http://www.wralsportsfan.com/wainstein-report-could-lead-to-loss-of-jobs-at-unc/14104255/

Quote :

" According to a 136-page report released by former federal prosecutor Kenneth Wainstein Wednesday, athletes at the University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill were specifically steered towards paper classes by academic counselors in a scandal that covered nearly two decades."

10/22/2014 2:33:14 PM

i don't know what all happened but

10/22/2014 2:33:34 PM

Wait what, I thought the report let UNC off the hook? What am I reading wrong?

10/22/2014 2:37:21 PM

from previous page
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/23/sports/university-of-north-carolina-investigation-reveals-shadow-curriculum-to-help-athletes.html


from picture caption

Quote :

"Carol Folt, the university chancellor, with Tom Ross, the university president. She said the fake classes thrived for so long because it was hard for people to fathom that they could even exist."

Holier than Thou mentality .

10/22/2014 2:39:23 PM

Quote :

"Though the report found no evidence that high-level university officials knew about the fake classes, it faulted the university for missing numerous warning signs about what was going on and said it had “failed to conduct any meaningful oversight” over the increasingly out-of-control African studies department."

10/22/2014 2:40:19 PM

Dan Kane with an awesome question.

Preface: Wainstein said that Roy noticed clustering of his players in AfAm classes and instructed his advisors to stop funneling players into those classes.

Dan Kane: "Two years ago I asked Coach Williams why his players stopped taking AfAm classes and his reply was 'Maybe they became interested in another subject.'"

UNC AD's: "That's a questions you'll have to ask Roy."

I literally laughed out loud.

10/22/2014 2:43:06 PM

i don't know how you don't take down banners after this.

PLEASE TAKE DOWN BANNERS NCAA.

10/22/2014 2:44:40 PM

^ Nope. They made championship rings for winning their division on technicalities.





[Edited on October 22, 2014 at 2:48 PM. Reason : #NEVERFORGET]

10/22/2014 2:46:39 PM

Sounds like LOIC, but they are trying to frame it as a "failure to monitor" based on not directly implicating management with being complicit in what was going on.

10/22/2014 2:47:47 PM

It is almost unreal that people like @Joey_Powell exist

not sure who the bigger joke is between him and Brad Bethel

10/22/2014 2:48:22 PM

im making an acc basketball tourney champion t-shirt for 2006 and ask we hang a banner. lost in title game to unc, but its a technicality since they had ineligible players.

V yes 2007 sorry. if they want to make bullshit coastal champ rings this only seems fitting... hang it right before they come to play in raleigh this year.

[Edited on October 22, 2014 at 3:15 PM. Reason : ...]

10/22/2014 2:48:48 PM

^2007

10/22/2014 2:52:14 PM

Quote :

"Coaching the Mind ?@BethelLearning Cannot overemphasize that staff who crossed lines did so to help students progress to graduation, not simply to keep them eligible for play."

Dafuq?

10/22/2014 3:05:00 PM

^^^^ Powell is also a "leader" of the Raleigh Chamber's Young Professionals Network...which from my limited attendance seems like the natural next step after you finish greek life in undergrad. I've heard him speak twice, he seemed totally fake throughout, and reading his tweets makes me think even less of him.

Also ^this just confirms UNC as a degree factory. It used to be "show up and get an A"; he's saying they didn't even have to show up to get a degree! What a moron.

[Edited on October 22, 2014 at 3:09 PM. Reason : .]

10/22/2014 3:07:04 PM

^^ how the balls does that make it any better?

10/22/2014 3:16:49 PM

if its an athletic issue, then the NCAA comes in. If it's an academic issue, then it's just a shitty university but everyone can continue on as normal.

Trying to change the narrative is pretty pointless though, that report and presentation was very thorough and clear

10/22/2014 3:20:25 PM

Seriously, I wish someone had just helped me along to graduation because they just felt so sorry for me. I had all sorts of things come up that were much more difficult than just being a poor student athlete and the response was pretty much figure it out.

10/22/2014 3:27:33 PM

^^no it is still failure to monitor your student athletes.

10/22/2014 3:30:32 PM

Quote :

" Subject: [FORMAL NOTICE] Message from Chancellor Carol L. Folt Dear Carolina Community, Earlier today, Kenneth Wainstein, a former federal prosecutor, released the findings of his independent investigation into academic irregularities at Carolina. You may view the report at carolinacommitment.unc.edu. I recognize that the past few years have been challenging for our community, but today we have a full picture of what happened. I am deeply disappointed by the duration and the extent of the wrongdoing, as well as the lack of oversight that could have corrected it sooner. We could have saved so much anguish and, more importantly, protected the students and countless members of our community who played absolutely no role. My greatest hope is that we can restore your trust and ensure that you do not feel diminished by the bad actions of others. It is important to separate the past from the present — and the future. Mr. Wainstein found that the irregularities were confined to one department, peaked almost a decade ago and ended in 2011. Since first learning of these irregularities four years ago, Carolina took action to stop the wrongdoing and implemented numerous additional reforms, and we continue to take actions that build on the initiatives currently in place. We already are stronger as a result of our journey, not only from the reforms, but because of our willingness to accept responsibility. Now is our time to show how resilient we can be – how we are going to continue the process of deep soul-searching and self-reflection, and how we are going to use what we have learned to become better, stronger and even more proud of who we are as an institution. I expect the members of our community to experience a range of emotions about the report’s findings and our actions. As you reflect upon the learnings, remember that our University’s 221-year history has never been defined by a single moment. Rather, our legacy is built from the impressive accomplishments and discoveries made every day on this campus by our students, faculty and staff. In that spirit, let me remind you of our town hall event this evening from 5 to 6 p.m. in room G100 of the Genome Sciences Building. I want to provide you with more insights on the report and respond to your questions. I hope you will be able to join me. I feel today, more than ever, that it is the privilege of my career to be chancellor of one of the greatest universities in America. I am so proud of what our campus community is accomplishing – and where we are headed. Thank you for your support. Sincerely, Carol L. Folt Chancellor This message is sponsored by: Office of the Chancellor"

10/22/2014 3:36:45 PM

Quote :

"Preface: Wainstein said that Roy noticed clustering of his players in AfAm classes and instructed his advisors to stop funneling players into those classes. Dan Kane: "Two years ago I asked Coach Williams why his players stopped taking AfAm classes and his reply was 'Maybe they became interested in another subject.'" UNC AD's: "That's a questions you'll have to ask Roy.""

Lololololol

10/22/2014 3:43:27 PM

Perhaps it's been posted somewhere, but I'd like a list of all UNC bball players back to 1980 and their major.

10/22/2014 3:43:51 PM

I mean I dont know all the rules involving colleges but seems to me if it is proven you handed out over 3000 fake degrees you should probably not only have your athletic program shut down but your accreditation pulled or suspended at least. I would be embarrassed to have attended that school at this point.

10/22/2014 3:47:50 PM

Id really like to see some severe NCAA sanctions come out of this, more than just a loss of one year post season, but I know it wont.

10/22/2014 3:48:22 PM

Which packpride screennames go on the C-F ring of honor if they have to take down a banner?

10/22/2014 3:49:58 PM

What I find most shocking in all of this is that it is not Friday afternoon.

10/22/2014 3:50:32 PM

A banner? Looks like 4 need to come down to me.

10/22/2014 3:51:31 PM

Take them all down, except for the fake one.

10/22/2014 3:57:57 PM

^ But zero are going to come down. This report doesn't change anything. It just broadens the scope of what was already known. Advisors and academic departments helped athletes (and a few others). No coaches are implicated directly. No one in the athletics department. The NCAA has already labeled it as an academic issue, not an athletic one. This is just an academic black eye for UNC, but their athletics programs will go on unscathed.

10/22/2014 3:58:57 PM

The 99.9 callers that talk about Roy like he's a close friend are the reason I listen.

10/22/2014 3:59:22 PM

comment from Deadspin:

Quote :

"Observations: -Tolerance/endorsement of plagiarism throughout -Some players were shifted into paper classes because they were so disruptive in regular classes that professors were unable to teach -Grades changed without professors' knowledge (this is probably the worst from an academic accreditation standpoint) -Three separate SACS accreditation periods failed to detect this, which suggests the university was more complicit in covering it up than the report indicates. SACS' decision not to sanction UNC is likely to cover their own asses insofar as being blind to the lack of institutional effectiveness. There are people whose jobs it is to recognize these things (or the lack of reporting) during QEP assessment periods, and they missed it all."

Quote :

"No one in the athletics department."

you need to read the report again, people in athletics were directly involved

[Edited on October 22, 2014 at 4:00 PM. Reason : .]

10/22/2014 3:59:29 PM

You mean the athletic academic advisers? Who for some reason don't count as part of the athletics department but as part of the academic/student advising area?

Look, I think UNC should have the book thrown at them. This is systematic academic fraud, mostly to benefit athletes and keep them eligible/help them graduate (semantics).

But I don't think anything's going to change. Maybe I'll be wrong.

10/22/2014 4:05:14 PM

Probably the most hilarious part was when Wainstein talked about Crowder announcing her resignation, and then there was a fucking bum rush of athletes trying to get in as many paper classes as possible before she left and couldn't hand them all A's and B's. He had fucking graphs outlining the whole situation. I mean...that's fucking gold right there.

10/22/2014 4:17:34 PM

Here's the thing that blows me away. They (fans/IC) still, after everything that has been revealed, claim that AFAM was a legit program.

Quote :

"Wainstein specifically said today they found evidence of real work done in the classes. He went on to talk about 150 or so final papers they uncovered in the million emails they reviews. How one student would have an outstanding paper, and another would have one that was poorly written. If some students were doing real work, then clearly this wasn't 100% fraudulent."

I'm convinced that all 150 were submitted by the one poor son of a bitch who thought he was in a legit class and someone was really going to read his paper.

10/22/2014 4:25:57 PM

remember when that old guy from Up at Penn State got immediately fired because his assistant was doing something he didn't know about?

10/22/2014 4:35:21 PM

Quote :

"but because of our willingness to accept responsibility."

i'm not sure i've ever seen a more deflective house of denial

Quote :

"even more proud of who we are as an institution."

is this even possible?

10/22/2014 4:54:24 PM

Nothing like Adam and Joe and 99 the fan to have a UNC HOMER ALUM Lauren Brownlow as a guest host today to yell at any caller who suggests any type of punishment to the UNC Athletics Dept...

10/22/2014 5:05:10 PM

Quote :

"i certainly don't expect anything new or groundbreaking. more of the same. "there were problems in the past with a few individuals acting on their own. those individuals are no longer part of the unc community and those problems no longer exist. we have taken extreme measures and implemented systems to ensure this does not ever happen again." will probably be what comes of this on wednesday."

that's my "prediction" from like monday...i was pretty wrong. this investigation was much more in depth than i expected...and parts were pretty damning.

i don't really expect the ncaa to tack on any additional punishments but at least unc has been forced to openly acknowledge just how bad some of the academic stuff was over there.

What cracks me up the most about @bethellearning is that he's quick to point out unfair, negative national headlines and media pushing an anti-UNC narrative...while acting as if he is completely impartial or is not obviously trying to spin things a certain way himself.

[Edited on October 22, 2014 at 5:17 PM. Reason : c]

10/22/2014 5:07:51 PM

Quote :

"Id really like to see some severe NCAA sanctions come out of this, more than just a loss of one year post season, but I know it wont."

I heard the BoG is super pissed. If the NCAA doesn't step in they are prepared to vacate all of UNC's losses over the last 20 years.













icwydt

10/22/2014 5:22:37 PM

ho li fuk

10/22/2014 5:31:04 PM

the BoG is so mad theyre going to put us on probation

10/22/2014 5:40:37 PM

Hah, on NBC Nightly News

10/22/2014 6:47:45 PM

Quote :

"Nothing like Adam and Joe and 99 the fan to have a UNC HOMER ALUM Lauren Brownlow as a guest host today to yell at any caller who suggests any type of punishment to the UNC Athletics Dept..."

Please take yourself over to pack pride.

10/22/2014 7:07:14 PM

Today was very bad, but I am disappointed in how they shielded the coaches. There is no fucking way you can have a majority of your players in these majors and classes and not have any knowledge of what was going on.

I'm hoping Dan Kane has some tricks up his sleeves and/or they somehow use Wayne Walden's knowledge of the scheme and take a title or two away from Roy. I think he'd have a heart attack.

10/22/2014 7:12:31 PM

i just can't believe an Admin was power housing all this grade change shit.

Was it confirmed in the report that Deborah actually sat down with Waldstein?

10/22/2014 7:23:24 PM

Who is this ass hat Caulton Tudor?

http://www.wralsportsfan.com/ncaa-will-keep-digging-but-relative-closure-near-for-heels/14105509/

"And even if the NCAA finds ineligible players were kept eligible through fraudulent classes, the most serious reprimand probably would be having more wins vacated. But would the NCAA or UNC go so far as to vacate the 2005 NCAA basketball title? No."

What does this guy expect? UNC is going to come out and say, "We only had ineligible during our first two Championships. Please God do not take away the 3rd or we will be tied with NC State!!"??

10/22/2014 7:23:38 PM

Quote :

"Basketball counselor Wayne Walden, who came to UNC from Kansas along with Roy Williams, acknowledged knowing how the paper classes worked."

From the WRAL article.

It's strange to me that an academic counselor would follow a coach.

10/22/2014 7:24:38 PM

I will say Carol is a total outsider to "The Carolina Way" which might explain why this was as thorough as it was. She is less interested in protecting the school than she is on keeping her image. She is not invested as personally as most of the others. It has ruffled some feathers.

It was fun watching the report today with Mack Brown's former secretary.

10/22/2014 7:55:10 PM

Quote :

"Who is this ass hat Caulton Tudor?"

You really don't know who Caulton Tudor is?

10/22/2014 7:57:41 PM

Besides being a sports writer? no

10/22/2014 8:06:32 PM

I don't think anything is going to actually come of this and the only thing that does is give schools an incentive to cheat. Say what you want about UNC's academic reputation taking a major hit, but they made an ass load of money off the victories and success generated by their basketball program and I doubt anyone involved with UNC (at least in their athletic dept) would ever really regret that.

The least surprising thing in all of this is that Roy came off looking relatively decent compared to everyone else. Guy learned the ropes from Dean, was at Kansas when this whole AFAM thing started, got to UNC and let the whole thing continue (although he never let out any evidence that he explicitly knew it was going on), and then when Butch and the FB team get in hot water with the NCAA in 2010 he starts pulling guys out of AFAM because he's "concerned" about it now. That way he gets to deny any knowledge of what was going on and can stick to that line whenever he gets a question about it.

Biggest thing about the Roy situation that irritates me is that Jimmy V didn't get the benefit of the doubt from the media or the UNC BOG when the NCAA said there was no proof that he knew about State players selling shoes & tickets. State got so much pressure from the UNC system that they shot their entire athletics department in the face in order to salvage the overall reputation of the school. Meanwhile its taken UNC 4 god damn years to get to this point.

/end rant

[Edited on October 22, 2014 at 8:24 PM. Reason : TBDV]

10/22/2014 8:24:05 PM