, sexy and as good a person as I have ever known. So the story's just false.""

Quote :

"In 2006, Edwards' political action committee paid $100,000 in a four-month span to a newly formed firm run by Hunter, who directed the production of just four Web videos, one a mere 2½ minutes long. The payments from Edwards's One America Committee to Midline Groove Productions started July 5, 2006, five days after Hunter incorporated the firm in Delaware."

let's see... $10,000 for the videos, and $90,000 as payment for sex?

Quote :

""I want to see our party lead on the great moral issues - yes, me a Democrat using that word - the great moral issues that face our country," Edwards tells the crowd. "If we want to live in a moral, honest just America and if we want to live in a moral and just world, we can't wait for somebody else to do it. We have to do it.""

ok....


[Edited on August 9, 2008 at 7:31 AM. Reason : ]

8/9/2008 7:23:00 AM

Here is a great commentary on the traditional media with this story.

Quote :

"With that admission, the illusion that traditional print and broadcast news organizations can establish the limits of acceptable political journalism joined the passenger pigeon on the roster of extinct Americana."

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/la-oe-newrutten9-2008aug09,0,3175773.column

Since Joe seems to be sticking to his idea that edwards wasnt a hypocrit, so its not that bad line:

Quote :

" Finally, throughout his political career, Edwards has made his marriage a centerpiece of his campaigns. "

Thats gotta sting a bit.

8/9/2008 9:16:40 AM

I do think it's funny that the same people that sided with Ann Coulter in calling his wife a bitch, among other things, think it's so horrible that he cheated on her. I call it political opportunism.


He was trash for cheating on her, but I'm for getting the government/media/everyone out of peoples bedrooms. It's part of the reason I love pointing out the hypocrisy of gay, child molesting, republican senators. They wouldn't have so far to fall if they didn't set themselves up so high (same with Edwards in this case).

8/9/2008 9:32:22 AM

An interesting point of view, one which I have mixed feelings about, is that if he did indeed tell Elizabeth about the affair in 2006, how could she have, in good conscience, supported his candidacy for the president in 2008? Anybody who knew this affair had taken place had a responsibility, at the very least, to keep him from becoming a presidential nominee. Had he taken the nomination, this would have guaranteed McCain a victory--which is pretty hilarious, since McCain did basically the same thing to his first wife as well.

8/9/2008 10:50:15 AM

I think the lesson here is the candid look into a politician's priorities.

Nothing surprising, unfortunately.

8/9/2008 11:09:13 AM

To me, it's not just another prominent politician being a hypocrite; it's another prominent CHRISTIAN being a hypocrite.

8/9/2008 11:22:24 AM

Quote :

"its been the subject of scientific study... leaders tend to be more sexually promiscuous than average folks. theres some connection in the brain. "

ha, i knew i'm destined to be a Congressman/Senator someday!



as far as Edwards, sure, he's been through a lot, but he's been a colossal douchebag even by politician standards for a long, long time...this doesn't surprise me in the least.

[Edited on August 9, 2008 at 11:39 AM. Reason : ^ i think he plays up the religion card because he's a political opportunist.]

8/9/2008 11:38:58 AM

Quote :

"It's part of the reason I love pointing out the hypocrisy of gay, child molesting, republican senators. They wouldn't have so far to fall if they didn't set themselves up so high (same with Edwards in this case)."

It's not hypocrisy. Hypocrisy is saying you believe one thing but actually believing something different.

In the case of these gay Republican senators, they probably still believe that being gay is wrong -- so they aren't hypocrites. What they're "guilty" of is weakness -- the inability to act consistently according to one's stated beliefs. The Bible quite correctly refers to this problem as "temptation" and even more correctly characterizes it as intrinsic to all human beings.

At least in that light -- within reason -- I don't fault the Larry Craigs of the world. I fault him more for the harm he did to his family and also for his failure to admit to the incident sooner.

In the case of John Edwards I suppose the charitable thing to do is to accept his "I'm only human" excuse. There is precedent for it. Unfortunately he has always played very much like a political tin man, jumping from a first term senator to a VP candidate to a Presidential candidate again in a very short time -- all while playing as a tireless advocate for the impoverished.

He lacks the surface credibility to get by with the "weakness" excuse. Especially considering that in a way he not only dishonored his wife in public but also his deceased son to whom he dedicated much of his public life.

There are limits to the weakness excuse. Faustian is more like it.

8/9/2008 3:55:06 PM

Quote :

"To me, it's not just another prominent politician being a hypocrite; it's another prominent CHRISTIAN being a hypocrite."

It wouldn't be nearly as bad if he were an atheist, pagan, or muslim right?

PEOPLE are hypocrites.

8/9/2008 4:15:06 PM

Quote :

"It wouldn't be nearly as bad if he were an atheist, pagan, or muslim right? PEOPLE are hypocrites. "

truth itt

8/9/2008 4:17:38 PM

lol edwards is hardly a prominent christian anyways imo

8/9/2008 4:27:12 PM

Quote :

"It's not hypocrisy. Hypocrisy is saying you believe one thing but actually believing something different."

It would appear that your definition of hypocrisy is far narrower in scope than most people's (and most dictionaries').

8/9/2008 4:33:03 PM

Quote :

"its been the subject of scientific study... leaders tend to be more sexually promiscuous than average folks. theres some connection in the brain. if i cared enough i'd look for links."

It's just typical Alpha Male behavior. Look at leaders throughout history.

8/9/2008 10:59:00 PM

what's far more illuminating is the fact that the U.S. is the only First-World country that gives two shits about who their leaders are having sex with.

8/9/2008 11:08:06 PM

Quote :

" It would appear that your definition of hypocrisy is far narrower in scope than most people's (and most dictionaries')."

The definitive dictionary of the English language is the Oxford English Dictionary (OED) and it defines a hypocrite solely as:

Quote :

"One who falsely professes to be virtuously or religiously inclined; one who pretends to have feelings or beliefs of a higher order than his real ones; hence generally, a dissembler, pretender."

Even the more widely available dictionary.com definition is:

Quote :

"a person who pretends to have virtues, moral or religious beliefs, principles, etc., that he or she does not actually possess, esp. a person whose actions belie stated beliefs."

No real contest here on what's the right definition. It's true that people often throw the term about for their own reasons -- but in reality that merely waters down the actual purpose of the word which is about the falsity of one's internal belief as opposed to mere bad behavior. Of course the latter clause about "especially a person whose actions belie ..." (in the non-authoritative version) is operative in the second definition; but an intellectually honest approach doesn't take that to mean that all people who act against their own beliefs are hypocrites (it's not implied by the definition, only taken as an aside).

Plenty of people act against their own internal beliefs because maintaining a rigid system of morality in practice is very hard. They may hold those beliefs and their actions in practice against them are failings, human weakness, etc. We are all confronted with conflicts between what we believe and the circumstances of our lives. For someone like Larry Craig that may be between his spirituality and his innate sexual drive. That is a very tough conflict to overcome (and if you've ever grown up both religious and gay, you'd understand).

I'm not trying to excuse the actions of an individual, I'm just saying that crying hypocrisy is an oversimplification and doesn't do justice to the situation. We need people who are moral crusaders in spite of their own personal failings. We cannot expect our leaders to be perfectly consistent, and sexual morality is particularly tough for individuals to deal with.

I just think Larry Craig's situation was objectively less extreme than John Edwards's. In the former case, the man wrestled -- I believe -- with an internal conflict between innate sexuality, inborn, and his spirituality and established life. In Edwards's, he wrestled with a conflict between his established life and loyalties, and -- by his own admission -- unbridled ambition and narcissism (the latter being his own term). The life of John Edwards was a Faustian bargain; he took on a zealous crusade for the presidency in exchange for the honor of his deathly-ill wife and his deceased son.

8/10/2008 6:03:07 AM

Quote :

"It's just typical Alpha Male behavior"

yep. i was gonna say the same thing.

the other factor is that leadership is also a learned behavior, and that extends to leading women into the sack, for lack of better wording.

(VOTE DUKE 2024)

_____________________________________________

^

I will agree that you are technically correct, and that certainly counts for something. On the other hand, I don't think it's really a stretch at all to label Edwards, or certainly Larry Craig, as a hypocrite.

[Edited on August 10, 2008 at 11:12 AM. Reason : asdfasd]

8/10/2008 11:07:08 AM

I mean I guess we could get into a big argument about what the "real" definition of hypocrisy is, as if such a thing existed, but regardless of what you call it, whether that's weakness, hypocrisy, or something else, it doesn't change what happened. You've got a guy who's spent his whole career discriminating against homosexuals that is found to be pursuing sex in a public area with a complete stranger. You've got a guy talking about family values who cheated on his wife. As has been said in this thread numerous times, you'd be hard pressed to find a president, or even a presidential candidate, without the personal characteristics that would at least make him susceptible to these kinds of deviations.

It certainly can be the case that the net effect these people have on our society and the world at large can, in the end, work out in their favor. Al Gore flies around in a jet and lives in a mansion, but I'm sure that the net reduction he has had on C02 emissions has been substantial. Maybe Larry Craig has engaged in sexual intercourse with strange men in public bathrooms, but due to his hard work to make life worse for gay people, the net effect was in his favor.

I guess what I'm getting at is that it doesn't make this any less fucked up. And I have a hard time taking my moral marching orders from people who appear to be far more amoral by their own standards than I, myself, am.


Oh, and because it's bugging me, and I say this knowing it has no real bearing on the conversation, "One who falsely professes to be virtuously...inclined" pretty much means, to me, that a person says he or she does not fuck strangers in bathrooms, cheat on one's wife, what have you, while doing the opposite (hence "falsely"). But whatever. INTERNET FIGHT!!!

8/10/2008 11:38:49 AM

edwards is the definition of sleezeball politician. He has never ever been fucking relevent and any attention given to this is a complete fucking waste of time.

8/10/2008 12:01:18 PM

set em up

8/10/2008 1:13:54 PM