http://www.technicianonline.com/multimedia/krispy_kreme_challenge_2009_video-1.1359812

2/9/2009 1:14:17 AM

This isn't good. I think the rankings in SetupEvents are being driven by GunTime, not ChipTime.

This is causing the 3rd place women's challenger to actually be 1st.

Can anyone else confirm? Or do I have my understand of GunTime / ChipTime incorrect?

2/9/2009 3:29:46 PM

darg. is the mens still down?

2/9/2009 3:41:50 PM

^^ for "real races", gun time is the one that counts when declaring winners and rank. The chip time is, of course, more accurate, but mostly for historical reasons, the major races will still use gun time to determine the final standings. There are arguments both ways, but race organizers will tell you that if it really matters "that much" to you or if the difference ends up determining who is on the podium, then you should have been at the front of the pack on the starting line anyway.

2/9/2009 4:05:46 PM

4^ That video was the best of all media so far.

2/9/2009 6:51:36 PM

This challenge might not exist next year:
http://www.newraleigh.com/articles/archive/wtf-krispy-kreme-to-close/

Although New Raleigh likes to drum up bs at times so no idea how accurate this is. Would suck big time if it were true though.

2/9/2009 7:04:26 PM

^ It sounds like the only thing they're basing that on is the fact that their stock is going down.

2/9/2009 7:19:42 PM

I saw a piece last night they did on the local news here in Beaumont, TX.

It sure has grown since I participated (2006)

2/9/2009 7:41:39 PM

@agentlion -- interesting. can you help explain this to me more? I'm not a racer. I thought the point of recording the time that a racer initially crosses the start-line and then crosses the finish-line was to remove the effect of large-crowds for timing purposes. this isn't done even for real races? what about circumstances in which the 'competitive pack' could be 20 rows deep, and that the time difference for the 8th row racer and the 1st row racer during the start was enough to cause a difference in the final rankings? That 8th row racer, despite completing the actual start-to-finish distance in the shortest time, would be denied the 1st place award? Because indeed, often seconds can separate top finishers.

This is very interesting for me to hear. Odd.

[Edited on February 9, 2009 at 8:50 PM. Reason : .]

2/9/2009 8:49:35 PM

He explained it pretty clearly in his post I thought. If you are going to be competetive, you should be up at the front of the pack. Consider a runner that knows he can win the marathon (or 10k even) at a sizable but not national event. What if he waited until most of the crowd cleared out (such that he wouldn't have to dodge and weave much at all) and then he decided to run his race. Someone at the front of the pack might break away and then ease up when they didn't have anyone around them. Then this guy strolls in a long time after the lead pack finishes with a time that bests them. How could they know that guy was back there?

2/9/2009 8:59:33 PM

^^ yeah, i'm not going to try to justify it one way or another. i'm just telling you the way it is.
If you want to see arguments on both sides, just try http://letmegooglethatforyou.com/?q=chip+time+vs+gun+time

2/9/2009 9:28:21 PM

big races will ask you for your pace time when you register and they'll assign you a corral

everyone has a chip timer but this allows for the more serious competitors to be up front and not have to worry about dodging other people or about their time. they can know their finish time almost instantly when they cross

when i did my half marathon, i didnt actually get to the start line until 30min after the race started bc there were so many people but my chip worked and reported my actual running time since it didnt activate until i crossed the line. results were up the next day but im guessing that that kind of technology is expensive and not affordable to the KK sized run?

2/9/2009 9:36:59 PM

^ they did use chip timing this year for the KK Challenge, and the results were up by saturday afternoon. That's why we're having this chip-time vs. gun-time discussion

2/9/2009 10:11:16 PM

KKC JUST MENTIONED ON KEITH OLBERMANNS THE COUNTDOWN

[Edited on February 9, 2009 at 10:31 PM. Reason : .]

2/9/2009 10:30:55 PM

awesome - what'd he say

2/9/2009 10:33:59 PM

lol don't even know. probably using NBC affiliate footage. my roommate just shouted and i ran over to see the last few seconds. most likely the Oddball section.

i'm so amazed that it's actually grown to receive this kind of attention, and to have helped grow it during its early years is weirdly satisfying. i never thought i'd end up doing something like this.

2/9/2009 10:37:06 PM

its really too bad that this event has such a rinkydink website

2/9/2009 10:40:24 PM

The website really would be a great tool for the future if they invested some time and effort into it. Its too bad my talks with them kinda fell through the cracks.

2/9/2009 11:14:18 PM

absolutely. the #1 thing i would change immediately is to have a competent webmaster who knows social media to join the core team. the website re-building needs to start now, not 4 months before the next event.

2/10/2009 12:59:25 AM

I'd totally manage their website free and even provide them free hosting on my server. Who should I contact?

Wow their website does suck; no page title's... seriously?! Also, what happened to the old logo? Not that I don't like the new one of the running doughnut guy, but well actually I'm undecided:



[Edited on February 10, 2009 at 7:42 AM. Reason : -]

2/10/2009 7:28:56 AM

i think they should use both logos. both look nice and could be used for different applications

2/10/2009 8:47:03 AM

Whomever the organizers are, because god knows they haven't show up here, need to get on the stick with basic communication. Answering emails, having a decent website, and just having a general presence and point of contact is just Business 101. I'd hate to see the KKC die on the vine because of a failure to take care of this stuff.

2/10/2009 10:31:37 AM

^^^ i offered the same thing last year, even was willing to throw in our CMS and build them a registration system for free so they didn't have to deal with outsourcing and paying for it.

Offer is still there if they want it.

2/10/2009 11:13:00 AM

The logos totally do not go together. You need to either use one or the other b/c a logo establishes a 'feel' for an event of place. The old one has a course feel to it. That's perfectly fine, but the second one should not be seen anywhere near it IMHO.

And yeah... they should do something about those organizers. I mean, the company they got to do the registration and chip timing did its job well. The results didn't work on occasion, but I got to see them as quick as I could have asked for and having unique split times constitutes a significant value to me.

I understand that gun time may be used for places of the winners, but some comments:
1.) don't tell everyone to not push at the start b/c it won't matter when... it will.
2.) why don't you tell your fucking announcer of the award ceremony how you're doing places?

and btw, do we have the list of groups? There were several group competitions awards in other years, which we didn't have at all this time. At minimum I would like to see the list of the largest # in whatever groups running/completing.

...oh wait, i'm not done.

The registration process was confusing. Like I said, the contracting company did it's job, the organizers did not. We were going through 2 different sites, had to create an account, and the instructions sucked balls. And when getting the times back I figured out where to get the times before the fucking webmaster did apparently.

Oh, and don't forget about the map. The map on BOTH sites was completely wrong and you gave us registration packets with a new course on it, not even bothering to change the website.

Speaking of registration packets... The brickyard organization was pointless crap. We got a T-shirt and a number handed to us. We still had to pick up the chip timer at the place, the brickyard people couldn't even put the scant stuff they were giving out into the bags, the line was way too long, and those with last names near the front of the alphabet had a short line for no reason! Why the fuck are you even doing brickyard packet pickup!? Have people get their stuff at the race or get your act together. In fact, if i'm not mistaken, I could have avoided the line waiting for my 'packet' by just not registering ahead of time and registering there at the brickyard.

[Edited on February 10, 2009 at 12:52 PM. Reason : ]

2/10/2009 12:40:17 PM

ECU is finally joining in the fun (I've been trying to get them to do it for like 2 years) since they have a KK right near campus.

http://www.donutsfordiabetes.com/index.php

course is shorter, but you gotta run straight back up college hill....that sucks. I'm sure the first year will be a little rough, lets see how it works out for them.

2/10/2009 2:20:39 PM

Of course, this is all assuming that KK won't go under this year, and there will actually be a Krispy Kreme in 2010

2/10/2009 4:11:51 PM

^^Why is the title of the page Krispy Creme Challenge?

2/10/2009 5:28:00 PM

Hell if I know.

I mean it is modeled after the krispy kreme challenge. You can even see in the content its called the "greenville krispy kreme challenge". Why they bought a URL with a totally different name is beyond me.

2/10/2009 5:34:13 PM

They just call it Krispy Kreme in one place and Krispy Creme in another. I think somebody forgot to proof the title.

2/10/2009 5:50:59 PM

oh I see what you're saying.

the whole site is a little lacking, bad spelling doesn't surprise me.

2/10/2009 6:31:46 PM

well i did end up puking but only that night after the KKC

it was likely my extreme diet leading up to the event that caused it but man...felt like death over sunday/monday...back to normal today

glad I won't be eating donuts again for a year

2/10/2009 8:53:16 PM

thats not exactly what KK wants to hear

2/10/2009 10:29:53 PM

39:xx, finished and kept down all the rings, got in the 80s overall .

I didn't feel the least bit tired when I finished, and I took a little trip down a sidestreet to properly dispose of my cup in a trashcan which lost me a few seconds. Spent lots of energy heckeling and cheering on fellow competitors too (yelled at spectators and did the whole "cheer for me" arm raise. Next year I'm going to try for a sub-35 if it's the same course. I started on the front line 3 people away from the ESPN reporter and he mentioned it would be broadcast the 22nd.

Overall I thought that they did a great job organizing the event, although I know it got very congested for people behind me.

2/10/2009 11:47:51 PM

@DPK @nacstate @JohnnySwank

i would love for you guys to get involved...you have real passion here and a skillset they so desperately need.

@mrfrog no idea on list of groups. don't know about the MAP mixup or not. the Raleigh PD is pretty clear though (I thought) on what roads they are going to close down, unless it was changed at the last minute for some reason. but the organizers aren't up to date on keeping the website current, so that could have been an issue. Doing chip-timing was absolutely going to cause problems with check-in. That was a big reason we didn't implement it in 2007. Pre-race checkin (where we give their t-shirt, race #, and info sheet) was a brilliant suggestion by my suitemate Deanna that really helped us get people pre-processed instead of doing it the morning of. I remember back in 2006 people waited 2 hours in the cold while we tried to process people the day of. Chip timing would ruin that, unless you shut down registration WELL in advance. But as I've shown here:
http://www.saketvora.com/kkc/kkc_registrants_vs_time_comparison.pdf

we get a sizable # of registrations in the last 3 days (hence why we plead plead plead for people to register early, heh).

Frankly, I'm more and more in favor of just scrapping chip timing. Track the top 10 finishers, put up a giant XC clock and tell people to track their own times if they care so much about it. HELLUVA less expensive too -- at least a few grand more for the Children's Hospital. I'd rather see all the funny costumes and antics anyway. More in line with the spirit of the race. just my opinion though.

@nacstate -- awesome to see it get started at ECU. best of luck with it! I'll might try to get someone here at Stanford to start one too...

2/11/2009 1:39:57 AM

^ that brings back to mind some more opinions I have of the race:

* I seriously think it should cost more. Some people aren't running b/c they cap registration (or just say they do). So the KKC is over capacity and the Children's Hospital isn't getting the funds from the people turned down. I like the chip timing, I LOVE getting the stats after the race. But I'm a serious runner/geek and have different wants from the event than you do. Again, by having such a low cost I think they are not satisfying the needs of both their philanthropy and prospective participants to the best of the race's potential.
* I also think they should have costume awards. People came out with some funny stuff for the 09 race, but if it was more actively encouraged I think we could see much more quality outfits.

I think the pre race check in makes sense, I just don't think it was handled well this time. I want to see more volunteers, more tables, and better organization when people are picking up their stuff on the brickyard. A motivated group of organizers could accomplish a lot with the packet pickup.

2/11/2009 11:25:14 AM

KKC at ECU is next weekend. They're getting a lot of press out there too.

http://www.theeastcarolinian.com/media/storage/paper915/news/2009/02/19/News/Krispy.Kreme.Challenge.Comes.To.Ecu-3636982.shtml

Quote :

"On Feb. 28, the First Annual Greenville Krispy Kreme Challenge supporting the Juvenile Diabetes Research Foundation (JDRF) will take place right here on ECU's campus. The challenge originated in 2004 at North Carolina State University in Raleigh as a bet between friends and has continued to be a student-operated event benefiting the N.C. Children's Hospital. At N.C. State's challenge, the participant must run two miles from the N.C. State bell tower to Krispy Kreme located on Peace Street in Raleigh, eat a dozen donuts and then run back all in one hour. Last year the race had over 3,000 runners. This year, ECU decided to bring the run to Greenville to raise money for JDRF and to find a cure for Type 1 diabetes. "The idea isn't to copy them," said Katherine Meyer, public relations chair for Phi Sigma Pi. "It's to take a great idea and do it in Greenville as well." Runners will start at the commuter lot on the bottom of College Hill Drive and run a one and a half mile loop to Krispy Kreme where they will attempt to eat the entire dozen, a volunteer will mark the amount actually eaten. Those who finish and eat the most donuts will win. There will be a top overall male and female plus top male and female in each age group. The age groups are 15 or younger, 16-19, 20-29, 30-39, 40-49, 50-59 and 60+. This year, Phi Sigma Phi National Honor Fraternity teamed up with Ben's Buddies, the JDRF family team of Annette Peery whose son Ben has Type 1 diabetes. "We want to increase awareness about JDRF and Type 1 diabetes and educate people on Type 1 and how it's different from Type 2," said Peery. "These kids can eat sugar like anyone else as long as they do so in moderation." According to the American Diabetes Association, Type 1 diabetes is usually diagnosed in children and young adults. Type 1 diabetics do not produce insulin, a hormone that is needed to convert sugar, starches and other food into energy, and diabetics must take insulin injections multiple times a day. In Type 2 diabetes, the most common form of diabetes, the body either does not produce enough insulin or the cells ignore the insulin. "The event is really about awareness and education," Peery said. Phi Sigma Pi currently has a table set up in Wright Place where interested students can register for the run and learn more about Type 1 diabetes. Registration for the event is $20 and money raised will benefit JDRF. "We're hoping for about 100 people," Peery said. "If we can exceed that that's wonderful." Registration and check-in begins at 7 a.m. at the ECU Commuter Lot on College Hill Drive. For more information students can visit donutsfordiabetes.com."

[Edited on February 19, 2009 at 11:13 PM. Reason : wtf link]

2/19/2009 11:11:39 PM

Quote :

""These kids can eat sugar like anyone else as long as they do so in moderation.""

moderation =/= pounding 1 dozen KK doughnuts

they need to make damn sure not to encourage people with DM type 1 to participate. it would take a ridiculous amount of insulin to balance out a dozen doughnuts. and there's no way you could pre-dose because running the first leg might bottom you out before you even got to KK.

2/19/2009 11:17:09 PM

Quote :

""The idea isn't to copy them," said Katherine Meyer, public relations chair for Phi Sigma Pi. "It's to take a great idea and do it in Greenville as well.""

I would rather them put their efforts into bringing people to Raleigh...I bet we could get a huge ECU pull if instead of spending money ont heir own event, they bussed people to ours.

2/19/2009 11:26:30 PM

I'm pretty sure the raleigh one is about tapped out without a major change in how its run. Its hard enough as it is to do the number of people they have, it can't just keep growing and growing.

I'd rather see it grow to any campus that has a KK nearby. That would actually be cool. Of course the NCSU one would always be the original. As long as any subsequent one pays homage to the history of the event, then maybe kids who participate in the local one would pilgrimage to NCSU to run in here.

Besides, it never hurts to raise money for a good cause.

2/19/2009 11:34:31 PM

Quote :

"The idea isn't to copy them," said Katherine Meyer, public relations chair for Phi Sigma Pi. "It's to take a great idea and do it in Greenville as well."

This woman should go into politics

2/20/2009 7:18:06 AM

So what happens if KK goes out of business this year?

2/20/2009 8:02:20 AM

^^ Haha yeah I got a good laugh out of that as well.

2/20/2009 8:57:46 AM

^^

Replace with "Roast Grill Challenge" -- run down to The Roast Grill, eat a dozen burnt hot dogs, get back to the Bell Tower?

2/20/2009 9:58:37 AM

Taco Bell Challenge, run to the one on western, down 12 chalupas, run back, shit your pants

2/20/2009 5:00:33 PM

Has this been on ESPN yet? Or is a story even going to be aired?

2/20/2009 5:19:43 PM

22nd i believe, likely one of those 5min excerpts at the end of sportcenter or something on sunday morning

2/20/2009 5:28:54 PM

See page 3:

Quote :

"one of my friends said it won't be shown until the 22nd, but i have no idea if there is any truth to that. "

and the post after that

2/20/2009 5:29:06 PM

Thanks!

2/20/2009 5:41:34 PM

i am all for seeing more campuses try fun, engaging ways to support good causes. it doesn't always have to be unhealthy eating contests either. Nourish International at UNC saw huge success with their Hold'em for Hunger poker tournament...they got insane prizes donated and raised a ton of money.

2/20/2009 6:54:52 PM

Anybody with a tuner card or similar setup planning to record this ESPN segment?

2/20/2009 8:28:09 PM