I want to GIB RON CHERRY DA BIDNESS

11/29/2010 12:58:28 PM

Stolen from PackPride

Quote :

"4th Down Spot Photos. I did this out of curiousity, but I'm definitely on the side of "we deserved to lose". Looks to me like we deserved one more shot at the endzone too, but we deserved to lose the game. 2 touchdown passes on 2 different drives dropped turned into 3 points instead of 14, huge difference. The WRs were a big letdown in this game. The play calling wasn't great either, and some adjustments should have been made on defense to at least try to limit the guy who caught 4 TD passes, instead of leaving him in single coverage with CJ the whole night. There was no urgency in the 4th quarter. If the team has played a little bit of hurry-up with 8 minutes to go, we might've had more than 50 seconds left at the end of the game to try and get the ball back again. This is the beginning of the 3rd down play, but notice the sideline, the stick is ON the 31yard hash. This is 4th down, showing the stick in the background. Again, you can see the stick in the background is ON the hashmark at 31 yards. Against 4th down. This is forward progress. It's a judgement call how far he went, but this looks like the farthest he went to me. Notice the hashmark at the foot of MD #67. To me, he looks close to the hash, but he doesn't reach it. And finally, the spot of the ball. The refs agreed, the runner didn't reach the 31yard hard mark. BUT, now the marker, which had been ON the 31yard hashmark is a foot short of the hashmark. And the play came down to half an inch. Notice at the very bottom how close the call was. "

11/29/2010 3:00:22 PM

wow. That's some bullshit.

11/29/2010 3:04:11 PM

11/29/2010 3:08:05 PM

what baffles me is, it doesn't look like the ball reaches the stick even with the favorable spot and chain position

11/29/2010 3:09:29 PM

what that looks like to me is where they placed the five yard indicator (if that's what its even called). All the chains have this little indicator that placed on the closest edge of a 5 yard line increment. So instead of doing it to the inside, they do it to the outside, which explains where there's roughly a 3-4inch movement of the flag closer towards the ball.

i know that might not make any sense, but it does to me. But clearly, the flag was not in the same spot. I don't question the spot at all. But how does the 10yard marker move UP the field?

11/29/2010 3:12:37 PM

Quote :

"what baffles me is, it doesn't look like the ball reaches the stick even with the favorable spot and chain position "

You're looking at the orange padding attached to the stick. The stick itself comes down on the front stripe of the ball.

11/29/2010 3:15:47 PM

77 for Maryland made sure he pancaked the fuck out of our guy, even though he was 5 yards away from the play

11/29/2010 3:15:48 PM

Quote :

"Contact the ACC Atlantic Coast Conference P.O. Drawer ACC Greensboro, NC 27417-6724 Phone: (336) 854-8787"

11/29/2010 3:17:32 PM

It's kind of a stupid, pipe-dream idea, but...

How long do you think it'll take them to develop some sort of laser technology, where the first down markers will have a laser signal going across the field, and the ball will have censors on it so there will be some sort of notification if the ball crosses that line.

The technology exists, but how long until football adopts it? (It'll prob take a botched Super bowl or something to make it happen)

11/29/2010 3:18:23 PM

Probably won't do you much good

Quote :

"ACC officiating coordinator Doug Rhoads said today that Ron Cherry's officiating crew handled the spot of the ball correctly on a key fourth-down play during the final minute of Maryland's 38-31 defeat of N.C. State on Saturday. The play has caused controversy because the N.C. State defense appeared to stop running back D.J. Adams short of the first-down marker on a rush on a fourth-and-1 at the N.C. State 32-yard line. But the officials gave Adams what appeared to be a generous spot of the ball, and coach Tom O'Brien was visibly frustrated when the officials' measurement showed Adams gained the first down that clinched the win for Maryland with 48 seconds left. "The play is handled correctly as well as can be done by human beings," Rhoads said this morning in a telephone interview. Rhoads said the line judge and head linesman ran in hard like they're supposed to after the play to mark the spot of the ball when Adams was stopped. He said on short-yardage plays where many large bodies are present, it's difficult to determine the spot of the ball. The officials estimated as accurately as possible where the forward-most point of the ball was, according to Rhoads. He said the TV replay official did review the spot, and the first governing principle of replay reviews is the presumption that the call on the field is correct. "The standard to overturn or reverse that is very high," Rhoads said. "That’s irrefutable video evidence. And I personally looked at the video of that, and you cannot ascertain the forward-most point of the ball, and it’s obscured because of all the bodies in there." Had Adams been ruled short of the first down, N.C. State would have taken possession at its own 32-yard line with 48 seconds remaining, trailing by seven points. Although the Wolfpack didn't have any timeouts remaining, there would have been time to attempt to work quickly to get the ball down the field for a tying touchdown. O'Brien declined to comment this morning about the call. Immediately after the game, he refrained from second guessing the officials. "It sure looked like [we stopped them] from where we were and we were right on the chains," O'Brien said Saturday night. ". . .[The call] was confirmed, so I guess it wasn't a stop. We thought we had him stopped, but my opinion doesn't count.""

http://blogs.newsobserver.com/accnow/acc-refs-boss-says-pack-call-handled-correctly

11/29/2010 3:18:37 PM

ha bullshit. The ball is clearly short of where the first down marker should be. Granted I suppose they got the spot of the ball correct so Fire the chain gang and the replay official for not catching it. Oh and fuck ron cherry, fire his ass too.

[Edited on November 29, 2010 at 3:23 PM. Reason : ]

11/29/2010 3:19:38 PM

ACC Refs boss assumes the chain was correct.

You know, now I'll assume the spot of the ball (yardline wise) was correct, because before I was relating it to the position of the first down marker. But now I see the chain was incorrect...I don't know which is worse.

11/29/2010 3:20:59 PM

Had he complained, I guarantee O'Brien would have been suspended unlike Bitch Davis up the road.

11/29/2010 3:23:40 PM

Quote :

" You're looking at the orange padding attached to the stick. The stick itself comes down on the front stripe of the ball."

good call

11/29/2010 3:25:17 PM

^True, but its right at the front of the stripe, not 5 inches behind it.

The pic where they are looking at the ball...the stick should be just on the other side of the ref's foot, not inside it.

[Edited on November 29, 2010 at 3:32 PM. Reason : ]

11/29/2010 3:30:56 PM

Quote :

"How long do you think it'll take them to develop some sort of laser technology, where the first down markers will have a laser signal going across the field, and the ball will have censors on it so there will be some sort of notification if the ball crosses that line."

Never. You'd have to have beams or mirrors surrounding the entire plane of the first down line, including from above, across the width of the field in the air, to account for people blocking the beam from one side or the other, and it'd be basically useless in the situation when there's a QB sneak or a dive play where the pile covers everything up.

Even after all that, you;d have to have a rail system of some sort or something to keep the beam aligned perpendicular to the field, and then you've gotta deal with stuff like repainting the lines on a grass surfaced field during the season, and keeping all that crap aligned and built in a manner that doesn't pose a safety issue for players running out of bounds.

I'd rather keep football from turning into some technological circus, even if we end up on the short end of a decision half the time.

11/29/2010 3:43:26 PM

you guys are ignoring the real issue here.

the ball is placed somewhere. then snapped and a guy jumps into a pile. then a ref who is standing 80' away eyeballs where the ball is and tries his best to run in a straight line to the middle of the field. then the ref takes the ball and uses his hand to put it down where his foot is.

then the refs run out w/ a chain that is exactly 10 yards and measure that shit down to the 1/4". it's an absolutely absurd notion.

11/29/2010 3:45:17 PM

Quote :

"it's an absolutely absurd notion."

Sometimes I feel like simonn is some perfect poster created by my imagination

Can you guys see his posts too or is it just me

11/29/2010 3:49:42 PM

^^^good points, i didn't really think about in that much detail at all. oh well, just a thought

[Edited on November 29, 2010 at 3:51 PM. Reason : ^]

11/29/2010 3:50:59 PM

I don't think it would be that hard. RFID tags in the football and sensors/detectors in the yardline sticks /pylons that trigger when the ball crosses over.

11/29/2010 3:51:07 PM

Measuring it from the sideline would be dumb ....

What you need is a sensor grid under the turf, tracking the progress of the tips of the ball, which would give you the real position of the ball over the plane.

That shit would rock for replay analysis, and with it you could measure speed along the field, player acceleration, and all kinds of other good stuff.

Who wants to design and build it with me

11/29/2010 4:11:03 PM

^ how accurate would some kind of GPS device inside the ball be?

11/29/2010 4:23:16 PM

not even close to accurate enough.

Ernie: o/

11/29/2010 4:28:06 PM

^^less accurate than human refs

[Edited on November 29, 2010 at 4:30 PM. Reason : ^x2]

11/29/2010 4:29:48 PM

gps would never work ... would need to be a magnetic sensor system of some sort I think.

FIFA was doing some trials on something similar according to this:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-501897/The-hi-tech-football-tells-referees-crossed-line.html

^ but it looks like some sort of spoofy news site ... not sure it can be trusted.

[Edited on November 29, 2010 at 4:31 PM. Reason : .]

11/29/2010 4:30:24 PM

that's what I was talking about

11/29/2010 4:36:00 PM

I am still sad about this.

EDIT: just read this page - so the chain gang screwed up?

[Edited on November 29, 2010 at 4:54 PM. Reason : e]

11/29/2010 4:47:29 PM

Then you have issues when guys stretching the ball when their knees are down in a pile....

Like it has been said, the real issue is the movement of the first-down marker. How is that mistake made by the chain crew? ESPN had a better first down marker than the chains did when they brought them in... This should have been caught by someone and I don't believe the bogus argument that the replay official didn't have "irrefutable video evidence". The first down marker was in the replay shot and it is obvious he doesn't make it.

11/29/2010 4:49:48 PM

sgdfz

[Edited on November 29, 2010 at 4:55 PM. Reason : f]

11/29/2010 4:54:39 PM

Judging by those pictures posted above, I would guess that the chain-gang "drifted" a tad between first down and 3rd down (when the first screen shot was taken). So on first down the ball may have been closer to the 42 than the 41...meaning they only need to reach 32 yard line, not the 31. So while the spot seemed to be accurate, the chain-gang apparently just drifted down the field about a half yard or so...That sucks, but I thought all along that the refs place the ball at a decent spot and the chain gang drifting down the field would support that.

11/29/2010 5:04:02 PM

Quote :

"Then you have issues when guys stretching the ball when their knees are down in a pile.... "

Not if you had synchronized time stamps on video and the measuring device. Look at a replay at moment X the ball was stopped look at the position of the ball at the exact same time (and time immediately beforehand for forward progress). Basically you could use eyeball spotting and then on replays/ measurement situations it would revert to absolute positioning sensors. TA would have been in and we would have gotten the ball back.

11/29/2010 5:54:57 PM

It would be interesting to see a first down screenshot that includes the chains to test the "chains drifting down the field between 1st and 3rd down" theory.

11/29/2010 11:43:07 PM

my biggest issue was how the first down moved from the edge of the 31 yard-line stripe to 6 inches behind it. someone explain that shit.

11/30/2010 12:33:14 AM

the whole game is on ESPN3, go check it.

11/30/2010 12:41:32 AM

The spot sucked, but it never should have gotten to that point anyway. Should've taken care of business earlier in the game.

11/30/2010 6:44:10 AM

Quote :

"You're looking at the orange padding attached to the stick. The stick itself comes down on the front stripe of the ball.""

is this what you are saying the stick is shaped like? lol

i think what you see as coming down on the stripe of the ball is the shadow of the stick on the guys wrist

11/30/2010 8:03:53 AM

wow

11/30/2010 8:49:49 AM

Oliver Stone should make a movie about this.

11/30/2010 9:41:54 AM

Quote :

"The spot sucked, but it never should have gotten to that point anyway. Should've taken care of business earlier in the game."

11/30/2010 10:17:24 AM

I've never understood justifying referee mistakes or team mistakes with the "we didn't deserve to win for sucking earlier in the game" mentality. There would never be comebacks if that were true.

11/30/2010 10:21:58 AM

Worst logic ever

11/30/2010 10:27:24 AM

Quote :

"It's kind of a stupid, pipe-dream idea, but... How long do you think it'll take them to develop some sort of laser technology, where the first down markers will have a laser signal going across the field, and the ball will have censors on it so there will be some sort of notification if the ball crosses that line. The technology exists, but how long until football adopts it? (It'll prob take a botched Super bowl or something to make it happen)"

RFIDs bro

11/30/2010 10:30:17 AM

fuck Maryland and fuck Ron Cherry

11/30/2010 11:01:23 AM

message_topic.aspx?topic=438399&page=1

11/30/2010 11:30:12 AM

When I did the chains in highschool for the JV team, we were taught to step on the chain to make sure it didnt move.

From those pictures posted, its clear the runner didnt make it. The spot was decent...generous to MD, but decent. I think when they brought the chains out to measure, they screwed up.

11/30/2010 11:38:46 AM

If we hadn't have played like ass for the 2nd, 3rd, and most of the 4th quarter, we wouldn't have had to worry about this call.

11/30/2010 11:50:05 AM

[NEW]

11/30/2010 11:56:19 AM

For the "it didn't cross the stick" argument...isn't the chain itself 10 yards? Then the ball wouldn't have to cross the stick...just the last chain link. Right? At least that makes sense to me. I don't actually know.

11/30/2010 12:01:38 PM

Yea, I could care less about this call. I was FAAR more upset after the game with the shit, inconsistent play of our offense. Its inexcusable for an offense with so many upperclassmen on it to play so poorly and inconsistently.

It was quite disheartening watching SENIOR wr Spencer get alligator arms and miss an easy TD catch, and JUNIOR te Bryan drop another TD, and JUNIOR wr Jay Smith drop his 800th 1st down catch of the year. Those are just 3 examples off the top of my head.

If you can't count on your upperclassmen to make plays, you might as well pack it in and not even play the game.

The only excuse the offense has is that the O-line is so young, but that doesn't excuse all of the bad play of this offense. The skill positions, which we thought would be the strength of this team, just really sucked it up Saturday.

11/30/2010 12:05:10 PM