Quote :

"why would joffrey do it? he knew about bran catching his mother and uncle having sex, or he knew that his uncle pushed him out of a window and wanted to cover it up? what motive would joffrey have? i certainly don't remember that from ASOS"

Early on I thought Jaime or Cersei, but by ASOS my money was on Joffrey and that seemed to be the conclusion online as well. I saw multiple discussions on this year ago, some longer than this, but this is from The Citadel which is basically considered a canon site. There never was a confession outright, but this is what they say and it basically sums up the impression I got while reading as well:

Quote :

"5.1. WHO TRIED TO KILL BRAN? Evidence revealed in A Storm of Swords points squarely at Joffrey as the instigator. At the queen’s breakfast he revealed, "... I am no stranger to Valyrian steel." (III: 663) Tyrion, suspicious of that statement, suggests that he will give a Valyrian steel dagger with a dragonbone hilt as a gift to Joffrey. Joffrey’s reply is awkward: "Joff gave him a sharp look. ‘You ... yes, a dagger to match my sword, good.’ He nodded. ‘A ... a gold hilt with rubies in it. Dragonbone is too plain.’" (III: 664) Finally, Jaime questions Cersei about the attempt on Bran. She reveals that Robert said in Joffrey’s hearing that it’d be a kindness to end the boy’s misery, but that they were all too weak. Jaime concludes that Joffrey, eager for his father’s attention, may have decided to prove that he was capable of doing it (III: 823)."

The show didn't emphasize this much, but the books emphasized how much Joffrey felt like he needed to impress Robert or win his respect. That, plus the comment about ending the boy's misery, and the text and context clues that Tyrion and Jaime both believed it was Joffrey was enough for me and that seems to be the common conclusion.

[Edited on May 6, 2013 at 10:01 PM. Reason : ]

5/6/2013 10:00:19 PM

Quote :

"Where da fuq did you read that?"

Many-Faced God is the Stranger: A Feast for Crows - Chapter 34
The Stranger is The Great Other, antigod of the Red god: Not specifically in the books, but R'hllor is the god of fire, life, and light; while the Great Other and The Stranger are both the god of death and darkness.
The history of the Many-Faced God: A Feast for Crows - Chapter 34

5/6/2013 10:53:17 PM

I'm gonna laugh so hard when the Red Wedding doesn't happen and Robb gains House Frey's support in the war.

5/7/2013 12:13:02 AM

Television audiences are finicky, I don't see them suddenly caring about the Dorne characters from Book 4. I see Lady Stark dying, but not Rob. Likewise, I see Ygritte not being killed by Jon Snow

5/7/2013 12:18:02 AM

You guys really think they could carry on the show without killing Robb? Or were you joking? I just can't imagine how much they would have to change to keep Robb alive, it would change the situation in Westeros too much. I can't imagine any scenario in which Robb survives the RW.

5/7/2013 5:29:25 AM

Quote :

"why would joffrey do it?"

I preface this by saying that it doesn't prove Joffrey did it and I personally think Cersei was lying to Jaime.

One night while drunk after Bran's fall, King Robert mentions that the boy should just be put out of his misery, Jaime concludes that Joffrey acts on this statement to gain approval from his father.

[Edited on May 7, 2013 at 6:14 AM. Reason : .]

5/7/2013 5:59:15 AM

Quote :

" I'm gonna laugh so hard when the Red Wedding doesn't happen and Robb gains House Frey's support in the war."

The show runners have already said in multiple interviews that it is happening this season

5/7/2013 6:27:38 AM

^ Episode 9 this season

Quote :

"I don't see them suddenly caring about the Dorne characters from Book 4"

seriously? they're one of the more interesting groups later on

at least as far as Red Viper and the Sand Snakes go

[Edited on May 7, 2013 at 8:33 AM. Reason : .]

5/7/2013 8:31:04 AM

Thank god I read the books.

My poor fiancee (shitty memory to begin with), is having trouble keeping up with the characters. While we're watching the show I have to remind her who some people are and their significance (ie: Gendry being Robert's bastard and Melisandre wanting "King's blood"). I can't imagine what's going to happen when they introduce the peeps from Dorne. I remember flying through the books and I had to keep reminding myself that Martell /= Tyrell.

5/7/2013 8:44:31 AM

Quote :

"I'm gonna laugh so hard when the Red Wedding doesn't happen and Robb gains House Frey's support in the war."

Even though they were cryptic about it, they talked about the Red Wedding this season from pretty early on in filming. And then later, Winter Is Coming confirmed that it was in this season, episode 9. This was back before the season started. It's definitely in this season. Now, whether they take huge liberties with it, who knows, but an eye-witness account from an extra (who apparently hadn't read the books?) said that at the day of filming there were 2 people killed and one's head was switched with an ox (it was speculated that they were either using this ox as a stand-in before CGI for a wolf or he just didn't know about direwolves) but he couldn't say more than that. George Martin also said he just couldn't write that episode because it was too disturbing for him the first time around.

To me, all signs point to not pandering to a finicky TV audience. Not 100%, but I'd be surprised if that's a twist they pull this season. They did say there would be a couple twists that would surprise the book readers, but I just can't imagine that being it. I would not be surprised if they CONSIDERED it, but I hope they wouldn't be that scared of the audience.

[Edited on May 7, 2013 at 9:36 AM. Reason : ]

5/7/2013 9:22:52 AM

I'm definitely going to cry during/after that episode

5/7/2013 9:29:25 AM

at least i don't have a book to throw down this time

5/7/2013 9:30:53 AM

Better than throwing down the iPad or kindle

5/7/2013 9:47:06 AM

I was reading in a coffee shop when I got to that part. I gave a very loud "what the fuck!??" and drew plenty of looks.

5/7/2013 10:53:10 AM

I just remember thinking it was a dream or something, but it comes so suddenly. Plus it's at the beginning of the chapter, and only what like 2/3 of the way through the book? Usually books save that sort of thing for near the end. I didn't believe it had actually happened until I finished the chapter. Then I raged at anyone and everyone around me.

The crazy thing is Robb wasn't nearly as prominent in the books as he is in the show; I can't imagine what it's going to be like for the few avid show-watchers who don't know what's coming.

5/7/2013 1:13:45 PM

it's pretty F-ing devastating. i feel stressed just thinking about it.

5/7/2013 2:21:13 PM

i, for one, loved the red wedding. it was mostly spoiled for me, at least who was lost, but i thought it was awesome. honestly i was more taken aback by what happened to Joffrey

5/7/2013 2:31:28 PM

i have this horrible habit of reading all there is to know on the internet about a series i'm reading before i've actually finished it, so i knew all that was going to happen. i really need to stop that. though i was surprised when dany attacked the slave masters in astapor. didn't know about that.

[Edited on May 7, 2013 at 2:34 PM. Reason : ]

5/7/2013 2:34:01 PM

I was surprised Joffrey didn't get killed earlier. He was such a weak character and everybody hated him (even his mother towards the end).

I'm looking forward to (yet also a little worried) seeing my fiancee's reaction towards the Red Wedding. She was devastated at Ned Stark's beheading. I don't know how she'll be able to take Rob and Catelyn's deaths.

5/7/2013 2:46:34 PM

Quote :

"i have this horrible habit of reading all there is to know on the internet about a series i'm reading before i've actually finished it"

yup i do the exact same thing. as soon as someone posted "RW" way back when, i had to know what it meant haha. oddly nervous about seeing it in television form.

5/7/2013 10:01:16 PM

http://www.pajiba.com/tv_reviews/10-things-we-learned-from-this-weeks-torturous-episode-of-game-of-thrones-spoiler-whore-and-book-reader-edition.php

5/9/2013 10:13:26 AM

^ Definitely agree with her in that they're making Loras out to be "too gay". He's suppose to be a pretty bad-ass fighter and they're kind of glossing over that.

I also think she missed the undertones in the Cersei/Tyrion conversation about her having him killed. To me, it looked like Tyrion was baiting her a bit. As if he knew that she wouldn't admit it so he was like, "Oh! So Joffrey had this done." Just to lead her to believe that he fell for it.

I think he knew that she wasn't going to confess.

[Edited on May 9, 2013 at 11:58 AM. Reason : .]

5/9/2013 11:56:46 AM

yeah Loras' character has been pretty terrible to be honest compared to the books. Sure he was a bit of a pretty-boy but he was still supposed to be an excellent fighter. The guy seems unathletic and looks like Arya could beat him up

Bronn on the other hand is a character who has been much better on the show than in the books. He was cool in the books, but his character has been better on screen for sure.

5/9/2013 1:32:02 PM

I think was always described as being pretty small/lithe. Garlan Tyrell had to wear Renly's armor in the Battle of Backwater because it was too big for Loras. But yeah, you definitely don't ever get the sense that he's some great warrior from the show.

5/9/2013 1:36:53 PM

^^^no, she wrote that he's portrayed as too stereotypically gay

not "too gay"

that said, I actually don't mind him being into fashion: in the books he makes sure to dress impeccably for every occasion, even when he's jousting

but it'd be good to see him fighting someone again... although they've got too many storylines going on to devote a lot of time to Loras anyhow

[Edited on May 9, 2013 at 1:50 PM. Reason : .]

5/9/2013 1:50:42 PM

He also isn't really that important unless this dragonstone siege works out more interestingly later.

5/9/2013 2:02:47 PM

Quote :

"Iwan Rheon is kill-ing-it. "

agree! he plays the psycho well

Quote :

" the show is majorly white washing her and painting Joffrey even blacker than the books did. I’m not sure I like that."

i don't mind. i hate joffrey and can't wait for him to die. i guess that means jack gleeson is doing a great job, but i'll never be able to look at him again and feel anything but contempt.

Quote :

" I also don’t like how absolutely evil they’re making Lord Baelish. It’s too soon for him to be this nasty"

agree with this also. the interesting thing about his character in the books is how his motives are slowly revealed throughout the series



[Edited on May 9, 2013 at 2:22 PM. Reason : ]

5/9/2013 2:20:34 PM

Yes, Littlefinger's character has been another disappointment. The TV character is OK, but the book character was awesome. Always trade-offs though with the adaptation of course.

5/9/2013 2:38:34 PM

Quote :

"no, she wrote that he's portrayed as too stereotypically gay not "too gay""

Quote :

"I think was always described as being pretty small/lithe."

I agree...I feel like they picked the right actor...just going a little overboard. Like when he was talking about clothing and fringe whatever at wedding...that was too much. I think they could go a little more Legolas and a little less fairy prince.

5/9/2013 2:41:09 PM

he is very handsome! they got the looks right

5/9/2013 2:48:18 PM

the actor is OK. Loras is definitely slender and the face and stuff works really well.

I just mean that it is much harder to believe in the show that he is one of the best fighters in Westeros. I think because it is on-screen, his personality is a little different than you expect reading the books, plus he had absolutely no muscles when we saw him. Just makes it hard to believe, fighting styles aside (brutes, small and speedy, skillful, tactical, etc.), that he is one of the best warriors when we see people like Bronn, Gregor, The Hound, etc. on a regular basis.

It's just a big sell in the show to believe he is as good of a fighter as he is supposed to be is all. In the books I feel like I remember feeling like he was a skilled tournament knight and a great warrior. In the show, I could see him being a good tournament knight (preppy, skilled, all for show) but getting pounded into the ground fighting someone like Bronn or The Hound.

[Edited on May 9, 2013 at 3:13 PM. Reason : ]

5/9/2013 3:12:48 PM

You guys seem to be forgetting that he won the joust in S1 and he had a pretty intense fight with Brienne, which are pretty much the only two battles he experiences in the book either. I think you guys are atrributing a great deal of skill to him that is not there in the books.

5/9/2013 4:13:43 PM

i've only read the books once but i got the impression he was a skilled fighter, especially in tournaments, but hasn't had a lot of battle experience until now. so he looks good for show but when it comes down to a dirty battle (like when the mountain attacked him) he might not be so ready

5/9/2013 4:30:55 PM

for obvious reasons in the show they've left out him becoming leader of the Kings Guard. A position held by many famous swordsmen.

5/9/2013 4:51:47 PM

When I was reading the books I was cheering when Tywin and Joffery died. Now that they are both being portrayed amazingly in the show, I don't want them to go. Seems like a huge waste of the two best actors on the show.

5/13/2013 10:09:15 AM

http://www.pajiba.com/tv_reviews/10-things-we-learned-from-this-weeks-monstrous-episode-of-game-of-thrones-spoiler-whore-and-book-reader-edition.php

5/16/2013 8:10:10 AM

It looks like greyscale that is on stannis' daughter's face. Can anyone confirm? I don't remember reading that in the books.

5/18/2013 10:34:53 PM

Shireen has greyscale in the books as well

5/18/2013 10:37:25 PM

I think GRRM has too many storylines going on now. I'm going to try to list the ones I remember after reading the last book (spoilers?):

zombie Catelyn
Jon Snow
Bran
Dany
Cerse
Jamie
Tyrion
Arya
Stannis
Theon
Sansa
Littlefinger
Varyis

Did I miss any?

5/19/2013 10:52:40 AM

Do you really not know how to spell the names of the characters, or are you just not trying?

5/19/2013 10:55:29 AM

I'm not really trying. Who did I screw up, Jaime and Varys?

[Edited on May 19, 2013 at 11:56 AM. Reason : And what the fuck does it matter, its good enough to get the point across. ]

5/19/2013 11:52:20 AM

Just saying

5/19/2013 12:09:09 PM

Don't forget about all the crap going on in Dorne with the Sunsnakes.

Asha has her own stuff going on with Stannis.

And I don't know if it counts as a storyline but Victarion (or was it Eulon?) going to try and find Dany.

5/19/2013 1:31:17 PM

Sand Snakes

5/19/2013 2:12:34 PM

Wow I completely forgot about Asha, Eulon and the Sunsnakes.

Its gonna end up being like Lost. I suspect they'll start leaving some of these lines out of the show.

5/19/2013 3:11:30 PM

sand snakes... wtf, have you guys even read the books or are you just trolling?

they're not going to just leave out Red Viper, he's basically the coolest Martell left

not sure if they'll keep Jon Connington and Quentyn Martell

they could use Asha in place of her uncles, that way they don't spend a bunch of on-screen time at the Kingsmoot - but who knows, since they're paying so much attention to Theon now

in any case, the show will open up for some more characters once you kill off Robb, etc too

5/19/2013 3:41:36 PM

I hope they include Victarion, he might be my favorite character in the books right now, and you can't not include Connington and "young Griff" assuming he actually is who we think he is right now.

It's true though, there's just too many storylines going on in the books to put it all in the show. They're going to have to drop stuff that isn't key to important plotlines. Honestly, the stuff with the sandsnakes and most of what is going on in Dorne doesn't seem to matter all that much unless something changes.

Euron crows eye and Victarion seem tied into Dany somehow. It's going to be interesting to see how it all resolves in the next couple of books.

5/19/2013 4:04:55 PM

they still included Balon in the leech scene

so maybe we'll see the Greyjoys soon

though we've got RW next week: I seriously hope Talisa dies, traitor or not (because her being pregnant with Robb's kid is basically unacceptable for the storyline)

5/19/2013 10:26:18 PM

Watch them pull some shit and not kill Joffrey

5/19/2013 10:26:23 PM

I will stop watching if they do that

5/19/2013 10:29:18 PM