Quote :

" It’s honestly fine. Does t mean he won’t win. Just to don’t be a MAGA-like cult member yelling into the void about polling. "

The polling doesn't mean he won't win but the problem is that the results are being used by the media as a weapon against him. If he's down in polls thats fine but as you can see in this thread, everyone starts regurgitating the media narrative (backed by polls) that Bernie is struggling.

The MAGA people can't be wrong about EVERYTHING. There is some truth to some of their grievances when it comes to the media, thats why the attacks land so well and why they won. Trump took advantage of distrust in the media. He figured why not just circumvent them and create his own narrative. Theres a swath of Trump supporters who are woke and know that both Trump and the media are dishonest but they cosign because it helps their agenda. Just like how neoliberals cosign MSM. If Bernie was more of an asshole, he could probably fight back against the media and have a better shot.

You can always find a metric and use that to spin the narrative you want to push. Thats how the media operates. You guys just don't notice it unless you watch foxnews and the narrative is the being pushed isn't the one you've been sipping on all along. Watch me do it the rest of this post.

Quote :

"The whole point of the primary is to EXPAND your support and your base. Bernie hasn't been able to do that this cycle. "

Really? Did he start off with 1 million donors and not move from there? How long has he been flat at 1 million donors?

Quote :

"Warren has done a better job of doing that so far"

How many individual donors does Warren have?

Quote :

" I frankly don't see a whole lot of Warren supporters in my filter bubbles, but when I do, I don't recall seeing an excessive amount of vitriol (sure there are exceptions, but in generalities)"

+dtownral's post.

I think its an accurate assessment because there is an appeal amongst middle class people with education who don't want to disturb the good life they are living. Bernie folks are mad as hell at more than just republicans.

Quote :

"Decent on healthcare, but everything else honestly seems pretty neoliberal. What am I missing?"

Another thing to add is that while people know about Biden's son, no one has brought up Warren's daughter, who got rich off of obamacare. Do you really think Liz would destroy her daughter's company?

You'll never see those takes in the MSM

9/23/2019 3:24:08 PM

Quote :

" Did he start off with 1 million donors and not move from there"

Quote :

" How many individual donors does Warren have?"

good questions. I do remember seeing Sanders ended Q2 with 746k donors (vs 421k for Warren).

end of Q3 FEC filing is coming up soon. hopefully we'll get ActBlue data again this quarter so we can better analyze small donor donations and what kind of reflection that shows on Q3 momentum in donations for what we've seen in polling results. very interested to take a look at this data

Bernie looked in a good position at the end of Q2. from what I can see, he has not built on this headstart, and warren has capitalized

[Edited on September 23, 2019 at 3:50 PM. Reason : . ]

9/23/2019 3:45:52 PM

Quote :

"Question for the Warren people: which of her policies do you like better than Bernie's? In particular, climate, housing, healthcare, and foreign policy."

They aren't far enough apart on the issues that matter most to me to make me choose one over the other, but Warren has gotten a lot more done in a lot less time. The back-and-forth gun reform filibuster she and Booker pulled was one of the greatest things I've ever seen in senate politics, and the way she stood up against Jeff Sessions' appointment was awe-inspiring.

9/23/2019 5:34:04 PM

?

Jeff session was appointed

9/23/2019 5:59:36 PM

Quote :

"pleasant, prepared and intelligent (which appeals to the moderate Dems)"

I would hope those qualities appeal to everyone.

9/23/2019 7:11:36 PM

^They don't. Authenticity is much more important and is exactly where Warren will fail. If I had a krystal ball, it would tell me that Warren is going to lose to Trump.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6cY-CghyKY

Please watch the video because it eloquently goes into most of the things being discussed in this thread and a lot of you just can't process the things I'm trying to say (my fault).

9/23/2019 7:30:57 PM

This is really proving my point. Warren supporters just seem to want a calm, composed president, and policy is secondary.

9/23/2019 8:07:01 PM

If trump gets anyone’s vote who values authenticity than they weren’t really valuing authenticity to begin with

[Edited on September 23, 2019 at 8:22 PM. Reason : Sd]

9/23/2019 8:21:38 PM

Good to know that the world's biggest troll is proving your tossed out point that Warren is Hilary lite

You ask over and over why someone would like Warren while diminishing reasons given then say she's Hilary lite without providing any reasoning

Warren has policies that are a little soft in some cases but she has shown herself over and over to be a fighter. She I on record fighting the Obama administration and Biden himself from the left and winning. She was first to strongly call for impeachment, Bernie was much later and softer, she called for abolishing filibuster, bernie is softer, she called for impeaching kavanaugh, Bernie was softer. Bernies great policies are meaningless if he's too worried about "rules" and "traditions" to get things done.

All that said, he is easily my 2nd choice and nobody else is anywhere close to the top 2

9/23/2019 8:37:24 PM

Give her another month or two for her full transformation to hillary 2.0

9/23/2019 8:42:42 PM

This is really proving my point.

9/23/2019 8:51:52 PM

She's embraced corporate money and is out there talking about things we cant do, tell me why that's not clintonesque

9/23/2019 10:01:03 PM

Quote :

"Good to know that the world's biggest troll is proving your tossed out point that Warren is Hilary lite You ask over and over why someone would like Warren while diminishing reasons given then say she's Hilary lite without providing any reasoning"

She is dude. She has a few notably progressive policies (healthcare, education, climate policy), all of which are worse than Bernie's. Her foreign policy is hawkish, housing policy is abysmally insufficient, and she's consistently failed to stand up for progressive movements in the past (Dakota pipeline, trans rights, worker movements, etc). She voted for Trump's defense budget twice. She stood up and clapped for Trump when he said we would never be a socialist country. Warren wants friendlier capitalism and friendlier colonialism. That's all.

Quote :

"Bernies great policies are meaningless if he's too worried about "rules" and "traditions" to get things done."

You need 60 votes to eliminate the filibuster. You need 50 votes to push the same legislation through under budget reconciliation. I'm not sure why you're hung up on this.

I'm not surprised Bernie voters have been swayed by Warren. She's younger, well-spoken, and says the right things. Unfortunately, her policies are just not good.

[Edited on September 23, 2019 at 11:38 PM. Reason : .]

9/23/2019 11:28:44 PM

I love how some Bernie Bros are trying to paint Warren as some Clinton clone, just because some of his earlier supporters got bored/impatient and have decided to move on from the angry, screaming old man to a warm, personable, intelligent woman who has relatively the same basic ideas, yet she can articulate them better.

9/24/2019 12:04:13 AM

at least a few people on here should be concerned that they're on the same side as this guy ^

9/24/2019 12:11:46 AM

Be concerned. Try and smear Warren because you won't get your way. Protest vote or stay home like petulant children. Kinda sad how you haven't learned your lesson, but it's a free country. Right?

9/24/2019 12:24:29 AM

Warren had her chance to pick a side in 2016 and she did. Theres no way she went from not even supporting progressive policies in 2016 to being the champion of them in just 3 years. Her supporters will never answer for our specific grievances because its much easier to just write large swaths of people off as looney and then blame Russia when trump unleashes the Pocahontas angle and they lose. Kinda sad they haven't learned their lesson.

9/24/2019 12:58:57 AM

Quote :

"Her supporters will never answer for our specific grievances because its much easier to just write large swaths of people off as looney and then blame Russia when trump unleashes the Pocahontas angle and they lose."

There are lots of reasons to vote, or not vote, for anyone. But what you’ve said here regarding Trump and “Pocohantas” is the one thing that is unacceptable. Worrying about the idiotic rhetoric a dementia-addled idiot will use about a candidate is no better than voting Biden because you think he is “the only one who can beat Trump.”

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 7:38 AM. Reason : Ffs, Trump will call Biden a socialist. Who gives a fuck what Trump says or thinks?]

9/24/2019 7:37:39 AM

wait i thought dtowngunz was okay with warren? did cable news tell him otherwise yesterday?

9/24/2019 7:39:20 AM

put down the bong, i've never said i'm not okay with warren



[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 8:42 AM. Reason : and lol at the idea of cable news being bernie supporters or leftists, how high are you?]

9/24/2019 8:35:51 AM

im not the one suddenly agreeing with earl, weirdo.

go back to cleaning your glock and watching CNN.

9/24/2019 9:06:44 AM

:dab:

9/24/2019 9:07:43 AM

https://twitter.com/ralstonreports/status/1176497268087635968?s=21

Again, same hedges. Just proving my point again about a user on here cherry-picking polls. I suspect we’ll continue to see more shuffling as Biden continues to lose support. My OPINION is that those people will tend to break more towards Warren because they will be more Dem establishment types.

9/24/2019 10:16:00 AM

Quote :

"Warren had her chance to pick a side in 2016 and she did. "

She didn’t endorse Hillary until June after it was super obvious Bernie was dunzo. Get over it already.

Aside from that, Bernie has his entire decades long career in national politics to deliver all of his amazing and 100% unique/original ideas to Americans and run for President, yet pretty much nobody even knew who the fuck he was until 2015 or so when he finally decided to become a Democrat.

It’s painfully obvious why Bernie Bros are always so angry- they entitled, delusional, and misogynistic. Sad.

9/24/2019 10:58:14 AM

lol #triggered

9/24/2019 11:19:38 AM

i feel uncomfortable when a gun nut says triggered.

9/24/2019 11:21:43 AM

try changing to a more CBD/THC balanced strain, your current strain may be inducing too much anxiety

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 11:28 AM. Reason : ask for more linalool next time]

9/24/2019 11:26:04 AM

youd think itd be a fairly simple matter for the progressive ringleader here to say buying 1000 rounds of ammo online is wrong.

yet here we are.

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 11:31 AM. Reason : self proclaimed, my bad ]

9/24/2019 11:30:34 AM

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/24/us/politics/bernie-sanders-wealth-tax.html

nice

9/24/2019 11:33:14 AM

Quote :

"She didn’t endorse Hillary until June"

I believe that is his point. She could have endorsed Bernie and she chose to stay silent and not take a side at all, which in effect worked in Hillary's favor

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 11:37 AM. Reason : whereas Tulsi resigned her position as DNC Vice Chair on order to support Bernie]

to be clear I don't think this makes Warren a trojan horse neoliberal corporatist shill or some nonsense, but it is was a wasted opportunity to stand up for the "progressive movement" that she claims to represent so much now

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 11:40 AM. Reason : .]

9/24/2019 11:35:14 AM

Earl literally called her a coward when she declined to endorse during the Mass. primary (Bernie lost )

She had remained neutral until June, and she did so primarily for her own benefit. It was a wise move on her part, considering now she's likely to be the Dem nominee, while the Bern redux for 2020 is already being snuffed out.

9/24/2019 11:39:37 AM

Quote :

"she did so primarily for her own benefi"

Indeed. Which is why some people don't trust her, call her an opportunist

Quote :

"It was a wise move on her part"

Or it wasn't because now Bernie supporters don't trust her, and if it does play out that Warren becomes significantly more popular than Bernie or wins the nomination, Bernie supporters may not want to vote for her. Whereas if she had supported Bernie more last cycle and Warren wins the nomination this cycle, maybe Bernie supporters would be more willing to move their support to her. Who knows.

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 11:44 AM. Reason : .]

9/24/2019 11:43:59 AM

So.. she was supposed to just do what Bernie wanted and help him become president, because with her endorsement of him he 'would have won' instead of losing to crooked Hillary (who still managed to win the popular vote).

Got it.

9/24/2019 11:46:41 AM

Politicians do things in their best interest. News at 11.

Easy argument to make that Bernie’s eventual endorsement of Clinton was a necessary first step in running the next open election for president. He simply had to in order to have any chance today with actual Democrats.

Bernie didn’t temporarily turn into a centrist from August to November, he did it out of opportunity and necessity.

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 11:48 AM. Reason : And there is nothing wrong with that]

9/24/2019 11:47:53 AM

Quote :

"So.. she was supposed to just do what Bernie wanted and help him become president, because with her endorsement of him he 'would have won' instead of losing to crooked Hillary (who still managed to win the popular vote)."

Idk why we need to re-hash this over and over again, but he was both more progressive, and more likely to win the general according to polls. Warren not endorsing was pretty clearly a self-preservation move.

Quote :

"Politicians do things in their best interest. News at 11. Easy argument to make that Bernie’s eventual endorsement of Clinton was a necessary first step in running the next open election for president. He simply had to in order to have any chance today with actual Democrats. Bernie didn’t temporarily turn into a centrist from August to November, he did it out of opportunity and necessity."

This, on the other hand, is some cynical BS. Noam Chomsky also said we should support Clinton, because it was important to defeat Trump, not because he wanted favor from Democrats.

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 11:51 AM. Reason : .]

9/24/2019 11:50:29 AM

I just don't get how to make the Bernie Bros happy, other than 100% giving them whatever they want.

Sanders and Warrens are actually friends, and their policies are a lot more similar than different, so to me it's super obvious they're running parallel campaigns to enthuse moderates about progressive ideas, and enthuse progressives by poaching votes from centrist Dems that Trump would beat anyway (hello, Biden).

Quote :

"Warren not endorsing was pretty clearly a self-preservation move."

No fucking shit, but it works both ways. Had she endorsed Bernie before the primaries were over, it would have pissed off a lot of centrist/moderate Dems since he lost to Clinton, and yet the same Bernie Bros today would probably be screaming even more about her being a copycat/opportunist.

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 11:55 AM. Reason : you can't win with Bernie Bros. Bernie or Bust.]

9/24/2019 11:52:17 AM

Quote :

"I just don't get how to make the Bernie Bros happy, other than 100% giving them whatever they want."

Literally every Bernie supporter on here has said they would vote for Warren. Still going to campaign for the better candidate, though.

9/24/2019 11:53:15 AM

Quote :

"she was supposed to just do what Bernie wanted"

Didn't say that. I'm saying if Warren wanted to stake a clear position as being a progressive (in the eyes of Bernie supporters at least for whatever that's worth) she would have endorsed Bernie back then. Many politicians did stick their neck out to endorse Bernie, so it's not like Warren would have been the only one to take that risk. She decided not to risk it. Which is her right. But now she has to live with the fact that some who were disappointed she did not endorse Bernie then will now be less likely to offer her their support this cycle.

9/24/2019 11:54:01 AM

Noam Chonsky isn’t and wasn’t running for President.

Bernie did what he had to do. He, unlike some of his supporters and staff, completely understands that he needs Democratic voters to win the Democratic primary.

^ its a simple game of math. For her 2020 primary chances she has essentially played it perfectly.

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 11:57 AM. Reason : X]

9/24/2019 11:56:07 AM

^^^ then why the early on smearing, calling her Clinton lite just because one recent poll in Iowa (it's four months away) shows her being the front runner. Oh wait, it's because that's the exact same tactic they tried in 2016 to discredit Hillary.





[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 11:59 AM. Reason : NOTE: Warren's policies are NOT the same as Hillary, and she doesn't have the baggage]]

9/24/2019 11:56:52 AM

^^
You're free to interpret it that way, but the difference between that and Warren's lack of endorsement is still massive. Bernie endorsed Clinton so Trump wouldn't win. Warren endorsed Clinton (or failed to endorse Bernie) so...Bernie wouldn't win?

Quote :

"then why the early on smearing, calling her Clinton lite"

I backed up my claims. You're free to tell me why I'm wrong. This is how a primary works.

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 12:00 PM. Reason : .]

9/24/2019 11:59:16 AM

It's only massive to Bernie Bros who are mad and trying to blame her for his loss. We will never know whether Warren's endorsement would have swayed things in Bernie's favor, so this revisionist history game is stupid.

My point about Bernie Bros still stands: why the smear tactics if they're basically on the same team and enthusing more voters than turning them off?

9/24/2019 12:01:47 PM

Monmouth NH poll just released

https://www.monmouth.edu/polling-institute/reports/monmouthpoll_nh_092419/

Quote :

" Among registered New Hampshire Democrats and unaffiliated voters who are likely to participate in the February 2020 Democratic primary, 27% currently support Warren and 25% support Biden. The only other candidates in double digits are Sanders at 12% and South Bend Mayor Pete Buttigieg at 10%. Others with measurable support are California Sen. Kamala Harris (3%), New Jersey Sen. Cory Booker (2%), Hawaii Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (2%), Minnesota Sen. Amy Klobuchar (2%), former hedge fund manager Tom Steyer (2%), and entrepreneur Andrew Yang (2%). The remaining 10 candidates included in the poll earn 1% or less."

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 12:04 PM. Reason : So Tulsi got her 4th qualifying poll for October and will be on the stage

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 12:05 PM. Reason : .]

9/24/2019 12:03:29 PM

Saw that. I THINK it means Gabbard qualifies for October debate.

Earl gonna be pissed that he can cry about her being blackballed.

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 12:05 PM. Reason : Also, wtf Steyer people. Come on..]

9/24/2019 12:05:00 PM

I mean as a Warren supporter, that's fantastic news, but until Iowa actually happens, I'm just looking at it as a sign that voters are 'enthused' by her- not that they'll actually vote for her. It's four months away and Warren and Sanders have played it nice, so why is it that this Clinton 2.0 narrative is already starting from Bernie Bros?

9/24/2019 12:05:46 PM

Quote :

"why the smear tactics if they're basically on the same team and enthusing more voters than turning them off?"

Again, what smear tactics? I backed up what I said, but no one cared to respond.

They may be friends, they may even be working together in some ways, but the fact is one of them is a socialist, and one is a capitalist reformer.

9/24/2019 12:07:29 PM

I mean, who cares really? Hardcore Sanders supporters that apparently annoying you on the Internet are a tiny, tiny sliver of the electorate. They are irrelevant and don’t even represent the majority of his support.

9/24/2019 12:08:29 PM

where have i heard this before...

9/24/2019 12:09:24 PM

^^I'm mostly just asking the two of them in this very thread, and at this point, it's earl and another one of his potential aliases.

I also find all of the 'evidence' posted on this page about Warren to be flimsy and lame (clapping?)

[Edited on September 24, 2019 at 12:11 PM. Reason : apparently in the real world, Bernie Bros are abandoning ship for Warren, so I'm not complaining...]

9/24/2019 12:10:57 PM

just to clarify, when i started calling dtownral 'newEarl' .. i didnt mean i actually thought he was earl.

9/24/2019 12:13:41 PM